NFL Week 8 Thread: The Power of Lord Brady Compels You!
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Flizzzipper
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Carolina 11, Indy 6
topsyturvy said:New Orleans at San Francisco - niners are horrible, :lol, those of you hoping that alex smith is your savior should jump on the bears wagon. They actually have one.
:lol
Alex Smith hasn't played since game 4 of the season (2 snaps before he got his shoulder separated). If he comes back this week, we'll win. Wanna do a avatar bet?
topsyturvy said:
The word you're looking for is "moot."
topsyturvy said:
Why would I compare Weeks 4-7? I'm comparing the first games each QB started.
topsyturvy said:
I also had a quote from Peter King saying Rex is playing like the leader the Bears always wanted. There are many more writers who were heaping praise on Rex, saying he was an MVP during the first quarter of last season.
levious said:
Now you're going to make me quote Friends:
Joey: All right, Rach. The big question is, "does he like you?" All right? Because if he doesn't like you, this is all a moo point.
Rachel: Huh. A moo point?
Joey: Yeah, it's like a cow's opinion. It just doesn't matter. It's moo.
Rachel: Have I been living with him for too long, or did that all just make sense?
Gigglepoo said:
griese has more passing attempts because we dont have a running game and the offense hasnt been gifted with short fields so far this year, that can be attributed to bad play calling, cedric "bust" benson, and an injury depleted defense
and since you like comparing stats, griese is the first bears quarterback with back to back 300 yard games since jim miller, and in 4 starts griese is averaging over 300 yards per game, i believe those numbers are better than grossmans
now if you actually watch football games instead of comparing box scores, you will see griese does many things that look like oh my gosh a legit nfl starting quarterback
he checks down when the receivers down field are covered
he steps up in the pocket when facing pressure to avoid the rush, something grossman never did
he doesnt throw off his back foot whenever pressured like grossbomb
griese doesnt lock onto 1 receiver the entire time, he reads the field, and spreads the ball around, i believe 9 different chicago receivers caught the ball last week
in 4 games, griese has led 3 4th quarter comebacks, would have been 3 wins too if the defense held up its end of the bargain, and APII was sick that day, how many times did we see grossman lead 4th quarter comebacks last year?
grossman if anything was a good front runner, the games he played well in he started the game fast, and the bears got off to big leads, the bears traditionally have been a horrible team playing from behind, yet griese has led 3 comebacks in a row for the offense
so you can keep bringing up grossman's stats from the first 4-5 starts last year if you want, but that doesnt paint the entire picture
i'd rather have griese starting for the bears than rex grossman, trent dilfer, or alex smith
(had to throw in the 9ers barb)Gigglepoo said:What were you saying last year at this time?
at this time last year, damn right i was drinking the grossman koolaid, but by the time of the rams/2nd vikings game, i was calling for a qb switch, so w/e
i mean what were 9ers fans saying before the season? playoffs? :lol
yacobod said:
So last year at this time you would have said, "I haven't seen a QB play this well in Chicago since Jim Miller in 2001!" That was basically my whole argument. Don't discount what Grossman did at the beginning of last year just because he tanked later on.
yacobod said:
We're saying "playoffs" right now. If we beat New Orleans and Atlanta, we're back to .500 and right back in the NFC West hunt.
topsyturvy
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by the way, didn't you even argue that grossman was better then phillip rivers for fucks sake. which is not true. :lolGigglepoo said:
lets end this shit now.
anyway, here is the question to stop this argument. everyone for know on vote :
who do you think is a better qb for the bears?
griese or rex grossman?
arguing by comparing the first 4 games for each qb is stupid. You know for damn sure that griese will have a better season then grossman could ever think of....accept if he gets hurt :/
:lol what can i say, i like to be surprise on gameday sometimes, i'm guessing griese will do great justice anyhow.yacobod said:
topsyturvy said:
I don't think highly of Phillips Rivers, to say the least.
topsyturvy said:
Why can't you understand why I choose the first four starts from both QBs? I have explained it over and over and over again and you just can't grasp it.
With this team, my vote is clearly Griese. But Grossman has more potential. I still think he can make something of himself on another team. The best Griese can ever achieve is a first round playoff loss.
With the ultimate greatest game of all time best in history according to ESPN until the next day coming up, I just realized that mute is the only way to watch this weeks MNF.
I really hope that Jaws grows a pair and bitch slaps Tony into being quiet so someone can actually commentate on the game going on. I mean most commentators will at least wait until the start of the 4th quarter in a blowout before they start babbling about turducken or whatever else they are interested in. But Tony will start his tired act before kickoff and keep it up all game long.
I never thought I would say it, but Joe Theissman > Tony K
I really hope that Jaws grows a pair and bitch slaps Tony into being quiet so someone can actually commentate on the game going on. I mean most commentators will at least wait until the start of the 4th quarter in a blowout before they start babbling about turducken or whatever else they are interested in. But Tony will start his tired act before kickoff and keep it up all game long.
I never thought I would say it, but Joe Theissman > Tony K
topsyturvy
Member
i understand why you choose to go by the first four games. he was excellent to say the least. But the outcome is still the outcome and he is a complete bust. FACT. You can't honestly tell me that because of those good games, he should go down as the bears best qb since miller. thats just stupid. griese is on route to take it.Gigglepoo said:
I'd take Grossman over Rivers. Asking Rivers to win a game for you is the same as throwing in the towel. At least Grossman has done it before. He was actually a very good qb until people kept telling him "don't lose us the game". Before then he was doing just fine. Rivers was overrated in college. Just like all above average ACC qbs, he's just gonna prove to be a fraud sooner or later.
topsyturvy said:
If you want to crown Griese, then crown his ass! He is what I thought he was!
I love how a decade of mediocrity has been erased with four decent starts for the Bears. If you want to keep pointing at when Grossman imploded last year, can I point to the years when Griese couldn't even get on the field?
topsyturvy
Member
fucking babies.
Wow...
He sat the bench as a rookie...
Did you miss what he did in San Francisco? Or the CFL?
And then he met Satan
Steve Young was a Heisman runner up in college. Being a backup to the best ever is not a shame.
The defending champs? The team that had no run game? Brady was the only reason they won 9 games.
He was incredible in college
Um... he was damn good for a rookie.
Backed up a Hall of Famer, became a Pro Bowler
I have no idea what you're trying to prove but it's pretty clear at this point that you don't know much about football.
I am honestly shocked that someone who claims they like football could be so ignorant about Steve Young, the greatest human being to ever play the sport. Here's the Wiki entry for his senior year at BYU:
"Young's senior season (1983) was spectacular. He passed for 3,902 yards and 33 touchdowns in the regular season, and his 71.3% completion percentage set an NCAA single-season record. He also added 544 yards rushing. With Young at quarterback, BYU set an NCAA record by averaging 584.2 yards of total offense per game, with 370.5 of those yards coming from Young's passing and rushing. The Cougars finished the year with an impressive 11-1 record; Young was named First Team All-American and finished second in voting for the Heisman Trophy (behind Nebraska running back Mike Rozier). Young capped his college career by scoring the game-winning touchdown in BYU's 21-17 victory over Missouri in the 1983 Holiday Bowl."
Please do even a modicum of research before posing an argument.
topsyturvy said:
He sat the bench as a rookie...
topsyturvy said:
Did you miss what he did in San Francisco? Or the CFL?
topsyturvy said:
And then he met Satan
topsyturvy said:
Steve Young was a Heisman runner up in college. Being a backup to the best ever is not a shame.
topsyturvy said:
The defending champs? The team that had no run game? Brady was the only reason they won 9 games.
topsyturvy said:
He was incredible in college
topsyturvy said:
Um... he was damn good for a rookie.
topsyturvy said:
Backed up a Hall of Famer, became a Pro Bowler
topsyturvy said:
I have no idea what you're trying to prove but it's pretty clear at this point that you don't know much about football.
I am honestly shocked that someone who claims they like football could be so ignorant about Steve Young, the greatest human being to ever play the sport. Here's the Wiki entry for his senior year at BYU:
"Young's senior season (1983) was spectacular. He passed for 3,902 yards and 33 touchdowns in the regular season, and his 71.3% completion percentage set an NCAA single-season record. He also added 544 yards rushing. With Young at quarterback, BYU set an NCAA record by averaging 584.2 yards of total offense per game, with 370.5 of those yards coming from Young's passing and rushing. The Cougars finished the year with an impressive 11-1 record; Young was named First Team All-American and finished second in voting for the Heisman Trophy (behind Nebraska running back Mike Rozier). Young capped his college career by scoring the game-winning touchdown in BYU's 21-17 victory over Missouri in the 1983 Holiday Bowl."
Please do even a modicum of research before posing an argument.
Yeah, that just didn't add up... Brett Favre? You must either really young or don't watch ESPN Classic. All of those guys on that list are pretty damn amazing. I think you're just jockriding since your Saints won't win 6 games.
topsyturvy
Member
wow,and your a complete bears hater. i stumble across that.Gigglepoo said:
topsyturvy
Member
sure you do, and i don't know shit about football either.Gigglepoo said:
How many Rookie QB's light it up?
Garcia was GREAT in San Fran - how many people are actually good in Detroit? That place has been a grave yard for the last 6-8 years.
Brady just got better... (sold his soul) but people DO actually get better. Drew Brees is perfect example of that. HOW THE HELL IS A ROOKIE SUPPOSED TO TAKE OVER FOR JOE MONTANA WTF!?
You can't expect guys to just take over their rookie year and produce pro bowl numbers. Jason Campbell for example, he sat for nearly two seasons and now he's running a damned good washington offense. Carson Palmer sat behind *Jon Kitna* and he's the next best QB behind Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.
I'm just blown by those statements man, I don't understand how you can ever take a shot a Steve Young.
Garcia was GREAT in San Fran - how many people are actually good in Detroit? That place has been a grave yard for the last 6-8 years.
Brady just got better... (sold his soul) but people DO actually get better. Drew Brees is perfect example of that. HOW THE HELL IS A ROOKIE SUPPOSED TO TAKE OVER FOR JOE MONTANA WTF!?
You can't expect guys to just take over their rookie year and produce pro bowl numbers. Jason Campbell for example, he sat for nearly two seasons and now he's running a damned good washington offense. Carson Palmer sat behind *Jon Kitna* and he's the next best QB behind Tom Brady and Peyton Manning.
I'm just blown by those statements man, I don't understand how you can ever take a shot a Steve Young.
topsyturvy
Member
sighGigglepoo said:
your not getting the list, the list was for backup and shitty seasons played, maybe i should've pointed that out and made it easier for you.
topsyturvy said:
I missed the guy on the list who played a decade in the NFL as a career backup but then turned everything around. Who was it?
And why did you include Favre, who took over in Green Bay (taking over for The Magic Man) his second year and hasn't looked back? Why did you say Romo sucked in college when he was actually amazing? Why did you take a shot at 2001 Brady who carried a pretty average team? Why did you think Steve Young backing up Joe Montana was somehow comparable to being cut by three NFL teams?
topsyturvy
Member
DY_nasty said:
dude, most of the list was for backup qbs. like i said, i should've just pointed that out, i thought it was obvious but i know for damn sure i didn't meant it that way. steve young is incredible and i didn't meant it that way at all.
Karakand said:
Hey, do you know who the last Raider QB, drafted by the Raiders, to make it to the Pro Bowl was? Dr. Z had this in his column today. Needless to say, it's been awhile.
Ken Stabler, 1968
I'm pulling for Russel. I'm going to have to watch the guy for the next decade, he better be good.
topsyturvy said:
Griese wasn't a backup. He was a starter who got benched. Big difference.
Karakand said:
Ha! Nice. Poor Daunte. People were pining for him until he actually took the field. I don't know why they can't throw Russel out there. Give him 10% of the playbook and see what happens. I have a feeling he'll at least be fun to watch.
And if not JMR... how about McCown? I think he's practicing this week. Could this be the Great Revival? Alex Smith and Josh McCown with the miraculous recoveries to lead their teams to the promised land? Bay Area Super Bowl!
I was gonna apologize to Topsy for not being clear that I was gauging QB careers and not just this season... but then Topsy went off the deep end here and I don't think I need to apologize anymore :lol
People always forget that Garcia was awesome in San Fran. The thing is that when a QB gets older, just because he didn't have totally lights-out seasons, people forget that they're more than capable. Look at Testaverde-- this is a guy who never was a superstar but has been a workman throughout his career, but people are so jaded that when he has an above-average game, we're all floored. Oh well... no big deal, I'm just sayin'...
and let's all just be honest and not talk about romo in college-- it's not like anyone here watched any of his games.
as for this weekend, I don't think the Lions are going to win. just feels like a game they'll lose, plus they're all hyped that they're 4-2. They were 4-2 under Mooch and finished the year with only 2 more wins, so I don't put a lot of weight into the current record. We'll see... it doesn't matter though cuz it doesn't seem that any wildcards will be available cuz NYG and washington will take 'em both.
OHHH yeah, bears fans. don't talk about "greatest since jim miller." don't forget cade mccown. BELIEVE! he'll come back to haunt the bears.
People always forget that Garcia was awesome in San Fran. The thing is that when a QB gets older, just because he didn't have totally lights-out seasons, people forget that they're more than capable. Look at Testaverde-- this is a guy who never was a superstar but has been a workman throughout his career, but people are so jaded that when he has an above-average game, we're all floored. Oh well... no big deal, I'm just sayin'...
and let's all just be honest and not talk about romo in college-- it's not like anyone here watched any of his games.
as for this weekend, I don't think the Lions are going to win. just feels like a game they'll lose, plus they're all hyped that they're 4-2. They were 4-2 under Mooch and finished the year with only 2 more wins, so I don't put a lot of weight into the current record. We'll see... it doesn't matter though cuz it doesn't seem that any wildcards will be available cuz NYG and washington will take 'em both.
OHHH yeah, bears fans. don't talk about "greatest since jim miller." don't forget cade mccown. BELIEVE! he'll come back to haunt the bears.
topsyturvy
Member
you completely had turn that list into a shit stain and made it something that its not. I'll be deleting it because your completely over exaggerating.Gigglepoo said:
brady 2001 as in backup qb, steve young behind joe montana as in backup qb that became greatnes,hasselback the same... you clearly stated that griese was a backup qb. did you not?
brett farve was completely shitty his first season and was traded, so was garcia playing shitty in the motorcity and drew brees playing shitty in SD. thats what i'm trying to point at here. brian griese was passable in denver and doing his time at bucs, but looking at how qbs bounce back all the time. griese looks like he's bouncing back very well. so please stop over exaggerating the damn list.
Before Big Ben the Steelers were a 6-10 team.DY_nasty said:
As a rookie Big Ben led the Steelers to a 15-1 regular season mark. Engineered 5 or 6 come from behind wins, including a classic where the Steelers were down 10 points to the Parcell Cowboys and afterwards Bill remarked that Ben reminded him of a young Marino. Big Ben finished the season with a 100+ qb rating before running out of gas in the playoffs. He learned his lessons though and finished strong in the following post season.
Of course Big Ben is probably going to be the only rookie qb to ever do this. So the answer to your question is there is and can only be one.
bionic77 said:Before Big Ben the Steelers were a 6-10 team.
As a rookie Big Ben led the Steelers to a 15-1 regular season mark. Engineered 5 or 6 come from behind wins, including a classic where the Steelers were down 10 points to the Parcell Cowboys and afterwards Bill remarked that Ben reminded him of a young Marino. Big Ben finished the season with a 100+ qb rating before running out of gas in the playoffs. He learned his lessons though and finished strong in the following post season.
Of course Big Ben is probably going to be the only rookie qb to ever do this. So the answer to your question is there is and can only be one.
And yet somehow, Vince Young is the one who gets the "just wins games" label.:lol
ok i'm going to sign off on griese for now
he's playing well, i think it will be better to evaluate him after we see how the season turns out, so we'll see how it turns out
who cares if he was a back up, he made the pro bowl once with denver, and played well at Tampa Bay before getting injured, he's a veteran quarterback, and may continue to have success given the opportunity, there have been plenty of quarterbacks who have had late career resurgences, like rich gannon, so we'll see how he pans out for the bears
if he continues to play well great, maybe we can salvage the season and make the playoffs as a wild card, if not oh well, at least we can evaluate the quarterbacks on our roster for next season, because the position will have to be addressed one way or the other in the offseason
he's playing well, i think it will be better to evaluate him after we see how the season turns out, so we'll see how it turns out
who cares if he was a back up, he made the pro bowl once with denver, and played well at Tampa Bay before getting injured, he's a veteran quarterback, and may continue to have success given the opportunity, there have been plenty of quarterbacks who have had late career resurgences, like rich gannon, so we'll see how he pans out for the bears
if he continues to play well great, maybe we can salvage the season and make the playoffs as a wild card, if not oh well, at least we can evaluate the quarterbacks on our roster for next season, because the position will have to be addressed one way or the other in the offseason
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