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NHL February 2016 |OT| Parlez-vous tankçais?

Z

zroid

Banned
Deadspin posted a write-up about the Wideman decision, and this part stood out to me:

The NHL was in a bind here. It was impossible to know Wideman’s motivations when he hit Henderson, but something bad happened, and the league, under pressure from the referees’ union, had to find someone or something at fault. Accepting Wideman’s concussion defense would have been a dangerous precedent, and pushed that fault over to the NHL itself. Colin Campbell dodged that thornbush altogether when he cited a rule with a mandatory suspension, which necessarily had to ascribe malice to Wideman’s actions. The league did not have to give Wideman 20 games, but it looks a hell of a lot better for the NHL if it makes it appear it had no choice.
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this whole thing makes me feel uncomfortable with how the NHL is handling it
 
M

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
Foggy said:
It feels like the Rags have been on a slow death march and we're now seeing the beginning of it. Trading away Duclair was only going to speed it up a bit. Also that blue line looks like they're going to get old and busted overnight.
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Well, I don't think things are quite that dire as of yet.

Our forward situation, for one, is pretty ok. Even the loss of a Duclair doesn't really kill us up there, though it would be nice to have. JT Miller is beginning to have a breakout season and is still only 22, Derick Brassard and Mats Zuccarello are both about to hit career high goal totals and are just entering their primes on solid contracts, Kreider and Hayes both have the capability of being elite-class power forwards if they can just get out of their own way (and they're both still young enough to be able to do just that), Derek Stepan can be a world class playmaker when he's healthy (which has been a bit of an issue the last couple of years), and Viktor Stalberg has emerged in the last month or so as a viable Hagelin replacement going forward. And we have Tanner Glass! Then there's also Pavel Buchnevich probably competing for a roster spot come training camp, so for the short term the forwards are still in pretty good shape. The only problem is we don't really have a whole lot of high end prospects in that area after Buchnevich arrives. The organization is putting a lot of hope in the idea that Ryan Gropp could pan out as a high end talent, but that's pretty much a pure gamble.

The defense has the opposite problem. The long term actually looks pretty good for the blue line if we can get rid of the short term problems. Brady Skjei, Ryan Graves, and Mat Bodie are all waiting in the wings in Hartford (with that also being the order of likelihood for success at the NHL level), and Dylan McIlrath has finally arrived as a legit NHL defenseman with an absolute cannon of a shot from the point, if only he could break into the lineup. The Rangers have 3 big short term problems on D, though, and they are Dan Boyle, Marc Staal, and Dan Girardi. Boyle will be gone one way or another come June as his contract is up, and he is likely to retire. That leaves Staal and Girardi, with the problems really being their contracts, which are bad in every possible way: money, length, and terms. That said, I also think they're still potentially movable. Both players are pretty well respected around the league. Claude Giroux, in his Players Tribune fill-in-the-blanks thing last week, even named Girardi as "the most underrated player in the league." So I do think there can be a market for them, and I don't think it would be impossible to get them to waive their no trade/move clauses for the right fit.

IF, and this is a big IF, we can solve the problem of the busted parts of the defense, we're actually pretty ok and poised to remain a contender for a few more years, basically as long as Hank is able to go. Can we actually get over the hump and win the whole damn thing? I...have my doubts. I still see the 2010s Rangers as something like the 1970s Rangers. Really beloved and sometimes excellent teams that just couldn't quite get the job done in the end.

To me, Gorton's priorities at the deadline (and beyond) should be:
1) Trade at least one of Staal and/or Girardi if possible
2) Trade Rick Nash (probably the most valuable tradeable asset we've got not named Yandle)
3) Re-sign Keith Yandle (only possible if you can accomplish at least one of the above)
4) 2016-17 blueline: McDonagh, Yandle, Skjei, McIlrath, Klein, Staal/Girardi/other

Unfortunately it's waaaaay more likely that we're going to trade Keith Yandle and hold on to all the problem elements because that's the easiest thing to do.



By the way, AV spent the morning skate today sitting in the stands with Jeff Gorton and Glen Sather. That's not very normal, particularly for Slats to be there. Something's up.

Meanwhile, Tanner Glass is being scratched for Jayson Megna tonight. Sadness.

And Dylan McIlrath is in for Klein, even though Klein surprised everybody by even showing up today. Klein is still considered "out indefinitely," but probably not in the long term sense that had previously been expected.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
It was impossible to know Wideman’s motivations when he hit Henderson, but something bad happened, and the league, under pressure from the referees’ union, had to find someone or something at fault.
Click to expand...
Simply "something bad happened" isn't really fair to the situation imo:

“I was just trying to get off the ice. And, at the last second, I looked up and saw him,” said Wideman post-game. “I couldn’t avoid it. I didn’t know where to go or how to get out of the way of him.”
Click to expand...
His own explanation is impossible to reconcile with what actually happened. He had his head up, was obviously frustrated, got his hands and stick up (not in a brace for impact kind of way either) and obviously hit him deliberately. Malice is safe to assume. Beside the fact that it's difficult to confuse zebra stripes with an NHL jersey, he doesn't mention at all that he thought it was someone else.

I'm not saying this wasn't handled poorly, but I think in single-mindedly shaming the NHL people are being too kind to Wideman.
 
M

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
3h9CnPV.png
 
F

Foggy

Member
MetatronM said:
No worries, I'll do better next time.
Click to expand...

:D

"Death march" is definitely exaggerating the severity. It does feel like they won't get on a legit run until they unload some of those D contracts as well as Nash. Just gotta make sure Hank never runs out of smoothies until then.
 
M

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
Foggy said:
:D

"Death march" is definitely exaggerating the severity. It does feel like they won't get on a legit run until they unload some of those D contracts as well as Nash. Just gotta make sure Hank never runs out of smoothies until then.
Click to expand...

Really what needs to happen is McDonagh needs to be freed from the anchor that is Dan Girardi on his right side. It's amazing how much more dynamic he can be when G's not there (Olympics, ASG, on the power play). It would make a huge difference in how the whole team in plays.
 
C

calder

Member
Pronman with his first update of the top 30 draft eligible's this season.

The following is my midseason assessment of the crop of players available this June for the 2016 NHL draft, including an overall assessment of the class and profiles of my top 30 prospects.

I have seen just about every player listed in the top 30 live in the past six months, and many of them several times; additionally, I have regular conversations with scouts and executives. My analysis incorporates this information on top of statistics, adjusted for age, league, position, randomness, other important contextual information and any other important background information I've procured on a prospect.

The 2016 draft class is one I'd describe as average. Top prospect Auston Matthews is a standard No. 1 overall prospect, arguably with a lean to being above-average in that cohort. The top 3-5 group is good, with this draft lacking a little bit on the depth side toward the end of the first and into the middle of the second round. This is a very strong draft class for the USA and Finland, and one of the weakest Canadian crops in a long time.

The biggest shakeup has been the play of Patrik Laine during the past 12 months. Six months ago, I'd have said it's unlikely the first overall pick would require deep thought, but he has put himself in the conversation. Between all the prospect rankings I have done, for draft-eligible or drafted players, this was one of the hardest top overall prospect rankings I have done. It matches Taylor Hall vs. Tyler Seguin in 2010, and the four-player debate atop the 2013 draft. This is due to Laine's consistent high level of play, and game-breaking attributes on display at the world under-18 championship last spring, through league play this season, and including his dominant world junior championship play.

Now on to the top 30 prospects for the 2016 draft class. Tiers for me would be the top two players, then No. 3 Jesse Puljujarvi in his own tier, followed by Nos. 4-10 being a tier.

1. Auston Matthews, C, ZCS (NLA)
DOB: 9/17/97 | Ht: 6-2 | Wt: 194
GP: 30 | G: 23 | A: 15

Matthews is a prospect of equivalent talent to Buffalo's Jack Eichel at the time of Eichel being drafted, and is the favorite to be picked first. Matthews' pure skill level is the highest in this draft class. The things he can do with the puck border on freakish, considering his frame. He also has above-average speed and great hockey IQ. He has been on a tear in the NLA since returning from the WJC. While some may scoff at the league and say his numbers aren't impressive in a global sense, recent studies have shown the NLA has actually surpassed the top Finnish league, and is nearly on par with the AHL, with many ex-NHLers making Switzerland their post-North America destination.

2. Patrik Laine, LW, Tampere (Liiga)
DOB: 4/19/98 | Ht: 6-4 | Wt: 207
GP: 33 | G: 13 | A: 14

Laine possesses elite skill, an elite power game and an elite shot. This combination of attributes makes him an absolute nightmare to check, and has allowed him to dominate the high-skill environments like the WJC, and the more physical, fast-paced environments like Finland's top professional league. His shot generation is off-the-charts good for a 17-year-old in the Liiga. His play has created a reasonable argument to be in the discussion to be picked first overall, and I would not find fault with an NHL team for doing just that this summer.

3. Jesse Puljujarvi, RW, Karpat (Liiga)
DOB: 5/7/98 | Ht: 6-3 | Wt: 201
GP: 39 | G: 8 | A: 11

On top of having the second-highest scoring total ever by a player his age at the WJC, Puljujarvi has been one of the best 17-year-olds in Finland's top league in recent years. He's an exciting prospect who skates incredibly well for a big man, displays good skill and coordination, and has a good shot as well. Puljujarvi's defensive play isn't perfect yet, but he's adept at competing for pucks along the boards. For me, he's quite not on the same level as Matthews and Laine, but has made a clear distinction between himself and the rest of the pack.

4. Clayton Keller, C, USNTDP (USHL)
DOB: 7/29/98 | Ht: 5-10 | Wt: 170
GP: 39 | G: 27 | A: 49

Keller's production for the USA under-18 team can be ranked with the all-time greats like Matthews, Eichel, Phil Kessel and Patrick Kane. He has been great during USHL and college games he has taken part in for the NTDP, and should contend for the top player award at the upcoming five nations under-18 tournament. Keller is a dynamic scorer with top-end skating and skill on top of being an excellent passer. He's undersized at 5-foot-10 and not overly physical, but does show commitment to defensive play. The size is a concern that attaches risk to his projection, but I see Keller having the potential to be a game-breaking forward.

5. Matthew Tkachuk, LW, London (OHL)
DOB: 12/11/97 | Ht: 6-1 | Wt: 194
GP: 38 | G: 16 | A: 54

Keith's son has done nothing but succeed at every level for the past few years, including this season in the OHL and at the WJC. He's a potential top-line winger at the NHL level, with high-end skill, great vision and hockey IQ, and a willingness to compete for pucks as hard as any prospect on this list. Any scout you talk to about him comes back raving about his hockey sense. He's not just his father's son; he's a guy who creates from the sideboards and has eyes in the back of his head.
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CTL-F "Marner"
No results found. Wow, that must have been tough for him.

I stopped at the top 5 to troll Leaf fans, he has Alex Nylander at six and everyone knows the Leafs are going to lose the lottery and pick like seventh or something. Two spots above the Jets. :(
 
Y

yyzjohn

Banned
Merguson said:
Bergevin: can you speak french tho?

Carlyle: um... bonjour?

Bergevin: fuck it you're hired
Click to expand...

My prediction for the next 3 Habs coaches:

Guy Boucher
Alain Vigneault
Patrick Roy

Boucher first and then whoever is available from firing in the future between Vigneault and Roy.
 
C

calder

Member
Isn't Boucher an actually good coach, unlike those other humps? I always had the impression that, in so far as advanced metrics can measure coaching, he did a pretty good job in Tampa.

So you can strike him off the list of potentials I'm sure.
 
S

Stasis

Member
MetatronM said:
Great write-up about the state of the Rangers moving forward.
Click to expand...

Hey man, great write-up about the state of the Rangers moving forward.

Agreed on all fronts. Getting rid of G and Nash would be great for us, I think, especially if we can get something decent in return. Something that would have an immediate impact as well as maybe a little restocking of the cupboard. I'm not hoping for a ton here, but a few decent pieces would be nice. Losing Yandle for nothing would/is going to suck. Wish we still had Duclair, even with Buch coming (probably). Looking forward to seeing Graves, and more of Skjei.

Only problem with moving G vs. Staal is that if we're planning on having both Graves and Skjei in any time soon, the left side is full with McD. Though Staal is an OK insurance policy if one (or both) doesn't pan out. I'd rather keep Staal than G personally. At least for now. We don't have to have 3L-3R, but we know AV will do his best. Get rid of G, somehow obtain Shattenkirk.

McDonagh - Shattenkirk
Skjei/Graves - McIlrath
Staal - Klein

Or some variant. Pairing a mobile guy with a stay at home, rookie with vet. Bodie isn't much of anything. Maybe a 7th along with Summers? So here's hoping some (all) of our guys pan out and that AV is willing to play younger D. He really seems to have an issue with that.

Nice to see Miller playing well. Hope that sticks. Need Kreider and Hayes to step up and evolve, Stepan to return to form. So many if's, but we can definitely be a contender for a while yet.
 
L

lamaroo

Unconfirmed Member
calder said:
Isn't Boucher an actually good coach, unlike those other humps? I always had the impression that, in so far as advanced metrics can measure coaching, he did a pretty good job in Tampa.

So you can strike him off the list of potentials I'm sure.
Click to expand...

I think I read that he had below league average goal tending for his entire tenure in Tampa. Everyone only remembers him for the 1-3-1, but I'm pretty sure he only did that to make up for his teams weakness.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
calder said:
Pronman with his first update of the top 30 draft eligible's this season.



CTL-F "Marner"
No results found. Wow, that must have been tough for him.

I stopped at the top 5 to troll Leaf fans, he has Alex Nylander at six and everyone knows the Leafs are going to lose the lottery and pick like seventh or something. Two spots above the Jets. :(
Click to expand...
Surprised to see him legitimately entertaining Laine as #1.

C'mon, Canucks. Please be terrible to finish the season. No more middling bullshit.
 
L

Lourio

Member
yyzjohn said:
My prediction for the next 3 Habs coaches:

Guy Boucher
Alain Vigneault
Patrick Roy

Boucher first and then whoever is available from firing in the future between Vigneault and Roy.
Click to expand...

Although I absolutely love Patrick Roy, he is not the right choice, nor are the other 2. Corey Crawford or Larry Robinson (good luck getting him to leave his position at San Jose though) would be my picks.
 
R

Red_Man

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
lamaroo said:
I think I read that he had below league average goal tending for his entire tenure in Tampa. Everyone only remembers him for the 1-3-1, but I'm pretty sure he only did that to make up for his teams weakness.
Click to expand...
This. Dude is a good tactician and like I've mentioned here, he's coached Subban, Price and Patches in the AHL.

Rangers falling out and firing Vigneualt and Bergevin grabbing him again would be the dream scenario at this point.
 
Y

Yawnier

Banned
Clayton Keller is a guy I can see Mark Hunter going for at the draft. Keller is a wizard with the puck.

zroid said:
We have a new leader in the sadness rankings:

CaXyiBnUkAATPe0.png
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That TOR % is way too high for my liking. I know it'll get lower when we trade off PAP and a few others but still.
 
C

CreeperBlocks

Banned
Hypothetically, what if the Habs don't hire a french coach? Who should we get?



Also if Guy Boucher doesn't wanna be coach, should we hire an complete unknown?
 
R

Red_Man

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
Price coming back at the end would be awful right now, last thing we need is to go on a hot streak and land at 9th in the east.

CreeperBlocks said:
Hypothetically, what if the Habs don't hire a french coach? Who should we get?
Click to expand...
Hahahahahaha good one

I don't know if you recall Molson actually coming out to the press and apologizing because Cunneyworth couldn't speak French. We're not getting an Anglo coach.
 
L

Lone_Prodigy

Member
Hard to believe this is the same Habs team that made the Conference Finals in 2014. They've won 5 out of their last 26 games. With such a sample size, I don't think you can call it a string of bad luck anymore. They may have to take a hard look at the core players. I don't think they're at the "trade Kessel" part though.
 
R

Red_Man

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
Barclays Center CEO on obstructed seats at Islanders games: "You can watch the game on your mobile device."
Click to expand...
:lol :lol

Lone_Prodigy said:
Hard to believe this is the same Habs team that made the Conference Finals in 2014. They've won 5 out of their last 26 games. With such a sample size, I don't think you can call it a string of bad luck anymore. They may have to take a hard look at the core players. I don't think they're at the "trade Kessel" part though.
Click to expand...
It's definitely not just bad luck, that terrible stretch they went through dominating teams and losing has destroyed their confidence. They're not on the same page, taking weak shots from the perimeter. They're done with Therrien, it's pretty obvious. I wouldn't be against trading guys like Plekanec or Markov, but their value is at their lowest right now, this is why I said they should have traded them last season.
 
Z

zroid

Banned
Lone_Prodigy said:
Hard to believe this is the same Habs team that made the Conference Finals in 2014. They've won 5 out of their last 26 games. With such a sample size, I don't think you can call it a string of bad luck anymore. They may have to take a hard look at the core players. I don't think they're at the "trade Kessel" part though.
Click to expand...

Or the team that had an 80 Pts% in the first 26 games this season. This goes beyond swings of luck, it's more like some voodoo shit at this stage. Never seen such a tale of two teams.
 
C

CreeperBlocks

Banned
lamaroo said:
You want to be lower on that chart dude!



Habs should have hired someone like Benoit Groulx, Eric Veilleux, or Jean-Francois Houle for St John's years ago.
Click to expand...

Benoit Groulx should be an Number One Candidate if we can't get Guy Boucher.

To people thinking Patrick Roy should Coach Montreal...

Do you really want Price or Condon pulled with 15 mins left in the game?
 
L

Lone_Prodigy

Member
zroid said:
Or the team that had an 80 Pts% in the first 26 games this season. This goes beyond swings of luck, it's more like some voodoo shit at this stage. Never seen such a tale of two teams.
Click to expand...

They overachieved, and now they're underachieving. The real Habs team is probably somewhere in the middle. But I don't think ownership is content with just an average team. Getting Price back does not make them a contender, nor does firing the coach. If they want to compete for a Cup, they will need to make some tough decisions in the next few years.

They do have time. Price is 28, Subban 26, Pacioretty 27. If he stays healthy, Price could play for another 8 years at a high level.
 
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