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NHL October Thread - The Shanabans North American Tour begins!

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S

Sanjuro

Member
RBH said:
Anyone here kind enough to post the entirety of this article?:



http://insider.espn.go.com/nhl/blog...innipeg-jets-begin-new-era-nhl-return-atlanta
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Sure.

ESPN Insider said:
Don Waddell couldn't get Sunday's Winnipeg Jets game on television from his cottage in Beaverton, Mich., so he tried to stream it online. The audio came and went, but he was able to listen to the first period of history in Winnipeg as the city lovingly embraced the team he once built.

There's no bitterness from Waddell, the former Thrashers general manager and team president. He thinks Winnipeg deserves a hockey team and knows the ownership there went about it the right way.

And on some level, those are still his players.

"It's pretty much our team from last year with a different coaching staff," Waddell said over the phone Tuesday. "I have a relationship with all those guys. [Jets GM] Kevin Cheveldayoff is a very good friend of mine who worked with us when he was running the Chicago Wolves. Claude Noel and I played together. I'm pretty tied to the organization."

Slowly, those ties will dissolve. Waddell is technically still working for the Atlanta Hawks as they transition to new ownership in a league not playing games, but that will end soon enough. Then it's back to hockey.

4wvlO.png
.
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P

pringles

Member
Socreges said:
As for Detroit moving to the East, I really don't see why they'd find it so easy. The East has gotten stronger and Detroit has gotten (and will get) weaker.
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"The Wings have too many euros to win."

"The Wings are too old"

"Detroit will never win with a european captain."

I love it, always the same story year after year, people predicting the end of the Wings.

Always such generic and unmotivated reasons for it too.

The toughest challenge facing the Wings in the coming seasons is adjusting to life without Lidstrom. That's going to be difficult. I wouldn't even be surprised if they finally miss the playoffs the season after he calls it quits.

But beyond that they've gotten rid of most of the older players without really missing a beat.

And they should have plenty of time to develop Calle Järnkrok, Teemu Pulkkinen, Tomas Tatar and Gustav Nyquist so that when Datsyuk and Zetterberg start to decline atleast one or two of them are ready to be top 3 guys.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
brucewaynegretzky said:
Dear Canucks Gaf,

Bring it.

Love,
Me
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Really looking forward to the Canucks/Flyers tonight. No expectations, but for it to be a fun game.

pringles said:
"The Wings have too many euros to win."

"The Wings are too old"

"Detroit will never win with a european captain."

I love it, always the same story year after year, people predicting the end of the Wings.

Always such generic and unmotivated reasons for it too.

The toughest challenge facing the Wings in the coming seasons is adjusting to life without Lidstrom. That's going to be difficult. I wouldn't even be surprised if they finally miss the playoffs the season after he calls it quits.

But beyond that they've gotten rid of most of the older players without really missing a beat.

And they should have plenty of time to develop Calle Järnkrok, Teemu Pulkkinen, Tomas Tatar and Gustav Nyquist so that when Datsyuk and Zetterberg start to decline atleast one or two of them are ready to be top 3 guys.
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So you agree with me?
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
Socreges said:
Really looking forward to the Canucks/Flyers tonight. No expectations, but for it to be a fun game.
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Yep. This is gonna be an awesome couple of days for the Flyers. Nucks tonight which should be a lot of fun to watch, then LA on Saturday. O God I can't take it!!!!!! I love October!!!!!!!!!!
 
S

Spire

Subconscious Brolonging
Plinko said:
I still don't think the Coyotes end up moving. Bettman is hellbent on them staying put--if the league wanted them to move, they'd have been gone two years ago.

Besides, as I said earlier, I fully expect another team in the Eastern Conference to relocate west in a few years.
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Nah, he's given them several chances to make it work and it just hasn't. I actually like that he didn't pull out of risky markets at the first sign of trouble and gave them time to make an impact but if they don't make it happen soon, it's done. They've made the playoffs the past couple years and still haven't hooked a major audience, that's the final straw I think.


brucewaynegretzky said:
Yep. This is gonna be an awesome couple of days for the Flyers. Nucks tonight which should be a lot of fun to watch, then LA on Saturday. O God I can't take it!!!!!! I love October!!!!!!!!!!
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Yeah, PHI/VAN is the game to watch today. I haven't seen Philly yet this season so I'm looking forward to it.
 
M

Marvie_3

Banned
Plinko said:
I still don't think the Coyotes end up moving. Bettman is hellbent on them staying put--if the league wanted them to move, they'd have been gone two years ago.

Besides, as I said earlier, I fully expect another team in the Eastern Conference to relocate west in a few years.
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The city of Glendale isn't going to be footing the bill for losses anymore though. The NHL has said they don't want to own the team anymore. If they can't find a sucker to buy them and keep them in Phoenix, which is pretty unlikely, then Phoenix is gone.

What Eastern team do you think is moving?


brucewaynegretzky said:
Yeah but you're assuming Gary Bettman is a logically coherent person. He may be sitting in his office saying "Look how excited people got when we moved a team to Winnipeg! We should totally do that again!"

Who? You think an eastern team is more likely than the Preds or BJs?
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The LAST thing he wanted was to move a team from a huge US market to a small Canadian market.
 
P

pringles

Member
Socreges said:
So you agree with me?
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You're basing the opinion that the Wings have gotten worse and will get worse solely on Lidstrom getting worse (only winning the Norris slightly last year instead of winning it in dominating fashion) and that he will retire eventually?

I said I wouldn't be surprised if they miss the playoffs when he quits, but that's worst case scenario. Their playoff streak has to end sometime and I could see one or two "transition seasons" after he leaves.

But I could also see Kronwall playing up to his potential and becoming a true top 2 d-man. I could see Kindl taking another step this season. I could see Ericsson growing a brain, I could see Brendan Smith learning some more defense and becoming our new Rafalski. I could see Adam Almqvist coming over from Sweden and stepping right into the NHL. I could see Holland pulling some magical trade, or just a decent trade or two to add to the defense.

Lidstrom isn't gone yet and it's completely possible he decides to go one or two more years after this, and it's by no means certain that the team will even miss a beat when he leaves.

Overall the team has gotten younger and they have some great prospects in the system. And right NOW, they're a contender for sure.
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
Marvie_3 said:
The city of Glendale isn't going to be footing the bill for losses anymore though. The NHL has said they don't want to own the team anymore. If they can't find a sucker to buy them and keep them in Phoenix, which is pretty unlikely, then Phoenix is gone.

What Eastern team do you think is moving?



The LAST thing he wanted was to move a team from a huge US market to a small Canadian market.
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I agree that he didn't want it, but I can't help but imagine that he's been pleasantly surprised by the reception the team has gotten and has been persuaded that this is a good idea. Like a kid who sees something new and shiny Bettman sees short term fan reaction.
 
S

Solo

Member
Epic Tales of Penis said:
Coming from the very same man who predicted a 5-0 Habs win over the Leafs!

It's....Solodamus!!!
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I got the score right, just the game wrong ;) That's the final score for the next Habs/Marlies matchup.
 
O

OnPoint

Member
Man the Sabres not playing until Friday has made for a super boring week.

I want to get in here and argue with you guys, but I just can't find the fire.

Sigh
 
S

Solo

Member
It seems like a lot of teams have a long break this week. Every season the NHL schedule sucks like that. Your team won't play for a whole week and then they'll play 4 games in 6 days. Ridiculous.
 
M

Marvie_3

Banned
Solo said:
Ladies and gentlemen, I give you the Boise Maple Leafs!
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:lol

brucewaynegretzky said:
I agree that he didn't want it, but I can't help but imagine that he's been pleasantly surprised by the reception the team has gotten and has been persuaded that this is a good idea. Like a kid who sees something new and shiny Bettman sees short term fan reaction.
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I can guarantee you this isn't the case. He wants the league to grow in the U.S. and that can't happen by moving a team to Winnipeg. The only reason the team was allowed to move to Winnipeg was because the league didn't have any choice in the matter like they do with Phoenix. The Atlanta ownership was done with the Thrashers. TNSE was the only legit bidder so they got the team. If there had been a serious U.S. buyer, Winnipeg wouldn't have a team yet.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
pringles said:
You're basing the opinion that the Wings have gotten worse and will get worse solely on Lidstrom getting worse (only winning the Norris slightly last year instead of winning it in dominating fashion) and that he will retire eventually?
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No. I said that you agree with me (high level), not that I agree with you (specifics). You were so deeply offended for me daring to speak ill of the Wings and project a continued decline. Then in the same breath said that you can even see them missing the playoffs. So I'm not sure why you're acting like I'm so off base here.

They had seven consecutive seasons of either winning the West or coming within just a few points of doing so. The previous two seasons they've been well behind the conference leaders (while still doing very well). "Gotten worse" cannot be debated. "Will continue to get worse" is not a foregone conclusion, of course, but I'm willing to bet the Wings will continue to see their season point totals decline (prospects won't be able to fill the shoes of the aging core and you don't have the marquee goaltending to cover up those holes).
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
Socreges said:
Really looking forward to the Canucks/Flyers tonight. No expectations, but for it to be a fun game.
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Polar opposite teams. Should be really interesting to see how they match up.
 
S

Spire

Subconscious Brolonging
Good news for the Pens, Neuvirth is day-to-day with a "lower body injury" (aka an uncomfortable outbreak of herpetic lesions). Bring on Vokoun!
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
Socreges said:
Polar opposites?
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Tough, hard-nosed team of grinders and assholes who get things done by committee; not built around a goaltender.

vs.

Soft, speedy team that relies heavily on its top line (or two, when healthy) and discipline/powerplay to score; built around a goalie.
 
P

pringles

Member
Socreges said:
No. I said that you agree with me (high level), not that I agree with you (specifics). You were so deeply offended for me daring to speak ill of the Wings and project a continued decline. Then in the same breath said that you can even see them missing the playoffs. So I'm not sure why you're acting like I'm so off base here.

They had seven consecutive seasons of either winning the West or coming within just a few points of doing so. The previous two seasons they've been well behind the conference leaders (while still doing very well). "Gotten worse" cannot be debated. "Will continue to get worse" is not a foregone conclusion, of course, but I'm willing to bet the Wings will continue to see their season point totals decline (prospects won't be able to fill the shoes of the aging core and you don't have the marquee goaltending to cover up those holes).
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Uhh, did I seem deeply offended to you? Maybe I should have added a smiley somewhere if that's what you thought.. ;)

That I can see them missing the playoffs is called realism. I don't think they're unbeatable. Losing Lidstrom, maybe getting some injuries to key players, someone not performing to expectations and just like that they miss the playoffs. The league is so even these days. You can't see the Nucks missing the playoffs at some point in the next 5 years?

That they've gotten worse can be debated. They haven't had as dominating regular seasons the last couple of years but winning the President's and having a 1st round exit isn't better than placing 3rd and reaching the 2nd round, IMO. That's not something I'd expect a Canuck fan to understand though.

However they have been in a bit of a generational shift the last few years which has been a big reason for that perceived "decline". Now it's mostly done, with really only Lidstrom and Holmstrom left of the 'old Wings'. Holmstrom is not part of the core so by "aging core" I guess you mean Zetterberg, Datsyuk and Lidstrom. Maybe Kronwall will be consider part of the core when Lidstrom leaves. And yes, they will get older. But Datsyuk has never been better than he is now. I don't think he's going to suck in a year or two or even three.
Nor will Zetterberg.

And I think you underrate both our prospects and Howard. Järnkrok is playing in the SEL and will likely step right into the NHL in a year or two. Nyquist pretty much would have been on the team if there had been room. Right there you have two guys that could reach the level of Zetterberg (they've both been compared to him).
Howard has carried the Wings at times. He's sometimes shaky, but after last year's playoffs I have a lot of confidence in him.
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
Nystrom traded to the Stars, presumably to help with the salary cap gap left by Sean Avery being waived (which dropped them below the floor). Why didn't they just pick him up on waivers the first time?
 
S

Socreges

Banned
pringles said:
That I can see them missing the playoffs is called realism. I don't think they're unbeatable. Losing Lidstrom, maybe getting some injuries to key players, someone not performing to expectations and just like that they miss the playoffs. The league is so even these days. You can't see the Nucks missing the playoffs at some point in the next 5 years?
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In five years? Of course. But how is that timeframe relevant to this, unless you're suddenly suggesting that Lidstrom has 5 more seasons in him?

pringles said:
That they've gotten worse can be debated. They haven't had as dominating regular seasons the last couple of years but winning the President's and having a 1st round exit isn't better than placing 3rd and reaching the 2nd round, IMO.
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The only playoffs matter argument, however true, isn't appropriate here. We're talking about the quality of the team, from year-to-year. Their position over 82 games speaks more to this argument than how they performed in a seven-game series against one team.

Keep in mind that I'm not saying the Wings won't be competitive. But we're talking about a team that consistently placed at the top and was, if anyone, considered the favourite each season. That's no longer the case (gotten worse) and I think over the next few years they'll be 4-8 at best and bubble team at worse.
 
S

Socreges

Banned
Curufinwe said:
One got rid of the goalie who crashed and burned in the deciding game of the Stanley Cup finals, the other didn't.
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Nice revisionism. The Canucks crashed and burned. Luongo just didn't save them (3 goals against, none bad).

[edit] Luongo DEFINITELY crashed and burned overall, though. Especially contrasted against Thomas
 
Y

yankeehater

Member
Curufinwe said:
One got rid of the goalie who crashed and burned in the deciding game of the Stanley Cup finals, the other didn't.
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LOL. I would say the Flyers are more built around their goalie, then the Nucks are.
 
M

MacAttack

Member
Socreges said:
Nice revisionism. The Canucks crashed and burned. Luongo just didn't save them (3 goals against, none bad).

[edit] Luongo DEFINITELY crashed and burned overall, though. Especially contrasted against Thomas
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lol @ the edit. Did you here my keystrokes preparing Luongo SCF stats?
 
C

Curufinwe

Member
Socreges said:
Nice revisionism. The Canucks crashed and burned. Luongo just didn't save them (3 goals against, none bad).
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So similar I sometimes I lose track of which one's Luongo and which one's Leighton.

In case it's not obvious I'm just revving things up before tonight's game.
 
C

CCF23

Member
Socreges said:
Nice revisionism. The Canucks crashed and burned. Luongo just didn't save them (3 goals against, none bad).

[edit] Luongo DEFINITELY crashed and burned overall, though. Especially contrasted against Thomas
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To a point...I don't know if the Canucks would've won the series even if the goalies had switched teams. Luongo single-handedly won 3 games for the Canucks, and despite being piss poor in the games in Boston, wasn't getting any goal support anyway.
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
CCF23 said:
To a point...I don't know if the Canucks would've won the series even if the goalies had switched teams. Luongo single-handedly won 3 games for the Canucks, and despite being piss poor in the games in Boston, wasn't getting any goal support anyway.
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This. Luongo's got his problems, but there was nothing he could do about the Canucks' scoring only 8 goals in 7 games.
 
S

SpectreFire

Member
aidan said:
This. Luongo's got his problems, but there was nothing he could do about the Canucks' scoring only 8 goals in 7 games.
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Clearly that is the reason why we need to trade him and keep offensive-goaltender Cory Schneider.

Cory-Schneider-Hat-Trick.png
 
S

Socreges

Banned
Curufinwe, didn't realize you were a Flyers fan.

Ass.

CCF23 said:
To a point...I don't know if the Canucks would've won the series even if the goalies had switched teams. Luongo single-handedly won 3 games for the Canucks, and despite being piss poor in the games in Boston, wasn't getting any goal support anyway.
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Agreed... kinda. If he was as excellent as Thomas throughout all seven games (and didn't shit the bed in Boston each night), the teams would have been in very different places mentally.
 
B

brucewaynegretzky

Member
Socreges said:
The only playoffs matter argument, however true, isn't appropriate here. We're talking about the quality of the team, from year-to-year. Their position over 82 games speaks more to this argument than how they performed in a seven-game series against one team.

Keep in mind that I'm not saying the Wings won't be competitive. But we're talking about a team that consistently placed at the top and was, if anyone, considered the favourite each season. That's no longer the case (gotten worse) and I think over the next few years they'll be 4-8 at best and bubble team at worse.
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Actually this is kind of logically incorrect. If the only way to measure the quality of a team is by how far they make it in the playoffs then it is perfectly appropriate.

Sorry that was bugging me.

GO FLYERS!

Who are the starters tonight? I figure Luongo will get back in, but any word on if this will be Bob's first game this year?
 
S

SpectreFire

Member
Considering this would be a measuring stick game for both teams, I'd imagine both teams would go in with their best roster (so far).

EDIT: Alberts in, Tanev out. Looks like AV wants more muscle against the Flyers.
 
C

CCF23

Member
Socreges said:
Agreed... kinda. If he was as excellent as Thomas throughout all seven games (and didn't shit the bed in Boston each night), the teams would have been in very different places mentally.
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I don't think it was as much mental for the Canucks as it was physical. The entire season their power play was one of the biggest factors in them being as good as they were, and Edler and Ehrhoff were among the key contributors to that. Not only do both get injured, but both get injured in a way that completely ruined their effectiveness on the PP. Edler breaks his hand and Ehrhoff fucks up his shoulder...Welp, the Bruins can see our D isn't going to shoot the puck, may as well shut down the forwards. It worked.

Add to that the fact that Kesler and Henrik were also both playing through pretty serious injuries and suddenly your first power play unit is only playing with one healthy body (Daniel). I won't even mention the 2nd power play unit, because it was just horrible.
 
A

aidan

Hugo Award Winning Author and Editor
Shockingly, it sounds like Kabanov is heading over to Europe to play in either the KHL or the SEL.
 
L

LoneWolf296

Member
brucewaynegretzky said:
I guess Lavy has managed to tame his instinctual need to switch out goaltenders without rhyme or reason.
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As much as I don't like Bobs getting his starts (most likely) cut, I know he is going to be a solid and reliable backup should Bryz need the time off, the only other respectable backup in the league is Cory Schneider so tonight should be interesting to see how ours and Vans starters hold up!
 
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