-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NiGHTS into Dreams HD |OT| Dreaming of snow, sparkles, and nightmares [Control patch]
- Thread starter ShadiWulf
- Start date
Not pre-patch Uncharted 3! The fact that managed to get patched and set off so many people definitely shows why it sucks to hinder full analog in games we expect it.
I honestly doubt that, or rather I doubt that's the full story. Nintendo debuted Analog and was their big rival, so either it was A reason to bring out the analog controller and they used NiGHTS as the game to finetune and get it right... or NiGHTS was possibly designed FOR that controller. Then again there's probably enough documentation and whatnot out there on the net I need to consult, but at a minimum I see someone on the NiGHTS staff pointing at Nintendo and Super Mario 64 going "See? We need this!" and getting authorization that way. I'd point out Sony, but I'm pretty sure their analog was the last to be revealed.
It could be speed too. I can't link anywhere near as fast in frozen bell. Even boosted. Completely breaks the ability to do insanely high links. I'd top 400 on Saturn and haven't seen over 50 on this.
Are you saying the Saturn 3D controller was more analogue and sensitive than modern controllers? And that's why the stick controls are not ported 1:1 with the original.
I think it was actually pointed out that the Dreamcast controller was several times more precise and sensitive than the Saturn analog controller. I actually wonder if this might be the opposite: the Analog controller for the Saturn is so far behind every other analog stick afterwards they're trying to compensate for that, only to overdo it? I believe emulators generally work around that well enough though so... what the hell?
What I fear is that maybe some of the designers explicitly WANT it this way, and no amount of outcry will make them budge, given that this was an issue actively brought up then ignored in testing this seems plausible. Also: It REALLY shows when playing as Elliot or Claris on foot, that's where I noticed the controls were worse most.
What I fear is that maybe some of the designers explicitly WANT it this way, and no amount of outcry will make them budge, given that this was an issue actively brought up then ignored in testing this seems plausible. Also: It REALLY shows when playing as Elliot or Claris on foot, that's where I noticed the controls were worse most.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
I believe some of it's there... buried under awful, unskippable cutscenes and a bunch of bullshit events you need to clear in order to get more to the meat that this game consisted of.
If you're willing to try anyway, get it for cheap, not that hard given it's $10 on Amazon. Otherwise I wouldn't bother.
ajim
Member
If you can get through the bullshit, the core gameplay (whilst slightly different) is still very good. The new levels (the traditional NiGHTS ones), music and bosses are fantastic. There is also some great fan service for NiGHTs Saturn fans in the game.
Now, it's just a question of whether or not you can get through all of the 'story' crap, the woeful platforming and other filler missions.
Sigh.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
Stay far away from Journey of Dreams. It is a hilarious train wreck out of context but if you're looking for something like this original NiGHTS game you will have your hopes crushed
Imagine if they took this game and applied a lot of the bad habits that dragged down the 3D Sonic games. An awful story, horrid voice acting, too many tutorials, lots of terrible filler content...
I personally feel Journey of Dreams is to NiGHTS what Sonic 2006 was to Sonic, though I guess JoD isn't really terribly buggy.
Imagine if they took this game and applied a lot of the bad habits that dragged down the 3D Sonic games. An awful story, horrid voice acting, too many tutorials, lots of terrible filler content...
I personally feel Journey of Dreams is to NiGHTS what Sonic 2006 was to Sonic, though I guess JoD isn't really terribly buggy.
I'd argue the effect was far worse too, even if the quality's probably roughly the same. Sonic 2006 was in a long line of games, with plenty of 2D games and Sonic Adventure 1 & 2 at least being fairly solid for their game, but NiGHTS was just... NiGHTS. It's like if we jumped from Sonic 2 or Sonic 3 & Knuckles straight to Sonic 2006. And never ever saw a new Sonic game afterwards, I certainly don't see us getting a Sonic Colors or Sonic Generation equivalent for NiGHTS. Then again, I guess if they decided to go the Sonic 4 route but better executed we'd be fine.
UnlovedJew
Member
Am I the only one who thought that JoD was pretty good minus the controls and story? I thought it was rather fun. The music was fantastic.
That story really drags things down, especially when you can't skip any of it and the game can be just challenging enough that you'll want to put it down for a little bit... only to have to rewatch the damn scene because you decided to quit out and shut the system down. not to mention all those events padding it out.
But seriously, the ability to skip would've been PLENTY to fix the game, but since they feel it's more important to make you watch it it drags the whole thing down.
But seriously, the ability to skip would've been PLENTY to fix the game, but since they feel it's more important to make you watch it it drags the whole thing down.
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
I just finished getting A ranks on every level including the Christmas bonus levels. At first I kind of fought the newer control scheme because I wanted to play NiGHTS HD like I always have on the Saturn for the past 15 or so years but then I adjusted to the slightly different scheme I ended up having a ton of fun. I found the control differences as a new challenge. I've beaten the original NiGHTS on Saturn into the ground by this point so it was OK for me to get pushed out of my comfort zone and treat the game as new again. Of course some people won't want to settle for the differences and that's their prerogative. At least their original Saturn copies will continue to give them their satisfaction.
Other than the obvious difference in control, I am a little disappointed that we don't get the Nightopian music box even though the Nightopian Collection menu option unlocks after you complete all the levels. I suppose it's not too bad but I was hoping I would be able to tinker with it on the 360 as well. At least I can still fire up the Saturn and just do it from there.
All in all, it's a pretty good port even with the control differences and I look forward to trying to keep my name in at least the top 50 for the next weeks to months ahead. I can't believe some people are getting 5 million plus points on some levels. Crazy...
While I may not keep my position in the leader boards for long at least I can be happy seeing stuff like this.
While I'm not holding my breath for a control patch I'd be totally jazzed if we did get one. It would be icing on this delicious cake of SEGA nostalgia. Hopefully the next SEGA Heritage Collection games are just as good or better than what we've seen so far. I look forward to more possible Saturn ports.
-Quoted my pics to resize
What the FUCK!!!!! the damn roller coaster section in stick canyon is absolute proof that the control is completely broken. You can't even control the coaster to grab the orbs! Did whoever ok this shit even bother playing the Saturn version? Or sit down with someone that knew how to play it? GAD DAMN IT. I seriously want my fucking money back. Geez.
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
Sorry to break it to you man but the sled is as controllable as its always been. It's always been difficult to maneuver.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
It's definitely more difficult to maneuver now, though. Like, in the Saturn version, you can get it to point in a specific direction, but here it seems to have a mind of its own.
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
I really wish there were some kind of replay share feature. I have been recording off the TV since I don't have a capture device. It looks alright. I plan to upload some of my more successful videos.
I finally broke the top 20 on Frozen Bell a few minutes ago.
I finally broke the top 20 on Frozen Bell a few minutes ago.
Really sad to hear the controls turned out so iffy. 
I was really looking forward to this. My boyfriend gave me a Saturn USB adapter for my birthday that works with the 3D pad so I could use it with the HD version when it comes out on PC, but it sounds like it wouldn't play right at all.
On the plus side, USB 3D pad + SSF + original Nights disc is a pretty flawless experience, widescreen and all.
I was really looking forward to this. My boyfriend gave me a Saturn USB adapter for my birthday that works with the 3D pad so I could use it with the HD version when it comes out on PC, but it sounds like it wouldn't play right at all.On the plus side, USB 3D pad + SSF + original Nights disc is a pretty flawless experience, widescreen and all.
Actually, on a very similar note:
Son of a bitch I may need to double dip on PC. Unless there's some ridiculous DRM or something (doubt it, Sega's big on Steamworks) SOMEONE is going to figure out how to mod this and get full analog in, making PC definitive beyond having the sharpest (hopefully) visuals. 360 controller would be somewhat preferable anyway to the PS3 controller, not that I don't like it (on average I DO prefer the DualShock for versatility) but the 360 controller's basically following the same evolutionary path the Saturn 3D Controller started, so although by steps it is closest.
I just hit 6th on Frozen Bell. Feelsgoodman
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
It's seriously one of my favorite stages in any game ever. NiGHTS was particularly good when it came to "show, don't tell."
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
In all my years of playing NiGHTS I've never experienced this before. Ellis was wearing a witches costume in Mystic Forest and NiGHTS was dressed differently as well. I remember Christmas Nights having stuff unlock near Christmas and New Year's eve but nothing about Halloween. It was kind of neat to see this Easter egg. I think I woke up my neighbors when I got all excited seeing this...
I took a shot of it with my crummy smartphone camera...
I took a shot of it with my crummy smartphone camera...
Hehe, yeah, that's not in the original one nor in Christmas NiGHTS.
It was added to the PS2 version and since HD is a port of that, it's the same here.
The Halloween ones only show up in Mystic Forest. Claris is a which and Elliot is dressed as Dracula.
Upsidedown Fuji
Member
Hehe, yeah, that's not in the original one nor in Christmas NiGHTS.
It was added to the PS2 version and since HD is a port of that, it's the same here.
The Halloween ones only show up in Mystic Forest. Claris is a which and Elliot is dressed as Dracula.
That explains a lot. I never owned the PS2 version. Cool!
Hehe, yeah, that's not in the original one nor in Christmas NiGHTS.
It was added to the PS2 version and since HD is a port of that, it's the same here.
The Halloween ones only show up in Mystic Forest. Claris is a which and Elliot is dressed as Dracula.
I really liked those small additions they made in the PS2 version.
they also had an unused halloween song that somebody found on the NiGHTS PS2 disc
I wouldn't mind some new Holiday level theme/costume/music DLC for NiGHTS. if it were well done, I would pay for it.
CreateNowSleepLater
Member
I am sorry to say I never played the original. Thinking of picking this up though.
Is that on PSN or XBLA? I'm not seeing this on my XBox360...
Do you need all A-scores for this to appear? I completed the game (all levels) but Mystic forest is still the same for me.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
Regarding bonus content in NiGHTS, here's screenshots I took and posted to GiantBomb from the PS2 version:
Mystic Forest: during the month of October, Claris gets a witch costume. Play on October 31st for Mystic Forest as Elliot in a Vampire costume.
Splash Garden: Play on July 20th to see Claris' summer outfit, or play on August 31st to see Elliot's.
And of course, play on April 1st for Reala.
Mystic Forest: during the month of October, Claris gets a witch costume. Play on October 31st for Mystic Forest as Elliot in a Vampire costume.
Splash Garden: Play on July 20th to see Claris' summer outfit, or play on August 31st to see Elliot's.
And of course, play on April 1st for Reala.
HueyFreeman
Banned
Really is awesome to see everybody enjoying Nights again, never thought I'd see the day.
I really do hope they control patch ultimately. Although it's totally playable and still the same incredible sense of wonder, I'd love to feel that original Saturn control.
I really do hope they control patch ultimately. Although it's totally playable and still the same incredible sense of wonder, I'd love to feel that original Saturn control.
Not sure, but I'd finished it with A before I noticed the Halloween stuff. It's not there in the Saturn mode.
Please reconsider. It's a bargain at this price, and even if you don't play it, if the game is a success Sega will be more inclined to listen. If this doesn't sell, NiGHTS as a franchise might very well be over.
I made a video showing the difference in controls between the Saturn, PS2 and HD version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnrnj6aRzwk
Besides not seeing the witch costume, I also don't know how I can set the system date on an XBox360 when the game requires me to login to Live (which automatically sets the system date). I'd have to create a separate account, but I'd rather keep all my progress on one account.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
Anybody out there willing to double dip? I found an interesting fact - the Playstation 3 version of NiGHTS HD preserves the "unlock everything" button code from the PS2 version, but so far, it has not been discovered in the Xbox 360 version.
I wonder if the PS3 version is more directly emulating the PS2 version? Any of you out there with the PS3 version of NiGHTS HD experiencing the weird control issues so many other people have noticed?
I wonder if the PS3 version is more directly emulating the PS2 version? Any of you out there with the PS3 version of NiGHTS HD experiencing the weird control issues so many other people have noticed?
nice job with the video.
i was going to double dip on the 360 version, but will wait for a patch that may never happen. I already bought the PS3 version, because, well, it's NiGHTS.
Yup. Haven't played the 360 version to compare, but NiGHTS kind of "locks" to a direction and doesn't really move as freely. Playable, but it's been throwing off my combos.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
Hm. I see. Thanks.
I'm really not sure that supporting a botched port is sending the right message, though. Doesn't that also tell Sega that people are willing to accept a subpar product if it's related to a game they enjoyed in the past? That doesn't bode well for a next entry in the series either.
Anyway, waiting for the PC version *is* still an interest in getting the rerelease. It's not our fault that Sega delayed the PC version significantly past the other versions!
Wow, I totally suck at this and I can't see how some of you are getting A's on this. I am having fun though even if I can't beat some bosses yet. I can't manage to beat the fish in the water or the mouse one with the explosions.
Also, I don't really have a problem with the controls but I didn't play the heck out of the Saturn version.
Also, I don't really have a problem with the controls but I didn't play the heck out of the Saturn version.
Ein Bear
Member
I really, really loved JoD. But I played it before the original, so I guess I didn't have the expectations that others did.
The chase scenes based on the core Nights gameplay were perfectly competent and actually quite a good variation on the original Nights, but the rest of the game was awful. I don't have that much patience for slogging through hours of terrible nonsense just to get to the good scenes so my opinion was pretty overwhelmingly negative. If I could have stripped it down to just the "real" levels with no story scenes or filler, or if I loved Z-grade platforming, I'd probably have a different opinion.
Similar threads
- Locked