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[BooJoh]

I think it's easy to get lost in the "rendering 2 frames vs. 1" train of thought. It's true that you're rendering 2 frames for every frame in 3D, but those two frames are identical except for the viewpoint.

So in the code, they need to:
1. Update the game world
2. Render a frame
3. Render the other frame
4. Display both frames

Versus 2D mode running at double framerate, which requires:
1. Update the game world
2. Render a frame
3. Display the frame
4. Update the game world
5. Render a frame
6. Display the frame

The point being, just rendering two frames at slightly different viewpoints takes a little extra power, but there's a lot more happening between each frame of 2D than between the Left and Right frames of 3D. So it's probably false logic to assume that disabling 3D automatically allows double the 2D frames.

At least that's my assumptions on the matter.

 

[EatChildren]

I get that. However, is 3D mode demanding the hardware to generate double the frames? If so, hardware capable of 60FPS in 3D should be capable of a higher frame rate when in a 2D software mode via game menu (not slider), wouldn't it?

It is more demanding and yes, you could theoretically get more FPS from playing a game in 2D. But not all games will bother doing it, especially if they can lock 60fps in either mode.

But if you simply turn down the slider (without any in-game option saying "hey, click this and you'll have double FPS in 2d mode") in DoA will the game automatically go from 30 to 60?

I assume that's a "no", right?

Also, is this option in SSF IV just a "that website" invention/rumor or is it really there?
Either way, the game is 60 FPS, right?

All i want is 60 FPS in games like Kid Icarus and Mario Kart 3DS... possibly in 3d.

I'm pretty sure DoA switches fps in real time when in 2D mode, not through any menu option. Im not positive though.

As far as we're aware SSFIV is 60fps in both modes. Kid Icarus looks like it has framerate problems regardless of what you play it in. Knowing Nintendo's track record Mario Kart should be 60fps.

 

[FoneBone]

But if you simply turn down the slider (without any in-game option saying "hey, click this and you'll have double FPS in 2d mode") in DoA will the game automatically go from 30 to 60?

I assume that's a "no", right?

Why would you assume that? And why wouldn't it?

 

[BooJoh]

Why would you assume that? And why wouldn't it?

Probably because SFIV has it as a menu option, and it's not entirely clear whether or not a game can detect the state of the 3D slider like that?

 

[Gospel]

But if you simply turn down the slider (without any in-game option saying "hey, click this and you'll have double FPS in 2d mode") in DoA will the game automatically go from 30 to 60?

I assume that's a "no", right?

Also, is this option in SSF IV just a "that website" invention/rumor or is it really there?
Either way, the game is 60 FPS, right?

All i want is 60 FPS in games like Kid Icarus and Mario Kart 3DS... possibly in 3d.

The Mario Kart demo thing was running at 60 fps according to IGN.

 

[redbarchetta]

Probably because SFIV has it as a menu option, and it's not entirely clear whether or not a game can detect the state of the 3D slider like that?

Games definitely know the position of the 3D slider. Changing the amount of 3D is a software function handled by the game itself, thus it has to know what that slider is set to.

 

[Fernando Rocker]

Team Meat confirms 3DS development...

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/02/28/team-meat-3ds-development/

 

[BooJoh]

Games definitely know the position of the 3D slider. Changing the amount of 3D is a software function handled by the game itself, thus it has to know what that slider is set to.

I wasn't sure about this. People have said that it affects the position of the ingame cameras or something like that, but I assumed it would probably be a predetermined function that operates pretty transparently for software developers to ensure effective and consistent functionality.

 

[donkey show]

Probably because SFIV has it as a menu option, and it's not entirely clear whether or not a game can detect the state of the 3D slider like that?

You're getting confused. "3D mode" in the menu is simply the name of the over-the-shoulder mode. The 3D slider works the same regardless of what mode you're in.

 

[Truth101]

Team Meat confirms 3DS development...

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/02/28/team-meat-3ds-development/

Hoho, Super Meat Boy 3DS to be the superior version

Spoiler

I hope

 

[BooJoh]

You're getting confused. "3D mode" in the menu is simply the name of the over-the-shoulder mode. The 3D slider works the same regardless of what mode you're in.

My bad. Someone quoted Go Nintendo and their statement "This isn't done through the slider, but instead the 3D option in the main menu. When you turn that off, the game will double up in framerate."

I figured the framerate increase was BS, didn't realize the entire statement was.

 

[Dreamwriter]

But if you simply turn down the slider (without any in-game option saying "hey, click this and you'll have double FPS in 2d mode") in DoA will the game automatically go from 30 to 60?

The game detects that the player has turned off 3D, and changes itself how it works to run at 60fps instead of 30fps. It's something the developers specifically did, no other 3DS game does anything like it; it's not part of the hardware or standard or anything, just the one case.

And yeah, the website things was just a crappy website rumor, there are videos of SSFIV in 3D running at 60fps (you can tell it's 3D, as the camera occasionally crosses the "sweet spot" and you can see the other point of view).

 

[Donnie]

Probably because SFIV has it as a menu option, and it's not entirely clear whether or not a game can detect the state of the 3D slider like that?

If the game couldn't detect the state of the 3D slider then when its turned right down and the parallax barrier is remove the game would still be displaying two images and it would just look like double vision.

 

[Graphics Horse]

At least that unequivocally puts to bed the notion that it uses a fixed barrier.

Also it does use rectangular pixels for a true 800x240,, I didn't expect that. The RGB elements are arranged vertically, which is a good thing for reducing colour distortion at the edges of the barrier.

 

[VOOK]

'On FedEX vehicle for delivery'

YES!

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

'On FedEX vehicle for delivery'

YES!

When dealing with FedEX, do they:

1) deliver on Saturdays, or if not,

2) give you a good idea of delivery time?

 

[VOOK]

Not on Saturdays in Perth at least, and they say 'before 5pm'. Q_Q

 

[Jonnyram]

Been picking up a few StreetPass people here and there. This is definitely off to a slow start, though. I remember when Nintendogs first came out, there were a LOT of people using the function.

 

[Hero of Legend]

My bad. Someone quoted Go Nintendo and their statement "This isn't done through the slider, but instead the 3D option in the main menu. When you turn that off, the game will double up in framerate."

I figured the framerate increase was BS, didn't realize the entire statement was.

That was me, I had a feeling something was up, that's why I brought it here for clarification.

 

[DJmizuhara]

Been picking up a few StreetPass people here and there. This is definitely off to a slow start, though. I remember when Nintendogs first came out, there were a LOT of people using the function.

Yeah it's defiantly off to a slow start, I went to 3 video games stores and a McDonald's yesterday to see if I could get any StreetPass action and NOTHING! All the cool kids in McDonald's where playing Monster Hunter (you could tell, they all had the crawl hand). Gonna try it again today after work to see if I get a hit.

 

[M3d10n]

I think it's easy to get lost in the "rendering 2 frames vs. 1" train of thought. It's true that you're rendering 2 frames for every frame in 3D, but those two frames are identical except for the viewpoint.

So in the code, they need to:
1. Update the game world
2. Render a frame
3. Render the other frame
4. Display both frames

Versus 2D mode running at double framerate, which requires:
1. Update the game world
2. Render a frame
3. Display the frame
4. Update the game world
5. Render a frame
6. Display the frame

The point being, just rendering two frames at slightly different viewpoints takes a little extra power, but there's a lot more happening between each frame of 2D than between the Left and Right frames of 3D. So it's probably false logic to assume that disabling 3D automatically allows double the 2D frames.

At least that's my assumptions on the matter.

Also, there are various other calculations which only need to be done once:
- Real time shadows (they are rendered from the light's POV and can be re-used for both images)
- CPU-based character skinning (aka: animating the model to match the joints)
- Updating particle positions.
- Real-time environment reflections.

These are the items that must be done twice:
- Vertex processing (transformation and shaders - vertices must be submitted twice to the GPU).
- Polygon assembly and clipping.
- Rasterisation (drawing the actual pixels) and per-pixel effects.

So, GPU-wise, rendering in 3D does means doubling the polycount and drawing twice the amount of pixels. If Nintendo had decided on 3D earlier, maybe they could have time to order a custom GPU with a modified geometry pipeline which takes two camera matrices instead of one and does the geometry doubling on the GPU (reusing as much non-view dependent data as possible), so they wouldn't have needed to increase the clock speed so much as they did.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

This is what you tech guys have been waiting for.

Hope they get the other parts out fast

I'm dying to find out if it's 96 meg or 128 meg.

 

[Cheesemeister]

Yeah it's defiantly off to a slow start, I went to 3 video games stores and a McDonald's yesterday to see if I could get any StreetPass action and NOTHING! All the cool kids in McDonald's where playing Monster Hunter (you could tell, they all had the crawl hand). Gonna try it again today after work to see if I get a hit.

You have to be careful how you handle the Miis you meet via StreetPass.

When new Miis appear in the Mii Plaza via StreetPass, exiting the Mii Plaza or going to the entrance to retrieve more new Miis before utilizing them in StreetPass Puzzle or StreetPass Quest forfeits their help. New StreetPass arrivals are limited to 10 people at a time.

 

[Kinspiracy]

Hoho, Super Meat Boy 3DS to be the superior version

Spoiler

I hope

Doubtful. I can always buy a new 360 controller when I snap it out of frustration. I don't want to have to replace my 3DS.

 

[BooJoh]

You have to be careful how you handle the Miis you meet via StreetPass.

So essentially using the Mii in StreetPass Quest or Puzzle saves them to your Mii Plaza, and if you don't use them they'll be gone? Or do they also disappear after using them in the games?

EDIT - or the alternative, that you keep the Miis either way, but can only use them in the games when they first arrive?

 

[Gravijah]

Doubtful. I can always buy a new 360 controller when I snap it out of frustration. I don't want to have to replace my 3DS.

You could always learn some self control. Or you could buy some cheap Mad Catz PS1 controllers to break when you get angry.

 

[Cheesemeister]

So essentially using the Mii in StreetPass Quest or Puzzle saves them to your Mii Plaza, and if you don't use them they'll be gone? Or do they also disappear after using them in the games?

Greeting Miis in the entrance of the Mii Plaza saves them to the Mii Plaza, clearing them out of the queue of 10. The Mii Plaza is the rank and file display of all the people you've met. Being able to use newly-met Miis get canceled if you go back to the entrance to greet more Miis or exit the program, which is really frustrating after you finally got data via StreetPass.

EDIT - or the alternative, that you keep the Miis either way, but can only use them in the games when they first arrive?

This.

 

[VOOK]

Got mine, so preeeety

 

[Kinspiracy]

You could always learn some self control. Or you could buy some cheap Mad Catz PS1 controllers to break when you get angry.

Self control is for shlubs. The point being that playing SMB, at least for me, put a ton of stress on the controller (mostly the left stick) just playing the game. I would not want to put that amount of pressure on the 3DS slider.

 

[isny]

Greeting Miis in the entrance of the Mii Plaza saves them to the Mii Plaza, clearing them out of the queue of 10. The Mii Plaza is the rank and file display of all the people you've met. Being able to use newly-met Miis get canceled if you go back to the entrance to greet more Miis or exit the program, which is really frustrating after you finally got data via StreetPass.

I can only imagine how great these features are going to be at conventions like Comic Con, Blizzcon, etc.

 

[Zee-Row]

Team Meat confirms 3DS development...

http://www.joystiq.com/2011/02/28/team-meat-3ds-development/

Nintendo just need to drop the size restrictions for games , if the game is too big we can just get a bigger card. Nintendo needs to realize that.

 

[Vic]

Got mine, so preeeety

Already?!

 

[Boney]

Got mine, so preeeety

piiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiics

 

[Gravijah]

Got mine, so preeeety

Since you're getting 3 (IIRC), you got at least one of each color right?

 

[Luigiv]

To add to the 60vs30 fps discussion, the reason DoAD is capable of a framerate doubling in 2D mode, was because it was optimised for 2D mode first; So in actuallity it's not framerate doubling in 2d but rather framerate halving in 3D. Essentially, TN were unable to optimise the rendering pipeline enough to get 60fps in 3D and they didn't want to compromise the graphical fidelity so they just took the easy way out by framerate halving.

 

[VOOK]

Since you're getting 3 (IIRC), you got at least one of each color right?

Sure did.

Here's some shitty iPhone pics, at work

And my Mii... my Wii one looks better, will import that!

Friend code is 4725-7909-5151, add me and I'll add joo.

Big thanks to CXVFreak for sending to it me <3

 

[NateDrake]

With the Japanese launch now done and some European outlets getting hardware in hand I wonder when the USA sites will begin to get localized hardware. Must be soon and it will lead to more in-depth impressions of the menu and other features hopefully.

 

[EatChildren]

Vook.

There has been a mistake.

A mix up.

A problem.

You have the 3DS that was supposed to be sent to me.

But that is okay.

Because you're a pretty cool dude.

You must send it to me now though.

Today.

Because its mine.

Thank you.

- EatChildren

 

[Boney]

So who's gonna send me mine

 

[Luigiv]

Sure did.

Here's some shitty iPhone pics, at work

http://imgur.com/cQpqH.jpg[IMG]

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/psZKl.jpg[IMG]

And my Mii... my Wii one looks better, will import that!

[IMG]http://imgur.com/Jjw5M.jpg[IMG]

Friend code is 4725-7909-5151, add me and I'll add joo.

Big thanks to CXVFreak for sending to it me <3[/QUOTE]
Oh sweet, time to activate that bug I planted on you last Saturday. ;)

 

[Vic]

How generous of you cvxfreak to send free 3DSes to your fellow GAF members...

...

DOT DOT DOT

 

[DeathbyVolcano]

I need some good HD videos comparing the Black and the Blue. I usually stick to black systems, but considering this is so glossy...I don't know, the blue looks pretty slick.

 

[EatChildren]

So who's gonna send me mine

Vook.

When he gets his second one.

 

[WillyFive]

It's only a month. Stop begging. Jeez.

 

[VOOK]

Oh god why did it have to come in the morning, so much work to do

*plays anyway*

 

[Gravijah]

It's only a month. Stop begging. Jeez.

get out of our clubhouse

 

[Jonnyram]

Add me VOOK
5412-9851-7872

 

[Boney]

Vook.

When he gets his second one.

REALLY!?

oh my gosh I'm so happy

thank you vooooook

 

[VOOK]

Add me VOOK
5412-9851-7872

Added!

Yes I won a 3DS at the launch event at Sydney, so that should be coming soon too (and in English )

 

[Cheesemeister]

Added!

Yes I won a 3DS at the launch event at Sydney, so that should be coming soon too (and in English )

Perhaps you'd be so kind as to verify the region lock (as if we didn't know already).