Nintendo 3DS Japanese Launch Thread
- Thread starter Cheesemeister
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ViperVisor said:I can't be the only one who failed when not judging distance correctly in these 2 places.
I don't remember how I did in the original since I haven't played the original in a long time, but I did play the Super Mario Galaxy 2 remake of the second level and had the cloud suit on and was making jumps football field length with no hesitation.
God making jumps with Cloud Suit Mario is so satisfying.
rpmurphy said:
Genuinely, no. The only time I miss jumps is when the jump is intentionally hard to make, because the platform is absurdly small and there's an extremely tiny timing window (you have to jump off at the edge at just the right point to make a jump) to make it like a lot of the Super Meat Boy levels. Not because I didn't judge the distance accurately.
Cheesemeister said:
More @ veal. They look like the exact same buttons as the DSI. Its not that they are cheap or break easily, its that, where they are located it is SUPER easy for dust/dirt/grime to get in under the button and make it so your button hits don't register.
Thats why blowing into them repairs it (until the moisture damage makes it so the DSi doesn't turn on for an hour)
I have a feeling these will have the same problem.
Soloution: always put it in a case or pouch, never just throw it into your bag or pocket.
New SF4 review: 9/10 - CVG
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/291433/reviews/street-fighter-iv-3d-edition-review/
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/291433/reviews/street-fighter-iv-3d-edition-review/
My way to work will never be the same.
EmCeeGramr
Member
Hey I never had problems aiming in RE4, but when I tried the two different control methods in RE4: Wii by plugging in my GameCube controller I was popping heads like nobody's business and blowing through Mercenaries and the shooting galleries way better and faster than I ever did on the original.Jinfash said:
I don't exaggerate the original like some terrible As Seen On TV advertisement (cue B/W footage of disheveled gamer fumbling with analog stick while screaming) but the improvement was there.
And yeah, lots of people DO kinda have issues telling depth in 3D platformers, especially in areas like the Mario games shown above. If you didn't have those shadows, you'd have seen a ton of people missing the mark before they got it right. It's not a debilitating nightmare, but being able to tell just by looking at the depth between the two platforms is a boon for some people.
Great example. Also, Ratchet and Clank, Mario Galaxy swimming levels, etc. Any time I have to rotate the camera to get alternate angles is a time I could benefit from stereoscopic.ViperVisor said:I can't be the only one who failed when not judging distance correctly in these 2 places.
redbarchetta
Banned
Amir0x said:
I also was quite adept and prefer aiming on the GameCube. However, aiming on the Wii is objectively faster and more accurate (unless you have an unsteady hand or something). You can unquestionably aim from one corner to the other faster than what's possible with the analog stick--there is no disputing this.
Amir0x said:
If it's indeed the "same thing," then determining distances using 3D is also objectively more accurate. You may not need it, nor may it enhance your particular feelings toward it, but it is more accurate.
Amir0x said:
For you, indeed. And is it really that surprising that new innovations may highlight problems that existed before? People weren't exactly knocking the one-analog second design until they were given a second either.
Amir0x said:
Where have I tried to convince anyone that 3D is objectively better for them (perhaps others have, but don't lump me in with them)? I'm merely trying to highlight the fact that is is subjective, and the mere act of compiling a list of pros and cons (some of dubious importance) really serves no one but yourself.
Some of your drawbacks are facts (limited viewing angles) of varying subjective importance. Hell, this thread has already proven many hardcore gamers can barely perceive frame rate differences. However, some of your other "facts" are more dubious in nature. If you experience headaches, that's fine. Most people won't have that problem, however. Also, most 3DS games do not suffer performance degradation, and the few that do doesn't automatically mean it's not worth the off-set of what many people deem to be a "magical" effect.
I just feel like the issue isn't as two-dimensional (heh) as you present it as. Just because some want 3D doesn't mean their gimmick-whores or shit at games.
Are they fucking serious?
I LOVE SF4 and I already have the 3d rev paid off...
but yeah, people are going to PREFER the 3d version with the shitty D-pad and no arcade stick, and having buttons on the fucking shoulders.
Come on now. Absurd thing to say in a review, shows you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about, and makes sure I will never go to/read your site for any reason.
That is just moronic.
redbarchetta said:
There was never a problem with judging distance before. It's just magically being invented as a problem now. Never once have I ever heard a gamer mention "oh jee I wish Mario was in 3D because I sure have trouble judging distance in these jumps!"
And they never will because it's idiotic. Judging distance NOW is obscenely easy. It's not even the same as a wiimote, which objectively does make aiming faster (the same way any pointer would). There is simply virtually no difficulty judging distance in gaming in its current state. You're talking about making something easy into something easy. There's no real world benefit there, the movement is infinitesimal at best. It's not a real lateral movement. It's not helping most gamers in any way they actually needed help in.
Now, before the parade of people pretending they had trouble making jumps come out and how they always dreamed 3D would come to solve their crappy platforming skills, let me just that if we lived in a world where the 3D had no drawbacks we'd have no discussion at all. But we don't.
redbarchetta said:
You just literally repeated what my tiny sentence meant in multiple paragraphs. You misinterpreted the first part too. My statement said 'you're trying to convince yourself that I think my opinion is fact.' If I thought my opinion was fact, I would say it was a fact. I don't mince words.
The rest just mirrors what I said - the drawbacks are facts. THEIR importance to you, or anyone else, is not.
Sorry, I shouldn't have even brought up the N64 thing, I realize it was silly. My original comparison was that the 3DS was a 3D PSP. This is what I meant. Sorry for the confusion (even than I realize its more powerful, I just can't get over these comparisons)
At this point the 3DS's graphics are very similar to the PSP's. I realize launch 3DS games won't utilize entire hardware and that it is slightly more powerful. That was just my original intention, although many will find it stupid, its all I got. I'm just trying to emphasis the importance of 3D to me.
At this point the 3DS's graphics are very similar to the PSP's. I realize launch 3DS games won't utilize entire hardware and that it is slightly more powerful. That was just my original intention, although many will find it stupid, its all I got. I'm just trying to emphasis the importance of 3D to me.
Guys, if you want a troll thread go elsewhere. We're having a discussion. Feel free to move the discussion to whatever is currently on your mind about 3DS and ignore this particular discussion. This thread can contain ANY 3DS launch discussion.
Man that is something. I mean, hell, the blocks DO cast shadows. lol
Glix said:
Man that is something. I mean, hell, the blocks DO cast shadows. lol
EmCeeGramr
Member
I've heard people talking about 3D platformers and the difficulty of judging distances long before the current 3D craze started.Amir0x said:
TylDurden said:Sorry, I shouldn't have even brought up the N64 thing, I realize it was silly. My original comparison was that the 3DS was a 3D PSP. This is what I meant. Sorry for the confusion (even than I realize its more powerful, I just can't get over these comparisons)
At this point the 3DS's graphics are very similar to the PSP's. I realize launch 3DS games won't utilize entire hardware and that it is slightly more powerful. That was just my original intention, although many will find it stupid, its all I got.
Dude, that KHBBS shot is a CRAZY bullshot. That is NOT a real screengrab.
Wrestlemania
Banned
It's not that 3D distance was impossible before, just that 3D undoubtedly makes it easier and allows you do do so more accurately and in a way that more closely resembles how you'd do it in real life. But, you know, things are okay as they are, so why improve?
Amir0x said:
It's a legitimate issue I've always had with certain 3D games. I honestly thought everyone had to deal with it, but it's not a giant issue or anything. I play 3D platformers fine, but I might have a stupid death or something because it was hard to tell how far I was supposed to jump.
Just out of curiosity, what are those drawbacks you keep talking about (serious question)?Amir0x said:
I imagine framerate would be one of them, but I don't see how that's different from say, prettier graphics. In that particular case, it's just as legitimate as sacrificing 60 fps for better graphics (which is something the vast majority of developers do).
I do agree that as far as gameplay goes, 3D can't really improve anything in any meaningfull way, but I always thought of 3D as something like graphics. It doesn't necessarilly change the gameplay, but people want it anyway.
Gravijah said:
I think it's hard to tell the type of momentum a character needs to make a jump distance, but it's never the distance itself that seemed to me to be the problem. I know how far something is, I just usually have to test to see if my character can make the jump. And if you're any good at Mario (or any other platformer), usually you already have pre-calculated such things.
I am now interested to see when a real 3D platformer comes out, if it even changes your deaths. I suspect you'd die anyway. That's not an insult but I really do not think it's DISTANCE JUDGING that is the culprit.
I think this judging distance thing has never really been an outspoken problem due to limitations of how we play our games, but I definitely remember people constantly say how Mirror's Edge just didn't work because you didn't know your character's physical relation to the environment. In this case, I think 3D would really help with that game and make it a lot more enjoyable with fewer trial and error "why can't I make this jump" situations.
That's just one example I can think of though, it really is hard to think of more useful 3D implementation if any.
That's just one example I can think of though, it really is hard to think of more useful 3D implementation if any.
From The Dust
Banned
we should also compare it to DDD. just to be even
redbarchetta
Banned
Amir0x said:
Someone just posted about this like a page back...(and I actually remember those parts being tricky as well). It's something that perhaps isn't often complained about because it's simply so common. As I said before, no one complained about having a single analog stick either until dual-sticks became the norm.
Amir0x said:
Obscenely easy? Ask anyone who played Epic Mickey. Camera controls, for platformers in particular, still aren't perfect and is something actual depth may actually be able to improve.
Regardless, whether or not it enhances gameplay is hardly the only reason to desire 3D. It can enhance immersion much as HD has, which enhanced gameplay directly even less.
Amir0x said:
You don't have to explicitly say something is a fact to present it as one, such as when you earlier used a false dilemma to call out those who enjoy 3D as "gimmick lovers" in contrast to those who "want substance," as if the two were mutually exclusive.
(I did indeed mis-read your first sentence, so I apologize for that transgression).
Jinfash
needs 2 extra inches
Improvements on different aspects of a game (from controls to depth perception) can be attained , no question, but I think some of these improvements -especially offered by 3D- are greatly exaggerated and reads like an As Seen On TV ad. A lot of people are extremely sold on the idea even before getting their hands on it, and before the games that will supposedly define these improvements are even released... All while completely ignoring the drawbacks of the technology on the 3DS.EmCeeGramr said:
As I see it now, 3D is an interesting new novelty with a couple of possible upsides. Whether it is so justifiable that it could turn into a standard remains to be seen.
Pavaloo said:
Mirror's Edge I think was an issue of orientation. Most people aren't used to platforming in first person, so they had to get a picture of where their footing was in their mind. It took me a little bit to re-orient to that perspective too. If it was third person, I think people wouldn't have a problem.
-WindYoshi-
Banned
It's funny how my comment disappeared. Wanting me to post it again? Traps are fun.
redbarchetta said:
I have Epic Mickey. it wasn't distance that was the problem with that fucking game. *grumble* It makes me angry even talking about it. I anticipated that game so much
It "enhances" immersion at the "expense" of a host of other things - for example, toss motion control gameplay out if you want to use the 3D of 3DS. Color degradation is, to me, a trade-off not worth 3D. It's been mentioned in several reviews. The horrendous viewing angle. The extreme difficulty in finding a sweet spot (some games which seemingly have none at all, just bad 3D in general). We would have had a second touch screen, but now we don't because of the 3D screen. A bad trade off by any measure. The wide variety of games that have technical downgrades in 3D, and they will only go up as the systems life goes on. If all games didn't use it we'd get better visuals across the board.
Generally speaking, whenever I have to think MORE about something than I did before the immersion goes DOWN.
Glix said:
Sorry, I'm seriously not trying to troll, here, just sharing what I've seen. I feel KH3DS shots are too far off while Kid Icarus seems to be right around the corner. I guess its possible they both release at the same time that was just my understanding. I couldn't find good gameplay shots of KHBBS that showed characters as close up as that shot if Kid Icarus which is most likely a cinematic shot as well so I felt they were very comparable.The M.O.B said:
Attempting to stay on topic is there a good place for stereoscopic videos of now launch 3DS games in action. YT3D seems to be very limited.
Just realized: that crazy flying bicycle in Pilotwings can probably be driven on the ground. In other words, you could drive it to the top of the mountain and then dive off a cliff and fly from there. Functionally, it's like a car that turns into a hang glider that turns into a plane!
Also, here's hoping the other two vehicles (as apparently there are two more for a total of six, which is twice as much as I was expecting) will be skydiving and the birdman. Those are just two very unique gameplay styles.
Also, here's hoping the other two vehicles (as apparently there are two more for a total of six, which is twice as much as I was expecting) will be skydiving and the birdman. Those are just two very unique gameplay styles.
redbarchetta
Banned
Amir0x said:I have Epic Mickey. it wasn't distance that was the problem with that fucking game. *grumble* It makes me angry even talking about it. I anticipated that game so much
I was looking forward to it too =(
Amir0x said:
Actually, I've played with the 3DS pretty extensively, and motion-controls worked fine for the 3D AR stuff, since I was keeping the system level with your eyes (I suspect they may vary person-to-person, but I had no trouble with it). Tilting, granted, would not work, and in such a case a game could simply use 2D. Not every game is going to use motion controls, just as not every game needs to use 3D.
And I've not read many, or any, reports of the sweet spot being "extreme difficulty" to find. Conversely, I found it extremely easy (less than a second) and even easier to maintain. If you move around a lot when you game, sure, 3D may not be for you, but I don't have a tendency to fidget when playing, so 3D enhances the experience by making it more immersive.
Sammy Samusu
Member
TylDurden
Banned
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i don't mean to say i told you so, but i told you soAmir0x said:I have Epic Mickey. it wasn't distance that was the problem with that fucking game. *grumble* It makes me angry even talking about it. I anticipated that game so much
UncleSporky
Member
I think the point is that even an extreme pro at judging distance in 3D will fall every once in a while, and 3D could mean the difference between making it or not in those cases. For those who are less of an expert, it could make a huge difference.
In fact I would love to see a nice case study on this, have someone playing a series of games known for tricky platforming in both 2D and 3D, just to see the results.
In fact I would love to see a nice case study on this, have someone playing a series of games known for tricky platforming in both 2D and 3D, just to see the results.