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[cireza]

Okay, I was wrong on that part. Just read up on what you've mentioned here. The cost of distributing on the larger 64GB cart is a problem, but a problem Nintendo created deliberately then?

Have they ever mentioned why they've stopped offering the other tiers as options?

Hum, I think that this is tied to the format they need. It is now higher speed on Switch 2, and in that format, there are no manufacturers of 8/16/32 sizes. So they would have to pay themselves to have such product lines created. They didn't, and simply offered this Game Key Cards as an alternate solution. Except that third parties are not using the 64 GB at all, despite their games being sometimes 50+ GB.

They created a bad situation for them (or did they ?), because third party games sales on Switch 2 are not going to get the traction they hope too, especially facing direct competition from... the exact same games on Switch 1.

Can't believe how nobody at Nintendo could predict this situation. Unless they did ? But didn't care in order to favor their own games at launch (all on 64 GB carts) to then come out and say "Oh my God your games are not selling ? We are so fucking sorry, we are going to introduce new carts now that our own games are the only ones that got sold during this super complicated launch year for us, and we are not telling you we are quite happy with the situation because this will definitely make better reports for our shareholders". This, more or less.

 

[existensmaximum]

That just makes it sound like you put more importance on the resale value of your purchase instead of being important because it's something that you can keep forever that doesn't required a full game install/download or a server validation to work.

If Nintendo allows you to trad/resale digital games back to them would you be OK with digital games at that point?

For me it's a matter of not trusting Nintendo because of their long history of quickly shutting down every other online service and eShop that they have used up until this point.

I'm looking at my SEGA Genesis 3 system that's still plugged to my CRT TV that still have those games I had for years now that still work

These Game Key Card games? I expect them to be in a landfill 20-30 years from now because clearly not enough people want them now and even less people are going to want them later.

Oh no, I agree with you 100%. I don't trust them or Sony or anyone else one else when it comes to that.

For me there are two issues: the one you mention, and the fact that I want a physical copy of the game to collect or resell, should I ever want to. Buying a game that you can't even resell is insane and extremely anti-consumer.

Digital only games hold no value to me, like pirated copies. All I'm saying is that game key cards are at least better than digital downloads.

 

[Dacvak]

Oh no, I agree with you 100%. I don't trust them or Sony or anyone else one else when it comes to that.

For me there are two issues: the one you mention, and the fact that I want a physical copy of the game to collect or resell, should I ever want to. Buying a game that you can't even resell is insane and extremely anti-consumer.

Digital only games hold no value to me, like pirated copies. All I'm saying is that game key cards are at least better than digital downloads.

Exactly. They're a better alternative to a download code in a box, and they open up the opportunity for indie games that can't afford a X0,000 copy minimum on a 64gb card the ability to still have a physical release.

The biggest problem with the whole thing are publishers that will abuse the lower costs of the key cards and choose to release their games on those, when they can afford the margins and minimums of a real game card.

The best compromise solution Nintendo could make, imo, is enforcing an order "maximum" on key card releases. This way if you're ordering, say, 100,000 physical copies of your game, you're forced to use a real game card.

The option to use key cards should only be available for publishers that NEED them, where the only alternative would be a download code in a box, or a digital-only release.

Key cards are not inherently a bad idea. It's whether or not publishers abuse the system, and if Nintendo has consumer protections in place or not.

 

[ReyBrujo]

Have they ever mentioned why they've stopped offering the other tiers as options?

Literally Samsung nor other companies are building small sized cards anymore. It's like wanting to buy a new 2gb graphics card today. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if the 64gb is expensive because they (manufacturers, not Nintendo) don't want to produce such small cards anymore.

 

[digdug2]

The idea that Nintendo will ever phase out a platform with >150mil online consoles in the wild is absurd.
If the big consoles (PS2, SNES) had been online from the start studios would still be making games for them and users would still be buying those games.
Users won't ever abandon a console that keeps getting new games and studios won't ever stop making games for a platform that has lots of users.

A smarter Nintendo could've made their "SNES Classic" console an online only SNES console with 5GB of storage (1GB holds the entire existing SNES library) and sold it for $200 with one wired SNES controller.
If it looked exactly like an SNES and had the exact same wired SNES controllers - hundreds of millions of people would buy it, regardless of what it actually does.
Brand new AAA SNES games would start rolling in from studios because users would buy them.
They could sell new collectible carts (box, manual, extras) that just tell the console which digital game to play and rack up an another $10-20 per game from people who want the full SNES experience.

Nintendo could launch or relaunch additional online consoles but it would be insane for them to ever stop selling games to users with existing ones.
Nintendo being publicly traded means that an obviously counterproductive move like that would effectively be impossible.

It's not absurd that Nintendo would do that. They shut down their Wii and 3DS servers. Wii sold over 101 million consoles and 3DS sold over 75 million. Nintendo was a publicly traded company when they stopped letting people download their purchased games on both of the above mentioned consoles, so what's stopping them from doing it again?

Edit: I was wrong. You can still download your Wii, Wii U, and 3DS purchases and I hope it stays that way.

 

[Sorcerer]

I think it's obvious that Nintendo saw keycards as a way to maintain a retail presence. The cards literally don't make sense. Nintendo wants it both ways, they want to be all digital but want to be in stores so customers can be remined of Nintendo every time they pass an electronics department in a store. Worth it just for the advertising aspect alone, doesn't even matter if you buy a game or not because you may just go home and download the game on your own. Bad for the retailer, great for Nintendo.

 

[CrustyBritches]

If given the option between game on cart or game key, nobody would chose the cart without the game.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Hum, I think that this is tied to the format they need. It is now higher speed on Switch 2, and in that format, there are no manufacturers of 8/16/32 sizes. So they would have to pay themselves to have such product lines created. They didn't, and simply offered this Game Key Cards as an alternate solution. Except that third parties are not using the 64 GB at all, despite their games being sometimes 50+ GB.

They created a bad situation for them (or did they ?), because third party games sales on Switch 2 are not going to get the traction they hope too, especially facing direct competition from... the exact same games on Switch 1.

Can't believe how nobody at Nintendo could predict this situation. Unless they did ? But didn't care in order to favor their own games at launch (all on 64 GB carts) to then come out and say "Oh my God your games are not selling ? We are so fucking sorry, we are going to introduce new carts now that our own games are the only ones that got sold during this super complicated launch year for us, and we are not telling you we are quite happy with the situation because this will definitely make better reports for our shareholders". This, more or less.

Specifically, they need SD Express format support

In reality SD Express has existed as a defined format spec for nearly a decade now but nobody bothered to make SD Express cards because no one really used SD Express until Nintendo came along and had the problem where they needed to build the Switch 2 but didn't want to use full blown PCIe SSD's as the internal storage format probably because of expense, large internal space needed, and trying to figure out how to make an internal SSD easily user-replaceable but also foolproof and not compromise the durability of the handheld

At this point nobody is going to go out of their way to develop smaller than 64 GB flash memory modules for anything really not just SD Express so Nintendo is kind of stuck. Thus, Game Key Cards

 

[Jacobson]

me reading all the fuck nintendo comments: see profile pic

nintendo provided the option to publishers/devs, so ultimately it's up to them.

nintendo is complicit still of course, but publishers/devs need to be held accountable as well.

 

[Ebrietas]

Switch 2 means you can play in bed. It might run better on Switch 2 than Steam Deck too. And maybe you don't have the PC in the living room but want to play in the couch. Etc

You don't need a Switch 2 to do that.

 

[Sorcerer]

edit

 

[Sorcerer]

Switch 2 means you can play in bed. It might run better on Switch 2 than Steam Deck too. And maybe you don't have the PC in the living room but want to play in the couch. Etc

It's all relative. Switch 2 runs better because its newer. If a Steamdeck 2 comes out it will run better than a Switch 2, presumably. Nintendo makes hardware for the long haul so at a certain point in time, the tech will seem long in the tooth. Just the nature of the beast.

 

[awwr999999]

It's not absurd that Nintendo would do that. They shut down their Wii and 3DS servers. Wii sold over 101 million consoles and 3DS sold over 75 million. Nintendo was a publicly traded company when they stopped letting people download their purchased games on both of the above mentioned consoles, so what's stopping them from doing it again?

A few things. Namely, this is their chance to beat Sony and take the number one spot away from the PS2. Taking that spot will be one thing and taking Switch sales beyond that point as far as possible to make it stick will be another.
All it will take for Sony to maintain (or regain) the PS2's number one spot is them releasing another PS2 console and tacking those sales onto the existing ones.

The second big thing is the reality that the maximum number of potential users for any new console is shrinking everyday.
Users only have so much time and they can spend it on a wide range of beloved legacy consoles from Nintendo and PlayStation.

 

[Dr. Suchong]

What's the point of buying Elden Ring and RDR 2, if you can get those games on PC or PS5/PS4 where their versions look better and are cheaper?

Nintendo Zealots are a weird breed.
Whooping and hollering about finally being able to play games that more rational individuals have enjoyed for years, because of not pledging a foolish fan boy allegiance to Nintendo.

 

[Furball]

That just makes it sound like you put more importance on the resale value of your purchase instead of being important because it's something that you can keep forever that doesn't required a full game install/download or a server validation to work.

If Nintendo allows you to trad/resale digital games back to them would you be OK with digital games at that point?

For me it's a matter of not trusting Nintendo because of their long history of quickly shutting down every other online service and eShop that they have used up until this point.

It's not absurd that Nintendo would do that. They shut down their Wii and 3DS servers. Wii sold over 101 million consoles and 3DS sold over 75 million. Nintendo was a publicly traded company when they stopped letting people download their purchased games on both of the above mentioned consoles, so what's stopping them from doing it again?

U can still download game u purchase from Wii , Wii U and 3DS . They shut down eshop storefront so u cant buy new game but they dont shut down download server .

I think it's obvious that Nintendo saw keycards as a way to maintain a retail presence. The cards literally don't make sense. Nintendo wants it both ways, they want to be all digital but want to be in stores so customers can be remined of Nintendo every time they pass an electronics department in a store. Worth it just for the advertising aspect alone, doesn't even matter if you buy a game or not because you may just go home and download the game on your own. Bad for the retailer, great for Nintendo.

this is only make sense if they use it themselve but Nintendo game are fully on Cart

 

[Xion_Stellar]

U can still download game u purchase from Wii , Wii U and 3DS . They shut down eshop storefront so u cant buy new game but they dont shut down download server .

Yeah you're correct you can still redownload your DSi,X360 and PSP purchases.

But the concern here isn't what we can still do today it's what we will be able to do in the future.

DSi services shut down in 2018 and I still have working 30 year old SEGA Genesis games in my room so can you sit here and say that you're absolutely sure that I will still be able to redownload my DSi purchases to my DSi in 2048? Because neither you or Nintendo can give that guaranteed right now.

Because I dont believe these companies will support back purchases forever and you might say that we are worrying over nothing right now but believe me the moment even a single one of the 3 decides the pull out and stop supporting the download of prior purchases then it will be all of the justification us real physical Nintendo game owners will need to say I told you and people won't be able to disregard this future concern anymore.

 

[Fess]

It's all relative. Switch 2 runs better because its newer. If a Steamdeck 2 comes out it will run better than a Switch 2, presumably. Nintendo makes hardware for the long haul so at a certain point in time, the tech will seem long in the tooth. Just the nature of the beast.

It's the same for all platform, when something new comes out the old stuff will run stuff worse. Can't just sit there waiting for new stuff, that's boring.

The question asked was why you would need a Switch 2 if you have a PC or PS5/PS4, assumably now and not when Steam Deck 2 is out or Xbox Ally or a PlayStation portable or whatever.

Neither a PC or PS5/PS4 is portable, so portability is a solid reason.

And if you only have a PC and no console you might not have that in the living room, so couch gaming could be another reason.

And as said if you only have a Steam Deck the games might run better on Switch 2.

 

[Rat Rage]

Nintendo knows game key cards suck.

They are only asking YOU - a.k.a the stupid consumer they are trying to milk - if YOU think they suck, too.

Bascially, with this survey, they are gauging the level of stupidity within their user base.

I wonder how many people will answer with: "I LOVE GAME KEY CARDS! Please don't stop selling them! OH, an while you are at it, please raise the price of your games to 100 dollars a piece!".

Speaking of which, they should follow up this survey with another one asking how people feel about SW2 game and peripheral prices...

 

[Gambit2483]

It's a decent idea that saves publisher's money, gives games a retail presence, and preserves ownership transfer to customers, but I wish they'd disallow publishers from doing code-in-a-box.

It wreaks havoc on storage space.

I'm OK with it for games that are way too big and wouldn't have been possible otherwise, but all other games should be physically on the card.

It will eventually severely limit how much you can store on your system. By year 3 we will need MULTIPLE micro sd cards.

 

[tr1p1ex]

It wreaks havoc on storage space.

I'm OK with it for games that are way too big and wouldn't have been possible otherwise, but all other games should be physically on the card.

It will eventually severely limit how much you can store on your system. By year 3 we will need MULTIPLE micro sd cards.

like all the other systems?

btw, you're paying for the storage in the end no matter where it is. That's the whole reason 3rd parties do key cards and previously did codes in the box and would use a cheaper smaller cart for half the game and require a download for the rest.


It's all moving to digital anyway. It's been that way on pc for 10+ years. Even Nintendo gaming software revenue is over 50% digital now.

 

[ReyBrujo]

Time for the Western side to reply!

 

[Gambit2483]

like all the other systems?

No, not like all other systems. Not when you have the games fully on the card. That's the point.

How/why do you think so many people were/are able to amass such huge Switch physical collections of games? Why do you think so many people are complaining about the issue to begin with? No one wants to have to start swapping games left and right because the average game is 60GB and their system only holds 256GB.

 

[Hollywood Hitman]

Hopefully they course correct, the most retarded idea ever in gaming history

 

[tr1p1ex]

No, not like all other systems. Not when you have the games fully on the card. That's the point.

How/why do you think so many people were/are able to amass such huge Switch physical collections of games? Why do you think so many people are complaining about the issue to begin with? No one wants to have to start swapping games left and right because the average game is 60GB and their system only holds 256GB.
.

You gotta pay for storage even on the cart. That is why you see key cards. A lot of 3rd party publishers chose key card over price increases.

The complaining is odd given this and given digital is the future and given last gen every big publisher either did a code in the box for or required half the game to be downloaded for some of their releases. Some switched to code in the box late in the gen after being fully on the cart early in the gen.

Even the ps and Xbox systems have relatively small default storage compared to game size.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

The wall of mockery.

Out of these games, eight would easily be safe purchases, but with this, they're down to zero.They want to pitch you good games, but they're keycards.

That's a scam... They could easily make Switch 1 games, when put on Switch 2, update and provide improvements, like Tears of the Kingdom.

I'm saying this if the companies don't have another option other than the 64 GB cartridges

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

In this game, it was a good alternative.

You have the full game on Switch 1, you buy it, and you put it on Switch 2 and the update improvements download.

That's the easiest way, and we'd all be happy

I say this as an option.

But it's best for everyone to stop with this Keycard thing.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

We hate them and we want them to die. I'd never buy one. I would rather have just digital.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Hopefully they course correct, the most retarded idea ever in gaming history

I want the name of the guy who came up with the Keycards idea so we can lynch him.

 

[Quezacolt]

The wall of mockery.

Out of these games, eight would easily be safe purchases

Daemon x Machina will be full on cart for the western release

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Daemon x Machina will be full on cart for the western release

I hope they don't change.

I was going to buy Little Nightmares 3 because it was supposedly complete, but it turns out it's also another key card.

 

[ReBurn]

I want the name of the guy who came up with the Keycards idea so we can lynch him.

That's kind of extreme there, Heimdall.

 

[Fess]

OP, you pulled me here with a laugh emoji so could you talk about the concern in detail?

Is a game key card on Switch 2 the same thing as physical releases on PC where we got a Steam key a decade ago?
It's Nintendo's version of a Steam key?
I know those weren't popular. Was around the time physical PC releases went away.

And is the real concern that you insert the game card and then have to wait for a download to finish?
I can understand the annoyance there. I remember playing GT a gazillion years ago and it just kept updating and updating and updating and updating, certainly didn't have the whole game on the disc, or even a fraction.

Or is it that in the future servers might be down?

Or is there a reselling issue I don't know about? Can you sell a game key card game?

I'm so used to digital that I might not see the problem. I went all digital over a decade ago on Xbox/PS, once I realized that I had to install games on a harddrive before playing when inserting a disc. And once every game got a day 1 patch physical releases felt pointless from a preservation perspective. There is no way I would want to play a unpatched game anyway.

 

[Baemono]

You all got into my brain and now I refuse to buy a game key card, my new (small) collection of games are all 100% physical for now

 

[Robb]

You all got into my brain and now I refuse to buy a game key card, my new (small) collection of games are all 100% physical for now

 

[Filben]

You have to produce the right amount of game cards, so why not only producing the quantity that got preordered ?

Because you can't charge customers are variable price depending on the number of pre-orders. There are variable costs per produced unit depending on your volume. A small batch has higher cost per unit than a bigger batch. When asking for a certain game (pre-order) price you calculate with a minimum number of pre-orders (worst case scenario, you need this number to break even). If you don't hit the numbers you're losing money because the earnings doesn't cover the cost.

Variable pre-order prices for end consumers aren't a thing, though. You can't charge let's say 39,99, then see your pre-order numbers not hitting the target, and then re-charge your existing pre-orders for another 9,99 to cover your additional expenses. You can't say to your potential customers: "if we hit 10,000 orders it'll cost 39,99. But if we hit only 8,000 it'll cost you 48,98."

That's why publishers for smaller/niche games are selective when it comes to physical distribution.

Not to mention that distribution for smaller batches takes much longer. No one sends a freighter across the globe for your meager 10,000 copies. Not even for 100,000. You have to wait for the logistics partners come up with a plan (e.g. waiting until a freighter has the exact spot for your amount/batch) to ship it at lowest cost possible or you either lose money or have to ask for higher pre-order prices (which again is retroactively not possible, although some board game kickstarter publishers tried this and you can bet how supporters felt about that... )

Why isn't this a big problem for big publishers? With their quantities, cost per unit gets so low that it doesn't make much of a difference on the per unit cost if you produce 5 million copies or 8 million. Once you're in a million sales territory, production cost of the storage medium isn't a concern anymore (unless you need that 64gb card; or a second Blu-ray disc per game etc. )

 

[Hyet]

People Who are saying Nintendo is not not blame and that its publishers taking the decision om sorry but I disagree.

Its Nintendo Who chose the type of card thir console uses and they chose a expensive model. Its also Nintendo the one who sells those cards to publishers, also making money while doing so and during the licensing process. Publishers would like to have physical releases but at this point in time is NINTENDO making It financially not viable for them. They should lower royalty costs for companies that support their console early.

Publishers can also be smart and do what Rune Factory devs did and release NS2 games on a NS card that includes that upgrade. At least they could save face doing so.

 

[NR1]

 

[TheDreadLord]

Nintendo wants the game key carts to succeed so badly that they don't even bother hiding it anymore. The next step will be their own first‑party games switching to this GK format. After that, you can bet they'll start charging players in the second‑hand market a fee every time a key is reactivated.

But Nintendo fans will come up with any sort os excuse to justify it.

 

[diffusionx]

I don't see the big deal about this. It's 2025. The entire world relies on internet infrastructure. Including gaming. PC gaming hasn't had physical releases for a decade. Let's be real what percentage of physical games you can buy are 100% complete and finished on the disc? I don't think any are. Every single PS5 game I own has an update. And GKCs have one big adventage compared to digital in that you can transfer your games.

 

[asdasdasdbb]

I don't see the big deal about this. It's 2025. The entire world relies on internet infrastructure. Including gaming. PC gaming hasn't had physical releases for a decade. Let's be real what percentage of physical games you can buy are 100% complete and finished on the disc? I don't think any are. Every single PS5 game I own has an update. And GKCs have one big adventage compared to digital in that you can transfer your games.

It's "Collectors" who somehow think games will be worth big bucks 20 years from now.

 

[BlackTron]

Nintendo wants the game key carts to succeed so badly that they don't even bother hiding it anymore. The next step will be their own first‑party games switching to this GK format. After that, you can bet they'll start charging players in the second‑hand market a fee every time a key is reactivated.

But Nintendo fans will come up with any sort os excuse to justify it.

Honestly, this is my hard limit. If Nintendo releases go keycard they might get one or two buys the whole gen from me depending on how megaton it is. I would keep Switch 2 for old games and see if it can be hacked by Switch 3. Pretty sad, I have all these rewards points with Best Buy from the launch to spend on a game and there's nothing I want to buy. Decided against the Pro 2 controller as well, more bad dpads. Gonna use the points on something non gaming before they expire. Way to go Big N.

 

[Mithos]

On a scale of 1 to 10 where 1 is worst and 10 is best...

-10 Digital Only
1 Keycards
8 Physical
10 End game Physical, everything on cart no newer patches exist.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

I don't see the big deal about this. It's 2025. The entire world relies on internet infrastructure. Including gaming. PC gaming hasn't had physical releases for a decade. Let's be real what percentage of physical games you can buy are 100% complete and finished on the disc? I don't think any are. Every single PS5 game I own has an update. And GKCs have one big adventage compared to digital in that you can transfer your games.

The Gravity Rush 1 and 2 games come complete in physical format and without updates. I've witnessed this. It was plug and play.

 

[ReyBrujo]

I don't see the big deal about this. It's 2025. The entire world relies on internet infrastructure. Including gaming. PC gaming hasn't had physical releases for a decade. Let's be real what percentage of physical games you can buy are 100% complete and finished on the disc? I don't think any are. Every single PS5 game I own has an update. And GKCs have one big adventage compared to digital in that you can transfer your games.

I think it's more about the idea of eventually Nintendo shutting down the servers or going bankrupt (?) and not being able to download the games anymore. Also the fact that games you get physical were always complete in media unless you bought a code in box one. I don't think Nintendo will stop promoting them even if they might never use them and it's probably a good idea for indies with 200-300mb games.

On a scale of 1 to 10 where 1 is worst and 10 is best...

-10 Digital Only
1 Keycards
8 Physical
10 End game Physical, everything on cart no newer patches exist.

I would call keycards more convenient than digital only if they are the same price, you got some resale value which digital has not. I would call physical with patches being 10, physical without patches being 9, keycards being 4 and digital only being 2.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Nintendo could be a vile beast if it ever thinks about the following: The newest and most anticipated Zelda... AS A KEYCARD.... NO NO NO NO.

 

[diffusionx]

I think it's more about the idea of eventually Nintendo shutting down the servers or going bankrupt (?) and not being able to download the games anymore. Also the fact that games you get physical were always complete in media unless you bought a code in box one. I don't think Nintendo will stop promoting them even if they might never use them and it's probably a good idea for indies with 200-300mb games.

What I am saying is that this is something that the entire videogame industry has on its back. Nintendo, Sony, Valve, Microsoft, Epic, every independent live service game, everything. Games haven't been complete in physical form in 15 years, even on console.

If this game key card business was coming out in 2005 I get the hangup over it but the entire industry has been digital for a very long time.

The Gravity Rush 1 and 2 games come complete in physical format and without updates. I've witnessed this. It was plug and play.

ok, so 2 games out of 5,000 or whatever, doesn't change my point.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

What I am saying is that this is something that the entire videogame industry has on its back. Nintendo, Sony, Valve, Microsoft, Epic, every independent live service game, everything. Games haven't been complete in physical form in 15 years, even on console.

If this game key card business was coming out in 2005 I get the hangup over it but the entire industry has been digital for a very long time.


ok, so 2 games out of 5,000 or whatever, doesn't change my point.

These games are examples of how wonderful they are.

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

Honestly.

I was going to buy that game.

That Keycard shit, it's like if they served you Lobster... But they put oil and chlorine in it like sauce.

 

[Hyet]

I don't see the big deal about this

You are:

Paying full price for a product that:
-Won't work unless your conect to the internet.
-You'll be subsidizing the Space the Game takes because nothing comes in the card
-You're also getting a cover with a ugly ass label
-No alternative other than digital purchase is offered

Its better than code in a box but not much better.

Also close to 90% of Game releases are like this.