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[Scotty W]

I noticed that Paper Mario: Origami King's lifetime sales (at least I think they are lifetime sales?) were similar to how the game has performed in a few months so who knows. Either way, fingers crossed

Nintendo seems to have a unique strategy, and I can’t quite figure it out.

Let’s take Metroid for example. Metroid doesn’t sell well. But having a Metroid game on a system will be a buy in for a certain number of people, who will then go on to buy a few megahits and other games in the ecosystem.

Those ecosystem games sweeten the deal and get the butter to the tipping point. Another factor is Nintendo has a revolving door of ports from system to system. Thinking about it, one of the problems of the N64 is that it has pretty much megahits, when something came out, that was pretty much it for months.

More than any other company, when Nintendo develops a game, the lifecycle is for the current console, and for a port in the future. People criticize them for it, but people buy these ports. Honestly it is a ridiculous criticism, any company that could do this, would. But few can.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

Time for new hardware, it is.

 

[VolticArchangel]

155 million by March 2025, and then a price cut after Switch 2 is out?

This thing is going to outsell the PS2's 160+ million, by at least 10-15 million in it's lifetime till Nintendo stops production.

Insane, to even think about and if you said this would happen in 2024, back in 2015-2016, when the Wii U was deemed as a total commercial failure, I, like everyone else, would have laughed at your face.

Iwata's dream has become real. R.I.P.

 

[Hardensoul]

6.8 million wasn't speculation, just the maximum possible PS2 number after doing the maths.

I believe a lot of those PS2s were being sold in developing markets where the PS3 was too expensive. So I don't think that those PS2 sales were replacing PS3 ones.

It’s still speculation because you don’t know the true number.

My edit answered my own question about where PS2 sales would be.

 

[Woopah]

It’s still speculation because you don’t know the true number.

My edit answered my own question about where PS2 sales would be.

It still wouldn't be speculation, as it was based on Sony's numbers. There was no guessing involved.

We knew for sure the number was between 158.6 million and 161.8 million. Now we know for sure that the number was 160 million.

And yes I agree with your edit.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

Some Highlights and notes

 

[Hardensoul]

It still wouldn't be speculation, as it was based on Sony's numbers. There was no guessing involved.

We knew for sure the number was between 158.6 million and 161.8 million. Now we know for sure that the number was 160 million.

And yes I agree with your edit.

No, we don’t know for sure. Jim Ryan could be rounding up or down. We don’t know the actual number. A range from 3m - 6m extra PS2, which is speculation how what the actual number was. Is it 4m, 5m, 6.8m? It big difference in accounting how much money was made.

 

[CosmicComet]

I wonder where the sales are sans the Switch lite?

I think the Switch still has a chance to surpass to surpass the PS2 in sales, but I only count the OLED or OG Switches as home consoles for obvious reasons.

 

[FoxMcChief]

How does Nintendo keep doing so damn well?

Oh, by making good/fun games that people want to play? That makes sense. Carry on Nintendo.

 

[Robb]

I wonder where the sales are sans the Switch lite?

Model Variants Total: Standard 93.44m, Lite 23.53m, Oled 24.34m

 

[Kataploom]

Lol, exactly. Jim Ryan bumped the number of PS2 sold to 160 million. Wonder who at Sony will come out suddenly to bump those numbers higher. Can't let a Nintendo handheld hybrid console outsell the GOAT PS2.

It's officially at 155 anyway, I guess he maliciously rounded it, but it's not 160 anyway

 

[Hardensoul]

Lite and Oled is actually close. Which is odd that Japan sales were learning more to Oled.

 

[LordOcidax]

There's more detail in this post here, but below is the simple version.

• PS2 shipments were over 155 million by the end of March 2012
• Sony continued making PS2s for another 9 months
• Between April 2012 and March 2013, Sony shipped 16.5 million PS3s and PS2s
• By using data Sony gave about PS3 sales later on, we can work out that the PS2 shipments in that fiscal year were between 3.6 million and 6.8 million
• Therefore the final PS2 total was somewhere between 158.6 million and 161.8 million

Now thanks to Jim Ryan, we have 160 million as a final figure.

Officials numbers are in the Playstation financial page… Not what Jim Ryan says.

 

[Kataploom]

The switch is a casual magnet. Look how they've managed to sell that much hardware without proper 3rd party support. Nintendo really got that ability to sell to a different audience from Sony or Microsoft.

Switch has great 3rd party support, what are you talking about? It's not the games that are popular here in GAF but they're games with big dedicated communities anyway. That alone will make Switch 2 a success since there are many Nintendo-only console players, and most of the time I've seen those only play Pokemon and Animal Crossing from Nintendo, the rest is 3rd parties.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

52 million for the Zelda franchise on Switch.

Actually 67 million, you forgot Link's Awakening remake (6.63m), Skyward Sword HD (4.15m) and Hyrule Warriors: Age of Calamity (4.00m).

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Officials numbers are in the Playstation financial page… Not what Jim Ryan says.

I mean, he was the CEO for years. Like, he would know. Yeah he may have been rounding up, but still. Literally he would have been the source.

 

[Hardensoul]

Actually 67 million, you forgot Link's Awakening remake (6.63m), Skyward Sword HD (4.15m) and Hyrule Warriors: Age of Calamity (4.00m).

WiiU Hyrule Warriors also got ported. Hyrule Warriors definitive edition

 

[ReyBrujo]

It’s going to be the greatest selling console of all time. There’s no point fighting it. Just let it wash over you.

Who knows, PS2 still sells well...

, like everyone else, would have laughed at your face.

And there were quite a few.

 

[Woopah]

Nintendo seems to have a unique strategy, and I can’t quite figure it out.

Let’s take Metroid for example. Metroid doesn’t sell well. But having a Metroid game on a system will be a buy in for a certain number of people, who will then go on to buy a few megahits and other games in the ecosystem.

Those ecosystem games sweeten the deal and get the butter to the tipping point. Another factor is Nintendo has a revolving door of ports from system to system. Thinking about it, one of the problems of the N64 is that it has pretty much megahits, when something came out, that was pretty much it for months.

More than any other company, when Nintendo develops a game, the lifecycle is for the current console, and for a port in the future. People criticize them for it, but people buy these ports. Honestly it is a ridiculous criticism, any company that could do this, would. But few can.

You seem to have figured out the strategy pretty well!

No, we don’t know for sure. Jim Ryan could be rounding up or down. We don’t know the actual number. A range from 3m - 6m extra PS2, which is speculation how what the actual number was. Is it 4m, 5m, 6.8m? It big difference in accounting how much money was made.

True, the real number could well be 159.X or 160.X

Officials numbers are in the Playstation financial page… Not what Jim Ryan says.

Well the official number is over 155 million by 31 March 2012 (with more sold after that). Using Sony's other financial numbers gives us a range of 158.6 million and 161.8 million for PS2.

Switch has great 3rd party support, what are you talking about? It's not the games that are popular here in GAF but they're games with big dedicated communities anyway. That alone will make Switch 2 a success since there are many Nintendo-only console players, and most of the time I've seen those only play Pokemon and Animal Crossing from Nintendo, the rest is 3rd parties.

It got better third party support than previous Nintendo systems, but still much worse than PlayStation and arguably Xbox.

 

[LordBlodgett]

Seems like it's just about time to release the Switch 2. Still incredible sales for a console in it's twilight though. What a huge success after the Wii U......

 

[Kataploom]

You seem to have figured out the strategy pretty well!

True, the real number could well be 159.X or 160.X

Well the official number is over 155 million by 31 March 2012 (with more sold after that). Using Sony's other financial numbers gives us a range of 158.6 million and 161.8 million for PS2.

It got better third party support than previous Nintendo systems, but still much worse than PlayStation and arguably Xbox.

They only don't get big AAA, which is just part of the industry, the one that GAF focuses on, almost like at all. There's a reason for many people to be Switch only or have it as main gaming device, it's just not the type of games you may like (hell, not even I but my wife definitely does and I've seen those other dedicated gaming communities thanks to her).

 

[Woopah]

They only don't get big AAA, which is just part of the industry, the one that GAF focuses on, almost like at all. There's a reason for many people to be Switch only or have it as main gaming device, it's just not the type of games you may like (hell, not even I but my wife definitely does and I've seen those other dedicated gaming communities thanks to her).

It's only part of it, but a pretty important part (there's also some none AAA games Switch doesn't get).

I'm not saying Switch doesn't get good third party support, or that there aren't a lot of third party sales (there are). But it doesn't get the "proper third party support" that the other two get.

 

[GigaBowser]

They only don't get big AAA, which is just part of the industry, the one that GAF focuses on, almost like at all. There's a reason for many people to be Switch only or have it as main gaming device, it's just not the type of games you may like (hell, not even I but my wife definitely does and I've seen those other dedicated gaming communities thanks to her).

big aaa onlys make like 3 good games a year rest are nintendo sony indies games Im sorry my friends

 

[Thick Thighs Save Lives]

You seem to have figured out the strategy pretty well!

True, the real number could well be 159.X or 160.X

Well the official number is over 155 million by 31 March 2012 (with more sold after that). Using Sony's other financial numbers gives us a range of 158.6 million and 161.8 million for PS2.

It got better third party support than previous Nintendo systems, but still much worse than PlayStation and arguably Xbox.

Btw, Nintendo has also released the share of 1st party sales for their last fiscal year. This means that less than 20% of the total software sold on Switch last FY was 3rd party. I really wish Switch 2 will receive better 3rd party support, especially from big western publishers.

 

[Kataploom]

It's only part of it, but a pretty important part (there's also some none AAA games Switch doesn't get).

I'm not saying Switch doesn't get good third party support, or that there aren't a lot of third party sales (there are). But it doesn't get the "proper third party support" that the other two get.

So AAA...

big aaa onlys make like 3 good games a year rest are nintendo sony indies games Im sorry my friends

I'm actually more into Nintendo and AA, any AAA these days feel bloated and even those I enjoy a lot like Jedi Survivor (currently playing).

But the same happens to many more people, they just picked another gaming branch, like cozy games, casuals like Just Dance which has a dedicated community it alone, JRPG fans which always ask Atlus to put their games on Switch (P3R and Metaphor), etc.

AAA is just the more talked, I'm thinking it's because they throw shitloads of money into marketing so media outlets and youtube channels talk about them more.

Switch has cozy gaming almost grabbed by the balls, except for PC that has Stardew Valley with mods and some others. JRPG community is also strong on Switch, I don't know if more than PS5 but I see a trend of having Switch for eveything and PS5 for those like FF or P3R that don't go to Switch.

I would still think Switch is mostly popular due to Nintendo games if I didn't have my wife and some friends that have as main gaming machine.

 

[Woopah]

So AAA...

As examples from this year alone, I would not consider Sand Land, Persona 3 Remake, Granblue Fantasy or Like A Dragon: Infinite Wealth to be AAA.

Btw, Nintendo has also released the share of 1st party sales for their last fiscal year. This means that less than 20% of the total software sold on Switch last FY was 3rd party. I really wish Switch 2 will receive better 3rd party support, especially from big western publishers.

That's revenue, not units. Nintendo gets more than three times as much revenue from a first party game as a third party game.

Unit wise, more than half of games sales on Switch will be third party.

 

[Thick Thighs Save Lives]

That's revenue, not units. Nintendo gets more than three times as much revenue from a first party game as a third party game.

Unit wise, more than half of games sales on Switch will be third party.

Ah, it's revenue based. My bad then.

 

[LordOcidax]

Well the official number is over 155 million by 31 March 2012 (with more sold after that). Using Sony's other financial numbers gives us a range of 158.6 million and 161.8 million for PS2.

Source of that “other financial numbers”?… Also why Sony doesn’t add those sales to their official figures?? So.. 155 Million is the official number according to Sony own site.

 

[Woopah]

Ah, it's revenue based. My bad then.

Yeah it's basically the ratio between full revenue of first party games, vs. the 30% royalties they get from third party games.

So even if the total first party games on Switch sold exactly the same number of units at exactly the same price as total third party games, that ratio would still show as around 75%.

 

[Astral Dog]

When these threads pop up, i always hope to see updated numbers to their more niche titles, like Astral Chain or if Xenoblade 3 crossed 2M, if FE Engage can grow to pass 2M (such a shame as its imo one of the best Switch games) any update is good but nope

Nintendo seems to have a unique strategy, and I can’t quite figure it out.

Let’s take Metroid for example. Metroid doesn’t sell well. But having a Metroid game on a system will be a buy in for a certain number of people, who will then go on to buy a few megahits and other games in the ecosystem.

Those ecosystem games sweeten the deal and get the butter to the tipping point. Another factor is Nintendo has a revolving door of ports from system to system. Thinking about it, one of the problems of the N64 is that it has pretty much megahits, when something came out, that was pretty much it for months.

More than any other company, when Nintendo develops a game, the lifecycle is for the current console, and for a port in the future. People criticize them for it, but people buy these ports. Honestly it is a ridiculous criticism, any company that could do this, would. But few can.

I overall agree with your point but lets be more specific with Metroid, i don't think Metroid doesn't sell,sure for the critical acclaim the series often gets, and for being a Nintendo brand when compared to its big brothers Metroid has always been more niche and a cult hit,but the very first game pushed 3Million copies wich is no small feat for any game, Samus returns on GameBoy also did very well, passing 2M Super Metroid had 'low' sales of 1.5M copies, but the series turns a decent profit

most of the sales are at full price wich is always an advantage,then Metroid Prime was a surprise hit for Nintendo, and they greenlighted multiple projects until Other M crashed

thats why they care alot about Metroid even if their projects don't always materialize, like Metroid 64, or take many years to come out like Samus Returns or Dread or now Prime 4

But the only games i believe had dissapointing numbers, to be of concern are Prime Echoes and Other M

But the series doesn't have a bad sales history,its just unremarkable placed next to such big IPs that defined gaming

Nintendo also cares more about nurturing new ip in genres they weren't so associated with, i think its because their marketing strategies evolved with Directs and such, they weren't as concerned that games like Xenoblade were going to bomb if they marketed them through these channels, and have been successful in attracting new audiences

 

[Kataploom]

As examples from this year alone, I would not consider Sand Land, Persona 3 Remake, Granblue Fantasy or Like A Dragon: Infinite Wealth to be AAA.


That's revenue, not units. Nintendo gets more than three times as much revenue from a first party game as a third party game.

Unit wise, more than half of games sales on Switch will be third party.

That fair from a revenues standpoint, yet I don't see an opposite trend ever, since Nintendo first parties are always behemoth sellers compared to almost anything in the industry

 

[Thick Thighs Save Lives]

Yeah it's basically the ratio between full revenue of first party games, vs. the 30% royalties they get from third party games.

So even if the total first party games on Switch sold exactly the same number of units at exactly the same price as total third party games, that ratio would still show as around 75%.

Appreciate the explanation and it makes sense. I was misled by another poster on a different forum, and looking back I should have checked the slides from the financial report myself to see exactly how Nintendo is actually reporting this stuff before posting it here.

 

[Woopah]

Source of that “other financial numbers”?… Also why Sony doesn’t add those sales to their official figures?? So.. 155 Million is the official number according to Sony own site.

By 31 March 2012 they had sold 155 million PS2s, then in the following year they sold 16.5 million PS3s and PS2s.

Using other financial information that Sony gave since about PS3 sales, we can work out that PS3 shipments between April 2012 and March 2013 were between 9.7 million and 12.9 million.

And since we have the PS3 and PS2 total for that year, it means the PS2 sold between 3.6 million and 6.8 million.

You can see the math and sources here.

 

[daxgame]

lmao they beat last FY's revenue&operating profit

 

[DKPOWPOW]

All they gotta do is release a Switch Micro/Pocket for $130-$150 (depending on the screen) and they'll sell another 15 million units easy. Price drops for the standard models aren't gonna do much. The Lite isn't appealing anymore. A switch that fits in your pocket is. Even if it's old hardware.

 

[Woopah]

Appreciate the explanation and it makes sense. I was misled by another poster on a different forum, and looking back I should have checked the slides from the financial report myself to see exactly how Nintendo is actually reporting this stuff before posting it here.

I completely understand why people would make that mistske, as it seems a simple ratio on first glance.

At the end of last quarter, Switch had around 1.2 billion full game sales, and roughly 590 million first party full games sales. But then you'd have to add in the digital only game sales, which will be heavily favoured towards third parties.

 

[Fabieter]

It’s going to be the greatest selling console of all time. There’s no point fighting it. Just let it wash over you.

*hybrid console.

 

[Woopah]

*hybrid console.

It's likely to be the highest overall console too.

 

[LordOcidax]

By 31 March 2012 they had sold 155 million PS2s, then in the following year they sold 16.5 million PS3s and PS2s.

Using other financial information that Sony gave since about PS3 sales, we can work out that PS3 shipments between April 2012 and March 2013 were between 9.7 million and 12.9 million.

And since we have the PS3 and PS2 total for that year, it means the PS2 sold between 3.6 million and 6.8 million.

You can see the math and sources here.

Sorry, but a tweet is not an official source… If is true, Sony should update the numbers in their next report… If not… 155 Million is the OFFICIAL number from SONY.

 

[Woopah]

Sorry, but a tweet is not an official source… If is true, Sony should update the numbers in their next report… If not… 155 Million is the OFFICIAL number from SONY.

The tweet itself is not the source. The tweet links to several financial statements from Sony.

The official number from Sony is over 155 million by March 2012, with more units shipped in the year after that. We just didn't know how many as Sony gave a combined number of PS2 and PS3.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

WiiU Hyrule Warriors also got ported. Hyrule Warriors definitive edition

I know but that never got a sales report which means ithe Switch version sold less than 1 million.

 

[Celine]

155 million locked?

I'm not so sure. The precipitous drop of the Wii makes me think otherwise.

There are high chances that NSW will end up over 160M, especially if they hit the current fiscal year forecast of 13.50M units.

 

[sloppyjoe_gamer]

I own a Switch and a PS5. These days i use my Switch only for 1st party Nintendo titles, and maybe an Indie here and there that doesn't go on PSN, but that's a rarity. Switch has great 3rd party support this time, but if im being honest, i'll get those titles on PS5 for the (more likely) better graphics, and trophies. Even if it's a title that isn't necessarily a looker but is still on both, ill go for the PS5 version by default for the trophies.

For their next system, i feel that they really need to have some sort of achievement system and a strong 4K HDR capable system docked and undocked at a minimum.

 

[Fabieter]

It's likely to be the highest overall console too.

If we still go by 155m ps2 than nintendo already has the highest console overall, if we dont countries hand-held because reasons than the ps2 will still be the most sold home console.

 

[Woopah]

If we still go by 155m ps2 than nintendo already has the highest console overall, if we dont countries hand-held because reasons than the ps2 will still be the most sold home console.

At the moment the console ranking is

1. PS2
2. DS
3. Switch

It will still be a couple of years or so until Switch passes PS2.

 

[tr1p1ex]

Ps2 sold at least 50mn of its units after the PS3 launched. A bunch in Asia somewhere (~25mn of those sales) starting a few years after the PS3 launched.

DS is #1 in some areas like North America. And Switch is already #2 in North America.

 

[Kataploom]

If we still go by 155m ps2 than nintendo already has the highest console overall, if we dont countries hand-held because reasons than the ps2 will still be the most sold home console.

The distinction between handheld and home consoles is something I've only seen from US people tho. In the end what matters is which gaming devices has the highest sales, because if we're picky then PS2 is in a very gray area considering it was also a DVD player... And if we're not seeing that as "cheating", because that's a console feature, the portability shouldn't also count like "cheating" since that's just a console feature, specially for the Switch which games are exactly the same you play on PC or other consoles.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

It’s weird flex, how did Sony overlook this number? Unless there’s official report from Sony, it’s hard to believe.

There is no official report just a random number casually thrown out by Jim at an interview.

 

[Gameplay Gods Bless]

When these threads pop up, i always hope to see updated numbers to their more niche titles, like Astral Chain or if Xenoblade 3 crossed 2M, if FE Engage can grow to pass 2M (such a shame as its imo one of the best Switch games) any update is good but nope

I overall agree with your point but lets be more specific with Metroid, i don't think Metroid doesn't sell,sure for the critical acclaim the series often gets, and for being a Nintendo brand when compared to its big brothers Metroid has always been more niche and a cult hit,but the very first game pushed 3Million copies wich is no small feat for any game, Samus returns on GameBoy also did very well, passing 2M Super Metroid had 'low' sales of 1.5M copies, but the series turns a decent profit

most of the sales are at full price wich is always an advantage,then Metroid Prime was a surprise hit for Nintendo, and they greenlighted multiple projects until Other M crashed

thats why they care alot about Metroid even if their projects don't always materialize, like Metroid 64, or take many years to come out like Samus Returns or Dread or now Prime 4

But the only games i believe had dissapointing numbers, to be of concern are Prime Echoes and Other M

But the series doesn't have a bad sales history,its just unremarkable placed next to such big IPs that defined gaming

Nintendo also cares more about nurturing new ip in genres they weren't so associated with, i think its because their marketing strategies evolved with Directs and such, they weren't as concerned that games like Xenoblade were going to bomb if they marketed them through these channels, and have been successful in attracting new audiences

Those games have to sell over a million in that financial time period to receive an update iirc

 

[Ogbert]

If we still go by 155m ps2 than nintendo already has the highest console overall, if we dont countries hand-held because reasons than the ps2 will still be the most sold home console.

Should we discount PS2s sold as DVD players from their numbers?