God damn does that sum up Nintendo's philosophy in a single line or what? LOL
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Now that the PS4 has already outsold the Wii U, where does Nintendo go from here?
- Thread starter Gonzo The Great
- Start date
- Status
God damn does that sum up Nintendo's philosophy in a single line or what? LOL
I think Nintendo's future is with a semi-hybrid device. You have an HDS and console with similar technology. You force everyone to code to an API. Absolutely no code close the metal. Doing this allows the console to read HDS games and make improvements. This allows all future hardware to be perfectly backwards compatible, like PC. Make the console cheap as fuck and with a refined motion control.
If that doesn't work, its third party future for Nintendo. The hardware market is dead.
They should have seen the writing on the wall when Apple released the Iphone. They weren't a phone company. Nintendo already made hardware with mobile tech (GBA and DS was based on ARM). Nintendo was in a great position to capitalize, but they didn't.
Honestly, if the hardware business is imploding on Nintendo, their best bet is an Android phone. Become like Samsung. Yes, they won't get royalties from third parties. But they pale in comparison to potential profits in phones. Its a hail mary for sure. But release a phone, make sure your games run best on it, package the damn thing with your best games and...wait for it...
A ton of VC games. Have a redemption code on each phone that allows you to download, for free (well with purchase of your phone) like 10 classic games.
Profit...maybe.
If that doesn't work, its third party future for Nintendo. The hardware market is dead.
They should have seen the writing on the wall when Apple released the Iphone. They weren't a phone company. Nintendo already made hardware with mobile tech (GBA and DS was based on ARM). Nintendo was in a great position to capitalize, but they didn't.
Honestly, if the hardware business is imploding on Nintendo, their best bet is an Android phone. Become like Samsung. Yes, they won't get royalties from third parties. But they pale in comparison to potential profits in phones. Its a hail mary for sure. But release a phone, make sure your games run best on it, package the damn thing with your best games and...wait for it...
A ton of VC games. Have a redemption code on each phone that allows you to download, for free (well with purchase of your phone) like 10 classic games.
Profit...maybe.
GardenSirens
Banned
I've always said that Nintendo should just sell off to Sony (or Microsoft) and be a developer. Imagine playing Mario on the PS4...oh boy! That would be cool.
Freezie KO
Banned
Aeriscloud
Banned
Or you know... on the console it's already on.
No one is playing it for the console it is on.
My two cents: Nintendo sells millions of games because of their consoles, not in spite of them.
What Nintendo did wrong this time around was that they added lots of expensive features that nobody wanted (the gamepad in particular). The Xbox 360 is like $160, so there's no reason why the Wii U (which obviously should have been called Wii 2 or Wii HD) should be more than $200 at launch with 360-like specs.
Another thing Nintendo does wrong, in my opinion, is being extremely conservative with their VC library. They make more money per title that way, sure, but they piss off their most loyal fans beyond belief.
Still, even though Nintendo makes amazing games, I'd be surprised if they could retain even 50% of their profits without the hardware division.
What Nintendo did wrong this time around was that they added lots of expensive features that nobody wanted (the gamepad in particular). The Xbox 360 is like $160, so there's no reason why the Wii U (which obviously should have been called Wii 2 or Wii HD) should be more than $200 at launch with 360-like specs.
Another thing Nintendo does wrong, in my opinion, is being extremely conservative with their VC library. They make more money per title that way, sure, but they piss off their most loyal fans beyond belief.
Still, even though Nintendo makes amazing games, I'd be surprised if they could retain even 50% of their profits without the hardware division.
Interceptor
Banned
Sony selling off to Nintendo is way more likely. Imagine playing Uncharted on the Wii U. SO COOL!
Oh wait. I don't need to beg. I can buy a ps4 for that.
Aeriscloud
Banned
Then why do people beg for it on Playstation in every single nintendoomed thread?
Because they want it on the console it is not on?
Aeriscloud
Banned
Oh right, Sony first party is rough.
I still don't understand why Nintendo can't pull out of thee vacuum and make hardware that has most of the status quo features(account, achievements, easy to manage friends list, more robust online, media capability, "near current Gen power"). Including features that others have gotten right doesn't mean that they can't still come up with stuff like Miiverse or the Wiimote, and a lot of those features have lots of historical data for easier inclusion. Most of the Wii U detractors here aren't asking for the Big N to emulate the competition, just add quality of life features for consumers and developers on top of doing their own thing. I also feel there should be more of an emphasis to be within sight of the strongest console performance wise, not necessarily needing to achieve parity, but making it so that there is a clear upgrade over the previous gen(they did this well until the Wii). I know some suggestions would increase their target price a bit, but no worse than the tablet gimmick that even they didn't have complete confidence in.
I feel that Nintendo could make some moves and completely dominate the home console market, with Sonysoft not able to do anything to stop them, but that would require much more willingness to adapt to the changing landscape and to actually care about the "core" buying their product vice giving us lip service repeatedly.
I feel that Nintendo could make some moves and completely dominate the home console market, with Sonysoft not able to do anything to stop them, but that would require much more willingness to adapt to the changing landscape and to actually care about the "core" buying their product vice giving us lip service repeatedly.
Aeriscloud
Banned
You're right, a poor choice of words, I meant boring.
Entryhazard
Banned
Why not Uncharted or TLOU on PC?
Well people play gamecube and wii games on PC...
the phone market was super different over a decade ago. not sure why you'd bring it up. no touch screen controls, no motion controls, and the screens were super tiny. the industry saw a small wave of support for that market around that time and it was basically dead by 2005. things didn't get cooking the way we know it until about five years back. his statement in 2003 seemed fairly accurate.
Making a statement like that showed lack of foresight.
I wouldn't either, if the 3DS wasn't so underpowered. I love Nintendo games, but I'd like to be able to play them with at least Wii level graphics.
The odd thing with Nintendo is that they appear conservative due to low powered tech, but their bill of materials is inflated by their gimmicks (gamepad, two screens for DS, 3D for 3DS). If they'd simply do a basic single-screen handheld, they'd be able to put more power and a better screen in for the same cost.
A Nintendo Vita would be perfect - gyros, front touch, analogue sticks - just leave out the pointless rear touch and use whatever recent mobile tech offers a good balance of price vs performance. 848x480 5" screen minimum - 720p would be nice but WVGA would be plenty
cell phones were primarily cell phones in 2003.
let's rewind the clock back to over ten years ago: if you had a cell phone, you were texting, taking pictures, maybe taking videos, and making calls. some might connect to the internet, but the internet itself was radically different too. no facebook, no twitter, no youtube, nothing.
phones now are used so much more for non-phoning/one-to-one purposes now. they're basically mini-computers that make phone calls, and it's so much easier to use them now that motion controls and touch controls have been added as interface options. his statements concerning battery life would be super out of date if they were made in the last couple of years, but 2003? yeah, it makes some sense.
breakfuss
Member
LOLOLOL, well, hot damn!!! Explains a lot. I tend to agree, though.... as do the sales.
I just wish Nintendo would set some goals and then soddin' go for them. Right now, it's more like yeah, we got this cool tablet controller... That we barely use. We have a Virtual Console service... That we don't care that much about. We have some of the most creative people in the industry and amazing IP... So yeah, Cranky Kong. We've heard good things about the Internets.... Yeah, maybe some day.
Someone needs to set fire to Iwata's arse.
Someone needs to set fire to Iwata's arse.
He was downplaying phones as gaming devices. He wasn't simply making a statement for that year, but making a broad statement about why cell phones are not good gaming devices. Which clearly they would be in a few years. They should have thought then
"Phones are about to become huge, what can we do about this?"
They didn't. The mobile market is now a very real threat to their business.
Nikodemos
Member
It doesn't actually matter. A top-ranking executive making definitive statements about a device that is in continual evolution is immensely shortsighted.
Besides, palmtop assistants were quite commonplace back in 2003. A few even had cellular capabilities. To believe that nobody would try to mass-market them and expand the consumer base for such products shows, again, a terrifying lack of foresight.
Prince Vultan
Banned
Jesus Christ... what a completely stupid thing to say. This one quote pretty much says it all about how Nintendo got into the mess they're in right now though if nothing else.
he was right to downplay it back then. there wasn't anything to propel sales of phones as gaming devices, nor would there be for years to come. achievements were still two years off- social media wasn't even a thing yet. touch screen gaming wasn't even widely accepted until 2006.
i'm sure he said something from 2011 or so that would be far more relevant to his current thoughts.
A mere statement of fact that only applied for a few years is lack of foresight.
“All the talk in the industry regarding online gaming has been misleading. Network swindlers have made it seem like companies can’t survive in this business without network compatibility,” said Iwata. “That’s the same type of rhetoric people have been saying about the newspaper business, that the paper-based periodical business will be dead in three years."
I guess you can say he was totally right, because at the moment he was talking, newspapers were just fine. Right? :/
This article came from the exact same show that Iwata was attending.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/tgs-2003-mobile-gaming-workshop/1100-6076018/
Its interesting to observe the differences in Sony's and Nintendo's managements. While Nintendo's is still entirely Japanese, Sony now has very senior western employees (e.g. Andrew House). I think that this reflects the fact that Nintendo is still very Japan-centric, as demonstrated by the fact that NoA and NoE produce more or less nothing. Compare this with Sony, where the majority of their dev teams are not in Japan, and where SCEA and SCEE seem to have a much larger input into the decision making process than their Nintendo counterparts. Sony just seem to be much more open to the views of their western consumer base and as a result are proving more successful in western markets.
Basically, I think Nintendo need to open up new non-Japan based dev studios, give NoE and NoA more autonomy, and start appointing non-Japanese employees to senior roles.
Basically, I think Nintendo need to open up new non-Japan based dev studios, give NoE and NoA more autonomy, and start appointing non-Japanese employees to senior roles.
Nintendo should subsidize the cost of the console with a partnership of some kind.
They already lack internet functionality. Hire someone to help build that (read: an investor with tons of cash flow)
Make pornhub do all the dirty work and have them cover the cost of the console for the next 3 years while you split the game revenue
Free Wii U for everyone
They already lack internet functionality. Hire someone to help build that (read: an investor with tons of cash flow)
Make pornhub do all the dirty work and have them cover the cost of the console for the next 3 years while you split the game revenue
Free Wii U for everyone
Unknown One
Member
It's even worst in full context.
"I’ve been told that Sony won over Nintendo by surrounding itself with software companies, and I will admit that situation was there in the past. However, times have changed, and it’s no longer a race to see how many useless companies you can get on your side. There are many people in the industry that know nothing about games. In particular, a large American company is trying to do the same thing by engulfing software houses with money, but I don’t believe that will go well. It looks like they’ll sell their game system next year, but we’ll see the answer to that the following year."
I think you can trace a lot of the PS3s early failure back to a complete disconnect with their customer base, which seems to be a bit of a feature of Japanese companies run in a typically Japanese manner (see also the Wii U, and pretty much every decision Square Enix have made recently).
scytherage
Member
I have one. So we who bought Wii Us don't count?
Threads like this are port begging in disguise.
PS3's only failure really, was price. It was just too expensive. But this was due to the Japanese culture within Sony that didn't keep Kutaragi in check.
lol. You and a few people bought the Wii U. They need an audience in the tens of millions STAT.
Are you serious with this stuff?
not really related but i like that these companies are singled out and not a single one exists as they did anymore. nokia is in microsoft, taito is in s-e, namco is part of bandai, and hudson soft was killed as an offering to the sun god ra.
i remember the phone gaming stuff back then, when tetris was available for the first time and that it was pretty neat. i also remember namco had a mobile division in the us and that it was shut down because they weren't doing any business.
well i'm not in the business of universally applying ideas and statements to things. if i think someone is wrong, they might not be wrong all the time.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Metallix87
Member
Because all these Nintendo doom mongers are secretly just glorified port beggers.
Congratulations on the worst post in this thread so far.
So, essentially, abandon the hardware market, which has been making them massive revenue for decades, from both sales and royalties, in favor of a model that only *might* make them money? Are you nuts?
*Looks at 3DS and Wii U sales*. Well let's see how that's working out for them now. 3DS is underperforming the DS and the Wii U has imploded. So what's going to happen with the 4DS and Wii U 2?
I think their future is very worrying.
Markitron
Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
I was a hardcore Nintendo fanboy during the N64/GC days, I still believe those two platforms had the greatest games libraries of their respective generations but Nintendo burned me badly with the Wii. I don't care how many they sold, it was an awful, underpowered console with a terrible gimmicky controller that was sold to us with a pack of lies.
It was because of this that the Wii-U wasn't even on my radar. The tablet is an answer in search of a question and they once again sacrificed power to include their gimmick, which straight away destroyed 3rd party support once more.
Im actually fine with having a console that is pretty much just for Nintendo exclusives, They used to make far and away the best games in the world. I want them to have a reasonably powerful box with a normal controller (there's still alot of room to innovate there, the N64 and GC controllers were revelations imo)
It was because of this that the Wii-U wasn't even on my radar. The tablet is an answer in search of a question and they once again sacrificed power to include their gimmick, which straight away destroyed 3rd party support once more.
Im actually fine with having a console that is pretty much just for Nintendo exclusives, They used to make far and away the best games in the world. I want them to have a reasonably powerful box with a normal controller (there's still alot of room to innovate there, the N64 and GC controllers were revelations imo)
Stone Ocean
Member
As long as you can be counted with fingers, no.
it's probably better to do what they did with the ds and wii than to have returned to their gba/gamecube philosophy like they did with the 3ds and wii u.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
I know you did not legitly think the 3DS would be like the DS Log.
Actually, I just realized, Iwata wasn't really dismissing the (at the time) cell phone gaming market (although he was also doing that), he was primarily saying that convergence is bad.
At the time, Nintendo was trying to argue that having the $5 DVD playback in the GameCube disabled was a "good thing", because pure gaming.
While Sony was reaping the benefits of being an early DVD player, and Nintendo was touting the portability of the GameCube and it's mysterious handle, so you could carry it into another room and hook it up to your spare TV. Nintendo saw no benefit in having a portable DVD player that undercut Sony by $100. Because that would be convergence.
- Status