NVIDIA to release GeForce Titan

That was written before the 600 series. Our SLI performance is fantastic now, if I do say so myself :) Almost always there's a profile ready at a game's launch, and if there's any kind of issue we fix it ASAP and release the profile via NVIDIA Update or GeForce Experience.

It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!
 
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stuttes, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!

Good point. This is my first foray into SLI and I've had no issued with 2 670's other than trying to find my overclocking sweet spot which I just figured out a few days back.
 
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!

This is something that needed to be said for a while now. I don't have an SLI setup myself, tried them a couple times on the 8000 GTX and 200 series, but never seen a CF box in action. I've tried them out more recently with the 600 series, a buddy of mine now has EVGA 670s in SLI. I don't see microstuttering, only super smooth 60/120fps. He's only using a 1080p 120hz screen, has the SLI to facilitate 3D at 60fps minimum.
 
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!

Sethos, I really aprpeciate this ! It totally quenches my fears about going the SLI route, it is very re-assuring, thank you again :)
 
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!

Yeah, that's been my experience too. Granted, I only got my SLI set up 3 months ago. But I've never seen any microstuttering, or had any issues. Going from a single GPU to SLI, I've only noticed a much smoother performance.

EDIT: Anyways, I keep reading these articles saying the titan will be VERY limited. That only 10,000 are being made. I'm just going to accept that I probably won't be getting one of these. And if they aren't going to make a 2nd batch (which we won't know unless they do decide to) - I won't be getting one. I'm kind of bummed out, but my 680 SLI is more than great (just wish I had gotten the 4gb version over 2gb, just because some of the newer games might start pushing past that memory limit). But in terms of performance, I can't complain one bit. Everything I've thrown at it at the 1600p resolution, has been handled with perfection and than some.

I do envy you guys that will be getting Titan's though.
 
Just because you don't see microstuttering doesn't mean it's not there. If you can maintain 60fps things are generally flawless, but as soon as things drop below that all bets are off.
 
Just because you don't see microstuttering doesn't mean it's not there.

So now we're supposed to care about stuff we can't feel or see because some obscure graph on some anal retentive hardware site says there's a few ms of frame latency rolled out as 'microstutter'? If there's no stutter, it's not a problem.

I've dropped below 60 plenty of times, do that every day in ArmA 2 and there's no stuttering.

Try a 5970, then you can talk about stutter.
 
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!

Well fuck, now im really really tempted to ditch my 7970 for 2 * 670s, I hope you are right, I had a really really bad experience Crossfiring 6950s.
 
So now we're supposed to care about stuff we can't feel or see because some obscure graph on some anal retentive hardware site says there's a few ms of frame latency rolled out as 'microstutter'? If there's no stutter, it's not a problem.

I've dropped below 60 plenty of times, do that every day in ArmA 2 and there's no stuttering.

Try a 5970, then you can talk about stutter.

The more important point is that even if you don't see it, someone else might.
 
EDIT: Anyways, I keep reading these articles saying the titan will be VERY limited. That only 10,000 are being made. I'm just going to accept that I probably won't be getting one of these. And if they aren't going to make a 2nd batch (which we won't know unless they do decide to) - I won't be getting one. I'm kind of bummed out, but my 680 SLI is more than great (just wish I had gotten the 4gb version over 2gb, just because some of the newer games might start pushing past that memory limit). But in terms of performance, I can't complain one bit. Everything I've thrown at it at the 1600p resolution, has been handled with perfection and than some.

I do envy you guys that will be getting Titan's though.

The 'rumor is that the chips used for Titans are basically K20 Tesla rejects because of the disabled SMX. It's expensive chips so you don't just ditch them, however it's not exactly a huge production line so the number of reject chips aren't going to be massive either.

So the Titan is probably just floor leftovers from the Tesla production line, trying to find some use for those chips :P

The more important point is that even if you don't see it, someone else might.

And if you notice, it's always the same people who basically live on these hardware sites and snort every piechart and graph concerning this stuff, they suddenly get the magic gift and can feel every stutter that isn't there and every single millisecond of lag, yet they don't have multi-GPU setups from the new generation.
 
Well fuck, now im really really tempted to ditch my 7970 for 2 * 670s, I hope you are right, I had a really really bad experience Crossfiring 6950s.

Well, I'm rocking two 680s SLI, and have had nothing but smooth sailing. And my CPU is definitely not anywhere as good as what most of you have. I'm rockin an i5 2320 at 3.4ghz, I can't even OC it. Even in the most demanding games, I'm always over 60fps and I never have stuttering or any issues.
 
The 'rumor is that the chips used for Titans are basically K20 Tesla rejects because of the disabled SMX. It's expensive chips so you don't just ditch them, however it's not exactly a huge production line so the number of reject chips aren't going to be massive either.

So the Titan is probably just floor leftovers from the Tesla production line, trying to find some use for those chips :P

Yeah, that is what I'm reading. So it actually makes sense why they will actually be a limited release. I would have gotten one, but I don't get paid until the 28th. So I'm just shy of having enough money. And no doubt this will be sold out within 3 minutes on the 18th.

So oh well. Guess I'll just wait for the next lineup. And upgrade later down the line.
 
Nevermind on SLI, just found a Hardocp forum post with someone saying there is Microstutter on a GTX 690 when playing at 5760 * 1200, no good, thats the resolution I play at, rather have the slower frame rates on a 7970.

Damn I really hope AMD or nVidia release something in the 500-600 range with better performance than the 680/7970 soon :(
 
Yeah, that is what I'm reading. So it actually makes sense why they will actually be a limited release. I would have gotten one, but I don't get paid until the 28th. So I'm just shy of having enough money. And no doubt this will be sold out within 3 minutes on the 18th.

So oh well. Guess I'll just wait for the next lineup. And upgrade later down the line.

They say the paper launch is on the 18th and the real launch is on the 24th, is what I hear. Not sure what that means for availability. This 'in the dark' situation is both annoying and sort of exciting :P
 
NVIDIA has never done a paper launch, and Tom himself said they never will.

Engadget reporting prices as much as $1200 though, which seems idiotic.
 
If the price goes much higher then I might give them a miss. I'm willing to stretch but there's also limits to the insanity.
 
Nevermind on SLI, just found a Hardocp forum post with someone saying there is Microstutter on a GTX 690 when playing at 5760 * 1200, no good, thats the resolution I play at, rather have the slower frame rates on a 7970.

Damn I really hope AMD or nVidia release something in the 500-600 range with better performance than the 680/7970 soon :(

I would recommend a larger framebuffer for Surround resolutions. From that post it sounds like the chap is hitting the RAM limit.
 
I would recommend a larger framebuffer for Surround resolutions. From that post it sounds like the chap is hitting the RAM limit.

Yeah the 7970 has 3GB by default and it really helps, I guess my only alternative is to get 670's with more than 2GB of Ram, dont know if they exist and if they are too expensive.
 
Short term memory.
Hah, the Shield. Touche.
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!
I'm genuinely really happy for you that you haven't had any issues. Seriously. The thing about anecdotes though, is that they are anecdotal, and there's all sorts of other ones out there.

In this generation of video cards, I've personally used 1x7970, 2x7970, 1x690, 3x670, 2x670, RoG Matrix 7970. Also have done two 560Tis, a 580 LX, two 5870s, 6870, and continue on back to the Voodoo 3 and earlier.

The microstutter still exists. SLI problems still exist. SLI profiles aren't always added in a timely manner, and the custom profiles don't always work. I'm not really sensitive to microstutter and honestly don't care in the least about it as I primarilly play competitive games. I never fuss with downsampling, getting the right kind/amount of AA. I just want 8.3ms frametimes, hopefully consistently.

When my 690 is getting worse performance in a game than a friend's 680, that's annoying. When a new competitive game, or a game in beta, is running like complete garbage on 3x670s, that's unacceptable. It still happens. It has happened to me as recently as two weeks ago in Warframe. The 690 should theoretically be less sensitive to this issue because it actually has a chip on it to do the frame matching that standard cards like 680s use hardware level code to achieve. There's still hiccups.

If getting two high end cards is the only way that you can get the performance you are aiming to reach for, SLI continues to be a very good option. But, saying SLI is now fixed and it is a great option, then you start to encourage people to do stupid things like get two 660s or 660Tis to try and game performance:$ to match a higher end card, which will bite them in the ass if they truly understand performance.

In my circle of folks, that 1 frame of input lag also tends to hurt their performance. I wasn't quite convinced of it at all, because it's not something I've been able to pick up on. I watched Kudochop use my rig in a match of T:A at a LAN I hosted recently, and he was missing headshots that would otherwise be a piece of cake. So for people who are sensitive to that, there's also that issue to contend with.
 
Yeah the 7970 has 3GB by default and it really helps, I guess my only alternative is to get 670's with more than 2GB of Ram, dont know if they exist and if they are too expensive.

Plenty of 4GB 670s out there and don't think they are that much more expensive compared to a 2GB.

And he's right, actual stutter like that sounds like the Vram roof being hit.
 
Nevermind on SLI, just found a Hardocp forum post with someone saying there is Microstutter on a GTX 690 when playing at 5760 * 1200, no good, thats the resolution I play at, rather have the slower frame rates on a 7970.

Damn I really hope AMD or nVidia release something in the 500-600 range with better performance than the 680/7970 soon :(

I think you linked the wrong post. Your link describes someone speaking about a 5970 in Crossfire.

edit: oh wait, it's in that thread, just not the post it goes to with your link. carry on!
 
Monday? Man...that kinda sucks. I will be on work travel from Tuesday - Friday so no time to have fun! Still not sure if I'm going to jump in. Probably going to sit this one out. :( Just picked up a G46VW lappy...

It's seriously going to be like $1200/card now? Not the ~$700 or so that was advertised earlier???
 
Yeah, if this launches at more than $1000, no way will I even consider buying one. That's just kind of obscene.
Plenty of 4GB 670s out there and don't think they are that much more expensive compared to a 2GB.

And he's right, actual stutter like that sounds like the Vram roof being hit.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013...670_directcu_ii_4gb_sli_review/5#.UR6PUaWcfqU

The limited information out there suggests that 4GB cards don't really perform any better than the 2GB cards when you get to the point that the 2GB of VRAM is insufficient. Granted, they don't use frame latency to test here, so it could be hidden in there.
 
Do you mean that it isn't widely available and that they run out of stock?

Because, you can always buy the cards day 1, even if in limited quantities. I might be totally mistaken here though if you help refresh my memory.
 
The limited information out there suggests that 4GB cards don't really perform any better than the 2GB cards when you get to the point that the 2GB of VRAM is insufficient. Granted, they don't use frame latency to test here, so it could be hidden in there.

It's not about performance, it's about actual stutter. Might not be visible in games coded with a safeguard for that event but some games, when they hit the Vram wall will start to stutter like crazy - As I've mentioned before, some mods that just use extremely high resolution textures can easily do that. So it's all about how you hit the wall and in what manner. So you avoid the stuttering, there's no performance gains.
 
Yeah, if this launches at more than $1000, no way will I even consider buying one. That's just kind of obscene.


.

I agree. If it is over a $1000.00 I am sitting this out as well. My 690 is servicing me well and have had very little issues with it...plus I have it in my Waterloop. At 1k, I think it is overpriced.
 
It's not about performance, it's about actual stutter. Might not be visible in games coded with a safeguard for that event but some games, when they hit the Vram wall will start to stutter like crazy - As I've mentioned before, some mods that just use extremely high resolution textures can easily do that. So it's all about how you hit the wall and in what manner. So you avoid the stuttering, there's no performance gains.
Yeah, no question. I've seen that personally when I went to my 670 4GB in Skyrim, much better performance. Mods are the only situation where I've seen this happen though, which makes sense.

If only HardOCP would stop using bad methodology. *sigh*

Now that I've sold off my 670s, I don't have the means to test this either.
 
I was actually considering doing this as I already have a 7970 and NCIX has a sale on a good OC 7970, so I searched google for "7970 Crossfire stutter" and I got way more links than I should have, looks like TONS of people have issues with Micrstutter, I will keep away from it.

One example:

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2227169

Go here, read the OP, but especially the stuff that is linked in the bottom of the OP.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=512976
 
Depends on the game in question, the general frame times, and the quality of the SLI profile for the game.

Some people are also a lot more sensitive to it than others.
 
Go here, read the OP, but especially the stuff that is linked in the bottom of the OP.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=512976

Not sure what you are suggesting... the 12.3 beta drivers???

Maybe I didnt explain myself correctly, I actually own a 7970 right now and I'm happy with the performance of it with the latest drivers.

What im staying away from is Crossfiring 2 of them, I had a really bad experience with the 6950 line and it seems like AMD has not fixed their CF issues, im not sure if those 12.3 drivers actually fix all the issues but im not about to spend $400 plus tax just to try out.

Im just really sad my only upgrade path for a good while is this Titan, is way too much money for a GPU, I was hoping for a $600 flagship single GPU card that out classes a single 680 and 7970.

Going from Crossfire 6950 to the 7970 was AMAZING, supposedly, I lost like 40fps in every game, but everything is so smooth now that I dont really care.
 
Rift was probably the worst game for microstutter. At 45fps, it felt like the game was running at half that.

Isn't that the fault of the game though? Like take Assasins Creed 3. Doesn't matter what system you have, the game was poorly optimized. Even single GPUs had problems. So regardless of SLI or single, performance is on a game by game basis.
 
I just realized that the PowerColor 7990 is $900 on Newegg.

If Titan releases at $1100-1200, even someone as stupid as me could not justify the price difference.
Not sure what you are suggesting... the 12.3 beta drivers???

Maybe I didnt explain myself correctly, I actually own a 7970 right now and I'm happy with the performance of it with the latest drivers.

What im staying away from is Crossfiring 2 of them, I had a really bad experience with the 6950 line and it seems like AMD has not fixed their CF issues, im not sure if those 12.3 drivers actually fix all the issues but im not about to spend $400 plus tax just to try out.

Im just really sad my only upgrade path for a good while is this Titan, is way too much money for a GPU, I was hoping for a $600 flagship single GPU card that out classes a single 680 and 7970.

Going from Crossfire 6950 to the 7970 was AMAZING, supposedly, I lost like 40fps in every game, but everything is so smooth now that I dont really care.
I'm saying that the AMD issue with microstutter has been exaggerated (as in, the problem has increased, not reports of it) due to the frame latency issues native to any GCN card. AMD is working hard on fixing this, and a pretty significant patch will heavily reduce frame times across all games.

If you have two cards, both of which are having inconsistent frame times, you get microstutter that is more pronounced. If both cards have really even frame times, then microstutter won't be nearly as much of an issue. I can tell you that the newest beta patch has already reduced the amount of variance I was having when I first started running all of those benches. iirc, I'm using 13.2 on my test bench.

So, I think if one is trying to achieve performance that they cannot with a single 7970, a second one is a really good bet right now, especially at those prices.

What kind of display are you running?
 
It actually annoys me that the general public still thinks all these 'last generation' issues are a part of SLI ( Can't speak for CF ). I still see people talking about micro stuttering and whatnot. Now, I've been through all the early and mid-generations dual-core GPU cards ranging from AMD's layercake cards to some of Nvidia's and a few real 2 Individual setups and it has always been terrible. The 5970 being hands down the worst card I've ever owned.

Don't ask me why I kept coming back, mostly an e-peen factor I think.

HOWEVER! After I got my 680 SLI setup, it's perfect. Not as in "Oh close to single-GPU feel" but completely perfect. There are simply no stutters, no massive SLI issues or anything of that nature. I don't sit around waiting for profiles or have to do a lot of tweaking to get anything working. Worse case scenario I've experienced is profiles that aren't 'perfect' which means reduced performance but it's still above the performance of just one card. I don't even disable SLI for older games as they usually work fine because they simply don't utilize it instead of spassing out as before.

Hurts me more than anything when someone says "Oh think I'll stay away from SLI because of the micro-stuttering, my <insert 5 year old cards> had some problems".

Let's shoot down the misconceptions!

Tell that to my poor GTX570, I wish I could of gone SLI but only the 6xx cards are mostly free from the problems.

And it is not even close to 5 years old.
 
Do you mean that it isn't widely available and that they run out of stock?

Because, you can always buy the cards day 1, even if in limited quantities. I might be totally mistaken here though if you help refresh my memory.
GTX480. (Purest form of paper launch)

Besides, having a small quantity of cards for a launch and blaming it on "high demand" is lame excuse to get out of the paper launch scenario.
 
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