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Official "I need a new PC!!" 2009 Edition
- Thread starter VictimOfGrief
- Start date
lowlylowlycook said:
If I could get that for that cheap here, I'd be all over it. From what I've read, these are OCZ's better line.
Here are my candidates so far:
Non-modular:
PC Power & Cooling (S75QB) Silencer 750 Quad 750W ($140)
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=014329&cid=PS.532
PC Power & Cooling (S61EPS) Silencer 610W ($119) - this one is a nono for SLI, since there are only 2 PCI-E connectors
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=014331&cid=PS.532
Corsair TX Series CMPSU-650TX 650W ($125 - $25 MIR) - this one is tempting...single 12V rail
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=015708&cid=PS.532
Modular:
Antec TP-650 Truepower New 650W Continuous Power Supply ($140) - only 2 PCI-E connectors
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=021533&cid=PS.830
Enermax EMD625AWT MODU82+ 625W Power Supply ($170, but I can get for $150)
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=017762&cid=PS.830
OCZ ModXStream Pro 700W Power Supply (OCZ700MXSP) ($105) - Possibly mediocre quality
http://www.canadacomputers.com/index.php?do=ShowProduct&cmd=pd&pid=020479&cid=PS.830
I doubt I'll ever go SLI, so the 2x PCI-E connectors is likely a non issue. I'm still leaning towards the Enermax 625W...but the Antec might be good as well. If I go non-modular, that corsair looks to be the best bet with its single 12V rail.
brain_stew said:
Firstly, thanks for the advice, I can put a computer together, but I am new at doing it for myself
. I don't actually remember the exact kind, but its Pentium D 3ghz.Only reason I was looking at Tiger direct is because it seemed to have more options, but it looks like newegg has a canadian site now
Hazaro said:
Thanks so much dude
MWS Natural
Member
brain_stew said:Once you get used to playing games at 1080p/60fps with 4xAA its damn hard to go back, you have been warned!
I assume you're going to be buying the Orange Box, right? Its pretty much a prerequisite purchase before you're allowed to join the PC gaming ranks.
Oh and let us know if you manage to get that thing running at anywhere close to 1ghz, if you do, we're talking about going completely off the bang for buck scale, so much power!!
Heh, to think that less than 12 months ago Nvidia seemed confident in launching a card that performs lower across the board, and with less headroom at $650!, and at the time that didn't seem too unreasonable, I mean it was in line with the current pricing structure. Skip forward 12 months and, yeah, its fair to say that the launch of the 4800 series stirred thing up a bit. That you can get more for less than a third of the price is rather nice, if you ask me.
Hmm...I wasn't planning too but I might double dip if the PC version is that much better. Yeah I'll be reading any guide I can find for OC'ing the 4890, I have a SFF case so I probably won't try to hit 1ghz since I want to keep things moderately cool and quiet (fan below 50%). What's crazy though is that once I had everything hooked up and turned on out of the 360, AVR and soon to be gaming PC my PS3 was the damn loudest! lol I couldn't believe it, but we will see once I slap the 4890 in there.
Hazaro said:Make sure to check the Crysis thread and grab the map pack + custom configs I perfer Mster myself.
Cryis Maximum edition of course
Yeah I will have to check that out. With the custom configs what kind of framerates would I be looking at? PIIx3 720 3.4ghz 4gbRAM 4890. What exactly do the custom configs do? Turn things off that you wouldn't notice to improve framerates?
brain_stew
Member
MWS Natural said:
That's part of it I gather, the better ones can also tweak shader effects, shadows and time of day settings as well, I'm sure there's some pixie magic thrown in there somewhere aswell. The end result can often appear to be very high quality graphics with the performance demands of high. Even at 1080p, you should be use a custom config to give very high level visuals and have a very smooth experience, it won't be 60fps but then Crysis is the one game that makes lower framerates more tolerable than any other so I doubt you'd complain.
The crazy thing about Cry Engine 2 is that "very high" Crysis is only the tip of the iceberg, even without creating any new assets at all there's "ultra" configs that ramp things up way past the ingame settings. The stuff people have produced when using those level of setting plus custom assets above the level found in the game is mindboggling. Cry Engine 3 will be ready and waiting to deliver some of the best early visuals on the next generation of consoles its that far ahead of everything else. Crazy Germans.
Half Life 2 is definitely best served on the PC. I've been playing through with the "cinematic mod" lately, now this thing can change a lot of things but the beauty is that you can pick and choose which parts to keep and which to get rid off by simply deleting the files. It adds motion blur and HDR to the earlier games , much better fog, view distances and particle effects, 3D foliage rather than 2D sprites and textures that are insanely high resolution whilst still being mostly true to the source material. You can add some new models and gameplay tweaks but I got rid of them and just enjoyed the high res. textures and engine upgrades. Really looks stunning at 1080p/60hz.
Orange Box is cheap as chips on Steam as well, and TF2 is like a totally new game.
evil solrac v3.0
Member
so i was thinking of buying the GTX285 in the summer but then i see you guys talking about the 4890, so what should i go for? I game at 1920x1200.
or should i buy 2 260's and do SLI?
this is my power supply and the specs (got them from new egg)
any advice is welcome.
or should i buy 2 260's and do SLI?
this is my power supply and the specs (got them from new egg)
any advice is welcome.
brain_stew
Member
Have you got one GTX 260 already? If so, SLI GTX 260s might be an interesting route.
Otherwise I'd just go with the single 4890, your PSU will cope with either regardless.
Otherwise I'd just go with the single 4890, your PSU will cope with either regardless.
Metalic Sand
who is Emo-Beas?
I was wondering if a MB supports crossfire can it do SLI?
lowlylowlycook
Member
Metalic Sand said:
Very very few boards do both. Keep in mind that it's hard to find an AM3 slot motherboard that supports SLI so far.
brain_stew
Member
lowlylowlycook said:
Pretty much every X58 board on the market suports both Crossfire and SLI, and if they don't you can usually mod the feature in anyway.
OB on PC isn't double dipping, it's dipping RIGHT.MWS Natural said:
Also it the things it tweaks you can see in the config file it self, either I'd imagine 35fps with Crysis on what looks like Very High.
SLI 260's offer darn good power for their pricing, but if you got a 4890 you could always crossfire that later.evil solrac v3.0 said:
I'd go for a 4890 right now.
lowlylowlycook
Member
brain_stew said:
Yeah, I haven't really paid attention to i7 stuff at all so I misspoke. Sorry about that.
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
dazzgc said:
How much would the sli 260s be?
The massive price difference between the 4890 and 285 for a such a smaller performance gain is just not worth it.
A 285 barely outdoes a 4890 even though it costs almost $100 more. A better argument is the GTX 275 and even that doesn't cut it.dazzgc said:
SLi 260's are nice ($300 AR), but you are paying for the issues of SLi and the need to upgrade both cards down the line. FPS/Cost for SLi 260's and a 4890 ($200 AR) is about the same.
Hazaro said:
really?
from my own experience, the 285gtx outperforms the 4890 and handidly so (in the 1080p section, anyway) but ive never owned a 260, let alone sli ofc
just posting my own experience and what ive read around the web in reviews. no manufacturer bias here, my last 4 cards were ati
The 4890 ties or wins by a bit on some games, and loses on others. At least, that's what the majority of internet reviews say.dazzgc said:really?
from my own experience, the 285gtx outperforms the 4890 and handidly so (in the 1080p section, anyway) but ive never owned a 260, let alone sli ofc
just posting my own experience and what ive read around the web in reviews. no manufacturer bias here, my last 4 cards were ati
Being so close most of the time in performance the price difference doesn't warrant the purchase, even the GTX 275 which is cheaper.
scorcho said:
I have a PII 920, unfortunately no unlocked multiplier but I love it, works great and does everything I need it to do fine, I have mine overclocked to 3.3ghz stable with voltage raised. I'm able to run OCCT on the 1 hour test no probs.
Photoshop and gaming ability at 1680x1050 is great, now I just need to replace my already aging 4870 with a 4890... or maybe run crossfire with both.
Metalic Sand
who is Emo-Beas?
brain_stew said:
Im on a AM3 board though. So i guess its a no go for SLI?
evil solrac v3.0
Member
brain_stew said:
no, i currently have two 9600 GT.
bishopcruz
Member
How is the Intel Pentium D 965 Extreme Edition Processor CPU?
I've seen some good deals on it floating around the interwebs.
I've seen some good deals on it floating around the interwebs.
rohlfinator
Member
Don't bother. Even the cheapest Core 2 Duo or Pentium Dual Core will easily outperform it, and draw about half as much power.bishopcruz said:
letsbereasonable
Member
rohlfinator said:
He might be looking at it if its the only dual core his motherboard/bios will support. I know there are some Dells out there that hit just before the multi-core revolution for which that is the best compatible processor. I agree, though, it's not worth it.
bishopcruz
Member
Ok, thanks, wonder why that chips still sells for more than a regular DUO then. Hmm...
Also, any tips on a ~$100-150 vid card? Honestly don't do TOO much gaming, but with Dragon Age, Starcraft 2, and Eventually D3, I do want to have a relatively decent machine ready.
Also, any tips on a ~$100-150 vid card? Honestly don't do TOO much gaming, but with Dragon Age, Starcraft 2, and Eventually D3, I do want to have a relatively decent machine ready.
TheRagnCajun
Member
MWS Natural said:
I recently upgraded to the 4890 too! I've got a 24" 1920 x 1200 monitor. Any bigger than that and you just end up moving the screen back more.
Ive decided to play Crysis last, though. Games like STALKER and Fallout3 aren't going to be as impressive if you start out with Crysis.
longdi
Banned
Hazaro said:
Not from what i read, the gtx 275 edge out 4890 on average at 1920x1200 and up. I realise that single gpus from gtx260 and above, are close within 10fps of each other that it is just splitting hairs. When you factor in factory overclock stocks, it is really confusing or we can say consumers have too many choices.
Some say nvidia have the better drivers and control panel, so you can factor that in.
rohlfinator
Member
I dunno... I think it's just a matter of economies of scale not working in its favor, since Core 2 Duos are much more popular now. Intel may also be keeping the price artificially high to encourage people to upgrade to newer hardware.bishopcruz said:
As for the video card: the current bang-for-your-buck favorites in that price range are the Radeon HD 4770 (at ~$100) and the GeForce GTX 260 (which you can find for close to $150 after rebate). Either should be pretty capable of handling those games, but the 260 will perform significantly better if you're running at 1080p or higher.
MWS Natural
Member
longdi said:
Hmm...I guess there are so many different reviews out there people kinda grab the ones they want lol. I would say you both are right from the reviews I have read but once you factor in the OC headroom of both the 4890 pulls away from the gtx275 and even passes the gtx285 in some games. This of course wouldn't matter for the average consumer but for an enthusiast who will OC it increases the value of the 4890 much more. A 1ghz graphics card for $199 sure sold me.
Alright. I've got my power supply options down to two power supplies.
The contenders:
1) CORSAIR CMPSU-620HX 620W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139002
2) ENERMAX MODU82+ EMD625AWT 625W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194027
Both power supplies seem to be highly recommended. I think my choice will depend on the connectors.
Here is a list of the connectors:
CORSAIR:
1 x 20+4-pin ATX
1 x 4-pin +12V
1 x 8-pin EPS12V
2 x PCI-Express
10 x 4-pin peripheral
2 x 4-pin floppy
8 x SATA
ENERMAX:
1 x Main connector (24Pin)
1 x 12V(P4)
1 x 12V(8Pin)
6 x peripheral
9 x SATA
1 x Floppy
4 x PCI-E
The main differences are that the Enermax has 4x PCI-E connectors, meaning it's the only one I'd consider if ever I go SLI/Crossfire (however doubtful that I might). The Corsair, ont he other hand, has 10 peripheral connectors instead of just 6 in the Enermax. What are these connectors used for?
The contenders:
1) CORSAIR CMPSU-620HX 620W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139002
2) ENERMAX MODU82+ EMD625AWT 625W
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817194027
Both power supplies seem to be highly recommended. I think my choice will depend on the connectors.
Here is a list of the connectors:
CORSAIR:
1 x 20+4-pin ATX
1 x 4-pin +12V
1 x 8-pin EPS12V
2 x PCI-Express
10 x 4-pin peripheral
2 x 4-pin floppy
8 x SATA
ENERMAX:
1 x Main connector (24Pin)
1 x 12V(P4)
1 x 12V(8Pin)
6 x peripheral
9 x SATA
1 x Floppy
4 x PCI-E
The main differences are that the Enermax has 4x PCI-E connectors, meaning it's the only one I'd consider if ever I go SLI/Crossfire (however doubtful that I might). The Corsair, ont he other hand, has 10 peripheral connectors instead of just 6 in the Enermax. What are these connectors used for?
Minsc said:
The main reason I'm considering the Enermax right now is because it's the only one suitable for an SLI setup. I'd go with it...I'm just not sure what those periphal ports are used for, and it has 4 less.
edit: are peripheral connectors the ones used for IDE drives? If so, I'm guessing 6x is more than enough. What else might I need them for?
edit2: specification wise, the advantage of the Enermax is it has better efficiency (88% max as opposed to 84% max). The advantage of the Corsair is that it's rated at 50C instead of 40C for the Enermax.
BigJonsson
Member
Here are the specs on my current power supply.........
Maximum Power: 420W
Input Voltage: 95~135V or 180V~265V (selected by slide switch)
Input Frequency Range: 47Hz~63Hz
Input Current: 40A/115V and 80A/230V max. during cold start
Hold up time: 17ms at 115VAC or 230VAC, full load
Over Voltage Protection: +5V: 5.5V~7.0V; +3.3V:3.76V~4.3V; +12V & +12V2: 13.4V~15.6V
Over Load Protection: 110~160% of max load
Over current Protection: +3.3V : 55A (max); +5V: 48A (max); +12V1 & +12V2: 20A (max)
Over Temperature Protection: Operating Ambient 10ºC~40ºC, Storage Ambient -40ºC~70ºC
Humidity:
Operating : to 85% relative humidity, non condensing at 25ºC
Storage: to 95% relative humidity, non condensing at 50ºC
MTBF: Greater than 100K hours at 70% of full rated load; 230VAC / 50Hz input; 25ºC ambient
EMC: EN55022 Class B, EN61000-4-2 Class B, EN61000-4-3 Class A, EN61000-4-4 Class B, EN61000-4-5 Class B, EN61000-4-6 Class A, EN61000-4-8 Class A, EN61000-4-11 Class B, FCC Part 15 & Part 2, CNS 13438 Class B
Safety: Approval UL, cUL, TÜV, CB
Dimension: W150 x H86 x D140 (mm)
http://www.enermaxusa.com/catalog/p...id=75&osCsid=9d84c93e5eb09dba55401efbba03aace
Would that be ok for running an X3 720, 4 gigs of ram and a GTX 260 (216)?
Maximum Power: 420W
Input Voltage: 95~135V or 180V~265V (selected by slide switch)
Input Frequency Range: 47Hz~63Hz
Input Current: 40A/115V and 80A/230V max. during cold start
Hold up time: 17ms at 115VAC or 230VAC, full load
Over Voltage Protection: +5V: 5.5V~7.0V; +3.3V:3.76V~4.3V; +12V & +12V2: 13.4V~15.6V
Over Load Protection: 110~160% of max load
Over current Protection: +3.3V : 55A (max); +5V: 48A (max); +12V1 & +12V2: 20A (max)
Over Temperature Protection: Operating Ambient 10ºC~40ºC, Storage Ambient -40ºC~70ºC
Humidity:
Operating : to 85% relative humidity, non condensing at 25ºC
Storage: to 95% relative humidity, non condensing at 50ºC
MTBF: Greater than 100K hours at 70% of full rated load; 230VAC / 50Hz input; 25ºC ambient
EMC: EN55022 Class B, EN61000-4-2 Class B, EN61000-4-3 Class A, EN61000-4-4 Class B, EN61000-4-5 Class B, EN61000-4-6 Class A, EN61000-4-8 Class A, EN61000-4-11 Class B, FCC Part 15 & Part 2, CNS 13438 Class B
Safety: Approval UL, cUL, TÜV, CB
Dimension: W150 x H86 x D140 (mm)
http://www.enermaxusa.com/catalog/p...id=75&osCsid=9d84c93e5eb09dba55401efbba03aace
Would that be ok for running an X3 720, 4 gigs of ram and a GTX 260 (216)?
The better tech sites out there (The ones that don't benchmark 4 games for a card "review") show the HD4890 trading blows with the GTX275, which is also it's direct price competitor.Hazaro said:
Due to how close their performance is, I would recommend whichever is cheaper at the time if someone was looking for spend $250 (Or in the UK £175ish) on a card. Over here at the moment the HD4890 is a bit cheaper, so I would say it is better value for similar performance at this time.
Anyway, I have a GTX275 thanks to Asus and a certain tech site, as I won it in a competition, and I am very happy with its performance so far. The ability to play Crysis at all High and seeing 60FPS in Fraps a lot of the time is pretty good.
Metalic Sand
who is Emo-Beas?
BigJonsson said:
I would think you would be fine. I do run a lower speced card though "GTS 250". I think i only hit around 300-350 Amps max. I run off a 400w corsair.
I have the proc Oced to 3.2(X3 720) and the 250 at 800 Mhz. Havent experienced any sign of not having enough power and i game for 5 hours+ at a time. Best to go alittle higher just to be safe especially if you OC at all. probly 500w
lowlylowlycook
Member
Stop It said:
How many games can really stress either of those cards at reasonable resolutions anyway?
brain_stew
Member
longdi said:
If they're testing without AA, perhaps it runs close, but I'll stick with Anandtech's reviews above all others, and what Hazaro's been saying proves true in nearly all of their tests. Its only at 2560x1600, where the switch occurs.
You can pick up a 4890 for $200, that's just too good value to ignore, considering you'll be paying a good $30 or $120 more for a GTX 275 or GTX 285 respectively. When you factor in that people are getting these things to run at 1ghz, its really hard to ignore if you want the ultimate single card solution.
I still prefer a GTX 260 (216) as a solution over the 4870 1GB, in the price bracket below that, if only because the OCing headroom of the 2 card is not at all comparable and the fact that the GTX 260 is generally cheaper as well.
bishopcruz said:
4850 512MB, or a GTX 260 (216) if you stretch to it (its at the very limits of your budget) and plan to play at 1080p or above.
bishopcruz said:
Terrible, the Netburst architecture is the lowest point in Intel's history. They run hot, suck up way too much power and are horribly inefficient. There's a reason the Core 2 line was such a revelation, it was a massive turnaround for Intel
lowlylowlycook said:
Well that's the thing, at 1680x1050 and below a 4850 512MB will mop up anything you throw at it and at 1080p and above the GTX 260 (216) performs incredibly well. So, spending an extra $40/$50 above a GTX 260 can be justified in the sense that you are getting better performance for a small bump in price even if you won't notice it atm but jumping to a GTX 285 from a GTX 260 (216) you're doubling your budget for a performance increase you might not even notice anyway. I just couldn't justify doing that, $50? Yeah sure as I know I've got a little excess power in the bag incase I ever need it, but $160, nah that's pushing things too far. If you're spending that amount of money its got to be SLI GTX 260s that you start thinking about imo.
MWS Natural
Member
Amazing deal over at Dell for a Samsung 23inch 1080p monitor for $153. I have it in my cart right now deciding if I should pull the trigger or wait on the 27inch LG... Ugh! I can't decide! Anyone think the extra 4inches is worth the $200 more? 23inches just seems so small =/ Surfing the internet on the Kuro isn't the most comfortable thing in the world so I don't want to be doing this for any long period of time lol.
Metalic Sand
who is Emo-Beas?
MWS Natural said:
Is there some sort of coupon because mine says $179.99 when i click to see the special sale price.
lowlylowlycook said:
Well, that's another question entirely, and the answer is: not many.
As I said, if the HD4890 can be found for $200, it should be bought, twice, as that is the best FPS per $ ratio I have ever seen. To be really honest I was happy with my HD4870 512MB but you can't say no to free stuff.
brain_stew
Member
MWS Natural said:
I sure don't, I'm using a 23 inch monitor now, and as a desktop monitor I'm not sure I'd want anything larger, it fills more of my vision than my 40" HDTV from 8 feet away for example, and you don't see people complaining about the size of a TV like that. You'll be getting an inferior pixel pitch with that monitor as well, so actual game IQ will be worse. That price is way, way too good to ignore. Simply insane.
Any GAFers after a monitor? Then buy this thing right this second!!!
brain_stew
Member
Stop It said:
Put it this way, 11 months ago Nvidia launched a card (the GTX 280) with less performance and less OCing headroom than a 4890 for $650. The 4890 is $200.
Even at that price the GTX 280 was welcomed generally favourably by review sites, it was afterall the fastest card on the market so a price premium was justified. In less than a year the market has changed so much that you can get a better card for less than 1/3 of the price set a year ago. If that doesn't stress just what sort of value you're getting, I doubt anything will.
TheExodu5 said:
The Corsair can handle dual video card just fine. You'd have to use the molex adapter supplied with your cards but its not a huge issue, though the Enermax does have a more elegant solution.
I'd recommend the Corsair simply because I know of many gamers that are very ahppy with it, though I doubt you'd be disappointed with either one.
BigJonsson said:
You should be fine, my PSU (even though its rated at 520w) has two 15a 12V rails and it handles a heavily overclocked GTX 260 (216), 3.5ghz E5200, 4 RAM sticks, 3 fans, 2 HDDs and a BD drive just fine.
I totally agree, I honestly feel for anyone who chucked $600+ for the GTX 280, only to watch in horror as faster cards are released less than a year later for THREE TIMES LESS. (Yes, that does need repeating).brain_stew said:
Also, I don't think that anyone buying a HD4890 or GTX275 will be needing a new graphics card for a long time to come, so I would certainly recommend them to anyone looking to future-proof their PC.
Anyway, I am a bit behind on Sound cards it seems, as I am still using my old Audigy 2 ZS. What are the best value for money cards out there and is it even worth my time upgrading as a gamer and not an audiophile as such?
rohlfinator
Member
Yikes, I wish I could justify putting my PC together right now. This is pretty much exactly what I'm looking for.brain_stew said:
lowlylowlycook
Member
Stop It said:
Yeah, I was just trying to point out that it would almost make sense to benchmark just a few games if you are comparing either high end cards or SLI/Xfire rigs.
So a general question: Anyone know of "realistic" CPU benchmarks for gaming? Almost every one I've seen artificially CPU limits the computers either with super low resolutions or crazy 4GPU setups. What I really want to know is under what circumstances a, say, Phenom II X3 will be a bottleneck if I have a GTX260. I guess that would be a lot of testing though.
MWS Natural
Member
brain_stew said:
Bought it, thanks for the advice. If it turns out to be a bit small I can always buy a 2nd and go dual monitors.
rohlfinator
Member
Yeah, you can basically just drop them into your new Steam folder and it'll work fine. When I've done this in the past, I usually start downloading the games on the new machine so Steam creates the file structure, and then drop the backup in and overwrite whichever files Steam just created. Then once you restart Steam, it should be good to go.Darklord said: