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Official PS5 PRO Specs (Finally)

Nice to see the official specs released, defo going to look/run better than base ps5.

Although not sure anyone who buys is going to convince anyone but themselves that it's a huge difference and worth the upgrade.

Most casuals and family/friends who see it in action won't think its anything different even with you saying "look that building has more clarity, or that puddle looks so much better,it looks so real.

Pop Tv GIF by Schitt's Creek's Creek
The same argument could be made for when it comes to choosing between PC vs console. PCs are more powerful sure, but most casuals don't really care about spending 3x the money for prettier looking puddles.
 
Well it's just that, ~60% more power + PSSR + 2GB RAM + 1TB SSD, for 75% more price than the digital PS5. I think it is coherent.
PSSR is the only killer feature and I’m quite excited for it.. I think it will be big specially when more mature in PS6… but for now in my eyes doesn’t really justify the asking price..
 

Mr.Phoenix

Member
Neither concerned nor do care. It's just amazing how Sony can get away with stuff and fanboys are just sheep following. at least Zen3 for a system that is being released 4 years since your last Zen 2 console.

I really hope it flop sales and marketing-wise. I'm not too fond of this trend.
Now this is a dumb thing to say....

since we are taking receipts... from Jan... couldn't find the one from last year

Same here, well I am between 16-17. I am curious to see how much at least sony first party makes use of the dual issue compute though. Its about time we actually see a game use it. Its pretty much been ignored on the PC side of things on both AMD and Nvidia cards.
and this was from last year on the 2GB of RAM
The fact is this, the PS5 has two pools of RAM. 16GB GDDR6 and 512MB DDR4. This is important because it ties into the many overlaps between the PS5s design and the PS4. The PS4 had 8GB of GDDR5 and 256MB of DDR3. How can you not see the similarities?

The PS4pro, kept the GDDR5amountthe ame, but increased the 256MB of DDR3 to 1GB. Doing so, and shifting more of the core os from GDDR to DDR, is a cheap way of giving the system more RAM.

Why you are insisting, that Sony will somehow not just do the same things again now wth the PS5pro is beyond me. And who is talking about spit pools? Increasing the RAM that is already in the system from 512MB to 2GB means that th 2.5GB of RAM used for the OS from the 16GB of GDDR6, can be freed up. They did the exact same thing with the PS4pro. This literally means that with the exact same bus width, exact same number of GDDR6 chips, exact same amount of GDDR6 RAM, devs now get as much as 2GB extra to work with on the PS5pro. And increasing the 512MB of DDR4 RAM to 2GB...is the most cost-effective way of doing that.
 
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Fafalada

Fafracer forever
Because that tablet-tier CPU was a much more limiting factor than the PS4 Pro’s GPU in most cases.
Outside of the handful of titles that aimed for higher fps on Pro (and there were really, really few) on average things were actually upside down.
Most Pro titles ran better on behalf of faster CPU (also goes for 1X) because baseline was the 30% lower clocked CPU in base machines. Usually that meant unstable-fps -> stable fps at given targets, which is very common result (even on the latest and greatest titles like the new Cod).
My personal experience with the hw mirrored that - where doing 'nothing' on the GPU gave us enough framerate headroom on CPU to bump LODs and stuff - and we only dialed up GPU settings after. Had the CPU not been faster - the upgrade would have been a much more painful juggle of things.

If we look GPU wise - you need to look inside the pipelines (framerate counters are very unreliable metric for this) but we do have the general average - most common PS4Pro enhancement was 1080p->1440p. The outliers are few and far in between, and average actually probably lands below 1440p but since other changes apply (not just pixel counts) that gets a bit harder to measure. But suffice to say you didn't normally see 130% faster GPU runtime.
 

SonGoku

Member
  • Oh I didn't see this.
So the extra two must be for the OS/UI like the PS4 Pro's extra 1GB.
Yes, I remember that and it may very well be however theres also the possibility of it being nothing more than SSD cache which im hope im wrong about but rather not get my hopes up before confirmation
PS4 Pro didn't use the extra memory as a disk cache but for the 4k frontend. It's likely the same case here as well because there's even less point in having a disk cache with an SSD.
PS4 Pro didn't have a built in SSD
All/Most fast SSDs use SDRAM as cache buffer, the PS5 has something like 512MB for the SSD cache. With the Pro being 2TB it fits with a 2GB cache.

For example the Samsung 990 Pro SSD has the following cache memory options:
  • 1 TB: 1 GB of Samsung 1GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM
  • 2 TB: 2 GB of Samsung 2GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM
  • 4 TB: 4 GB of Samsung 4GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM
I hope this is not the case btw, im just wondering considering Cerny did not mention it as part of a System memory addon to free GDDR6 for games like how they did it with the PS4 Pro
 
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You forgot to include a copy of windows, keyboard and a mouse/controller. Also a fee for putting this all together given that PS5 pro comes pre-assembled.

Sorry. What was your point again?
I’m not a PC gamer but you are missing the point.. most of the things you mention PC gamers already have.. of course the cost is there but is diluted in time as just you maybe have bought the base PS5 so you should factor that price too when considering the PS5 Pro cost.. no doubt the larger part of initial buyers will have base PS5 already..

And I’m not even considering games prices and cost to play online…

Unlike console gaming, PC gamers don’t need to fully buy a new PC when they want to upgrade.. they just do it overtime… choosing the components they need..

In the end they will pay more? Yes but maybe not that much and the experience will be considerably better..
 

SonGoku

Member
I don't think it's for OS in the way most of think it is. That would mean it would have a split memory pool like XBSX, which Cerny doesn't like. Which means the CPU doesn't benefit from that 2GB DDR5.


On PS4 Pro, it was separate form the main chip and acted as cache.

The nitty-gritty details of the PS4 Pro, according to system architect Mark Cerny / More power, at what cost?
It also makes use of its system memory in a more efficient fashion, using a higher bandwidth on the 8GB of GDDR5 memory to squeeze out an additional 512MB for game developers to make use of. An additional 1GB of conventional DRAM was put in the Pro to help it switch applications, so software like Netflix will be stored on the DRAM when open but not in use.

Here we can see the PS4 Pro's motherboard, which shows the 1GB DDR3 connected to the SCEI I/O controller (Auxiliary processor) and not the main chip.

PlayStation 4 Pro Teardown
5ILLe7A.jpeg


Same for PS4 as well, but with 256 MB of DDR3.
PlayStation 4 technical specifications

Auxiliary processor

The PS4 includes a secondary ARM processor (with separate 256 MiB of RAM) to assist with background functions and OS features.


On the PS5, we can see a similar approach. 512MB DDR4 is connected to the SSD controller as cache.

PlayStation 5 Teardown
Ma0oWSn.jpeg


If Sony is following what they did with the PS4 Pro, the 512MB DDR4 would increase and change to 2GB DDR5.

PSSR and Ray Tracing memory utilization is probably the reason they went with 2GB.

The PS5's SSD controller actually handles a lot of stuff.
XFyhJmj.jpeg



RO3ZNGY.jpeg
Interesting, so you think they could use the SSD controller IO memory for more than just SSD cache to help free GDDR6 for games like they did with the PS4 Pro?
Come on, dude. PS5 Standard is $550. Does anyone really think that the $80 difference of the disc drive is equivalent to the bigger GPU, WiFi-7 chip, RDNA 4 ray-tracing, ML hardware, PSSR tech, 1 TB additional SSD, etc.?

Let's be realistic.

$699 is absolutely a lot of money, but PS5 Pro still literally is the cheapest device for high-end gaming.
PS4 launched at $399, PS4 Pro which was over 2x GPU upgrade launched at $399 with disc drive
The base PS5 is overpriced to begin with which is why its sales are starting to fall off so unless Sony drops the price of base PS5 its sales will just keep falling off with the exception of odd game releases like GTA6, at this point of the generation base PS5 without drive should be below $399. The Pro APU shouldn't be that much more expensive given its size and things like WiFI chips and extra storage are dirt cheap for Sony to buy in bulk, that does not explain a >$200 gap.

If it’s 4nm why does it need a nearly 400W power supply?
PSU does not equal power consumption, afik it has a buffer to work with. Its average gaming consumption could be 300W or maybe less
It's real RAM. I remember the MLID leak said something similar months ago.
I hope, i dont trust MLID is the slightest
 

AngelMuffin

Member
None of it matters.

It could be a supercomputer and people would still bitch and moan because of the sticker shock.

Rational breakdowns of component costs? Who cares. Comparisons with the price of equivalent PC hardware? Ok egghead.

None of that generates clicks like a disgruntled Youtube thumbnail does.

RWZGDRw.jpeg


Lqgm5Cg.jpeg


ZW4DALk.jpeg


hWaW5w1.jpeg


8Jp5jR1.jpeg
I’ve never had a problems with the price. I’m sure Sony could have priced this at $599, but the profit margin for the Pro needs to be higher than the base console since they will only sell a fraction vs the base console. You can break even or have slim margins on a mass market console while steadily increasing margins over time with refreshes, etc., but not on something like this.
 
Literally no one would be bitching if this thing was on par or outperforming even a 4080 (which is over 2 years old at this point). The problem is when you start to hit certain price tiers (i.e. $850 for a disc edition with tax), people aren't so eager to pay that much for a fourth or fifth class experience. Nearing $1000 for gaming hardware is courting premium shoppers looking for a top tier experience, and Sony is absolutely competing for mindshare with impending $699 5070's and 999$ 5080's that will run circles around Pro. High end GPU's aren't actually competition or reasonable substitutions against a $399 PS5, but they are against a $780 Pro. No one entertaining $850 for a Pro is pinching pennies trying to buy used PC shit off Craigslist, they have disposable income and the means to increase their budget without skipping meals.
Dude, seriously, if the Rtx 5070 is 699 I'm gonna shave my head completely bald. If the 5080 is 999, I'm gonna cut my dick off. Like, really, what year is this, 2016? We're well past the point where an xx70 and xx80 class gpu was priced like that. This ain't 2016, and we ain't looking at Nvidia in their Gtx 10 series gpu days, where they priced their different gpu tiers reasonably. Those days are long gone and anybody expecting the 50 series to be priced that reasonably... Well, they're in for a rude awakening. Notable Perf uplifts for the 50 series are definitely happening, just don't expect to get that at a reasonable price point, we're well past that.
 
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diffusionx

Gold Member
Literally no one would be bitching if this thing was on par or outperforming even a 4080 (which is over 2 years old at this point). The problem is when you start to hit certain price tiers (i.e. $850 for a disc edition with tax), people aren't so eager to pay that much for a fourth or fifth class experience. Nearing $1000 for gaming hardware is courting premium shoppers looking for a top tier experience, and Sony is absolutely competing for mindshare with impending $699 5070's and 999$ 5080's that will run circles around Pro. High end GPU's aren't actually competition or reasonable substitutions against a $399 PS5, but they are against a $780 Pro. No one entertaining $850 for a Pro is pinching pennies trying to buy used PC shit off Craigslist, they have disposable income and the means to increase their budget without skipping meals.

Yes, the actual real world price of the (soon to be ) released PS5 Pro does compare to these fantastical prices of the not even yet announced 5xxx GPUs. Problem is that the 5080 isn't going to cost $1000 and the 5070 will not cost $700, provided it releases at the same time and not 6-9 months later like the 4070 did.

It also needs to be said that every PC component has gone up in price over the past couple years except for RAM and SSDs. Motherboards are more expensive. Power supplies are more expensive. CPUs are more expensive. Anything beyond a standard black brick case is more expensive. You're just laying out way more money for this stuff than you used to. Especially for hardware that targets "gamers."

Sony raised the price of the PS5 Pro because hardware has gotten more expensive across the board, they are following the charge not leading it.
 
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Loboxxx

Member
PSSR is the only killer feature and I’m quite excited for it.. I think it will be big specially when more mature in PS6… but for now in my eyes doesn’t really justify the asking price..
Now I think no one can say whether or not the PS5pro is worth it, but all the criticisms that speculate about PS5pro are because it is expensive, none of us know what it can really offer. If Unreal 5 games or games like Dragon Dogma or the recent Monster Hunter Wild, look sharp and keep the 60fps, everything will change and suddenly it will look better. There are still about 5 years left in the generation and they can be very long in terms of IQ or performance.

I recognize that I bought it blindly and I may be disappointed, but I believe that the goal of achieving 60fps and good image quality of PS5 games will be achieved. 🫰
 

Loxus

Member
Interesting, so you think they could use the SSD controller IO memory for more than just SSD cache to help free GDDR6 for games like they did with the PS4 Pro?
Well, on the motherboard I do see a chip that resembles DDR, but it rather large in comparison to other DDR chip next to the SSD controller.

The chip next to the GDDR6 at the bottom.
kDsrd1N.jpeg


Nothing resembling DDR on the other side.
R3vAi7j.jpeg


If that's the DDR5, it's still most likely used as some form of cache, probably for PSSR and RT, plus other background stuff.

Having that 2GB of DDR5 for the OS would be inefficient, as data would still need to be duplicated in the GDDR6.
 

Euler007

Member
None of it matters.

It could be a supercomputer and people would still bitch and moan because of the sticker shock.

Rational breakdowns of component costs? Who cares. Comparisons with the price of equivalent PC hardware? Ok egghead.

None of that generates clicks like a disgruntled Youtube thumbnail does.

RWZGDRw.jpeg


Lqgm5Cg.jpeg


ZW4DALk.jpeg


hWaW5w1.jpeg


8Jp5jR1.jpeg
The funny part about these thumbnails is that it's a bunch of content creators that are either driving lambos or aspiring to by getting clicks from minimum wage workers.
 

sncvsrtoip

Member
the 2GB DDR5 is only for the OS. its not for games.

Previously, the ps5 used 12.5 gb of Gddr5 for games. so 3.5 gb was reserved for the os. iirc, there were recent reports that some of this was freed up recently due to reducing the OS footprint. but having a dedicated 2GB of slower ddr5 ram just for OS will free up at least 2GB for games, and likely the full 16GB. this is exactly what happened with the ps4 pro which got an additional 1gb of ddr4 ram that opened up around 1.5 gb for pro games from the 8 gb gddr5 pool.
We already knew its 13.7gb on pro vs 12.5 on amateur
 

Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
PS4 launched at $399, PS4 Pro which was over 2x GPU upgrade launched at $399 with disc drive
The base PS5 is overpriced to begin with which is why its sales are starting to fall off so unless Sony drops the price of base PS5 its sales will just keep falling off with the exception of odd game releases like GTA6, at this point of the generation base PS5 without drive should be below $399. The Pro APU shouldn't be that much more expensive given its size and things like WiFI chips and extra storage are dirt cheap for Sony to buy in bulk, that does not explain a >$200 gap.
How is PS5 overpriced to begin with when Sony is still facing hardware losses?

UEyt694.jpeg
 

Pfroebbel

Member
Do we know if i can use my m2 ssd from my old PS5 and put it in the Pro and the installed Games run on the New Console or does it format the m2 when i put it in a new Console?
 
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Fafalada

Fafracer forever
Yes, I remember that and it may very well be however theres also the possibility of it being nothing more than SSD cache which im hope im wrong about but rather not get my hopes up before confirmation
The way I remember in-depth walkthrough of PS5 I/O architecture - there are no DRam caches, they built a stack in a fashion that allowed them to leverage SRam (in much smaller quantities obviously) for caching relevant bits of data and achieving the throughput they were after.

On the PS4Pro front - they did ostensibly leverage DRam as a hot-swap for System memory though (basically freeing it up when it was inactive), so that could still apply here to retain the functionality without requiring software dealing with any special cases.

Do we know if i can use my m2 ssd from my old PS5 and put it in the Pro and the installed Games run on the New Console or does it format the m2 when i put it in a new Console?
According to this youtuber - yes.
I've never tried it myself though so can't say if it's real or not.
 

Mibu no ookami

Demoted Member® Pro™
How is PS5 overpriced to begin with when Sony is still facing hardware losses?

UEyt694.jpeg

It's wild that people will say things without any actual understanding, yet have no problem being confident. They have no ideal that inflation hits companies too. The idea that because at this point in previous generations they've been able to cut prices means that they should have cut prices this generation, is such surface level commentary.

If Sony dropped the price of the PS5 family by 100 dollars at the end of the previous fiscal year and sold say 20 million units this fiscal year, it would have been a net loss of 2 billion dollars.

Instead of doing that they kept their 2 billion dollars and actually released whats certainly a higher margin model. If they make 100 dollars on the Pro (probably less) and sell 2 million units of Pros this fiscal year that's 200 million in profit.

More realistically you aim for 18 million units (16 standard and 2 pro). That's a net of 2 billion dollars. And that's just on top of the losses they were already going to incur.

Likely that will Pro sales/profits will be offset by holiday discounting to keep MAUs up.

Do we know if i can use my m2 ssd from my old PS5 and put it in the Pro and the installed Games run on the New Console or does it format the m2 when i put it in a new Console?

It'll format based on what I heard. But the above video shows otherwise.... interesting.
 
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Do you have examples of PS4 vs PS4 Pro’s performance with uncapped frame rate or when they aren’t CPU-limited? Because that tablet-tier CPU was a much more limiting factor than the PS4 Pro’s GPU in most cases.
Most PS4 Pro games runs either at 1440p (instead of 1080p) then CBR 1800p. CBR 2160 was actually pretty rare. 1440p is 77% more pixels than 1080p. CBR 1800p must be about 1440p level with the cost of CBR.
 

MaKTaiL

Member
Premium product?

60% increase in power, same old CPU, missing features.. still relying in 30 fps modes to give you the best experience.. all this 4 years later and at double the price of the base console!! (In Europe)

This machine is in no man’s land.. the casuals will completely ignore it and the hard core who care for specs and best experiences will still look at it as an half assed effort from Sony but being asked to pay premium price..

Of course a lot of people will still buy it and enjoy it for sure.. but in the mid long run I think it will tank hard if they don’t revise the price, specially in Europe..
30fps is never going away. Extra power will always be used to boost graphics.
 

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
Yes, I remember that and it may very well be however theres also the possibility of it being nothing more than SSD cache which im hope im wrong about but rather not get my hopes up before confirmation

PS4 Pro didn't have a built in SSD
All/Most fast SSDs use SDRAM as cache buffer, the PS5 has something like 512MB for the SSD cache. With the Pro being 2TB it fits with a 2GB cache.

For example the Samsung 990 Pro SSD has the following cache memory options:
  • 1 TB: 1 GB of Samsung 1GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM
  • 2 TB: 2 GB of Samsung 2GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM
  • 4 TB: 4 GB of Samsung 4GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM
I hope this is not the case btw, im just wondering considering Cerny did not mention it as part of a System memory addon to free GDDR6 for games like how they did it with the PS4 Pro
The I/O has partitions made on the storage for this.
 

SonGoku

Member
Well, on the motherboard I do see a chip that resembles DDR, but it rather large in comparison to other DDR chip next to the SSD controller.

The chip next to the GDDR6 at the bottom.
kDsrd1N.jpeg


Nothing resembling DDR on the other side.
R3vAi7j.jpeg


If that's the DDR5, it's still most likely used as some form of cache, probably for PSSR and RT, plus other background stuff.

Having that 2GB of DDR5 for the OS would be inefficient, as data would still need to be duplicated in the GDDR6.
What about the possibility of it just being SSD cache which was previously 512MB now upgraded to 2GB to cope with 2TB?
How is PS5 overpriced to begin with when Sony is still facing hardware losses?

UEyt694.jpeg
Because it launched at $399(DE) & $499 (PE). Four years later there should be a substantial price cut not increase.
As far back as August 2021 they claimed the PE no longer selling at loss and the DE had its losses offset by peripherals and PS4
It's basically impossibile they kept 32 Gbps....

For a simple reason: PS5 Pro actually supports 8K output

They could use compression, but I still expect at least 40 if not 48 gbps
8K output on a base PS5 was never enabled via firmware...

PS5 Pro has 8K output natively

HDMI chip should be different
The Brazilian guy doing the tear down claims its the exact same hdmi chip as the PS5 Phat and Slim

It’s still an increase in power
Sure but the increase in CUs is higher than the power reduction going from 7nm to 4nm
The way I remember in-depth walkthrough of PS5 I/O architecture - there are no DRam caches, they built a stack in a fashion that allowed them to leverage SRam (in much smaller quantities obviously) for caching relevant bits of data and achieving the throughput they were after.
What was the 512MB DDR4 chip used for then? I assumed it was the SSD cache, techpowerup has it listed as SSD cache
GQkfpbS.png
 
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Poppyseed

Member
Do we know if i can use my m2 ssd from my old PS5 and put it in the Pro and the installed Games run on the New Console or does it format the m2 when i put it in a new Console?
When I switched from the OG PS5 to the Slim PS5, I just moved across the SSD, and I was surprised to see all my games just showed up. So... probably, is the answer to your question.
 

Gaiff

SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
Most PS4 Pro games runs either at 1440p (instead of 1080p) then CBR 1800p. CBR 2160 was actually pretty rare. 1440p is 77% more pixels than 1080p. CBR 1800p must be about 1440p level with the cost of CBR.
You don’t use the better percentage of pixels to refer to rendering performance. 77% more pixels =/= 77% faster rendering.

However, if the PS4 Pro only did 1080p>1440p most of the time, it’s even less than 77% faster.
 
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Loxus

Member
SonGoku SonGoku
Could be possible.
On PS4 Pro there's a secondary ARM processor which the DDR3 is connected to and is used as cache for swapping apps. I don't think the SSD controller on the PS5 is much different, since it also handles background functions such as Blu-ray, WiFi, Bluetooth, LAN, etc.

How is more info on what that 1GB DDR3 on PS4 Pro is used for.
Inside PlayStation 4 Pro: How Sony made the first 4K games console
"We felt games needed a little more memory - about 10 per cent more - so we added a gigabyte of slow, conventional DRAM to the console," Cerny reveals, confirming that it's DDR3 in nature. "On a standard model, if you're switching between an application, such as Netflix, and a game, Netflix is still in system memory even when you're playing the game. We use that architecture because it allows for a very quick swap between applications. Nothing needs to be loaded, it's already in memory."

Some might say it's an extravagant use of the PS4's fast GDDR5 memory, so the extra DDR3 memory in the Pro is used to store non-critical apps, opening up more RAM for game developers.

"On PS4 Pro, we do things differently, when you stop using Netflix, we move it to the slow, conventional gigabyte of DRAM. Using that strategy frees up almost one gigabyte of the eight gigabytes of GDDR5. We use 512MB of that freed up space for games, which is to say that games can use 5.5GB instead of the five and we use most of the rest to make the PS4 Pro interface - meaning what you see when you hit the PS button - at 4K rather than the 1080p it is today."
 
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