BobTheFork
Member
I need to read it again. I thought it was just a normal flock of birds and Sabo can ride it because he's awesome.
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One Piece Manga |OT| ZEHAHAHAHA! The Name of this Age is Blackbeard!
- Thread starter TheGreatDirector
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LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
Lol, wouldn't that be amazing if you could ride birds just by being awesome.
Reminds me of "KILL HIM WITH YOUR AWESOME!" ;b
Cloud Strife
Member
Imperial Bishop
Banned
At last, the events that led up to Sabo joining the Revs is revealed.
The amnesia card is pretty cliche, but it makes sense. Sabo doesn't seem like the kind of guy who would stay put if he knew Ace was going to be executed.
Luffy's tearful sobbing and hugging the shit out of Sabo had me like
The amnesia card is pretty cliche, but it makes sense. Sabo doesn't seem like the kind of guy who would stay put if he knew Ace was going to be executed.
Luffy's tearful sobbing and hugging the shit out of Sabo had me like
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Kind of disappointed Oda used Amnesia to explain why Sabo didn't go to Marineford
More Fun To Compute
Member
Sabo being amnesiac is a bit corny but there probably are not many better ways of showing the whole inherited will thing.
That cheeky wizard of oz cover and tiny images of women standing next to Dragon will fuel One Piece theories for years though.
That cheeky wizard of oz cover and tiny images of women standing next to Dragon will fuel One Piece theories for years though.
Imperial Bishop
Banned
This all but confirms that Dragon has a Wind logia devil fruit power, right?
BobTheFork
Member
I'm guessing wind. With that we could just move storm systems where ever he wanted.
Pegosaurus
Banned
I guess amnesia explains a lot.
Nice chapter though, glad Luffy and Sabo still have each other :')
Also, I wonder who the birds belong to. Interesting ability.
Hiatus next week, as expected, but are we back to getting chapters on wednesdays instead of thursday?
yeah bellamy was thanking luffy for stopping him and doflamingo.
he knew that he was being foolish, but would rather keep his pride/not admit to losing respect for himself and be defeated by Luffy instead of betraying the man he looked up to for so long. as he said, fools have their own foolish way of doing things. I actually really really liked the exchanges between Luffy and Bellamy, and I like how Luffy considers him his friend.
Nice chapter though, glad Luffy and Sabo still have each other :')
Also, I wonder who the birds belong to. Interesting ability.
Hiatus next week, as expected, but are we back to getting chapters on wednesdays instead of thursday?
IIRC Bellamy was thanking Luffy for stopping him.
I didn't really get it tbh.
yeah bellamy was thanking luffy for stopping him and doflamingo.
he knew that he was being foolish, but would rather keep his pride/not admit to losing respect for himself and be defeated by Luffy instead of betraying the man he looked up to for so long. as he said, fools have their own foolish way of doing things. I actually really really liked the exchanges between Luffy and Bellamy, and I like how Luffy considers him his friend.
Audible Phonetics
Member
Good chapter but tired of these hiatus breaks
Pegosaurus
Banned
i'd like no hiatuses too, but being a mangaka is a demanding job and Oda has almost 800 chapters under his belt for one (very popular) manga.
he can take a break every few weeks, he deserves it tbh.
More Fun To Compute
Member
Doesn't the tattoo on Dragon's face look like a stylised flock of birds? Coincidence?
Pegosaurus
Banned
i don't really see it
I think this storm power is our best guess so far for his abilities
he might not even have a devil fruit
More Fun To Compute
Member
Storm power could be a thing but as Nami would tell you the way to create a storm would be by changing air pressure. Any of the characters with abilities that alter things like heat, cold or gravity could create a storm.
BobTheFork
Member
To me it just looked like a diamond grid. I hope they reveal it doesn't mean anything and he just got a tribal tattoo when he turned 18
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Dragon always looked like a Go Nagai character or something
BobTheFork
Member
Oh better yet! Luffy's Mom ate the Tat-Tat fruit and was dying an basically just inked herself onto her husband's face as her last act.
More Fun To Compute
Member
The lines are more curved and overlapping than you would have in a diamond but maybe in some of the art it looks more like a straight diamond pattern.
When Oda quits and Kishimoto takes over that's totally what is going to happen. Or if the Bleach guys takes over then it turns out all along that everyone was hypnotised by the tattoo and was doing exactly what Dragon wanted them to do from the start. They were all manipulated by his amazing plan such intelligent reveal.
Pegosaurus
Banned
And he's said that he hasn't been able to spend much time with his family, in the past -- so I assume the breaks are partly to let him do that.
J
Jpop
Unconfirmed Member
Doesn't Jump force breaks on Oda as he overworks himself?
Yep. Early in Dressrosa he worked himself into the hospital.
They don't want to risk anything happening to him, which is a good thing. For once what's good for the employee and what's good for the company line up perfectly. Besides, it gives him an extra week to work on nothing but the story each month.
One Piece 794:
I wish Oda could have written something better than Amnesia but it's one of the few story options that work since he added Sabo after the fact vs planning him from the beginning, and there's no other good ways to explain Sabo not showing up after all this time.
There's still a long time between now and the end of One Piece in regards to Sabo's future actions so I recognize my opinions about Sabo now will probably change, but at the moment I still think Oda should have just left Ace alive vs having to come up with all this back story for a new character just to be able to shock fans by killing a well liked character they weren't expecting him to kill. But this is only the first arc Sabo has been in, so I'm hoping Oda gives him more importance story wise outside of doing things Ace could have done in his place.
I wish Oda could have written something better than Amnesia but it's one of the few story options that work since he added Sabo after the fact vs planning him from the beginning, and there's no other good ways to explain Sabo not showing up after all this time.
There's still a long time between now and the end of One Piece in regards to Sabo's future actions so I recognize my opinions about Sabo now will probably change, but at the moment I still think Oda should have just left Ace alive vs having to come up with all this back story for a new character just to be able to shock fans by killing a well liked character they weren't expecting him to kill. But this is only the first arc Sabo has been in, so I'm hoping Oda gives him more importance story wise outside of doing things Ace could have done in his place.
Sabo acts as a link to the revolution, he functions differently in the story than Ace did while he was alive. Ace acted as a link between Luffy and the higher levels of pirates in the series, now that he's challenging those powers Ace isn't really needed. From a narrative stand point anyway.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Ace's role as a death in the story fits him much better, plus his relationship with WhiteBeard would mean he could never join the Revolutionary Army like Sabo. Not like he'd ever want to, Ace was too free spirited for that. Sabo being a noble and then a revolutionary is better.
Unknown One
Member
So the revolutionary army also hunt down some pirates I'm guessing. Makes sense really.
Oda definitely couldn't have had Sabo be a pirate also, otherwise there's no way Ace and him wouldn't have crossed paths at some point.
While you're right that Sabo is giving us a different perspective, we're really not learning that much about the Revolutionaries at the moment and I have a feeling it's going to stay that way until it's time for Dragon and Luffy to talk.
"Arguably", Ace's tattoo is an example of a "retcon". Originally the tattoo misspelling was just a funny joke making fun of Ace for misspelling his own name/having to fix his tattoo to spell his name right. Until Ace was killed and Sabo was added, there were no other story reasons to indicate Ace's tattoo had any other significance. Because of this, there's no reason to believe Oda "always had this planned" outside of getting too caught up in the fandom/"OMG Oda". It's similar to arguments between people who believe Oda always had Haki planned vs Shanks having a badass moment all those years ago and Oda crafting a story/a concept around that moment later in the story to enhance it.
Got proof of that?
Read more of my post than the bolded? I opened my post with "Arguably" for a reason.
You stated the tattoo had no significance and was a retcon and tried to pass it off with a myth that was proven wrong. There's no "arguably" here.
Sabo has been planned for a very long time, there's no "retcon" here. He was always a character who would show up in this series.
Now whether you like or hated how his story played out is another discussion.
Sabo has been planned for a very long time, there's no "retcon" here. He was always a character who would show up in this series.
Now whether you like or hated how his story played out is another discussion.
So then instead of asking me for proof, how about you provide proof for your claims since you're clearly making statements as factual as opposed to me using critical thinking and posting an argument?
The image of Ace on the right is from chapter 157 in Alabasta when they first arrived. He's been a character destined for the story since way back then.
So are you going to try to nitpick this or will you provide your proof that started this discussion where you stated the tattoo was a joke on the misspelling of his name?
You're not posting anything that goes against my original response to you. Not only that, but that image isn't proof of anything I bolded in your last post where you:
A) Claimed I tried to pass off a myth that was proven wrong.
B) Claimed that Sabo was planned for a very long time and was always a character who was going to show up in the series.
All your picture shows is that Ace has always had a tattoo with his name but with an S crossed out since he was first revealed. But that doesn't also mean that the S in Ace's tattoo has always had a connection to Sabo. That is my argument, that the connection to Sabo was established by Oda later and was an afterthought/retcon to the story. So unless you have proof that Sabo, not the S in the tattoo, was established earlier in the story of One Piece prior to the flashback where we were shown three Sake cup, you can't support any of the claims you made about my argument.
I'm sure that Sabo was planned and the tattoo was intentional, but my beef with it is that it makes little sense for Ace to have his tattoo structured like that. Why would he make his tribute A(SABO)CE? What does him placing Sabo's name in his name supposed to mean? I don't know if the misspelled tattoo thing was an idea that the fans came up with or if Oda put it in an SBS, but it was almost certainly made like that to mislead fans into thinking it's insignificant. Otherwise, they might have seen it and thought "Whats that S mean? Maybe a tribute to some dead character?" and guessed Sabo before he wanted to reveal it.
Personally, I'd have just had the crossed out S and have his mother's name begin with an S. Fans would think that it was a tribute to his mom, and then get slammed with the actual reveal.
Personally, I'd have just had the crossed out S and have his mother's name begin with an S. Fans would think that it was a tribute to his mom, and then get slammed with the actual reveal.
I've answered everything in your original post to me.
We can keep going in circles here as you dig yourself more and more into a hole, it's up to you.
I've still yet to see your proof that "arguably" the tattoo is a retcon.
It's clear here it doesn't matter what I say because you'll keep claiming it's a retcon anyways despite what's being shown to you.
And to Veelk the misspelled tattoo theory about it being a joke on Ace was a fan theory. It was stated Oda said it was a joke in an SBS but no such SBS exists.
We can keep going in circles here as you dig yourself more and more into a hole, it's up to you.
I've still yet to see your proof that "arguably" the tattoo is a retcon.
It's clear here it doesn't matter what I say because you'll keep claiming it's a retcon anyways despite what's being shown to you.
And to Veelk the misspelled tattoo theory about it being a joke on Ace was a fan theory. It was stated Oda said it was a joke in an SBS but no such SBS exists.
Right, but I would think the point of the tattoo being structured like that was still to mislead fans into thinking the tattoo was just a messed up tattoo, so as to preserve the big reveal. I just really don't understand the arrangement of placing in the symbol between his name otherwise.
Anyway, what you and Kreed are arguing about is literally answerable only by Oda himself, if even him. What Kreed suggests is that the Tattoo may not have actually had a purpose and was indeed just a design placement on Ace because why the hell not. This wouldn't be surprising, as plenty of characters have some designs that are just meant to look cool. If it was indeed so, then Oda decided later on that he can use the misspelling as a tribute to a dead brother instead, then that was easily arrangable by making Sabo's signature a crossed S. In this case, yes, it is a retcon. On the other hand, if Oda really planned it from the start, then it's foreshadowing. In regards to the story, it doesn't really make a difference because it's not like the tattoo is replacing any meaning before, and even if the illiterate tattooist were real, the replaced meaning is far more poignant than the original, so I'm pretty sure everyone would agree this is the better meaning.
But there is literally no way to know this for sure. If oda comes up to us and says "Yeah, it was planned from the start", even that could potentially be untrue if Oda was inclined to lie to make himself look better (Unlikely I guess, but possible). The only way is if we found documentation of some kind verifying it, and I doubt that's gonna come up any time soon.
Anyway, there's nothing wrong with Retcons so long as they are done correctly, like any other writing technique, so there's no reason to get finicky over a potential one that you can't even verify.
Do you even know what dig yourself in a hole means? You clearly didn't understand what I was saying in my original post, otherwise you would have never posted that image as a response since it didn't go against anything I originally said to you. You were the one who said I was believing in a myth and that my argument was PROVEN wrong. And you've posted nothing to support what you said. And now you want to end the argument. THAT is digging yourself in a hole. You also don't seem to have a concept of what a retcon is (hint: Terminator 5 wasn't always planned when the original Terminator was released, despite Terminator 5 having references to the original Terminator).
I don't get why it's so hard for you and so many One Piece fans to be willing to even entertain the idea that Oda can come up with SOME story elements after the fact and weaved them into the story vs having EVERY detail planned out since he submitted the first One Piece chapter to Jump. But if it helps with your enjoyment of the story, enjoy. But I can also believe he retconned it without being told I am believing in a "myth that was proven wrong" when it wasn't.
But yes, if you have nothing to add but images of Ace's tattoo with an S in it, we can agree to disagree and move on.
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