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[samus i am]

Paterno is being made a scapegoat, people are calling for his blood like he was the one diddling kids. It shows how quickly people can turn on you.

 

[C Jones]

He's a football coach, not Kojak. He reported it to the right people within his organization. How is he supposed to know that they'd be down for excusing and protecting a pedophile?

Because he keeps showing up to your school?

 

[Kosmo]

He's a football coach, not Kojak. He reported it to the right people within his organization. How is he supposed to know that they'd be down for excusing and protecting a pedophile?

It's a guy he worked with for over 30 years and was still around the program for another 10 and when he hears of these allegations he doesn't even talk to the guy about it?

JoePa is done, stick a form in him.

 

[WedgeX]

Is PA's mandated reporters of child abuse law really only limited to telling your superior? In Michigan it entails contacting and making a report to Child Protective Services as well.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

Right but the point here is I think the Board is using him as a scapegoat. If anyone at that school deserves to get institutional protection it is him.

Well, I can sort of agree with this. But he's also the figurehead for the program and the university and has to operate beyond reproach. Like a pastor or priest.

 

[crowphoenix]

Paterno is being made a scapegoat, people are calling for his blood like he was the one diddling kids. It shows how quickly people can turn on you.

He had the chance to do the right thing. He chose his football program over children. He deserves this.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

I'm going to post a link to the Grand Jury findings. I struggled to get through it, and felt physically ill more than once. Anyone defending Paterno and staff really needs to read it.

The content is extremely graphic.

http://www.attorneygeneral.gov/uploadedFiles/Press/Sandusky-Grand-Jury-Presentment.pdf

Because things are emotional we should immediately punish everyone involved as harshly as possible, even if they did what they were required to do....

Yeah. That's rational.

Like I keep saying. These things are awful. Sandusky should get whatever he has coming to him. What evidence is there that JoePa was "protecting" him though and not just doing his damn job which is unrelated to policing child abuse.

Well, I can sort of agree with this. But he's also the figurehead for the program and the university and has to operate beyond reproach. Like a pastor or priest.

Bullshit. They owe him. And on top of that there's no conduct here that suggests he was really doing anything wrong. If that university had any loyalty they would have issued a statement distancing from Sandusky and supporting JoePa.

 

[harSon]

I don't know, but after several years, you'd think he might pick up on the idea that something was off.

If I report to my superiors that someone within my organization was seen molesting a child, and nothing comes of it, I'd personally assume that nothing was found and the information was false. I'd like to think that people so high up within a prestigious college organization would not be in favor of lying for and protecting a child rapist, and I'm sure the same is true for Paterno and most people, so it's not surprising that he went on without connecting dots.

 

[Dude Abides]

He's a football coach, not Kojak. He reported it to the right people within his organization. How is he supposed to know that they'd be down for excusing and protecting a pedophile?

Hey could ask. "Hey, Tim. Whatever happened with Mike saying he saw Jerry raping a kid?"

Instead, "Hey Jerry, keep using our facilities. How's Second Mile going? That seems like a nice young boy you brought to practice today."

 

[tycoonheart]

Hey could ask. "Hey, Tim. Whatever happened with Mike saying he saw Jerry raping a kid?"

Instead, "Hey Jerry, keep using our facilities. How's Second Mile going? That seems like a nice young boy you brought to practice today."

Maybe he did ask that question. Maybe he was told that they carried out an investigation and found that to be a baseless accusation. We don't know those details yet.

 

[samus i am]

Hey could ask. "Hey, Tim. Whatever happened with Mike saying he saw Jerry raping a kid?"

Instead, "Hey Jerry, keep using our facilities. How's Second Mile going? That seems like a nice young boy you brought to practice today."

You have made your own assumptions about all of this. You have no idea if any of that took place.

 

[tokkun]

Is PA's mandated reporters of child abuse law really only limited to telling your superior? In Michigan it entails contacting and making a report to Child Protective Services as well.

They are required to report it to the police. The argument here is that Paterno reported it to an administrator who oversaw the campus police, so that counts as reporting to the police.

Maybe he did ask that question. Maybe he was told that they carried out an investigation and found that to be a baseless accusation. We don't know those details yet.

If this were true it seems like it would be mentioned in either the grand jury report or Paterno's official statement to the press.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

Hey could ask. "Hey, Tim. Whatever happened with Mike saying he saw Jerry raping a kid?"

Instead, "Hey Jerry, keep using our facilities. How's Second Mile going? That seems like a nice young boy you brought to practice today."

Most people don't press sensitive issues like that about their close friends. I even think most people would just report it and not bring it up with the close friend for fear of finding something out about them. If nothing came back I don't really blame JoePa if he just thought it got handled by the AD's office.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Holy shit, the Scott Van Pelt show just showed the line for the canceled press conference and it was huge. JoePa would've been eaten alive.

 

[crowphoenix]

If I report to my superiors that someone within my organization was seen molesting a child, and nothing comes of it, I'd personally assume that nothing was found and the information was false. I'd like to think that people so high up within a prestigious college organization would not be in favor of lying for and protecting a child rapist, and I'm sure the same is true for Paterno and most people, so it's not surprising that he went on without connecting dots.

Maybe after the first time, but this happened multiple times. And if those superiors had gone to the police, Paterno would have probably been interviewed as a character witness at least. And when it came out that nothing came of an investigation, I bet that not only would he have known, but that everyone in the athletics department would be quoting it constantly right now.

 

[Averon]

You report to your bosses that one of your co-workers is sexually abusing boys; nothing, apparently, is done and you don't follow up on it? Surely any sane person would be saying in their head "Why is this guy still working here? Why wasn't he arrested?" Joe may not have done anything criminal, but he showed extremely poor judgement.

 

[tokkun]

Most people don't press sensitive issues like that about their close friends. I even think most people would just report it and not bring it up with the close friend for fear of finding something out about them. If nothing came back I don't really blame JoePa if he just thought it got handled by the AD's office.

Most people? Know a lot of people whose friends have been accused of raping children by an eyewitness, do you?

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

Bullshit. They owe him. And on top of that there's no conduct here that suggests he was really doing anything wrong. If that university had any loyalty they would have issued a statement distancing from Sandusky and supporting JoePa.

Man, he was alerted that Sandusky did something sexual with a kid. Which, one can presume is why Sandusky never took over from JoePa in 99. And don't you think it's weird that Sandusky never got a coaching job ever after that? Fucking people were throwing captain chair's at Riker! And the Sandusky kept showing up on campus with other kids!

State College is a small town, you know who everyone else is.

"Oh, that's Jeff, his dad is the Defensive coordinator. Oh, that's my classmate Heather, her dad runs the Blue Band. Oh, that's Mike, he dad is a business prof. My buddy jon, his dad is a Chem prof"

 

[Marleyman]

Paterno is being made a scapegoat, people are calling for his blood like he was the one diddling kids. It shows how quickly people can turn on you.

Huh? He is the head man for YEARS at that place and didn't report this immediately to the police. He knew Sandusky for YEARS as well and didn't know he was how he was? So be it, but he has to step down as does everyone in charge. They need to start clean to start the process of cleaning this mess up.

 

[ReturnOfTheRAT]

He's no longer teflon. It's about time really.

 

[Amory]

Whether Paterno loses his job over this is completely irrelevant, the guy has what, maybe 2 more seasons in him at most anyway? Sure the argument could be made that he technically didn't do anything legally wrong and that he should keep coaching. In the court of public opinion, though, the guy's finished. Why keep him there after he helped to cover up something so morally reprehensible?

 

[Dude Abides]

You have made your own assumptions about all of this. You have no idea if any of that took place.

No evidence in the GJ report that he did any follow-up, and he hasn't claimed he did. If he had, the DA would presumably have asked him about it to strengthen the case against Curley and Schultz. Considering the incentives here, the safe assumption based on the record is that he didn't.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

You report to your bosses that one of your co-workers is sexually abusing boys; nothing, apparently, is done and you don't follow up on it? Surely any sane person would be saying in their head "Why is this guy still working here? Why wasn't he arrested?" Joe may not have done anything criminal, but he showed extremely poor judgement.

Um because you assume the accusations are baseless because this guy is your friend and you think you know him? I had a acquaintance who was put away for something comparable once, NO ONE would have expected it. I can't see how you would assume you're good friend is guilty based on accusations.

 

[samus i am]

You report to your bosses that one of your co-workers is sexually abusing boys; nothing, apparently, is done and you don't follow up on it? Surely any sane person would be saying in their head "Why is this guy still working here? Why wasn't he arrested?" Joe may not have done anything criminal, but he showed extremely poor judgement.

I don't agree. It is reasonable to assume that an investigation took place. An investigation that JoePa would not in anyway be involved in. If nothing came out of it, since he never got fired, it is safe to assume that the matter was handled.

So yes, he made a lot of assumptions, but none of that is a crime.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

Huh? He is the head man for YEARS at that place and didn't report this immediately to the police. He knew Sandusky for YEARS as well and didn't know he was how he was? So be it, but he has to step down as does everyone in charge. They need to start clean to start the process of cleaning this mess up.

If that's your logic then I would think a few people on the Board should be stepping down too. If you expect that big a shakeup you are a fool. If ANYONE in that organization should be left when this is all over it should be JoePa.

 

[Sanjuro]

Anyone coming in here uneducated, just read this. It will help you understand the entire situation clearer.

http://cbschicago.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/sandusky-grand-jury-presentment.pdf

The kicker for me is when one of the parent confronted Sandusky. His answer is a direct quote, she basically asked him this,

Mother: Did you fuck my son?
Sandusky: "I don't think so...maybe."

I can only imagine being a parent hearing that. Sandusky would have died that night or have needed reconstructive surgery.

 

[Marleyman]

Whether Paterno loses his job over this is completely irrelevant, the guy has what, maybe 2 more seasons in him at most anyway? Sure the argument could be made that he technically didn't do anything legally wrong and that he should keep coaching. In the court of public opinion, though, the guy's finished. Why keep him there after he helped to cover up something so morally reprehensible?

While he may have a few seasons left in him it is best to just wash their hands of anything to do with Sandusky and try to start clean.

 

[samus i am]

No evidence in the GJ report that he did any follow-up, and he hasn't claimed he did. If he had, the DA would presumably have asked him about it to strengthen the case against Curley and Schultz. Considering the incentives here, the safe assumption based on the record is that he didn't.

Maybe he didn't because he isn't a cop or prosecutor. He reported it to his higher ups and they are the ones that should have handled it.

 

[Marleyman]

If that's your logic then I would think a few people on the Board should be stepping down too. If you expect that big a shakeup you are a fool. If ANYONE in that organization should be left when this is all over it should be JoePa.

I expect his resignation within the next day or so; is that a "big shakeup" to you?

 

[tokkun]

Um because you assume the accusations are baseless because this guy is your friend and you think you know him? I had a acquaintance who was put away for something comparable once, NO ONE would have expected it. I can't see how you would assume you're good friend is guilty based on accusations.

Sandusky had been investigated for a similar case in 1998, just 4 years earlier. The eyewitness who is telling you he saw the guy raping a kid is one of your co-workers. What kind of person thinks the accusations are baseless in that situation?

 

[Incendiary]

Right but the point here is I think the Board is using him as a scapegoat. If anyone at that school deserves to get institutional protection it is him.

Paterno is the Penn State figurehead. Regardless of how instrumental a role he had in covering up Sandusky's activities, he's got to be the one to pay for it in the media and the general public's eyes. There may be other staff members who were much more proactive in brushing Sandusky's crimes under the rug, but it doesn't matter. Paterno was involved, so to save face the Penn State board has to deal with him first and foremost.

If Paterno stays, everyone who thinks he's a piece of shit now will continue to think he's a piece of shit. If Paterno resigns/is fired/leaves, everyone who thinks he's a piece of shit now will continue to think he's a piece of shit. There is absolutely nothing Paterno can do now aside from a long legal battle, and even then people will continue to think he's a piece of shit.

Legally, he may have done what he needed to. But morally, most people are going to say he didn't do enough because the guy wasn't prosecuted immediately. And there's nothing anyone can really do about it.

 

[braves01]

The media spin against Paterno is really ridiculous.

 

[Dude Abides]

Maybe he didn't because he isn't a cop or prosecutor. He reported it to his higher ups and they are the ones that should have handled it.

He's not a cop or a prosecutor. He's also someone who, at best, doesn't really care if his former DC and friend for decades is a child rapist who used his football team's facilities.

 

[Talamius]

Because things are emotional we should immediately punish everyone involved as harshly as possible, even if they did what they were required to do....

Yeah. That's rational.

Like I keep saying. These things are awful. Sandusky should get whatever he has coming to him. What evidence is there that JoePa was "protecting" him though and not just doing his damn job which is unrelated to policing child abuse.

Let's assume, just for a second, that JoePa wasn't protecting anyone. Would any rational human being who sees Sandusky in team facilities years later, WITH A KID THAT IS NOT HIS start asking questions? Especially if one of the current coaches actually walked in on such an act taking place? Why would Sandusky be allowed to operate out of an office on campus up until very recently?

It absolutely stinks of cover-up.

 

[pxleyes]

Paterno is being made a scapegoat, people are calling for his blood like he was the one diddling kids. It shows how quickly people can turn on you.

He is the face, body, and soul of Penn State football. He has as much sway as the President of the University. He is in no way a scapegoat when he could have done any number of things to address this in the past.

 

[brucewaynegretzky]

I expect his resignation within the next day or so; is that a "big shakeup" to you?

No. Him leaving is not a big shakeup. Getting EVERYONE in involved would likely involve dozens of people all the way up to the Board. JoePa is getting fucked in every direction at this point.

 

[C Jones]

Per WFAN 660 JoePa wanted to talk to the press today but Penn State shut it down. Scott Paterno said they are trying to schedule a media meeting for today so JoePa can talk. The family is also aware of the NYT report.

 

[Marleyman]

No. Him leaving is not a big shakeup. Getting EVERYONE in involved would likely involve dozens of people all the way up to the Board. JoePa is getting fucked in every direction at this point.

I realize that JoePa is getting it, but he is the figure head of that school for decades now, and this happened under his nose in his facility.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

Man, its gonna break my heart to see that old man cry.

 

[Dude Abides]

No. Him leaving is not a big shakeup. Getting EVERYONE in involved would likely involve dozens of people all the way up to the Board. JoePa is getting fucked in every direction at this point.

It's almost like he's a 10 year old boy!

 

[crowphoenix]

Man, its gonna breat my heart to see that old man cry.

Honestly, me too. I'm mad as hell at him and everyone in the Athletics Department. But last week, Paterno was one of my favorite coaches. I genuinely liked the old man, and I always wanted to see him win. Now... just god damn it.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

Honestly, me too. I'm mad as hell at him and everyone in the Athletics Department. But last week, Paterno was one of my favorite coaches. I genuinely liked the old man, and I always wanted to see him win. Now... just god damn it.

I have one of these cutouts at my folk's place still. Well, mine looks different, but the cardboard cutout all the same.

Sad to think this footage at a furry convention is just now depressing and prophetic of much darker things.

 

[Hari Seldon]

What is with Pennsylvania and rape mang!? He should know they didn't after that person continued to be employed for several more years giving him more opportunities to ruin lives.

Who was employed? Sandusky was asked to resign in 1999, presumably due to the 1998 investigation that was still ongoing. They just let him hang around because no chargers were filed in the earlier investigation.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Sad affair of things. I just got back but have been following on talk radio for a while.

I was going to look for the grand jury report next but this is just terrible.

 

[andycapps]

Per WFAN 660 JoePa wanted to talk to the press today but Penn State shut it down. Scott Paterno said they are trying to schedule a media meeting for today so JoePa can talk. The family is also aware of the NYT report.

I would like to see him talk, but that is just a horrible idea for himself. He is going to get hammered by the media by questions. A resignation by him at this point is probably the best case scenario for his legacy instead of trying to weather this and fight it.

Sad affair of things. I just got back but have been following on talk radio for a while.

I was going to look for the grand jury report next but this is just terrible.

I don't know if I can recommend reading it. It's pretty sick and depressing.

 

[Ourobolus]

Man, its gonna break my heart to see that old man cry.

My wife and I are gonna be crushed (well, even more so). :\

 

[Ninja Scooter]

He'll probably be Ohio State's next HC.

Not sure a guy name after a Pope is going to want to take Over a program off the heels of a child abuse scandal.

 

[Hari Seldon]

I would like to see him talk, but that is just a horrible idea for himself. He is going to get hammered by the media by questions. A resignation by him at this point is probably the best case scenario for his legacy instead of trying to weather this and fight it.

Let him talk. The dude is 84 years old and will confuse the shit out of everyone for maximum hilarity. Especially the non-sports reporters who have no idea who they are dealing with.

 

[C Jones]

I would like to see him talk, but that is just a horrible idea for himself. He is going to get hammered by the media by questions. A resignation by him at this point is probably the best case scenario for his legacy instead of trying to weather this and fight it.



I don't know if I can recommend reading it. It's pretty sick and depressing.

Joe is a feisty guy. He's not going to back down. I don't see a problem with him talking but Penn State may go ballistic.

Who thinks he's going to coach Saturday?

 

[Hari Seldon]

And for the record, there is no way JoePa should be fired before the people WHO WERE ACTUALLY INDICTED. Fucking Spanier, his head needs to be on a pike in front of Old Main.