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Penn State football pedophilia thread (UPDATE: NCAA sanctions handed down)
- Thread starter BertramCooper
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I'm aware of that, but usually it happens because of recruiting violations, not because they found out 10 years later that one of the players or coaches was a criminal who should've been in jail at the time.
Anyways, I can buy into the competitive advantage argument, but saying "it's a good punishment because it hurts his pride! LOL!" still seems really silly.
Who's "they" in your example?
ElectricBlanketFire
Member
Watch the student reactions to today's press conference and then get back to us.
The NCAA
At least Bobbo was coherent in his post-game interviews...and just interviews in general. It's clear JoePa was on the brink of senility. He should have retired before Holtz's crazy ass. PEACE.
Ok, because the thing is, switch "should've been in jail" for "should've been ineligible," and that definitely would happen.
Add on that the coach was covering it up, and I don't see a problem.
Care to explain again why vacating wins is exactly the same as what Paterno did?
While most of his shtick is way off, he is right that this has the potential to do serious harm to the academic side of the university, as well as the town itself, all in an effort to supposedly punish the admittedly culpable athletic arm of the university. Of course, like I said earlier, it seems that certain posters in here would be happy to see State College die out.
I never said they were exactly the same, I said that they're both forms of history denial in some sense. I feel that the proper preservation of history is more important than spiting some dead guy and his fans. But again, I'm okay with the vacation if the official reason for it is that Sandusky shouldn't have been eligible, but that's not what most of the people in here are arguing.
Tremendous lost revenues for the school, reduced donations from alumni, lost business in the town from reduced enrollment and athletic attendance, and so on. Not too hard to imagine. Like I mentioned earlier, Corbett, who by all rights must have known more than he's leading on while he was AG of PA during the whole scandal, gets off scot-free while simultaneously trying to reduce funding for state schools.
Ninja Scooter
Member
That's the ONLY way for the NCAA to have any power or authority to force schools to follow rules. Otherwise you are just saying to schools "If you cheat, as long as you cover it up while the player is playing for you, you can get away with it".
I think history's going to be just fine. There are going to be plenty of records of this punishment.
Well it's in part punitive, of course. As it should be.
This was the argument against the death penalty. You know, against not getting to play football games.
They're still going to play the games, they're just going to have a crap team. I really don't see how this will kill the university. "Tremendous lost revenues" - no, football revenue is a drop in the bucket compared to the rest of university revenues. And it'll still be there, even if somewhat reduced. "Reduced donations" - maybe, as a consequence of a bad team. Doubt it'll have that huge of an impact. "Reduced enrollment" - why would they reduce enrollment? The school decides how many people are enrolled, not the NCAA. "athletic attendance" - they're still playing the games, and attendance will still be high.
Rockandrollclown
lookwhatyou'vedone
There is no way to prove this of course, but I imagine the majority of lost revenues will come from the damage done to Penn State by the abusers, not the NCAA sanctions. If I mention Penn State to anyone now, what do you think of? Serial child molestation where the entire institution tried to cover it up. Not a place I would want to attend/give my alumni dollars even if the NCAA didn't do a thing.
If a year off would have meant avoiding the chance your team is devastated starting this year, I would have taken the death penalty. The team is done in the Big 10 for atleast half a decade. Bill O' brien was able to actual have a good recruiting season thus far based solely off of selling his NFL experience, but this kills it and leaves it majority walk-ons for a while.
Ninja Scooter
Member
The death penalty would have meant all coaches and players gone. Bill O'Brien would have gone and gotten a job somewhere else. They would have lost every single player on the roster. One year with no football might not sound like a lot, but it would have been even more devastating to this program than the sanctions imposed.
Sorry guys, I haven't been following the thread for the past few hours. Can someone explain to me if the statue is still there, if the Penn State students have rioted, and why some people are telling me that Paterno isn't the winningest college football coach of all time anymore? How does that even work? Doesn't that undermine all of the hard work that the faculty did to get these student athletes ready to play? What about the groundskeepers that mowed the ballpark and put the stripes on the field? Does that mean they never did any of that?
Has the abused kids asked for death penalty?
This has been asked before and is not relevant. They haven't asked for anything publicly nor should they be expected to.
Not really.
The NCAA COULD choose to go after what all of these athletic programs really care about:
Money.
Confiscate a schools TV money for a season or two and see how quickly things change.
The NCAA will never do that though, because ultimately the NCAA is run by the schools and they aren't going to take money out of their own pockets when they can just punish a bunch of people who had nothing to do with whatever happened and pretend that they are actually doing something.
GoldenEye 007
Member
Didn't the NCAA and Big Ten conference both fine PSU, though? NCAA 60 million taken out of their revenues to go to charity and the Big Ten taking away their share of bowl money to go to charity at 13 million per year. So about 112 million in lost FB revenue over 4 years.
ElectricBlanketFire
Member
Dat thread title change.
I wasn't really talking about this case in particular, this case is a bit of an outlier in that it has nothing to do with NCAA rules violations, but something much worse.
My point was mainly that the NCAA has the power to punish schools without punishing the athletes who didn't do anything wrong.
No it wouldn't. The school could still retain some staff and field a team and players that wanted to play could play. Penn state still has a lot of upside that would make them a competitive and compelling team even if they were gone for a year. What this does is cripple them for the long term. SMU was destroyed not because of missing the 1987 and 88 year but because they weren't able to fully recruit until the 90's. By then they were left behind.
I don't know beast, you tell me.
gutter_trash
Banned
Too lenient IMO
Too lenient. Hiding child rape should be dealt with harsher than giving players money etc.
Ninja Scooter
Member
If they were gone for a year, none of the good players or coaches in place would stick around. As it stands, at least now they have a slim chance to keep some of them. And you seem to be operating under the assumption that they'd be gone for a year and then back to business as usual. They might still face some sanctions that would hurt them in the long term.
Erickson said they would have faced additional penalties on top of the death penalty.
Imagine the current scholarship loss/bowl ban on top of literally not fielding a football team for an entire year.
You're talking about it like they had a choice between the two penalties. The way I read it was the death penalty would be in addition. I think PSU basically took the equivalent to a plea deal..."Accept this now and play football this year or drag it out longer and we'll also tack on no football this year and maybe more".
I don't really consider there to be a punishment that the NCAA can give that's too harsh. They're up against a culture that puts football over protecting people from heinous crimes. What if a slightly harsher punishment would have been the wake-up call to destroy that culture and prevent the next case? I mean, just look at some of those PSU reactions. So many still don't get it. Would a harsher punishment help? Maybe, maybe not, but it's worth it anyway.
Does this create a "slippery slope"? Yes. But this is a slope with "child rape" at the top and "destroyed football program" at the bottom. I'm OK with sliding down that slope.
Does this create a "slippery slope"? Yes. But this is a slope with "child rape" at the top and "destroyed football program" at the bottom. I'm OK with sliding down that slope.
I would have preferred a multi-year shutdown of the program and keeping the wins vs. what was actually handed out.
There needs to be a cultural purge at PSU. The football program is the heart of the cancer. It needs to be cut out and hopefully what grows in its place after a few years won't be corrupted.
There needs to be a cultural purge at PSU. The football program is the heart of the cancer. It needs to be cut out and hopefully what grows in its place after a few years won't be corrupted.
EatinOlives
Member
This is what truly pisses me off. All the people with the angry tweets and gasps of disbelief and the outrage, and not one is about the child rape.
This is irony on a whole fucking new level.
Future Foundation
Member
Saw one on SC, it was just complete shock. "What?" "All those years?"
alfredofroylan
Member
Bobby Bowden on his new status:
http://blog.pennlive.com/patriotnewssports/2012/07/bobby_bowden_on_penn_state_san.html
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
The NCAA really played this perfectly.
"Want to appeal? 4-year death penalty. No? OK. Looks like we agree."
http://www.975thefanatic.com/teams/college/blogentry.aspx?BlogEntryID=10406780
Anthony Lubrano (the insane Penn State Board of Trustee Member) on a philly sports station.
Man, he's kinda crazy. Radio host says "I can't take it anymore" in the end.
Anthony Lubrano (the insane Penn State Board of Trustee Member) on a philly sports station.
Man, he's kinda crazy. Radio host says "I can't take it anymore" in the end.
Child abuse charity. Not to the victims though.
I heard it was going to different childcare and abuse victims organizations.
EatinOlives
Member
Kind of flies in the face with all the fans getting their jimmies rustled. Come on, the university itself, you know, the one that has to pay $60 million, is fine with this. They can handle this too, ffs.
Mammoth Jones
Member
What's ironic is that Joe Paterno kept Sandusky's child abuse quiet as to not embarrass the Penn State football programs. He also did it to not tarnish his legacy. The very actions he took to prevent those things were exactly what lead do it happening. He has done irreparable harm to Penn State's reputation and destroyed his own legacy.
They should have turned on Sandusky the MOMENT they caught word of his antics. Full public disclosure, thrown him to the wolves.
And shit, this isn't even something one should do to protect their legacy or anything....it's just THE RIGHT thing to do in order to protect children.
His legacy is mud and it should be: He put the interests of a game ahead of the interests of children being raped.
They should have turned on Sandusky the MOMENT they caught word of his antics. Full public disclosure, thrown him to the wolves.
And shit, this isn't even something one should do to protect their legacy or anything....it's just THE RIGHT thing to do in order to protect children.
His legacy is mud and it should be: He put the interests of a game ahead of the interests of children being raped.
Vincent Alexander
Member
Unprecedented sanctions, my ass. Something like this has never quite happened before. If you don't get the death penalty for this, what the Hell do you get it for?
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