Ninja Scooter
Member
A Black Falcon said:
from what I heard this morning he took a leave of absence. I wouldn't worry though, if they are going to fire Paterno I doubt his staff survives.
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Penn State football pedophilia thread (UPDATE: NCAA sanctions handed down)
- Thread starter BertramCooper
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from what I heard this morning he took a leave of absence. I wouldn't worry though, if they are going to fire Paterno I doubt his staff survives.
Officerrob
Banned
Not only that, but if you read the grand jury report, Sandusky also kept bringing young kids to coaches meetings, home games, away games , and bowl games with him (he used these trips along with gifts to try and get into the boys pants). This doesn't raise a GIANT red fucking flag to Paterno after being told that Sandusky was observed raping a young boy?FrenchMovieTheme said:
Ninja Scooter
Member
Officerrob said:
Paterno testified to a grand jury about the child rape incident, and even after THAT Sandusky was still using the football facilities. He may have done the bare minimum to keep himself out of legal hot water, but I don't see how anyone can't see his complete failure on a moral and ethical level (and when your job is a head football coach/school administrator, that matters when talking job security) you are blind or naive. You might be sad that his legendary career went out like this, but if you don't think this should have cost him his job, or that he is somehow being treated unfairly or persecuted, you are insane. What happened was an example of someone who has had so much power and had his ass kissed so much for 40+ years that it warped his sense of reality. People in power at Penn St. really thought this would just go away quietly.
Joe said:
It's been said before, but this is worth reading. Ugly reading, but necessary if you want to understand.
http://assets.espn.go.com/photo/2011/1107/espn_e_Sandusky-Grand-Jury-Presentment.pdf
Victim 2 is the critical bit, with respect to your question. It takes radical mental incompetence to accept that what the grad assistant saw would have been described to Paterno or Curley or Schultz as "horsing around" or as merely "inappropriate".
SolidSnakex
Member
Joe said:
.
Officerrob
Banned
The guy who observed it says that he told Paterno about the sodomy. Paterno's testimony to the grand jury states, "the graduate assistant had seen Jerry Sandusky in the Lasch Building showers fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy". Even if Paterno's story is he was told about only "fondling" he can still go fuck himself.Joe said:
SerArthurDayne
Member
FrenchMovieTheme said:
This isn't entirely clear, but to me is what suggests a greater degree of culpability from Paterno than what we already "know."
An investigation of a complaint in 1998 was investigated, no legal action. Sandusky retires, despite being the coach-in-waiting behind an old man. This suggests Paterno knew then, but let him retire and forget all about it.
The incident we know about was in 2002 when Paterno was told by the GA. Sandusky had not been working for Penn State for years, but was heavily involved with his organization, and spent time regularly on Campus.
So basically, Paterno has known about this for 9-13 years and did nothing. He was either willfully ignorant, or simply chose to ignore it. That is why he had to go.
Ninja Scooter
Member
To me that is an egregious enough offense to get fired, and this we know as fact: McQuery told Paterno he saw the rape in the shower. Paterno relayed this to the AD or the campus police, whatever. He told someone. Great. But to then allow McQuery to stay on staff, while Sandusky still had a visible presence on campus, and do NOTHING, was a massive failure on his part. Seriously? No "Hey so what's the deal with Sandusky?" or "Hey is McQuery a horrible person who accuses people of being child rapists, or is Sandusky really a child rapist? I think I need to know this". No follow up even on that basic of a level? WTF?
bigtroyjon
Member
A Black Falcon said:
Saw someone post somewhere that there may be possible whistleblower considerations so they probably have to make sure all their ducks are in a row if they are going to fire him.
The answer is that he knew deep down that McQuery wasn't lying, and he really didn't want to have to accept something so terrible about his friend.Ninja Scooter said:
Nothing mysterious about it, it's all too human.
Edit: and just to clarify, yes, it was a major failure and definitely firing-worthy.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Cyan said:
I know, I'm just saying, forget what he might or might not have known, this much we know as fact and it's enough to merit being fired. I don't see how anyone can defend that.
ErasureAcer
Banned
Can't believe people are defending Paterno so much that they've taken to the streets.
lazybones18
Banned
SolidSnakex
Member
Lonestar said:
Wait..what? No one thought that it would be a bad idea for him to be doing the investigation?
SerArthurDayne
Member
Lonestar said:
I'm not really sure why the current board is really relevant. Ties were severed with Sandusky in 2005 or something, and it sounds like the organization probably does some good work for the community. I think it goes down in flames now for obvious reasons, and obviously it was used by its founder for some truly reprehensible things.
I'm surprised the trustees didn't suspend Paterno indefinitely pending the results of further investigation rather than simply firing him. It would have prevented or somewhat diminished the emotional responses on both sides of this issue and allowed time for greater clarity into what Paterno knew, whether he followed up in any way, how much his de facto power influenced the situation, etc. Then, he could have been fired after his support had eroded from further scrutiny.
Regarding the others, I think it's pretty clear the AD, the president, and the other VP who were informed of the allegations have to be fired since this tragedy was prolonged through their failure to fulfill the formal obligations of their jobs (not to mention the moral obligation).
Regarding the others, I think it's pretty clear the AD, the president, and the other VP who were informed of the allegations have to be fired since this tragedy was prolonged through their failure to fulfill the formal obligations of their jobs (not to mention the moral obligation).
Ninja Scooter
Member
braves01 said:
That would be delaying the inevitable for no good reason. House needs to be cleaned. Might as well get it over with now.
Also:
how does this not apply to Paterno as well? He may have reported the initial incident, but he made no attempt to follow up and go over his superiors heads if he thought they were trying to cover things up.
Ninja Scooter said:
Anybody who carried on while party to the disgracefully weak-ass rule that Sandusky "couldn't bring kids into the facilities", and party to the reason for it, is so goddamn guilty.
That "rule" disgusts me. It's some fucked-up Opposite World version of taking action.
Ninja Scooter said:
No good reason? Paterno fulfilled every legal and professional obligation he had and is currently being demonized for a moral situation that hinges around facts no one knows, like the extent of his knowledge at the time. He needs to be questioned by an investigating committee. It's way too vague at this point, there is tons of speculation and "He must have known."
The others are directly responsible for failing to properly report the allegations to the state/investigate further. They are the highest authorities at Penn St. no matter what Paterno's gravitas might be. There is no ambiguity there.
braves01 said:
Both the graduate assistant and Paterno have a legal obligation to report the incident to the town police as soon as they witnessesed/were told about it. Paterno broke the law by telling his superiors but not calling the police.
The graduate student and Paterno could both be criminally liable and subject to charges. Also both can be held liable in a civil case.
This is per a lawyer specializing in abuse cases interviewed on the PBS news show.
BertramCooper
Banned
I don't know if this particular story has been posted yet or not.
http://www.collegian.psu.edu/archive/2011/11/09/riot_after_paterno_fired.aspx
What an absolute fucking disgrace.
http://www.collegian.psu.edu/archive/2011/11/09/riot_after_paterno_fired.aspx
What an absolute fucking disgrace.
SouthernDragon
Member
BertramCooper said:
Fucking dumb.
computers putin'
Member
The fact that there isn't any unified outrage directed towards Joe Paterno as well is sickening. Now isn't the time to be celebrating his coaching career either for fucks sake.
Alcibiades
Member
Agree that a lot of people have been filling in the facts for themselves and Paterno looks to be getting the brunt of attacks that are based on assumptions and speculation.braves01 said:
Not too surprising, but just wish the justified outrage didn't lead to scapegoating and all this holier-than-thou attitude we are seeing.
Alcibiades said:
From reading the GJ report, it's possible to assert with extreme confidence that he knew that there was a rule preventing Sandusky from "bringing kids on campus" - a rule that apparently they couldn't figure out how to enforce - and he knew that this rule was related to someone witnessing Sandusky sodomising a child.
This didn't bother him sufficiently for him to object to Sandusky being not only at liberty but on campus.
Fuck yes, that is more than enough to condemn the man. It is contemptible to call that judgement or others like it "holier than thou". Too fucking right I feel morally superior to someone who fucked up to that extent.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
I am a child of Penn State.
I moved there when I was 6 years old. I went to Fairmount Elementary, Park Forest Jr. High and presumably State College Intermediate High and then State College Senior High, had my parents not moved us to Colorado. But I grew up there, had all the childhood first there, lost my first tooth, learned how to ride a bike, caught my first fish, fell in love with videogames (Playland/Campus Casino) first fight and first kiss. My student teachers, my babysitters, my friend's older siblings, my friend's parents. They were all Penn State students, faculty or athletes.
I used to play soccer at Sunset Park, and I would watch the older kids play football there, and we would try and join in. I always wanted to be Shane Conlan, despite the fact that I was an undersized Asian kid with a bowl cut and Sears glasses. And every time we played football, we would stop and stare when JoePa would walk by. It was always with a sense of awe and admiration. Once when we were playing, he was walking with John Shaffer, and they stopped to show us how to run routes. I learned what a post, out and slant route was, the button hook and how to defend against the receiver in the middle, like Shane Conlan, from Coach Paterno himself.
I know Joe Paterno had to be fired. I knew he wasn't going to last the season. But it fucking breaks my heart.
And I know this is GAF, so I would say that 99% of you think I'm being stupid, or blind. and I admit that it totally looks that way from the outside. But I know some of you went to Penn State, and maybe some of you grew up there, that understand.
I ordered a 1/2 gallon of Peachy Paterno. And I'm going to eat all of it in misery.
I moved there when I was 6 years old. I went to Fairmount Elementary, Park Forest Jr. High and presumably State College Intermediate High and then State College Senior High, had my parents not moved us to Colorado. But I grew up there, had all the childhood first there, lost my first tooth, learned how to ride a bike, caught my first fish, fell in love with videogames (Playland/Campus Casino) first fight and first kiss. My student teachers, my babysitters, my friend's older siblings, my friend's parents. They were all Penn State students, faculty or athletes.
I used to play soccer at Sunset Park, and I would watch the older kids play football there, and we would try and join in. I always wanted to be Shane Conlan, despite the fact that I was an undersized Asian kid with a bowl cut and Sears glasses. And every time we played football, we would stop and stare when JoePa would walk by. It was always with a sense of awe and admiration. Once when we were playing, he was walking with John Shaffer, and they stopped to show us how to run routes. I learned what a post, out and slant route was, the button hook and how to defend against the receiver in the middle, like Shane Conlan, from Coach Paterno himself.
I know Joe Paterno had to be fired. I knew he wasn't going to last the season. But it fucking breaks my heart.
And I know this is GAF, so I would say that 99% of you think I'm being stupid, or blind. and I admit that it totally looks that way from the outside. But I know some of you went to Penn State, and maybe some of you grew up there, that understand.
I ordered a 1/2 gallon of Peachy Paterno. And I'm going to eat all of it in misery.
BertramCooper
Banned
Your reaction is completely understandable. I'm a fourth-generation alumnus of Ohio State, and I can only imagine how shocked and miserable I'd be had this happened here. Hell, I was shocked and miserable after Tattoo-Gate, and that isn't even close to being as serious as what's happening in State College.ChiTownBuffalo said:
What we cannot understand is the contingent of Penn State students turning their anger toward the media and law enforcement instead of the people who are truly to blame for this mess. Obviously, there are many reasonable PSU students who agree that Paterno needed to be ousted, but they're getting drowned out by this vocal and destructive minority.
Dreams-Visions
Member
indeed, sir. indeed.BertramCooper said:
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Celsior said:
Celsior said:
Righteous indignation/douchey fervor > reading comprehension/spelling all the time on the internets.
BertramCooper
Banned
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
Celsior said:
Thanks, you are doing all the work yourself.
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
mre said:
Ordering ice cream over the internet from my living room in Chicago.
Sandusky Blitz, apparently off the menu there.
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