But I don't see how this excuses Atlus in any way, since most of their games come out here in English only anyway, and pretty much every other publisher seems to have no problems with our laws.
If you want stronger arguments, you could use difficulties with publishing and distributing the product, but ultimately this just highlights Atlus's unwillingness to invest in any substantial way in the European market.
Is it worth them investing substantially in Europe though? Do the sales numbers support that? Ghostlight needed under 2000 preorders before they would bring devil survivor 2 over, so at that point I wonder if it's worth Atlus making substantial investments in Europe.
Is it worth them investing substantially in Europe though? Do the sales numbers support that? Ghostlight needed under 2000 preorders before they would bring devil survivor 2 over, so at that point I wonder if it's worth Atlus making substantial investments in Europe.
guess my P3 FES playthrough will be quite an experience. hoping to get to it soon. not sure if I should try to connect my PS2 Slim to my bedroom or just use that PS2CX emulator.
I mean we're both speaking as fans who don't know this information but that's why I don't think it's fair to say too much about the Atlus EU situation. I still think Devil survivor is fairly telling, not a perfect example but ghostlight has dealt with numerous localisations of Atlus games before so they would have the numbers to look at and judge how well these games tend to perform. I also doubt importers would have a huge impact on their expectations.
You also just bummed me out as I bought devil survivor overclocked last month not knowing it has game breaking bugs.
guess my P3 FES playthrough will be quite an experience. hoping to get to it soon. not sure if I should try to connect my PS2 Slim to my bedroom or just use that PS2CX emulator.
P3's is really emotional too, but I played P4 first so Nevermore just holds the first spot.
Seems weird, considering the nature of the two endings, but that's just how it goes. Either way, Atlus puts a ton of finality in those two songs, which is great for such long, involving games.
It's not just cutscenes, it's seeing the in-game models animate and "act" to each other that give persona a bit of it's charm. It will also eliminate some of the emotional punch some scenes have to be without them.
I'm kind of split on it. The game as a while isn't completely harmed by the presentation change in Persona 3 Portable. But there are a number of scenes that definitely suffer. One of my favorite scenes, for example, is missing the music. Which completely changes the tone of it.
I'm kind of split on it. The game as a while isn't completely harmed by the presentation change in Persona 3 Portable. But there's a number of scenes that definitely suffer. One of my favorite scenes, for example, is missing the music from the scene. Which completely changes the tone of it.
This was originally in my edit, but I'm moving it to a new post so you see it.
The scene in question (P3 ending spoilers)
is Nyx's descent near the end of the game, right after you beat the Nyx Avatar. While the animation itself is nothing special, the amazingly haunting music is completely missing from Persona 3 Portable. It just doesn't have the same sense of dread anymore.
While I prefer P3P overall, the ending suffered a lot because of the lack of models. The very last scene in the ending is definitely more powerful in FES (to me) due to a single character movement.
P3 ending spoilers
that moment when P3MC tried to wipe Aigis' tears in the rooftop broke me into tears.
I mean we're both speaking as fans who don't know this information but that's why I don't think it's fair to say too much about the Atlus EU situation. I still think Devil survivor is fairly telling, not a perfect example but ghostlight has dealt with numerous localisations of Atlus games before so they would have the numbers to look at and judge how well these games tend to perform. I also doubt importers would have a huge impact on their expectations.
You also just bummed me out as I bought devil survivor overclocked last month not knowing it has game breaking bugs.
"I mean we're both speaking as fans who don't know this information but that's why I don't think it's fair to say too much about the Atlus EU situation."
Sure, but I mean, it's not like if I send an email to Atlus and ask them what's up with their EU publishing they'll give me any hard data or even any reason at all as to why things are as they are. I think it's even more unfair to ask of fans to just say nothing if they are in a situation where they can't possibly understand what's going on with the company.
Every customer should be able to show their dissatisfaction with certain events, even if the reasons for such events aren't disclosed. Because, otherwise, how are things going to change?
Also, and I'm sorry to insist, but Devil Survivor 2's case is worthless for this discussion, and unless you counter the arguments I carefully laid out as a list above, you can't just say that it's a "fairly telling" representation of how Atlus games perform in Europe. Especially when I went out of my way to explain in detail why DS2 is an abnormal case. Pretty much everything that could go wrong with that game in Europe went, well, wrong. DS2's release in Europe made no sense from a sales expectation POV. That game was already dead before it was even released. The 2000 pre-orders (1800, to be exact) were just so Ghostlight could break even on the manufacturing costs for the game. By the way, the US version of the game was available from Amazon.co.uk's Marketplace like a month after it came out in North America. You didn't even need to import, some stores were doing the importing for you.
Devil Survivor 2 is not "a perfect example," as you said. It just isn't an example at all. It's a freak accident, an isolated case. If Atlus is using DS2 as an example of why Europe isn't worth their time, then may the Goddess of Common Sense help us all.
Also, a patch for the European version of Overclocked was eventually released in the eShop, so just get that and you should be fine (enjoy the game!).
This was originally in my edit, but I'm moving it to a new post so you see it.
The scene in question (P3 ending spoilers)
is Nyx's descent near the end of the game, right after you beat the Nyx Avatar. While the animation itself is nothing special, the amazingly haunting music is completely missing from Persona 3 Portable. It just doesn't have the same sense of dread anymore.
I can't really say if p3p additions are worth it, since I played it first and blind, so I didn't get to fully appreciate them, what I can say though is that in my opinion, presentation wise fes is better, a lot of moments are more powerfull because of the 3d world and models.
Also, having played p3p before fes, I don't consider all the changes in the battle system for the better, for example I like how multi-target spells need to knock down all the enemies to give you a one more, that kind of differences made my fes run totally worth it.
While I prefer P3P overall, the ending suffered a lot because of the lack of models. The very last scene in the ending is definitely more powerful in FES (to me) due to a single character movement.
P3 ending spoilers
that moment when P3MC tried to wipe Aigis' tears in the rooftop broke me into tears.
I can't really say if p3p additions are worth it, since I played it first and blind, so I didn't get to fully appreciate them, what I can say though is that in my opinion, presentation wise fes is better, a lot of moments are more powerfull because of the 3d world and models.
Also, having played p3p before fes, I don't consider all the changes in the battle system for the better, for example I like how multi-target spells need to knock down all the enemies to give you a one more, that kind of differences made my fes run totally worth it.
Yeah, the One More system kind of breaks down with P4/P3P's version of the system. The concept of suppression is lessened as you can't deny either side turns.
Every customer should be able to show their dissatisfaction with certain events, even if the reasons for such events aren't disclosed. Because, otherwise, how are things going to change?
I totally agree and I personally think the worst offender in this stuff is the lack of communication, I'm not asking for weekly updates but it would be nice in the case of something like SMTIV if we were kept in the loop instead of being left in the dark for months after a localisation announcement.
People should be vocal about their dissatisfaction with the way this stuff is handled but I just think it's crappy for people to act like Atlus just doesn't care as they probably do but other factors that are hard to get over get in the way. It's all about how you present your complaint, simply asking for a localisation is enough you don't need to be overly aggressive with your comment or continually badger them and it seems like a lot of people do.
As for your points on DS2, I'll try to address them when I'm not on my phone on a train as I'd like to do a bit of digging.
Made all the more annoying that I think the female protag was a much better designed one than the original. To me, the "definitive" version of P3 would probably be the female route with all the bells and whistles of the male route in terms of presentation, and I'd probably throw in the male tired/sick system as well as not having direct control of the party.
Made all the more annoying that I think the female protag was a much better designed one than the original. To me, the "definitive" version of P3 would probably be the female route with all the bells and whistles of the male route in terms of presentation, and I'd probably throw in the male tired/sick system as well as not having direct control of the party.
My main gripe about the female protag is that she seems too upbeat and happy for a game whose theme is death and depression. The male protag looks like he fits that theme and his hair even matches the central color of the game. I'm not the biggest fan of his look but I do think it fits the theme better. I think the female has a more interesting design but would have been more fit in her own game with a different theme.
You made the right choice. You're in for a treat. Though if you're planning on hooking up with dudes I'd probably say use a spoiler free guide to find out what to say and when, cus some of the choices are kinda unintuitive.
I used this. It's a max S-Link guide. No spoilers; I'm pretty sure, but I haven't thoroughly checked. It's pretty restrictive so I wouldn't use it as intended; your first playthrough is always more fun if mostly blind, but it lists the ideal dialogue choices for each rank so I guess you could just search in the document, for example 'Magician 5' or 'Star 6' and look up what to say if you feel like it.
On the subject of P3P vs. FES: I played P3P first and I have no regrets. The improvements outweighs the presentation of FES. I would just watch the cutscenes on Youtube afterwards. The game has fantastic art and works pretty well as a visual novel.
I used this. It's a max S-Link guide. No spoilers; I'm pretty sure, but I haven't thoroughly checked. It's pretty restrictive so I wouldn't use it as intended; your first playthrough is always more fun if mostly blind, but it lists the ideal dialogue choices for each rank so I guess you could just search in the document, for example 'Magician 5' or 'Star 6' and look up what to say if you feel like it.
I actually played P3P first for 10 hours, saw the 3D models on FES, and immediately jumped ship. I don't like the visual novel presentations at all. Even if it means a worse battle system and AI teammates.
(P3 Spoilers)
Also nearing the end of my P3P FeMC run (already played FES), is the ending THAT butchered?
And one more thing, what about the final days before graduation? How is that presented? Seeing Aigis and P3MC together made me lose it, i was crying through that entire scene in FES. Is that emotion still there?
I actually played P3P first for 10 hours, saw the 3D models on FES, and immediately jumped ship. I don't like the visual novel presentations at all. Even if it means a worse battle system and AI teammates.
(P3 Spoilers)
Also nearing the end of my P3P FeMC run (already played FES), is the ending THAT butchered?
And one more thing, what about the final days before graduation? How is that presented? Seeing Aigis and P3MC together made me lose it, i was crying through that entire scene in FES. Is that emotion still there?
I totally agree and I personally think the worst offender in this stuff is the lack of communication, I'm not asking for weekly updates but it would be nice in the case of something like SMTIV if we were kept in the loop instead of being left in the dark for months after a localisation announcement.
People should be vocal about their dissatisfaction with the way this stuff is handled but I just think it's crappy for people to act like Atlus just doesn't care as they probably do but other factors that are hard to get over get in the way. It's all about how you present your complaint, simply asking for a localisation is enough you don't need to be overly aggressive with your comment or continually badger them and it seems like a lot of people do.
As for your points on DS2, I'll try to address them when I'm not on my phone on a train as I'd like to do a bit of digging.
I totally agree with it depending on how you present your points! Especially since being rude is actually counter-productive to your goals. It's unfortunate that some complaints are overaggressive, especially since they're usually directed at people who aren't directly responsible for the situation.
Sometimes that rudeness derives from frustration though, which is a side effect of being a European Atlus fan. Still, no excuse to actually be rude. We're all humans here.
1) Thanks everyone for the support -- means a lot . But while I don't want anyone showing up at my house or anything, feel free to bug or pester all you want. Some feedback I have answers to, or at least can try to get/raise awareness of. Other feedback, the "defies all common sense" feedback (i.e. "why can't you port Etrian Odyssey to the Vita?" or "plz add P3MC to Ultimax,") tends to get ignored.
2) EU homies - I can certainly sympathize with your lack of information about upcoming titles. Here's the bottom line: there's a bunch of mitigating factors for us releasing a game to the EU region, and they change with every single game. It sucks a lot, but it's the current state of how it works for smaller, niche publishers. Certain things are just a bunch of WTF, like I'm not sure why the PQ 3DS theme isn't out in EU yet; NISA says they're working on it on their end, but no solid update yet
3) On the bright side, some EU announcements should be coming really damn soon for a few titles. It's not my place to make those announcements, but I politely bug our partners to make sure the info gets out in a timely fashion. Ultimately though, that timing is up to them.
4) Bottom line: if it were a matter of flipping a switch, I'd have it all squared away from the time we announce a game, but sadly, it's not. I'm doing my best to make sure upper management make EU distribution an earlier priority so you aren't left in limbo for so long, but my noisy insistence doesn't always have the pull I want it to internally. Just know that I'm trying.
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