No, I've been thinking it for years before P5 came out.
It did reinforce my feelings though.
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Persona Community Thread |OT9| SPOILER TAGS OR DIE
- Thread starter Dantis
- Start date
No, I've been thinking it for years before P5 came out.
It did reinforce my feelings though.
No, I've been thinking it for years before P5 came out.
It did reinforce my feelings though.
You're an abnormality.
In all seriousness, let's not undersell Hashino, Meguro and Soejima either. It's all well and good saying that a game is made by teams, not individuals, but Meguro is solely responsible for the music and Soejima is (almost) solely responsible for the aesthetic. And I think it's no coincidence that all of Atlus' best and best selling titles since Nocturne have been directed by Hashino.
The three of them couldn't make a game without the team behind them, but without the three of them, Persona is an entirely different project.
The three of them couldn't make a game without the team behind them, but without the three of them, Persona is an entirely different project.
Cannon_Fodder
Member
As much as I love Hashino's work, this bears repeating. I think Hashino has an x factor that makes his stuff stand apart, but the rest of Atlus seems to share in his thoughtful approach to game design. I'm actually thinking P6 will surprise a lot of people with its quality. I can't wait to see what other directors at Atlus see as areas of improvement within the Persona formula, because there is still at lot that could use improvement. I wonder what the priority will be.
I don't want to be misunderstood: The team that takes over Persona might do even better than the current team. I think it's important for people to move out of the way for new talent to shine - that's exactly what happened with P3.
My point is more that if you like what Hashino and his team brought to Persona, you shouldn't really act like he's leaving. He's working on something new, and I think that's where he shines the most. It's something I realized while playing P5: I like what this team is doing with the persona series, but there's potentially more they can do elsewhere. The Persona series is well defined at this point and is actually getting away from P3's original vision where the calendar system was tied into the theme of living your life to the fullest.
I think people get too wrapped up in "franchises" when there's so much more potential if we celebrate "teams". It's not that the same team is always going to knock everything out of the park. It's that it's fun to see that clearly talented team get a crack at something new. I don't like to lump everything on "one guy", but it's clear that the Meguro/Hashino/Soejima team have an insanely strong collective vision when working together. I'd rather follow that vision than tie up all my hopes in the Persona series alone.
StarSketch
Banned
Keeping this in mind, the spinoffs:
A) used characters that the spinoff team didn't create and the ones that did were required to mesh with the prexisting ones (even if they did fail sometimes >.>) I generally recall people liking Kanami and Labrys, though the rest of Kanami's team is forgettable (but their role is minor so w/e), Sho is sho, and I dunno about Rei/Zen.
B) They were continuing a preexisting story, and had to mimic its themes which won't be a problem with P6 at all.
C) The spin offs were 4 games coming out in rapid succession one after another, rather than one game coming out all on its own, which won't be a problem with P6 (hopefully)
CrimsonFist
Member
I recall Ochimizu being considered the standout P4D character. Rei and Zen's story is good too.
I do agree with this though, the spinoffs are held back in a large part due to their nature. They have to work in overly large casts of characters who've had their stories concluded and don't really have any reason to be there, and write the story around whatever mechanics the spinoff is focused on.
It's unlikely, but I hope they do their own thing instead of trying to ape the style of Meguro and Soejima. Soejima had to play it close to Kaneko's style early on, but eventually he really came into his own style and the series was better for it.
It's for this reason that I completely agree that we shouldn't undersell hashino/meguro/soejima: it's almost impossible to envision what the series is without them moving forward. They have a strong, definable vision. Hopefully the new team can find their own as well.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
I want one DLC but I can't decide between the P4 DAN version of reach out to the truth, Mass destruction or a lone prayer...hmmmmm
snow in jamaica
Member
*wipes blood off cheek*
this... this power...
bwuhahaha! as expected of christmas eve!!!
(i'm sorry)
DDS1 does this with Hunting too. I'm not sure why this kind of variety didn't catch on.
this... this power...
bwuhahaha! as expected of christmas eve!!!
(i'm sorry)
DDS1 does this with Hunting too. I'm not sure why this kind of variety didn't catch on.
eyeball_kid
Member
I think that philosophy is a mixed bag. I think the idea that seasoned devs should be moved aside to make way for fresh talent always strikes me as a little bit ageist and lacking in confidence of the original team, as if new ideas only spring from the minds of youth.
And look at what happened to Kaneko when he was "moved aside". He was moved into the flower field, never to return. It's a tragedy that we no longer have his art. This isn't the same story with Hashino of course, and I think in this case he wanted to do something new.
The bigger question I have is how Soejima can possibly be expected to work on both Persona and the fantasy project. My guess is that he will focus on the fantasy game, while taking more of a director role on Persona and delegating most of the actual art to others.
Considering he was working on P4A, PQ, and PDAN at the time P5 development was heating up, this isn't surprising.
I think we're on the same page here. I'm not saying I'm tired of the current team on Persona, I'm just saying that I like it when that team does new things. It's because their vision is so strong and their talent so apparent that it's sometimes annoying to have that same team chained to the same concepts over and over again. However, I added the part about the old team moving on because there is truth to the fact that old ideas can be shaken up with a new perspective. That's exactly what Hashino did with SMT and Persona. Quite frankly, I don't have a ton of faith in the new team, but some people thought I was downplaying their efforts when it's entirely possible that they could turn out something new and interesting.
This isn't a case of anyone pushing the old team aside, it's the old team moving on to new things that they clearly want to work on.
There's that, but they were hiring new people who worked on Persona 5 as late as 2015, with P4D's development ending the same year.
What I thought, however, was that Wada had been involved with Persona 5 prior to his "emergency" involvement with Persona 4: Dancing All Night after the Dingo stuff went down. He wasn't supposed to be the director and producer of that game at all, originally: Yosuke Uda was meant to have that role.
It does make sense, though, when we consider how he would have been busy with whatever project that will be announced soon after having to do all of the spin-offs.
TurnipFritters
Member
Lone Prayer gets you accessories that make you immune to Bless and Curse.
I was bored so I figured i'd transcribe this. From top to bottom:
Protagonist: You can see that he has above average HP and SP. He seems to have less than the P3MC (who if I recall correctly was blatantly better than everyone) and more than the P4MC (who's HP and SP stats were nearly identical to Yosuke's). Basically an All arounder.
Ryuji: Ryuji has above average HP and below average SP. He is closer to Junpei than Kanji in terms of stat, since his HP isn't ridiculously high like Kanji's, but his SP isn't super low either. Obvious Physical attacker.
Morgana: Below average HP and above average SP. Your typical caster, and from previous footage we know that Morgana specializes in healing and wind skills. Caster/Support.
Anne: Below average HP and above average SP. We know from previous footage that she's the standard black mage, w/ healing and poison skills.
Yusuke: It depends on how much he points he gains in a level up, but his HP and SP are in the average range. He'll probably specialize in Physical and Magic attacks as well as have some other gimmick.
Makoto: The most surprising. Contrary to what her appearance may imply, she does not have the physical attacker build. Her HP is average and her SP way above average (higher than everyone else). In fact, her HP/SP stats overshadow Yusuke. It's hard to predict what kind of character she'll be, but I doubt she'll strictly be a physical attacker.
#ThrowbackThursday
enfieldvball
Member
If Soejima is completely on Re:Fantasy I'd like to see the Trauma Team designer for P6 less that was him too...
CrimsonFist
Member
Trauma Team was Doi
A Dead Diehard
Member
Quel twist.
snow in jamaica
Member
Jazz fusion, I hope.
Really, I don't know if I want it in that game but I do really want a fantasy game with a jazz fusion soundtrack. Thanks a lot, Romantic Warrior.
Cannon_Fodder
Member
I'm going to guess pretty "standard" fantasy fare like chanting, strings, and heavy percussion. While it's only one song, Meguro's pitch material for Re:Fantasy is the least interesting to me. I like the design approach Hashino describes, and Soejima's art is gorgeous. But Meguro's music doesn't grab me yet.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
Whew I forgot how tough some of the early fights in P3 can be.
The fight against the intrepid knight who blocks the 59th floor was damn tough. I basically had to fuse a null wind persona to take care of it, and even then I had to play switcharoo with all my personas because if I kept null wind active too long he would just null resists and basically one shot me after charging up.
It doesnt help that akihiko is basiclally the only useful party member you have available for that boss fight. Yukari literally doesn't do anything half the time and all stupei and mitsuru are good for is getting one shot and giving the boss a free turn.
The fight against the intrepid knight who blocks the 59th floor was damn tough. I basically had to fuse a null wind persona to take care of it, and even then I had to play switcharoo with all my personas because if I kept null wind active too long he would just null resists and basically one shot me after charging up.
It doesnt help that akihiko is basiclally the only useful party member you have available for that boss fight. Yukari literally doesn't do anything half the time and all stupei and mitsuru are good for is getting one shot and giving the boss a free turn.
Cannon_Fodder
Member
US Gamer put up a very interesting read about the real-world inspirations for P5's villains. It is VERY spoilerly, so don't read it if you haven't beat the game or care about late game events. Link here:
http://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-real-world-problems-behind-persona-5
I've always thought that a Persona game by Atlus Japan set anywhere BUT Japan just wouldn't work, and I think that article gives some insight into why that might be the case. It's one thing to know enough about a foreign country to write about it; it's something else entirely to do it convincingly. I think nailing all the little details that make convincing social commentary is really tough, and frankly, not worth it for P-Studio in the end.
http://www.usgamer.net/articles/the-real-world-problems-behind-persona-5
I've always thought that a Persona game by Atlus Japan set anywhere BUT Japan just wouldn't work, and I think that article gives some insight into why that might be the case. It's one thing to know enough about a foreign country to write about it; it's something else entirely to do it convincingly. I think nailing all the little details that make convincing social commentary is really tough, and frankly, not worth it for P-Studio in the end.
eyeball_kid
Member
On the third palace, and wow... the section where
really goes way too long without a safe room. I had to use a SP potion just to get through the final battle with
and half my party was almost empty. I think in general I don't like how scarce SP items are in P5, and the spacing of safe rooms feels more punishing than in P3.
Yeah I think we are also. And I'll give the new people the benefit of the doubt, but I do think this is going to be a make or break period for Atlus. Both in doing something successful with a big new IP, and with passing the baton on their biggest moneymaker. People can say what they will about milking their IP with spinoffs, when Atlus does decide to do something bold they don't hesitate. That's the quality I've always most admired of them.
I don't know how it's all going to work out. In some ways I wish the Persona team had stayed together and instead did what they did with Catherine -- make a Persona title, then make a standalone "experiment" -- then back to Persona. I'm a bit nervous about this fantasy title simply because it's so different than anything they've done before.
you have to get into the Laundering area
the three demons
Yeah I think we are also. And I'll give the new people the benefit of the doubt, but I do think this is going to be a make or break period for Atlus. Both in doing something successful with a big new IP, and with passing the baton on their biggest moneymaker. People can say what they will about milking their IP with spinoffs, when Atlus does decide to do something bold they don't hesitate. That's the quality I've always most admired of them.
I don't know how it's all going to work out. In some ways I wish the Persona team had stayed together and instead did what they did with Catherine -- make a Persona title, then make a standalone "experiment" -- then back to Persona. I'm a bit nervous about this fantasy title simply because it's so different than anything they've done before.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
Yes...i think? Pretty sure he says at one point that because ann wouldn't do it he made shiho do it or something like that.
Mediking
Member
The game has a lot of SP solutions, just not until later game. Coffee/Curry, SP Adhesives from Tae, as well as tons of SP items that are dropped from enemies if you negotiate with them or steal them with the MC's attack. First half of the game, though? Extremely scarce. It's this game's version of "i'm feeling tired" from P3. I just broke up the dungeons between multiple days instead of trying to rush them. I'm definitely aware of the part you're at though and yeah, it was a bit rough. There's actually a save point right in front of the elevator down to the vault, it's just way in the back of the room on the bottom floor.
Oh yeah, it's a big risk. The ultimatum from Hashino must have been intense, considering they knew that P5 would be a big hit and would have to follow it up to keep the revenue flowing.
A Dead Diehard
Member
I mean,
the fact that even his Shadow only goes as far as saying "sexual harassment" calls it into doubt, but everything else lines up with the presumption that it DID happen.
eyeball_kid
Member
I hadn't used a guide at all so far, but I'm somewhat ashamed to admit I had to for the the
three demon
Yeah I need to get that curry ASAP, though I imagine it's not a big boost.
It also speaks to the hands-off nature of Sega's management that they would be okay with this kind of shakeup. Surely Sega bought Atlus mostly for the Persona brand, so this is a big risk for them as well.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
Meguro's OST is absolutely the thing I am most concerned for.
Will it be a solid OST? Most likely. Will it be a good release for Meguro? I'm not so sure. He needs to not just rely on doing a strings-based fantasy OST, because, to be blunt, it's not where his strengths lie. Strange Journey's OST is fine. It is also Meguro's worst soundtrack, well, maybe ever?
My point is that there are a lot of really high end composers doing fantasy orchestral OSTs and I'm concerned that Meguro can't keep up.
Strange Journey immediately came to my mind as well.
There's nothing stopping him from doing his guitar/piano fare, tons of Fantasy RPG's use modern music. But given that Hashino seems to be looking at very, very traditional fantasy literature for this, it'd make sense if they want to go that route for the soundtrack as well.
Green Mamba
Member
Beginning of October in P5. Charm and Kindness maxed out, the rest of the stats at four. S.Link progress sans the seemingly automatic ones:
Priestess - 9
Empress - n/a
Emperor - 8
Hierophant - 7
Lovers - 8
Chariot - 8
Hermit - 7 (request accepted)
Fortune - 7
Strength - 8 (I think, whichever was Hecatoncheires)
Hanged Man - 4 or 5, can't remember
Death - 7 (request completed)
Temperance - Max
Devil - 4
Tower - 2
Star - 7
Moon - 8
Sun - Max
I think I'm doing pretty good...
I love this game.
Priestess - 9
Empress - n/a
Emperor - 8
Hierophant - 7
Lovers - 8
Chariot - 8
Hermit - 7 (request accepted)
Fortune - 7
Strength - 8 (I think, whichever was Hecatoncheires)
Hanged Man - 4 or 5, can't remember
Death - 7 (request completed)
Temperance - Max
Devil - 4
Tower - 2
Star - 7
Moon - 8
Sun - Max
I think I'm doing pretty good...
I love this game.
Damn, I wish I spread out my party member Confidants like you did. I ended up maxing out their Confidants, so I was rocking their 2nd Personas pretty early on.
Guitar and piano would absolutely be my preference.
I think I'd really like it if the story for this was smaller scale in the same way Persona 4 was. A story of two youths travelling across the country/world as they grow up, trying to find a place where they fit in (Picking up new friends along the way, OBV), could be really sweet and play to P-Studios strengths really well.
Except you know there will still be a God at the end of it all.
In all seriousness, I actually expect this game to follow the path of the tarot even more closely than the previous games. Overcoming Death and finding The World and all that. Just seems that way given that it's called "A Fool's Journey".
Hahahaha
Ha
Ha
No, but seriously, it's almost definitely going to happen. It'll be fine if it does it like previous games though, where it's pretty much there for a dumb 'epic' climax. Soejima's concept pieces give a feeling of something quite intimate and wistful.
Comparative images for P5 really captured the feeling of the final game, if not the actual content, so I'd be surprised if the same didn't apply here.
Hashino mentioned in a recent interview that one of his key concepts for Re:Fantasy is "Anxiety". That's a broad term, but with Hashino he usually knows the exact feeling he wants to convey and isn't subtle about it.
It's so broad that it actually covers most of Hashino's games, which also cover anxiety in its different forms. P3 is anxiety of death, P4 is anxiety about self, P5 is anxiety about society. Catherine is about anxiety over commitment. So really, that statement could mean anything.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
So does the P5 protag wear fake glasses or what?
It always bothered me that he doesn't seem to need his glasses despite the fact that he wears them like 80% of the time outside palaces.
Maybe he's got a really low strength prescription where he only really needs them in school?
It always bothered me that he doesn't seem to need his glasses despite the fact that he wears them like 80% of the time outside palaces.
Maybe he's got a really low strength prescription where he only really needs them in school?
His glasses are literally labeled as fashion glasses in the JP version and I'm almost 100% sure that the same is true for the Western version. So yeah, they're fake.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
They're labeled as stylish glasses in the western version if I remember right but yeah alright that makes sense lol.
A Dead Diehard
Member
He doesn't wear them in the flashbacks in the station and his hometown,
he doesn't wear them in the ending.
he doesn't wear them in the ending.
Pretty open and shut.
eyeball_kid
Member
Thinking about the long spacings between Safe Rooms some more, I think one thing that frustrates me is how a session with P5 is often a big time commitment. Sure, if you're doing side activities that day you can play for a short period, but the ticking clock means there are frequent points in the game where you just can't even play the game without committing a couple hours.
Coming off of Yakuza 0 where at any point in the game I could do some side content for 30 minutes and put it down, P5 by comparison feels like an old school experience, and fitting that into my schedule has been sometimes difficult.
In the spirit of taking a fresh approach to the fantasy genre, I hope that he'll do something out of left field. Spitballing here, but something like his take on acid jazz, but mixed with a traditional English-sounding brass band.
Coming off of Yakuza 0 where at any point in the game I could do some side content for 30 minutes and put it down, P5 by comparison feels like an old school experience, and fitting that into my schedule has been sometimes difficult.
In the spirit of taking a fresh approach to the fantasy genre, I hope that he'll do something out of left field. Spitballing here, but something like his take on acid jazz, but mixed with a traditional English-sounding brass band.
MudoSkills
Volcano High Alumnus (Cum Laude)
Admittedly there's a hell of a lot of thread I haven't read, but in terms of references to previous games I've seen people talk about references to the P4 cast through checking the TV, but not seen anybody mention this fucking thing, which I end up looking at whenever I get sent to bed early:
