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Persona Community Thread |OT9| SPOILER TAGS OR DIE
- Thread starter Dantis
- Start date
A Dead Diehard
Member
Well, cognition made manifest is a pretty supernatural thing, no?
Also, how P3 handles things can be easily dismissed as the writers not thinking ahead.
testtrack321
Neo Member
Hey P-GAF, long time lurker, finally registered and posting. Thanks for all the fun over the years of mysterious old woman anchors, #HardinLied, and more.
I need to look at the P3 club book again, but the Dark Hour itself is not a cognitive existence. It's existence is real, regardless of the one's perception of it. Hence why so many coffins are present in it. However, due to the nature of shadows, cognitive existences could theoretically exist within the Dark Hour.
I thought the Dark Hour was created
, which they then switched their research towards.
Also I wonder if they'll ever talk about the canonicity of those old Persona 3 clubbooks, since some of the ideas (
), seem a little....weird in the scope of the Persona world today.
due to the experiments the Kirijo group were running in order to find time travel (at least, I think that was the original goal; has been a while.), and the coincidentally just happened to find the Dark Hour and Shadows
Also I wonder if they'll ever talk about the canonicity of those old Persona 3 clubbooks, since some of the ideas (
like Nyx actually being an alien from before Earth's existence
A Dead Diehard
Member
Welcome to PersonaGAF. Here's to plenty of news in the months to come!
Wait, did they actually say that? Cause all the game gave us was
Ryoji vaguely saying "In ancient times"
Almost everything in the books has appeared in the games at this point. Only really the stuff you mentioned in the spoilers hasn't. The book foreshadowed elements that would appear in P3FES (
Ryoji implying that Nyx, and by extension himself are not malevolent
The fact that an artificial Dark Hour could be created.
As for the Dark Hour:
That's more or less correct. Basically, Shadows have an ability to manipulate space-time as an inherit power. But this power is insanely weak on it's own. The Kirjiro Group effectively gathered a massive amount of these shadows with the intention of manipulating space time for their own benefit. But then they started embracing nihilism and started heading towards the Fall.
Yeah,
Nyx having existed since ancient times is canonical.
No wonder SEES can use their Persona in the real world (there a couple of scenes of that in Arena) meanwhile the Bond Dancers and Phantom Thieves cant (and the games imply that a couple of times too)
"bond dancers?" >.>
And to be fair, they very well could with some training. Once you've used your Persona once, as long as you continue to use it, you can call it any time.
The concept of cognition and cognitive existences in Persona 5 is interesting, because the concept has existed as far back as the original Persona. Being extensively used in Persona 2, in fact. It's simply never been named until now.
MASSIVE PERSONA 5 SPOILERS:
And thanks to Morgana basically being an avatar of sorts for Igor, the term is about as official as it gets.
Thats how they call to the p4 cast in Dancing All Night in the Love meets Bonds festival , official name was "Rise Kujikawa and the Bond Dancers" if not mistaken.
Was a "funny" way to call the IT until last month , i suppose P3 , P4 and P5 are all the "Bond Dancers" now... (and i glad they are).
-----
And interesting concept , i remember reading in this thread how the cognition is part of the whole series and not just p5 , but yeah still interesting , even with the Dark Hour been a special phenomenon.
I've always chuckled over how Kirijo Group essentially turned into nihilism themed Rapture.
Mediking
Member
Welcome to the Velvet Room!!!
Nice to meetcha!
I'm Minato... uh, I'm Mediking. I have a Persona. Do you?
A Dead Diehard
Member
I made a rough flowchart of the relationship between the various aspects of Personas and Shadows. Major spoilers for every installment on here, but especially for Persona 3 and Persona 5
Flowchart
I may expand upon this later. EDIT: I expanded upon it, now contains more stuff from Persona 5 on there.
Flowchart
ComradeZero
Member
I'm trying to plow through P4: DAN, but my god...this story mode is utter shit. Despite that, I love playing this game lying in bed. I just don't know how long I can listen to 'Snowflakes' and 'Maze of Life' over and over again. Just gimme that 'When the Moon's Reaching Out Stars' remix already.
Star Orpheus
Member
I actually enjoyed the story mode for Dancing all Night.
There are some rough patches like the dance instructor and the lull in the middle of the game.
But I found it to arguably be the most in character the IT had been characterized since the original(though I admit I don't mind the exagerated characters as much as others.)
The best part for me is easily
the section where your playing as Kanami.
I understand it's not going to be for everyone though. I hope whatever replacement they have for story mode in Dancing Star/Moon Night keeps the fun character interactions. My favorite part of the P4 spin offs.
Nice chart! Laying things out like that really shows the dualism of the series. I like the idea that they've kinda laid a consistent "groundwork" that even encompasses the original(1-2) series. Gives hope that, if there's is a Persona not directed by Katsura Hashino, they'll at least have a sort of "backbone" they can continue to build upon for the series.
I'd guess that "made" beings like the
Velvet Room Attendants
Metis/Teddie/Morgana
The only thing they've truly done a retcon on is the Wild Card. The concept straight up did not exist in Persona 1 and 2, even if no major NPCs (AFAIK) ever switch their Personas. Everything else has been fairly consistent, even if a large amount of it is a byproduct of plot expansion that's done each game.
Ehh, maybe? The thing about everyone you're referring to in the spoilers is that they are either a part of the collective unconsciousness, or they became part of it over time.
The Velvet Room Attendants are implied to be Shadows that have obtained life somehow, possibly by Igor. Morgana was already a living being by the time he appeared in the story. Teddie was a Shadow at some point, but either around the time of P4, or during the events of it, developed into something more. Metis is perhaps the most unique of the bunch, having returned to Aigis's unconsciousness and the collective unconsciousness after the events of The Answer.
Pretty interesting tbh
This , DAN story is not a masterpiece but for sure a better story than people give credit for it. The characterization of the IT is way better than Arena / Ultimax or Q (but this one people give it a free card since the team is still "growing" during that one , despite the characters are turned into 1 joke) ...
And Kanamin is a good character , no easy to dig a char which first line is " Sup everybody im your delicious cow , eat me dear fans ..." but in the end of it is still a good character and she grow in me , enough to care by the end of the story.
Q gets a pass because it tells the best story out of all the spin-offs once the plot finally gets going. One thing I liked about Q was also that it added something new from a thematic perspective to both P3 and P4. The game doesn't retread the same stuff you already saw in the other games. Q also doesn't turn flanderize everybody (even though those that are indeed hit by flanderization suffer quite a lot) and actually manages to pull off the incredible feat of making Marie likeable after her disastrous S.Link in P4G.
P4A - The story's alright. It attempts to capture the tone of the original Persona games, but it's not quite on the mark. There are a couple amount of good moments, and Labrys's short-story is enjoyable, but characterization issues and the weak main antagonist bring down the experience.
PQ - The game doesn't even remotely try to capture the tone of the Persona games, but it doesn't care. It's basically a Saturday morning cartoon mixed in with some appropriate dark moments. Rei and Zen are pretty good as characters and it ultimately tells a fun story. The strolls and quests are absolutely God tier, and aside from a handful of terrible takes on certain characters, it's a fun experience. (Favorite spinoff)
P4U - Shonen garbage.
P4D - On the one hand, this game is the closest to capturing the characterization present in the original game. It does a fantastic job of selling the Investigation Team as the best of friends, Ochimizu is bae, and I really like Kanamin's fellow dancers. On the other hand, Kanamin herself is a weak character, the story is repetitive, and it falls flat on its face when leaning on the darker themes. Overall the story is so-so. It doesn't really impress, but it doesn't fail miserably like P4U.
PQ - The game doesn't even remotely try to capture the tone of the Persona games, but it doesn't care. It's basically a Saturday morning cartoon mixed in with some appropriate dark moments. Rei and Zen are pretty good as characters and it ultimately tells a fun story. The strolls and quests are absolutely God tier, and aside from a handful of terrible takes on certain characters, it's a fun experience. (Favorite spinoff)
P4U - Shonen garbage.
P4D - On the one hand, this game is the closest to capturing the characterization present in the original game. It does a fantastic job of selling the Investigation Team as the best of friends, Ochimizu is bae, and I really like Kanamin's fellow dancers. On the other hand, Kanamin herself is a weak character, the story is repetitive, and it falls flat on its face when leaning on the darker themes. Overall the story is so-so. It doesn't really impress, but it doesn't fail miserably like P4U.
CrimsonFist
Member
Cross Tag Battle will put all the other spinoff stories to shame.
guess I'll just watch the ending on youtube, 3 of my characters only have personas weak to ice so nothing I can do, the last save room is miles from the boss as well... do you just start the game again from the beginning to go the other route?
Yes, to start the Snow Queen route, play the game from the beginning. When you return to the school, do not go through the hole in the wall to meet Maki. Instead talk to the various NPCs at the school until you find the Snow Queen mask.
Star Orpheus
Member
Oh yeah Blazblue alone makes Persona look positively sane in compression.
Jubei accomplished what Morgana only dares to dream of.
Not Spaceghost
Spaceghost
https://twitter.com/MysticDistance/status/907397786680877056
P3 Dorm untextured found in P5 map files
P3 HD REMAKE PLEASEEEEE
P3 Dorm untextured found in P5 map files
P3 HD REMAKE PLEASEEEEE
Persona 5's models are of a completely different size and style from the ones in Persona 3, too.
Which means this wasn't merely geometry data from one game to another....
A Dead Diehard
Member
I want that friendzone so badly... I can TASTE it!
Star Orpheus
Member
I don't care if this would be technically the fifth time I bought Persona 3. I NEED IT!
To be fair, it could just be for P3 Dancing.
That being said, I'd be willing to see a P3 remake just to see those characters in HD.
Not to rain on anyone's parade or anything but that was most likely done to test the new engine or whatever very early on in development. Best case scenario they might've planned a trip to Iwatodai but scrapped the idea somewhere along the road.
I mean, Lisa has a fully fledged character model on Nocturne and P2 fans are still waiting for their remake
I mean, Lisa has a fully fledged character model on Nocturne and P2 fans are still waiting for their remake
enfieldvball
Member
Not to rain on anyone's parade or anything but that was most likely done to test the new engine or whatever very early on in development. Best case scenario they might've planned a trip to Iwatodai but scrapped the idea somewhere along the road.
I mean, Lisa has a fully fledged character model on Nocturne and P2 fans are still waiting for their remake
Wouldn't there have been a place holder for Inaba instead? In P4 they visited Gekkoukan High so if they kept that event it'd be Tokyo to Inaba?
TheGeniusArcana
Member
I don't know how else to say that they were obviously not simultaneously working on the biggest game the company has ever made (P5) and a Persona 3 remake even if it was just in the earliest stages possible. These kind of tests are in all kinds of games too.
CrimsonFist
Member
I think the only precedent for assets of an actual unreleased game would be some DDS stuff in Nocturne Maniax?
But DDS's release was only a few months after Maniax anyway.
But DDS's release was only a few months after Maniax anyway.
Funyarinpa
Member
This also helps debunk the P3D theory, in the sense that they probably weren't working on P3D way back in 2016.
klabautermann
Member
Maya had a model in Nocturne, doesn't mean anything really. I would love a remake (though I would be a bit salty if a P3 remake came before a P1-P2IS/EP remake), but I hope it actually is something substantial.
P1/P2 remake is arguably more work. Because they would want to include a ton of qol improvements too but the play mechanic is different from P3 onwards.
P3 remake will probably be improved graphics + P3P + some mechanics from P5.
Those are my thoughts anyway
klabautermann
Member
It definitely is, but those games could use a facelift way more than P3. P3 is still perfectly playable, P1 and P2 are slogs gameplay wise now.
I love Mr Edogawa's TV classes. I was thinking how cool would it be for P5 to have something similar but as I watch more of them I realize he pretty much already explains everything P5 touches upon so there wouldn't be much left to explore lol
Unless they took a more social approach rather than focusing on psychology and myths.
Unless they took a more social approach rather than focusing on psychology and myths.
CrimsonFist
Member
The mobile game too. That should be a good source of new models for other games to use if nothing else as well.
Funyarinpa
Member
I really doubt PS3-level demon models would be used for a mobile game.
ASilentProtagonist
Member
If a sequel to Catherine is in development, it'll throw a wrench into the development of other titles. We might wait another 6-8 years before we get Persona 6...
Im more interested in a sequel of Catherine or Persona 6 than a p3 remake tbh.
The way they tease it that new "Catherine" game feels is gonna be a Studio Zero game...so is gonna take a while since they are with the Fantasy game RN.
Persona 6 can became sooner , just bc im curious what direction the series is gonna take without Hashino... but we are in p5 train now , and is gonna be like for the next 5 years at least ... lets see how much P3-P4 they can hold on too until Atlus decide to move on from those too.
P3-P4-P5-P6