Tatsumi Oga
Banned
But for most genres, except shooters that would still be playable though right? So the motion interpolation on Samsung TV's don't really show these nasty artifacts when it's enabled?
Plasma, LCD, OLED, LED, best tv for next gen
- Thread starter spannicus
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But for most genres, except shooters that would still be playable though right? So the motion interpolation on Samsung TV's don't really show these nasty artifacts when it's enabled?
ss_lemonade
Member
I think you can get used to the input lag, but the artifacts can be distracting (Sony user here too). What I noticed (and this might just be me) is this seems to work well if you're playing games with locked framerates, like locked 30fps.
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
Yep, true, the artifacts don't seem to show up as much then. What i also did when i had the Sony was turning down sensitivty in games so that it would stay nice, for RPG it was fine but for a shooter it wasn't. It was awesome in GTA V and Sunset Overdrive, man what a world of difference, but as soon as i would pan the camera a little too fast, blur and all these nasty effects showed their faces.
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
To be honest, i went from a Sony W829b which is full HD only, to a Panasonic CX700 and that one was 4K. I did not notice any kind of improvement in the picture quality or anything. And i only game on consoles, so i have not been able to try out 4K gaming.
Pagusas
Elden Member
Completely depends on the scaler in the TV. Vizio (only seen the M serries) has a weird scaler that oversharpens, making the image look worse. Samsung and Sony sets looks great, no real noticeable scaling artifacts from the scaling.
Overal there is no chance to improve IQ from a native 1080p set, only a chance to look the same, which some sets do a great job of, other ones dont.
On the AVS forum, a lot of people who bought Vizios are using their higher end recievers to handle the 4k upscaling as it performs better.
Finaika
Member
Isn't upscaled 1080p to 4K better than native 1080p?
Pagusas
Elden Member
NO.
Finaika
Member
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
So i just got some great news and to make a long story short, it allows for a much bigger budget. Basically soon i can spend about 3,320 euros on a TV. The question is though, is it worth for me shelling out so much cash.
Basically it now allows me to go for bigger....MUCH bigger and i mean that in screen size. I am still planning on going for the LG 55EC9300 OLED. But then there's also the Samsung UE65JS8500. 65 fricking inch, damn. The LG is now 1969 euros and the Samsung is 3,067 euros. It's a 55 inch OLED vs a 65 inch 4K LCD. I already know the black levels is where the LG is going to win, but picture quality overall? I love a huge screen, but at the end of the day PQ is the most important.
One thing i probably need to take into account is that still several games on Xbox One (my console of choice) are not fully 1080p, Battlefront is definitely going to be one of those. Wouldn't it look a whole lot better on a more smaller screen?
Thoughts/advice?
Basically it now allows me to go for bigger....MUCH bigger and i mean that in screen size. I am still planning on going for the LG 55EC9300 OLED. But then there's also the Samsung UE65JS8500. 65 fricking inch, damn. The LG is now 1969 euros and the Samsung is 3,067 euros. It's a 55 inch OLED vs a 65 inch 4K LCD. I already know the black levels is where the LG is going to win, but picture quality overall? I love a huge screen, but at the end of the day PQ is the most important.
One thing i probably need to take into account is that still several games on Xbox One (my console of choice) are not fully 1080p, Battlefront is definitely going to be one of those. Wouldn't it look a whole lot better on a more smaller screen?
Thoughts/advice?
IXI FalcoN
Member
Buydig (via ebay) has the LG 55EG9100 new for $1700. This is the 2015 replacement 1080p model for the EC9300.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/33166466353...37259887&afepn=5337259887&rmvSB=true#shpCntId
Buydig is an authorized LG seller BTW. http://www.lg.com/us/authorizeddealers/lg_online_authorized_retailers
I'm foaming at the mouth over this. Have the money, but don't need a TV right now. Maybe in another beer or 2 I'll pull the trigger.
EDIT: Well, I bit. Estimated Delivery of Oct. 5. This should be interesting.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/33166466353...37259887&afepn=5337259887&rmvSB=true#shpCntId
Buydig is an authorized LG seller BTW. http://www.lg.com/us/authorizeddealers/lg_online_authorized_retailers
I'm foaming at the mouth over this. Have the money, but don't need a TV right now. Maybe in another beer or 2 I'll pull the trigger.
EDIT: Well, I bit. Estimated Delivery of Oct. 5. This should be interesting.
Pagusas
Elden Member
At the end of the day their is no replacement for screen size (to a certain level of quality of course). I'll always advocate a bigger screen for a small pq difference.
Some things will look better on a small screen if the sitting distance is the same.
That's a bit of bummer.
I mean I don't expect the game to look 4K, but it would be nice that you would see some sort of improvement.
megarockexe
Member
Wow, not the case on my Vizio. TV speakers had much better sync than my sound bar. There's almost a full second video delay with the sound bar and I've tried all the settings and I don't know what to do.
Wildschwein
Member
I'm in the market for a bedroom television to use for gaming. I'm mostly concerned with running older consoles though, as my systems are currently all hooked up to my monitor. It works pretty well, but the scaling of 720 and below games is non-existent, and it doesn't support limited RGB so my Wii U looks awful on it.
I'm looking at 32 or 40 inch, but the space I have for it is fairly narrow. That seems to leave the Vizio E40-C2 out of the running, since the stands are on the far edges. I need a central stand. I think it boils down to the Samsung J lines. Particularly I'm looking at the J6200. The problem here is that the review on rtings shows that it handles 720p upscaling especially poorly, so that throws it out the window for last-gen systems.
My only other find was just wandering in costco today and seeing the Samsung UN40H5201A. I looked around to get some info and found....
Nothing.
Not a thing. I'm not sure if this is some costco-specific model or something, but the price and size are right. There's also the H5003 that turned up pretty much nothing as well.
Can anyone recommend something in the 32 to 40-inch range? Or if anyone has info on the J6200 or J6300 I would be grateful. The E40-C2 could be an option if I wall mount it, though it isn't my first pick. Price range is around $400.
EDIT: A 40 inch J6300 seems to exist as a best buy exclusive model for ~$500?
EDIT AGAIN: I think it's down to the J6200 and the J6300. The J6200 has minimal motion blur, while the J6300 has slightly better contrast and better upscaling. Not sure what to go with. It's probably going to come down to stand width. The E40-C2 has the better input lag though.
I'm looking at 32 or 40 inch, but the space I have for it is fairly narrow. That seems to leave the Vizio E40-C2 out of the running, since the stands are on the far edges. I need a central stand. I think it boils down to the Samsung J lines. Particularly I'm looking at the J6200. The problem here is that the review on rtings shows that it handles 720p upscaling especially poorly, so that throws it out the window for last-gen systems.
My only other find was just wandering in costco today and seeing the Samsung UN40H5201A. I looked around to get some info and found....
Nothing.
Not a thing. I'm not sure if this is some costco-specific model or something, but the price and size are right. There's also the H5003 that turned up pretty much nothing as well.
Can anyone recommend something in the 32 to 40-inch range? Or if anyone has info on the J6200 or J6300 I would be grateful. The E40-C2 could be an option if I wall mount it, though it isn't my first pick. Price range is around $400.
EDIT: A 40 inch J6300 seems to exist as a best buy exclusive model for ~$500?
EDIT AGAIN: I think it's down to the J6200 and the J6300. The J6200 has minimal motion blur, while the J6300 has slightly better contrast and better upscaling. Not sure what to go with. It's probably going to come down to stand width. The E40-C2 has the better input lag though.
Pagusas
Elden Member
You can only work with what you have, a native 1080p signal will only ever have 1920x1080 pixels of information, scaling up requires either duplicating pixels (nearest neighbor) or using an algorithm to determine what information should fill in the extra pixels. Some companies like Samsung and Sony do an amazing job, maintaining the integrity of the original image without adding noise (over sharpened, haloing) color banding (incorrect filling) or junk (errors out data creating lines/artifacts)
Vizio has the worst 4K scaler I've seen so far (overly sharp, haloing), lg seems fine except with its handling of temporal data (weird juttering during pans, may be. Bigger issue with the screen though as I've seen a lot of complaints about it, even in reviews)
This is why even though Panasonic may be using lg oleds, the actual software driving the panels may be wayyy better. LG is junk, always will be, they just happen to have a market hold right now, and deserve a lot of praise for pushing oleds. But soon as the other players arive, lg will go back to being that brand that just always seems crippled in some way.
FrankNitty
Member
just got confirmation that my 65EF9500 is shipping on the 30th. At a way lower price then what is supposed to be available on the 4th
Got to try and sell a TV this coming week
Got to try and sell a TV this coming week
lifeexpectancy
Member
That may be true for LG's traditional sets, but the OLED does motion just fine. It runs around 40-50ms input lag IIRC, which isn't ideal.
Pagusas
Elden Member
I disagree on this from what I've seen in stores and in reviews of the 4K lg oleds. In fact lg oleds are specifically what I was citing as bad in this regard.
FrankNitty
Member
I think I know what you are referencing. It was mentioned in the Digital Trends review as well as the HDTV test review. I thought they had a solution to get around it but even then that really shouldn't be a thing. shouldn't need a solution it should just work.
I'm going to put the EF9500 through it's paces and just hold out until Panasonic releases theirs at a reasonable price and then move up.
I have no problems with motion on the oleds, but you need to configure it right...
For film content, Tru Motion engaged with dejudder at 0 and maxed deblur seems to be the best setting for me. This still increases the motion resolution to 600 lines, and doesn't introduce the SOE effect.
If it's native 60 Hz content just enable PC mode, you don't need additional processing there.
30 FPS games are the only problematic source since turning on Tru Motion introduces a lot of input lag. But, the bulk of my gaming is on PC, so I'm always at 60 FPS for the most part.
For film content, Tru Motion engaged with dejudder at 0 and maxed deblur seems to be the best setting for me. This still increases the motion resolution to 600 lines, and doesn't introduce the SOE effect.
If it's native 60 Hz content just enable PC mode, you don't need additional processing there.
30 FPS games are the only problematic source since turning on Tru Motion introduces a lot of input lag. But, the bulk of my gaming is on PC, so I'm always at 60 FPS for the most part.
Wildschwein
Member
I think I've narrowed things down to grabbing a Samsung UN40J6200 sometime in the next month. At least, that's the plan.
So I'm going to ask the stupid subjective question, but 44ms input lag? Is that going to feel off? I'm used to sub 10ms, but the last TV I played a game on had around 35ms and I didn't notice anything. I doubt that ~10ms difference is going to make or break things for me.
Should I be concerned?
So I'm going to ask the stupid subjective question, but 44ms input lag? Is that going to feel off? I'm used to sub 10ms, but the last TV I played a game on had around 35ms and I didn't notice anything. I doubt that ~10ms difference is going to make or break things for me.
Should I be concerned?
FrankNitty
Member
Cleveland Plasma is selling the 65EF9500 for 4250 delivered for those interested.
j0hnnix
Member
I have an opportunity to get an 73" DLP WD-73738 specifically for about 495. Just wondering if I should jump on it. It includes the TV Stand. Person says mint condition minimal use - I still have to see it in action before the purchase. What do you guys think? I am holding off on 4K for a little longer.
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
But i recall there were a few settings that had to be enabled so 30fps games would be fine too. On Youtube the other day i saw Tomb Raider on X1 on the ec930V and the motion looked fine. The uploader said he only had enabled game mode.
Holy shit. Where is that? 1350 is crazy.
Great price for an amazing TV, pick it up.
Hey guys I'm back, I've been looking for a new TV for a month now and narrowed it down to these two. Opinions?
Sony KDL48W600B 48"
Sharp LC-50LB371U 50"
Edit: found this , any good?
Sony 50 KDL50W800C"
Sony KDL48W600B 48"
Sharp LC-50LB371U 50"
Edit: found this , any good?
Sony 50 KDL50W800C"
JudgmentJay
Member
Close to pulling the trigger on this, but those pictures of very poor 2-5% grey uniformity are causing me to hesitate.
I have a 65" JS9500 on its way to me as a replacement for an F8500 with a severe buzzing problem that they couldn't fix. I highly doubt I can live with blooming so I'll probably end up selling it and grabbing a 65" EF9500.
FrankNitty
Member
The 5% screens users have been posting after use and compensation it looks like it is going away for most. Now there are several that hardly have it at all. The 2% uniformity is not really a deal breaker for me. I have to actually see it in person and have some time with it to really decide though. Plus thinking about it I have never had a display with 100% perfect uniformity. The closest is my ZT60 which has a vertical band on the far right that can only be seen at specific IRE with certain colors.
I cannot really think of any display that has perfect uniformity and if it does there is always something else. Either edge bleeding, blooming, false contouring, etc,
I can see where you are coming from though, if uniformity is one of those things you can't live with I can dig it. I feel that way about edge bleeding and blooming.
The JS9500 is supposed to be a beast of a display though, so either way you land I doubt you will be disappointed.
The JS9500 has pretty noticeable blooming, enough to be unacceptable IMO considering it was 160 zones vs the Sony 940 which has 84 and far less (and on a bigger panel no less)
Checked out and played around with a flat EF9500 OLED and got the motion to look good enough that it's making me wanna say fuck it and just buy it....
Checked out and played around with a flat EF9500 OLED and got the motion to look good enough that it's making me wanna say fuck it and just buy it....
The Panasonic OLED looks to be a dud for gaming. Input lag was measured at 200ms and 86ms in game mode from a German site that reviewed it.
https://translate.googleusercontent...0.html&usg=ALkJrhjjyhOZQPZn50Ks3iEK-TM2GVz8Sg
https://translate.googleusercontent...0.html&usg=ALkJrhjjyhOZQPZn50Ks3iEK-TM2GVz8Sg
JudgmentJay
Member
I hope you're wrong, but I'm sure you're right. My last experience with a FALD set was the Sony HX929 back in 2011. It was unbearable.
The upscaler just works... the TV will automatically upscale everything to 4k. It's not something the end user has access to.
As a prospective buyer it turned me off, along with some of the worst viewing angles I've ever seen.
Everyones tolerance for it is different though....
Does anyone who have the x940c have any changes to the default settings? (For picture or anything else.) I put my consoles in Game Mode, added my wireless sub, but that's about it. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong but have a hard time finding these things on avsforums.
Carlos on AVS took pics of the day and night settings at the VE shootout. See if these help any...
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/166-l...930c-x940c-owners-thread-47.html#post35319842
IXI FalcoN
Member
That is a huge disappointment if it turns out to be true, but not unexpected. As I noticed with the LG sets, it kind of confirms my fear that it will be a few years before the input lag on the 4k OLEDs gets down to acceptable levels. If it can at all, too early to tell with OLED.
Right now the only 4k sets with decent input lag are the 2015 Samsungs, but from what I've read the PQ goes to shit when you enable game mode and turn off all the post processing to get the lag down. Hope this gets solved quickly or people will have a hard time picking up a decent TV for gaming in the next year or 2 when the 1080p sets dry up at the high end.
My EG9100 shipped today, should be here in a week. So excited to join the OLED club!
lifeexpectancy
Member
It isn't anywhere near that high AFAIK, unless that's the first measurement of the new 4k models. IIRC the 2014 models were measuring 38-48ms, which is high but tolerable for some folks.
Edit: I'm an idiot. That's the Panasonic one not the LG one lol. Surprising to be honest. I thought Panny was usually better at the processing stuff.
JudgmentJay
Member
No longer true actually, at least for the JS9500. A firmware patch this month enabled local dimming in game mode. Since you want all the other post-processing effects off anyway, I think the only thing you lose is the ability to tweak the 10-point CMS. That's pretty minor though.
TrAcEr_x90
Member
Resistance series. Played all of them. Love the games but always came short to making the series a Sony exclusive.
lifeexpectancy
Member
Panasonic's most recent flagship LCD - AX900 - had ridiculously high input lag too. I'm not sure what happened over there, they used to cater to gamers even at the very high end.
DOT DASH DOT
Member
Yeah it's a real shame, they are terrible for lag now, but seemingly good performers in most other categories. I'm not going 4K till next year when new models are out, hope they sort it out.
French retail store promotion. That I moght be able to combo with LG Cashback.
Let's do this then ! Thanks guys
Aaaaand bought. Took a good 2h to be able to do everything (it wasn't supposed to get this price until tomorrow, and by then the cashback offer wouldn't be valid anymore), but I managed to do everything on time 
And to top that, got a free credit, and 120€ of store credit above all !
The TV should be available for pickup tomorrow, and I. Just. Can't. Wait.
And to top that, got a free credit, and 120€ of store credit above all !
The TV should be available for pickup tomorrow, and I. Just. Can't. Wait.
Thanks very much for the link. I've been following (and posting in) that thread too but it just moves too fast and is too big.
tomwhite2004
Member
Looking for a 42 inch 1080p set around the £400 mark, any recommendations or standouts from the 2015 models?
Had my eye on the below but no idea how it would cope with scaling 720p etc
http://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/tv-and...g-ue43j5600-smart-43-led-tv-10126331-pdt.html
Am in the uk, many thanks!
Had my eye on the below but no idea how it would cope with scaling 720p etc
http://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/tv-and...g-ue43j5600-smart-43-led-tv-10126331-pdt.html
Am in the uk, many thanks!
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
Had a rather unfortunete set back happening here which means what i previously said is no longer true. Way things are looking now, i'll be lucky if i can buy the OLED late October, maybe late November. I hope the former, cause i want to start Halo 5 and Fallout 4 on the new TV. This situation sucks, cause i am still gaming and watching movies/shows on this small ass 22 inch monitor. Then again, when i do finally get a new TV it will be amazing.
The problem is..the OLED is now nicely priced in some stores here and there's no guarantee that will be the case around the time i can finally afford it.
However, this store here has two Philips 4K screens, 55 inch. It's the 55PUS8908 and the 9109. Both nicely priced and if i wanted, i could get it now. But the doubts are big for this one, something tells me i should be patient and save up money for that OLED. Anyone here have any experience or actually have any of these two Philips sets?
The problem is..the OLED is now nicely priced in some stores here and there's no guarantee that will be the case around the time i can finally afford it.
However, this store here has two Philips 4K screens, 55 inch. It's the 55PUS8908 and the 9109. Both nicely priced and if i wanted, i could get it now. But the doubts are big for this one, something tells me i should be patient and save up money for that OLED. Anyone here have any experience or actually have any of these two Philips sets?