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PoliGAF 2012 |OT3| If it's not a legitimate OT the mods have ways to shut it down

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A

AlteredBeast

Fork 'em, Sparky!
Aaron Strife said:
Joe Biden will always be my favorite.



BidenKobe.jpg
Click to expand...

I thought that was Biden consoling Obama after last night's debate performance.

BTW, that article gave me diabetes just by reading it. Thanks, Aaron.
 
S

Sirpopopop

Member
kaching said:
And to what extent did Bush adopt Romney's strategy from last night? To what degree did Bush willfully dissemble and etch-a-sketch his way through the debate?
Click to expand...

And, etch-a-sketching your way through a debate is better than what I saw last night from Obama. At least when Bush took shots from Kerry, he hit right back. He didn't miss major opportunities like the $716 billion medicare cut kerfuffle, and Romney lying his ass off about his tax policies.

It's not as if Romney's performance was good. It was mediocre at best. Bush or Kerry would have kicked his ass.
 
B

Blergmeister

Member
Diablos said:
I'm a worrywort, a bit emotional sometimes, but I thoroughly enjoy these threads. I'm not a troll, you have my word. I've been on GAF for over 10 years now.

That said this is one of those times when it's totally legit to worry.
Click to expand...

I'm telling you it's not. To use an example from this thread as an anology, say we've had a few weeks of dropping First Time Unemployment claims. The new week comes in and it ticks up a little bit. That was what this debate was. It could be the start of a trend but it's most likely noise. The three week average still shows it going down. Stop chicken littling over the first blip of possible maybe bad news, just watch the trendline.

The Presidents campaign has gone fairly well at this point. I'm not saying it's been the perfect campaign, but it's gone as well as one can realistically hope for. I'm suprised it's gone as long as it has without a blip like this. And we don't even know if it's a blip yet! Right now it looks like the take away from the debate is not "President Obama flubs debate, Romney Wins Election!", it looks more like "Romney wants to fire Big Bird!" And it's still to early to tell if it's even going to be that.
 
D

Doc Holliday

SPOILER: Columbus finds America
Obama is always better when he's behind. This is the part of the movie in which the montage music kicks in. He just got his back broken! He'll will RISE!

TDKR-Lazarus-Pit-Script.jpg
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Diablos said:
A weak debater? Loser? Inept? He has proven to thwart all of those things and yet it's as though Obama from last night came from a time machine circa 2007. It's weird as hell.

Even Nate Silver is now more than open to the possibility that the debate could have really changed the landscape:
Click to expand...

You read the same article, so why are you still bullshitting?

fivethirtyeight-1004-pd2_2-blog480.jpg


In several other cases, however, the instant-reaction polls did not correlate with the change in head-to-head polls. Before Wednesday night, the second-clearest margin of victory for a challenging candidate in the CNN poll came in 2008, when Mr. Obama was declared the winner of the third presidential debate by a 27-point margin. However, his opponent John McCain actually gained slightly in the polls instead just after that debate.
Click to expand...

EVERYBODY PANIC
 
J

johnsmith

remember me
Diablos has to be a joke character, right?

Obama's still going to win this. Mitt's positions are not popular, and the more people listen to them and him the less they like both. Obama's just running out the clock while Mitt keeps lying and providing more ad fodder.
 
L

Loudninja

Member
M

Measley

Junior Member
Diablos said:
From a purely objective point of view, pretending I don't care about politics or what it means to be red or blue, that the non-political Diablos would not be able to understand what Obama was trying to articulate, nor would I feel compelled to support him in any capacity. But Mitt sure did look a lot like a President, and I might want to listen to him. That Obama guy? What was he doing up there?
Click to expand...

Honestly if you've been paying attention to twitter and facebook, it's all about Sesame Street and how Romney is going to destroy Medicare. If Romney won, it's being drowned out very quickly.

The moral of the story? Don't fuck with Big Bird and grandpa's medicine.
 
J

jamesinclair

Banned
Folks, does the fact that the left thought Romeny did really well.....well, isnt that a big fucking clue that he sort of didnt?

His debate performance was a MASSIVE shift to the left. His etch-a-sketch moment, except 3 months later than expected.

I mean seriously, he loves regulation now? During the GOP primaries the candidates were shoving each other to declare themselves the bigger hate of regulation.

He wont lower taxes on the rich? Huh, wasnt he trying to proclaim himself the king of lowering taxes?

The left turned into chicken littles because THEY thought Romney did well....because Romney was out there debating like a godamned (big bird hating) democrat.

....but how does that play for the entire GOP base that just got shit on? All the voter excitement? How do you think they felt about their candidate now?


But wait, theres more. Those 5 people in the middle who can be swayed like a fucking weathervane? They liked what they heard. Do you think they like hearing that they were lied to, and so are made to fel like idiots for believing Romney?

----

And the whole big bird thing?

No shit its a big moment.

Romneys whole game is that he has NO specifics and NO substance. And the ONE, the ONE and ONLY time he picks to be specific is with something people care about?

Major error.

Look, whatever romney chose to be specific on, people would jump on because it would be the only thing they could look at.

And on top of that, he chose the worst wording possible.

"I will defund the national arts commission" (or whatever its called)

You know what reaction that would get? None.

Look, people are 100% self centered pricks.

Joe Voter has the following lines of though:

-Ive never heard of this arts thing
-Ergo, I dont benefit from this arts thing
-Which means, it's waste, as it doesn't benefit me
-Yay romney!

On the other hand, Joe Voter knows what big bird is.

-I HAVE heard of this big bird thing
-Ergo, I DO benefit from this bird thing
-Which means, it is IMPORTANT because it benefits me (and obviously not wasteful at all)
-Fuck Romney!

Doesnt matter if theyre the exact same thing.

AND THEN theres the bit how "national arts commission" is slightly less tweetable than "big bird".

Romney dun goofed.
 
G

gutter_trash

Banned
I love how the lame stream media is spinning this as a Romney win

sell your newspapers, get your ratings LOL, they want the race to seem artificially tight and close.

the electoral college is still a hard goal for Mitt in the end
 
O

Owzers

Member
vouchercare
tax policy, what's that? I got a plan man!
big bird
my health care policy covers pre-existing conditions = complete lie, admitted by the Romney campaign that what he said wasn't accurate.

Obama has material, but the problem is he had material before the first debate and failed to do anything with it so i don't expect much better.
 
P

Puddles

Banned
So I was wondering: there was a point in the debate where Obama talked about ending tax breaks for corporations that ship jobs overseas.

Romney countered by saying that in decades of doing business, he had never heard of such a tax break. IMO, it really made Obama look bad, especially because he never pushed back on that point.

Does anyone know what specific tax break Obama was referring to? I remember him saying more or less the same thing in 2008. The fact that he's saying it again four years later would indicate that either it doesn't exist and he's been using it as a paper tiger this whole time, that he's really talking about some other tax break that can theoretically be claimed by businesses who relocate production overseas, or that this tax break is politically impossible to eliminate.
 
B

Bulbo Urethral Baggins

Banned
Puddles said:
So I was wondering: there was a point in the debate where Obama talked about ending tax breaks for corporations that ship jobs overseas.

Romney countered by saying that in decades of doing business, he had never heard of such a tax break. IMO, it really made Obama look bad, especially because he never pushed back on that point.

Does anyone know what specific tax break Obama was referring to? I remember him saying more or less the same thing in 2008. The fact that he's saying it again four years later would indicate that either it doesn't exist and he's been using it as a paper tiger this whole time, that he's really talking about some other tax break that can theoretically be claimed by businesses who relocate production overseas, or that this tax break is politically impossible to eliminate.
Click to expand...

I read an article in the Wash Post about that this morning. I'll find it.

Edit:
Here it is. In short, it doesn't really exist.

“I also want to close those loopholes that are giving incentives for companies that are shipping jobs overseas.”
— Obama
“You said you get a deduction for taking a plant overseas. Look, I’ve been in business for 25 years. I have no idea what you’re talking about. I maybe need to get a new accountant.”
— Romney

Romney said he was unaware of any provision that gives companies a tax deduction for moving operations overseas. But Obama is right; there is such a provision that allows companies to deduct such expenses — but it is not a specific loophole or incentive, as Obama indicated.

Here’s how the nonpartisan Joint Committee on Taxation described it:

“Under present law, there are no specific tax credits or disallowances of deductions solely for locating jobs in the United States or overseas. Deductions generally are allowed for all ordinary and necessary expenses paid or incurred by the taxpayer during the taxable year in carrying on any trade or business, which includes the relocation of business units.”
Moreover, it is pretty small potatoes given the attention Democrats pay to it. The JCT estimated that ending the deduction for moving operations overseas would raise just $168 million over a decade.

In the federal government with an annual budget deficit of more than $1 trillion, that’s what you call a rounding error.
Click to expand...
 
T

titiklabingapat

Member
Jesus Christ, this thread. I still don't get how easy some of you are throwing away Obama's superior ground game, superior campaign, superior organization and barring the debate last night, superior messaging. Some of you are completely missing the entire forest and are focusing on one sickly looking tree.

It's like last night's events was in a vacuum, irrespective of everything else that has happened, and will happen, this cycle.

Slow down, smell the roses, have some chamomile tea and check twitter and Facebook. The common layperson is talking about Sesame St, PBS and Big Bird today, not who won the debates last night. It's what's gonna be on talks shows tonight and SNL this weekend.
 
R

Rocket Scientist

Member
Loudninja said:
Haha

Obama: Romney Will Ignore Wall Street, ‘Crack Down On Sesame Street’

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/obama-romney-will-ignore-wall-street-crack-down
Click to expand...
This is gold. Can't believe this is actually a thing lol. Just came back from a lecture on American politics by Maarten van Rossem. It was funny seeing him react the same way as gaf even though he's Dutch. He was very disappointed, almost angry at Obama for the way he handled the debate. I'm glad the lecture was the day after the debate.
 
M

Measley

Junior Member
Puddles said:
So I was wondering: there was a point in the debate where Obama talked about ending tax breaks for corporations that ship jobs overseas.

Romney countered by saying that in decades of doing business, he had never heard of such a tax break. IMO, it really made Obama look bad, especially because he never pushed back on that point.

Does anyone know what specific tax break Obama was referring to? I remember him saying more or less the same thing in 2008. The fact that he's saying it again four years later would indicate that either it doesn't exist and he's been using it as a paper tiger this whole time, that he's really talking about some other tax break that can theoretically be claimed by businesses who relocate production overseas, or that this tax break is politically impossible to eliminate.
Click to expand...

It does exist. In the tax code, you can count it as a deduction. Obama has advocated getting rid of it for years now. It's also pretty well known to the general public.

Romney saying that he had never heard of it in "25 years of doing business" made me LoL.
 
K

Kusagari

Member
markatisu said:
Yup more and more interviews are showing that, he had a commanding presence to say exactly nothing.

I have seen more Big Bird references than anything else today, not sure that is the thing to get Romney back 5-8 pts lol
Click to expand...

I agree. Everyone says Romney won, but the discussion seems to be focusing more on the ridiculousness of the Big Bird statement than anything.

I don't think he's really going to get that much of a bump. He will get one, though.
 
M

markatisu

Member
johnsmith said:
Diablos has to be a joke character, right?

Obama's still going to win this. Mitt's positions are not popular, and the more people listen to them and him the less they like both. Obama's just running out the clock while Mitt keeps lying and providing more ad fodder.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately no posters like diablos and cartoon_solider are real people. At least we know PD is trolling us on purpose
 
A

Allard

Member
markatisu said:
Yup more and more interviews are showing that, he had a commanding presence to say exactly nothing.

I have seen more Big Bird references than anything else today, not sure that is the thing to get Romney back 5-8 pts lol
Click to expand...

I said this almost exactly after the debate ended, there was no 'moment' for Romney, he carried his own and looked competent but he left nothing lingering for anyone to remember because he gave nothing substantial for people to talk about. (where as Obama did give comments to remember but he seemed so disinterested saying it plus everyone more or less already knows his policies that it couldn't be memorable either) Romneys zingers fell on deaf ears as nothing more then entertainment, a lot of people won't vote for him because either they don't know his policies or don't trust him to stand on anything he has to say. You can't convince the latter but you can at least throw a bone or two to the former and the only substantial info we got from him were "Big Bird" and "Vouchers". Also another interesting diversion to the common wisdom. People said he won because compared to Obama Romney was quick and concise where as Obama rambled on. I say both rambled on and Romney talked so damn fast to get his point across that nothing sunk in for most the viewers other then a few key references to their daily lives (and none of them are positive).
 
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