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PoliGAF 2012 |OT3| If it's not a legitimate OT the mods have ways to shut it down
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Sirpopopop
Member
It looks like the GOP is attacking the Jerusalem/God fiasco, rather than the Clinton speech.
It's a good strategy. It could be their new, "You didn't build that."
http://www.foxnews.com/
It's a good strategy. It could be their new, "You didn't build that."
http://www.foxnews.com/
Honestly, what can they say about the Clinton speech? Republicans of yesteryear would have been able to go toe to toe, but he picked these clowns and their vacuous 2012 campaign apart.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Kerry's campaign initially went for states like Missouri and Indiana that were not typically blue states but could flip under the right circumstances. Then they said screw it and tripled down on Ohio.
So if they want to borrow from that playbook, it's cool.
You're barking up the wrong tree - women are, and should be, free to do whatever they want with their body. What you're arguing is that I should be responsible for funding that and somehow not wanting to pay for that means I want control of their bodies.
Most companies do pay for birth control - but I also think they should have the right to not cover it.
It was probably quite difficult to get Romney to admit that he doesn't have a prayer of winning Michigan, given that he was born there and his father governed there.
PhoenixDark
Banned
ADP report looks good (200k) but economists are expecting 120k jobs, which isn't great. Given the ADP' inaccuracies in the past (due to public sector job losses) I'm expecting around 110-120k
DeathbyVolcano
Banned
120k is bad? I thought that was typically GOOD the last few months.
Gotta say, this God/Jerusalem stuff is a pretty big blunder (and I say that as a 'Bama-lovin' atheist) and the way they tried to fix it may have made it worse. I'm not at all surprised that Fox News is running with it; Rove must be licking his lips as well, possibly already cutting a few ads in his head.
Thankfully, Clinton's speech was so brilliant it seems to have drowned it out completely on all non-Fox networks.
Thankfully, Clinton's speech was so brilliant it seems to have drowned it out completely on all non-Fox networks.
That's treading water with population growth.
The Librarian
Banned
It'd be up YOY.
So yes because its not a decline
120k isn't good. Its just not terrible.
anything over 120k will make the report a non issue and allow the DNC messaging to survive. Over 200k is a huge boost to Obama (just doubt that high)
Aaron Strife
Banned
120k isn't great but it's not terrible, nor would it have the effect you're hoping it would.
ADP was also spot-on last month, the inaccuracies in recent months can be attributed to BLS' odd seasonal adjustments.
I'm going to say 160k.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
"Good strategy" implies that it would actually motivate independent voters to vote for the GOP.
I don't qualify this as "good strategy," as most likely the people who care about this the most are already voting for Romney.
This is more like, "We have to do our best to pick up the pieces after that Clinton speech. What can we grab?"
So you're telling me you're not a social conservative, fine. How do you reconcile your pro-choice stance with the platforms your party supports? The idea of a company paying the cost of BCPs is more upsetting to you than a government that wants to deny a woman's right to choose?
I don't see how you can believe that you support a woman's ability to do what she wants and then say that a company having to pay for it, is more important than that basic human right to have domain over one's own body. You're more pro-business than pro-choice, and that, to me, is bullshit.
I don't think it's a good strategy.
The GOP can only win on the economy, if they can't win on that front, they can't win the election.
It's understandable that they'll try to divert attention from Clinton's speech in whatever way way they can, but as a long term strategy, I can't see it working.
I'm starting to get annoyed at the "Clinton did a better job of explaining than Obama himself". If Obama defended himself by blaming the GOP and the hand he was dealt, he'd get shredded by the media as a whiner.
The reason the Clinton thing is so shrewd is that they get to put the facts out there w/o Obama saying that stuff himself. Or do people think Obama's folks didn't work with Bill's speechwriters to get all those facts in there?
It's not that the Obama team can't explain themselves. It's just hard to campaign with a slogan of "It could have been much worse"
The reason the Clinton thing is so shrewd is that they get to put the facts out there w/o Obama saying that stuff himself. Or do people think Obama's folks didn't work with Bill's speechwriters to get all those facts in there?
It's not that the Obama team can't explain themselves. It's just hard to campaign with a slogan of "It could have been much worse"
electricpirate
Member
Saw this over at Weigel, the AP fact check of Obama is really straining for some kosmo esque false equivalency here.
You lied once, therefore, all future statements shall be graded against that lie!
You lied once, therefore, all future statements shall be graded against that lie!
they can't have less words on the Dem side lest they not be "Fair and Balanced"
Israel consider Jerusalem to be its capital, but it's recognized by practically no one, including the US, and there are no embassies in Jerusalem.
p.s.
Considering that Tel Aviv is one of the greatest cities in the world (like, top 3) and that Jerusalem is a shithole filled with racists and crazy people (for real, what other city has a family of mental disorders named after it?), Israel should listen to the world there.
Obama has the instincts of a Hollywood actor -- when there's nasty or tedious work to be done, he'd much rather have somebody else do it for him. (Shades of Punahou again.) I don't think this is a problem, I think it's an effective strategy, but I also don't think it's totally unfair to say that Obama hasn't offered the defense of his record that Clinton did.
I agree that Clinton is just a way better person for the job here, because of his popularity, his down-homeyness, and of course being a white guy, and that's one of the reasons he looks like he did way better. But I also think he's probably a better speaker than Obama when the speech has to grapple with complicated subjects. There were a few very important moments during the speech where Clinton casually mentioned critical bits of Democratic messaging that haven't been getting out effectively. "Now, we know that by the numbers the economy is improving, but many Americans just don't feel it yet" is a very valuable line, because it lets him get on the TV-watcher side of the issue rather than the wonk side. "Of course, right now people are paying to lend us money, so debt isn't a short-term concern" is another thing I'm glad he said, although I'm not sure the importance of that will sink in. And, of course, "nobody could possibly have fixed this economy in four years" is a (true!) line that Clinton might be the only politician alive today who could get away with saying.
edit: Also, "two-thirds of Medicaid goes to nursing homes."
This is some bullshit stuff
They're arresting people in the Wisconsin Capitol for displaying any sort of sign. Even people holding up their t-shirts from the blood drive going on right in the capitol got arrested.
Might start a thread on this.
They're arresting people in the Wisconsin Capitol for displaying any sort of sign. Even people holding up their t-shirts from the blood drive going on right in the capitol got arrested.
Might start a thread on this.
"In God We Trust four words that speak volumes about America's values, yet Democrats booed and shouted 'no' when His name was restored to the party platform, and now can't agree on how or why it happened."
Ugh
By the way, the "disillusioned woman voter" in this ad is the Republican National Committee Director of Hispanic Outreach, Bettina Inclan.
http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/09/rnc-staffer-plays-obama-supporter-in-gop-ad.php (WARNING: THIS LINK CONTAINS WORDS KNOWN TO THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA TO CAUSE BACKPATTING AND OTHER LIBERAL BEHAVIOR)
For my money, there are better falafels in Israel outside Jerusalem (specifically in the north of Israel, which is of the Lebanese variety), but you have to give props for the Jerusalem for its street food.
No denying that.
p.s.
Lebanese food is generally stellar, I wish I could go there.
One day.
I should really say, I wish I could go there as a civilian.
Disgusting.
Aaron Strife
Banned
"Well, the statement itself is completely true, but the man who says it lied one time, so we'll rate this one as Mostly False."
I disagree. When Obama does it, he's too "professorial". Obama explains policy as well as anyone but I guess Middle-America and the media don't want to hear wonky stuff from him. I will say Clinton is better at the bumper-sticker phrases though. "Double down on Trickle-Down" is classic lol
I do agree that the Dems have run away from the Medicaid thing because they don't want Obama to be accused to helping blacks! Depressing...
PS: Ashley Judd was on MSNBC just now. She is just fantastic <3
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
I think it's a mistake. Read: who does that appeal to that isn't already voting for Romney? If there's one consistent mistake Romney is being forced to make over and over again, it's having to chase votes that should already be in his column.
If they really wanted to move the needle, Romney would have a populist argument. Oh shit, Romney's a tax-evading, job-off shoring billionaire. Never mind.
I mean, I think this is basically what I mean. You are almost certainly right that there's an aspect of bigotry to it, but I love Obama and I have trouble listening to too much wonky stuff from him also. I'd rather he write it down and send me an email, where he has a proven gift for communication -- if anything, his speaking voice suffers because it too closely resembles his excellent writing voice, but in the wrong context. I almost always find myself resorting to the transcript when I watch long speeches by Obama. In a debate I think he does better, which is only natural for a lawyer. But Clinton is clearly more of a natural speaker than a writer (read his autobiography if you need proof).
Started a thread on the WI Capitol arrests. Don't think many people actually care though
Started a thread on the WI Capitol arrests. Don't think many people actually care though
I think most people will think given the nature of that government its par for the course sadly
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
That might be the worst "fact check" I've ever seen.
Sirpopopop
Member
The Clinton speech was a disaster for the GOP. The only thing they can do is divert attention from it, and muddy up the messaging for this cycle. If the Clinton speech is all people are talking about, then it's over for the GOP.
From that point of view this strategy of focusing on God & Israel is effective. It fires up the base. It also gives the base a talking point to scream down independents throats - "Democrats don't love God & Israel. Democrats ignore the cries of their own base, how can you trust them when they say they have a jobs platform?"
Independents are only independents because they don't pay strong attention to the issues. They believe in ideas like, "It is best for the country if I vote Democrat in one column and Republican in the other - it creates balance." (a common refrain I hear from them) Messaging like the above has the potential to work on an independent.
Edit: For the record I think it was a mistake to include God & Israel in the platform. Only because I think both positions have no place in any party platform.
Had you started it before football season, ezanrk would've trolled it for a 10 page extravaganza.Started a thread on the WI Capitol arrests. Don't think many people actually care though
Timing is everything, and honestly, you need someone special to give a fuck about Wisconsin.
It would take quite a special troll to defend this crap, I think. You really think he would?
Didn't laws like this get put up in more places than just Wisconsin? I should really look into that.
I was just coming to post this.He also said in the article that there are no moderates left in the democratic party. Is this some kind of joke?
Nope, if they're not talking about the economy, they're losing.
Having a Mormon and a Catholic on the ticket kinda ruins their pandering for the Fundamentalist Christian vote.
speculawyer
Member
Yeah, that is what I thought. Most people don't give a crap about Jerusalem. The GOP already has all the religious zealot vote.
Romney has spent most of his post clinch-the-nomination time shoring up his base. If you are doing that then you are losing.
Sirpopopop
Member
You would think it would, but living in near ground zero (Greenville, SC - home to Bob Jones University) for that movement, from all signs they seem to have coalesced around Romney.
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