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PoliGAF 2012 |OT4|: Your job is not to worry about 47% of these posts.

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W

watershed

Banned
One thing I'm really glad about is Biden pointing out the ridiculous nature of Republicans who have hated medicare its entire existence now saying they are going to save it.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
So I have to ask for the #3883498374873894792 time why in God's name is Stephen Colbert a better journamalist than most of the journamalists out there?

http://www.colbertnation.com/full-episodes/thu-october-11-2012-chrystia-freeland

Skip to the second segment, with Stephen vs. Stephen or whatever the hell it's called (sorry, can't isolate the clip cause I'm too awesome and plus I don't know how).

"Mitt Romney wants to cut taxes on the rich by 20%"

"Ah, but he wants to close loopholes so the rich pay the same amount they were previously paying"

"....then why cut their taxes?"




WAS THAT SO FUCKING HARD?! Seriously, I've been asking this goddamned question for YEARS. Why has nobody (aside from a few lefty bloggers here and there) asked this?!
 
S

SquiddyCracker

Banned
Oblivion said:
lol:

http://mansplainingryan.tumblr.com/
Click to expand...

tumblr_mbrdkvmAoy1rii2yho1_400.png
 
A

AniHawk

Member
Oblivion said:
Twitter debate reactions.
Click to expand...

'dear democrats, watch how the gop behaves when they lose a debate - contradicting, inventing gaffes, pretending you won. do this next time.'

problem is, democrats (mostly) live in reality. they'll invent gaffes like the big bird thing, but they're also honest with themselves about losses. republicans are much more insecure and whine and cry like little babies when they lose.

i don't need democrats to take the 'high road,' but i'd prefer it if they stayed here in reality... for the most part. we don't need two groups of people with their fingers in their ears.
 
C

Chumly

Member
Obama is just going to have to be an "asshole" then because somebody has to call out the bullshit and god knows the media won't do it. In fact the more and faster you lie just means your a "good" debater according to the media.
 
A

anonymous_abc

Member
T

Tom_Cody

Member
I there any consensus in post-debate polling as far who won? I think Biden clearly won for a number reasons but I'm seeing mixed reactions online.
 
kingkaiser

kingkaiser

Member
Oblivion said:
"Mitt Romney wants to cut taxes on the rich by 20%"

"Ah, but he wants to close loopholes so the rich pay the same amount they were previously paying"

"....then why cut their taxes?"


WAS THAT SO FUCKING HARD?! Seriously, I've been asking this goddamned question for YEARS. Why has nobody (aside from a few lefty bloggers here and there) asked this?!
Click to expand...

Because it is always better for the economy and the people to have a simple and more transparent fiscal-law with low tax rates but a more efficient taxation. In that way the productive people are not scared away to be even more productive and at the same time they are not encouraged to cheat the state, thus resulting in much higher fiscal revenue.
 
C

Chumly

Member
Lol the only thing media can talk about this morning in support of Ryan is bidens style because he was kind of mean at times.
 
T

Tom_Cody

Member
Chumly said:
Lol the only thing media can talk about this morning in support of Ryan is bidens style because he was kind of mean at times.
Click to expand...
Lading up to the Obama-Romney debate we got two weeks of people talking about Gore's eye rolling and sighing. As far as decorum for these debates go, Biden went thermonuclear.

Again, I think he won but I am in no way surprised that his theatricality is getting so much attention.
 
S

scorcho

testicles on a cold fall morning
Obama isn't allowed to be angry or reactive during the debate, lest he becomes the prototypical angry black man that conservatives wish him to be. This is the teleprompter President, an effete liberal with little intellectual curiosity who, by the twin fortune of affirmative action and Chicago's crony politics waltzed unchallenged and untested into the Presidency. Nevermind that he's also illegitimate to hold the office, being both Kenyan-born and Muslim.

Conservatives Undecided voters saw in the first debate Romney morph into a charlatan Reagan. He's a man who believes in America's greatness but without a map to even know where to begin. But he put Obama in his place the way that McCain couldn't. He made Obama look small and befuddled. Romney became the last Great White Hope for 2012 that'll save us all through trickle down part 2.

Part 1? Not Reagan, think Kennedy.

Ryan's a fucking idiot.
 
K

Krauser Kat

Member
kingkaiser said:
Because it is always better for the economy and the people to have a simple and more transparent fiscal-law with low tax rates but a more efficient taxation. In that way the productive wealthy are not scared away to be even more productive and at the same time they are not encouraged to cheat the state, thus resulting in much higher fiscal revenue.
Click to expand...

Easier fiscal law would be great for everyone. The only money you save is what you spend on tax software/man hours. There is no information i have seen supporting growth romney camp is saying would happen from the cuts and simplification.
 
T

Tim-E

Member
kingkaiser said:
Because it is always better for the economy and the people to have a simple and more transparent fiscal-law with low tax rates but a more efficient taxation. In that way the productive people are not scared away to be even more productive and at the same time they are not encouraged to cheat the state, thus resulting in much higher fiscal revenue.
Click to expand...

If you would, please provide some evidence that a low tax rate for wealthy people equates to economic growth for all over an extended period of time. Also, please provide some evidence that a low top tax rate equates to low unemployment or increased wages over an extended period of time.

Go on, I'll wait.
 
kingkaiser

kingkaiser

Member
Tim-E said:
If you would, please provide some evidence that a low tax rate for wealthy people equates to economic growth for all over an extended period of time. Also, please provide some evidence that a low top tax rate equates to low unemployment or increased wages over an extended period of time.

Go on, I'll wait.
Click to expand...

Ok, one example:

Beside some very important structural reforms in the last ten years here in Germany, the capital-gains-tax was reduced from 40% to 20% in 2007, which led one of the most disastrous economies in europe become the most robust one.
 
T

Tim-E

Member
kingkaiser said:
Ok, one example:

Beside some very important structural reforms in the last ten years here in Germany, the capital-gains-tax was reduced from 40% to 20% in 2007, which lead from one of the most disastrous economies in europe to become the most robust one.
Click to expand...

Long-term capital gains taxes in the United States will raise to 20% after this year from its current rate of 15%, if I'm understanding this correctly. It also looks like your top tax rate for an individual is 45%. If the current tax cuts in the US were allowed to expire for top income earners, the rate would be less than 40%. So not only are our capital gains taxes lower than yours, our top individual tax rate is lower, as well. I don't think this situation in Germany is comparable to that of the United States.

Economics isn't my strong suit, so correct me if I'm wrong.
 
C

Chumly

Member
kingkaiser said:
Ok, one example:

Beside some very important structural reforms in the last ten years here in Germany, the capital-gains-tax was reduced from 40% to 20% in 2007, which led one of the most disastrous economies in europe become the most robust one.
Click to expand...
United States lowered its taxes on the rich and capital gains and caused one of the weakest growth periods and lead to the Great Recession.
 
I

ISOM

Member
I hope Obama is practicing with biden over the weekend if obama can look like a stronger debater against biden to impartial people that will help him ALOT to take on romney. I think the worst thing going into the first debate was john kerry practicing with obama.
 
D

Dreamcaster

Banned
Oblivion said:
So I have to ask for the #3883498374873894792 time why in God's name is Stephen Colbert a better journamalist than most of the journamalists out there?

http://www.colbertnation.com/full-episodes/thu-october-11-2012-chrystia-freeland

Skip to the second segment, with Stephen vs. Stephen or whatever the hell it's called (sorry, can't isolate the clip cause I'm too awesome and plus I don't know how).

"Mitt Romney wants to cut taxes on the rich by 20%"

"Ah, but he wants to close loopholes so the rich pay the same amount they were previously paying"

"....then why cut their taxes?"




WAS THAT SO FUCKING HARD?! Seriously, I've been asking this goddamned question for YEARS. Why has nobody (aside from a few lefty bloggers here and there) asked this?!
Click to expand...

I think the simple answer would be to simplify the tax code. Why should those that cannot afford tax attorneys essentially pay a "complexity tax" because they are not able to take advantage of every break written into the tax code? Even small business owners that hire accountants are not getting every break a highly skilled tax attorney could find for them.
 
H

Half and half

Member
Ahhhhh, good morning everyone. Slept like a baby last night.

Had the most wonderful dream about a crazy old wizard fighting back an angry leprechaun.
 
T

Tim-E

Member
IGSaint said:
I hope Obama is practicing with biden over the weekend if obama can look like a stronger debater against biden to impartial people that will help him ALOT to take on romney. I think the worst thing going into the first debate was john kerry practicing with obama.
Click to expand...

I don't think it's Kerry's fault that Obama didn't feel the need to try. Obama's led this race all year and felt like he didn't need to engage Romney at all. He's seen how that works and I'd guarantee he won't let that happen again.

In addition, Obama doesn't really need to be aggressive in this next debate, as it's a town hall style debate. He just needs to be proactive in pointing out Romney's inconsistencies. Plus that format will be better for Obama than the last.
 
D

Dreamcaster

Banned
Tim-E said:
I don't think it's Kerry's fault that Obama didn't feel the need to try. Obama's led this race all year and felt like he didn't need to engage Romney at all. He's seen how that works and I'd guarantee he won't let that happen again.

In addition, Obama doesn't really need to be aggressive in this next debate, as it's a town hall style debate. He just needs to be proactive in pointing out Romney's inconsistencies. Plus that format will be better for Obama than the last.
Click to expand...

The town hall is a difficult format to have a "winner" barring any major gaffe. It's basically voters (albeit hand selected with approved questions) asking direct questions and they are much more interested in the candidate answering their question as it relates to them, rather than demonizing their opponent.

I always wonder what would happen in this format if someone with an "approved" question just went off script and asked an off the wall question.

"Mitt, here are 10 issues you've been on both sides of - how do we know you'll keep your word."
"Barack, let me see your wedding ring - what does this inscription mean?" (assuming some wack-job got in the audience).
 
P

Particle Physicist

between a quark and a baryon
I

ISOM

Member
Tim-E said:
I don't think it's Kerry's fault that Obama didn't feel the need to try. Obama's led this race all year and felt like he didn't need to engage Romney at all. He's seen how that works and I'd guarantee he won't let that happen again.

In addition, Obama doesn't really need to be aggressive in this next debate, as it's a town hall style debate. He just needs to be proactive in pointing out Romney's inconsistencies. Plus that format will be better for Obama than the last.
Click to expand...

I mean it in the way that obama was not prepared for a style such as romney's a different debater someone who threw him off, interrupted him and looked more energized than obama would make him realize that he was going into the debate way too flat and reserved.

Have you seen kerry debate? He fits into obama's style, respectful not interrupting etc.. but I agree that obama will definetly game change and come out aggressive throughout for the second debate.
 
C

codhand

Member
scorcho said:
Obama isn't allowed to be angry or reactive during the debate, lest he becomes the prototypical angry black man that conservatives wish him to be.
Click to expand...

It's really time to throw that shit out the window, Obama can move on to 270 without winning that crowd over, by simply firing up his base a la Biden. Republicans claiming victory last night are in a state of shock like in that movie Waiting, where the restaurant staff trick new co-workers into looking at their balls between their legs; yeah that's what Biden did to Republicans last night. He bat-winged Ryan, and got to kick him in the ass.
 
M

Manmademan

Member
Tim-E said:
Long-term capital gains taxes in the United States will raise to 20% after this year from its current rate of 15%, if I'm understanding this correctly. It also looks like your top tax rate for an individual is 45%. If the current tax cuts in the US were allowed to expire for top income earners, the rate would be less than 40%. So not only are our capital gains taxes lower than yours, our top individual tax rate is lower, as well. I don't think this situation in Germany is comparable to that of the United States.

Economics isn't my strong suit, so correct me if I'm wrong.
Click to expand...

the US also has no VAT, so total taxes are much less when that's taken into account.
 
T

Tim-E

Member
cartoon_soldier said:
So...emerging Media narrative is that Biden laughed too much?
Click to expand...

The media narrative doesn't matter. As I said last night, this debate succeeded in getting liberals excited again, which is all it needed to do. The VP debate was never going to move the needle in any significant fashion.
 
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