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PoliGAF 2012 |OT4|: Your job is not to worry about 47% of these posts.

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O

Owzers

Member
cartoon_soldier said:
So...emerging Media narrative is that Biden laughed too much?
Click to expand...

Biden couldn't control his joy in tearing Ryan's arguments apart.

Chuck Todd letting a wingnut babble on, i guess he's OCCASIONALLY correcting his lies but like most "exchanges" it's a person rambling on about their stump speech. Todd even let him get away with saying Republicans stand behind their tough truths while Obama steals from Medicare to pay for Obamacare. you know, standing behind the same cuts in Medicare that Ryan wanted in that budget? How do you not mention that Chuck? Go do a poll!
 
G

gkryhewy

Member
sillymonkey321 said:
Obama steals from Medicare to pay for Obamacare. you know, standing behind the same cuts in Medicare that Ryan wanted in that budget? How do you not mention that Chuck? Go do a poll!
Click to expand...

Honestly, this was the one miss Biden had last night. When Ryan broke out that cookie jar line about the raiding the medicare advantage cookie jar to pay for obamacare, I was *sure* Biden was going to nail him a la Bill Clinton for doing the same thing in his budget.
 
R

RDreamer

Member
AniHawk said:
'dear democrats, watch how the gop behaves when they lose a debate - contradicting, inventing gaffes, pretending you won. do this next time.'

problem is, democrats (mostly) live in reality. they'll invent gaffes like the big bird thing, but they're also honest with themselves about losses. republicans are much more insecure and whine and cry like little babies when they lose.

i don't need democrats to take the 'high road,' but i'd prefer it if they stayed here in reality... for the most part. we don't need two groups of people with their fingers in their ears.
Click to expand...

They didn't even need to invent a gaffe for the Obama debate. Mitt lied his damned ass off. Liberals should have seized on that, and made it the focus post-debate.
 
T

Tim-E

Member
RDreamer said:
They didn't even need to invent a gaffe for the Obama debate. Mitt lied his damned ass off. Liberals should have seized on that, and made it the focus post-debate.
Click to expand...

They were too busy seizing on their ultimate opportunity to return to being the party that collapses when the least bit of adversity comes their way as they have been since Vietnam.
 
F

Frank the Great

Banned
this is why the media is making a big deal out of the laughing.

same thing happened with big bird . . . they refuse to do any reporting on their own and the substance of the debates - and instead just parrot what the campaigns say.
 
S

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
All my Facebook Republicans are calling it a tie, so it must have been a greater brutalizing than I thought. Somebody better check Ryan's glutes for impact craters.
 
E

effzee

Member
The reaction to the debates is so laughable. They knowingly acknowledge spin alley yet still cater to it.

WTF is wrong with our political media? Is it money and sponsorship? Why do let politicians and their teams dictate the narrative?

Also maybe I am thinking in very simplistic terms but whenever Romney and Ryan bring up working across the aisle, why don't Obama and Biden counter with solid concrete examples?

Isn't it well documented that many Republicans on TV claimed just days after Obama got into office that their #1 goal now was to make him a 1 term President? That by definition that meant they wouldn't work with him to help recover the economy? Last night again Ryan brought up how they would work with Democrats. Then to highlight that point more he claimed Romney worked with his mostly liberal state when he was Governor. Well why not hit back and mention that the governor Romney was practically a liberal himself who was pro Obamacare and pro choice?

I don't get why these points are made more often.
 
T

TiVo

Member
So, undecided women voters, who are they?

Not offended by Todd Akin.
Not offended by a panel of Republican men making decisions about women's bodies.
But Biden's laughing made you decide to vote for Romney?
 
E

effzee

Member
TiVo said:
So, undecided women voters, who are they?

Not offended by Todd Akin.
Not offended by a panel of Republican men making decisions about women's bodies.
But Biden's laughing made you decide to vote for Romney?
Click to expand...

They don't exist. Women vote like most others, based on party lines. And no matter what we see as a clear attack on their rights, if they have a conservative/republican world view they don't see it as an attack on themselves.
 
C

cartoon_soldier

Member
Plouffe calls Mason Dixon poll bunk

http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/plouffe-pushes-back-against-florida-poll-showing-obama

Obama campaign rarely calls out individual polls though

Arguing to the Tampa Bay Times that the poll is "not rooted in reality," Plouffe argued that it was unlikely that Obama is polling so low in the Sunshine State.

"We got 57 percent of the Latino vote, according to exit (polls) last time," Plouffe said. "We think we'll probably push 60 or above this time. It's impossible for us to be at 44 in Florida."
Click to expand...

I agree with him. Romney may win FL (and I think he is a favorite currently to do so), but it won't be by that Margin. More like 1% difference.
 
C

Crisco

Banned
The Obama campaign must really have more money than it knows what to do with. I've actually seen a handful of official ads run here in Utah.
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
Good morning!
24490_thumb.gif

MilbrD20121012_low.jpg

(shamelessly ripped from DU)

I slept for three hours, but still feel really rested!
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
effzee said:
The reaction to the debates is so laughable. They knowingly acknowledge spin alley yet still cater to it.

WTF is wrong with our political media? Is it money and sponsorship? Why do let politicians and their teams dictate the narrative?

Also maybe I am thinking in very simplistic terms but whenever Romney and Ryan bring up working across the aisle, why don't Obama and Biden counter with solid concrete examples?

Isn't it well documented that many Republicans on TV claimed just days after Obama got into office that their #1 goal now was to make him a 1 term President? That by definition that meant they wouldn't work with him to help recover the economy? Last night again Ryan brought up how they would work with Democrats. Then to highlight that point more he claimed Romney worked with his mostly liberal state when he was Governor. Well why not hit back and mention that the governor Romney was practically a liberal himself who was pro Obamacare and pro choice?

I don't get why these points are made more often.
Click to expand...

My take is this: Fox News has destroyed other news venues because they cater to republicans. The other networks want some of that market share back. The only way to get that back is to spout some stuff that appeals to that side.
 
M

MetatronM

Unconfirmed Member
Saw on my commute this morning that the Murdoch rag New York Post is running "VOTE FOR JOE!" as its big front page headline with a picture of smiling Biden and the sub header "Preening VP shows O how to debate."

Sure, it's still a jab at Obama as any News Corp approved header is going to be, but that's about as clear an indicator as any that Biden won the debate.
 
M

markatisu

Member
TiVo said:
So, undecided women voters, who are they?

Not offended by Todd Akin.
Not offended by a panel of Republican men making decisions about women's bodies.
But Biden's laughing made you decide to vote for Romney?
Click to expand...

Here's a hint they are not undecided, they are just too embarrassed and ashamed to call themselves Republicans ;)
 
F

Frank the Great

Banned
MetatronM said:
Saw on my commute this morning that the Murdoch rag New York Post is running "VOTE FOR JOE!" as its big front page headline with a picture of smiling Biden and the sub header "Preening VP shows O how to debate."

Sure, it's still a jab at Obama as any News Corp approved header is going to be, but that's about as clear an indicator as any that Biden won the debate.
Click to expand...

yeah, that is the best headline democrats could ask for.
 
M

massoluk

Banned
There's no fucking way a reasonable person could objectively watch this debate and thought Biden didn't win the debate.

He mercilessly countered every single phrase uttered by Ryan and ditched out many of his own blows. Foreign Policy? Nailed it. Taxes? Called out the BS on specifics. Abortion? Perfect response, respectful toward pro-choice, not offensive toward Catholics. Stimulus? Excellent counter with Ryan's own stimulus.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
kingkaiser said:
Ok, one example:

Beside some very important structural reforms in the last ten years here in Germany, the capital-gains-tax was reduced from 40% to 20% in 2007, which led one of the most disastrous economies in europe become the most robust one.
Click to expand...

...you don't think the labor law guttings of Agenda 2010 were maybe more relevant? Or the export and capital siphoning opportunities offered by the Eurozone? You have probably identified the least important factor in Germany's success.

Dreamcaster said:
I think the simple answer would be to simplify the tax code. Why should those that cannot afford tax attorneys essentially pay a "complexity tax" because they are not able to take advantage of every break written into the tax code? Even small business owners that hire accountants are not getting every break a highly skilled tax attorney could find for them.
Click to expand...

This is a fair point, br you must remember that many of those tax breaks are policy levers, designed to encourage specific behavior on the part of taxpayers. That's why we wrote them -- with the classic example being the charitable giving deduction. So what will we use to motivate action if tax breaks and penalties are off the table?
 
G

gcubed

Member
Dreamcaster said:
I think the simple answer would be to simplify the tax code. Why should those that cannot afford tax attorneys essentially pay a "complexity tax" because they are not able to take advantage of every break written into the tax code? Even small business owners that hire accountants are not getting every break a highly skilled tax attorney could find for them.
Click to expand...

yeah, i dont get the original argument. The benefit of cutting tax rates but removing deductions is to get rid of loopholes and ways to shelter your money. It's what Obama should be doing as well.
 
D

Dreamcaster

Banned
Minor pet peeve - does it seem odd that anytime Biden's wife is brought up, the press is adamant that she is referred to as DOCTOR Jill Biden (thanks to her Doctorate in Education received in 2007)? After the debate when the wives come up it was "And the VP is greeted by his wife, Dr. Jill Biden" not "And there is the VPs wife, Jill."

I don't think actual medical doctors in Congress are referred to as Doctor, though Ron Paul is occasionally introduced as Dr. Ron Paul.

I have no idea what this bothers me! I guess I'm in the "If you're not a medical doctor, you're not really a DOCTOR camp."
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Dreamcaster said:
Minor pet peeve - does it seem odd that anytime Biden's wife is brought up, the press is adamant that she is referred to as DOCTOR Jill Biden (thanks to her Doctorate in Education received in 2007)? After the debate when the wives come up it was "And the VP is greeted by his wife, Dr. Jill Biden" not "And there is the VPs wife, Jill."

I don't think actual medical doctors in Congress are referred to as Doctor, though Ron Paul is occasionally introduced as Dr. Ron Paul.

I have no idea what this bothers me! I guess I'm in the "If you're not a medical doctor, you're not really a DOCTOR camp."
Click to expand...

It's customary for those with a doctorate to be referred to as Dr in ap style while so called real doctors are MD's unless they have an actual doctorate.
 
G

Godslay

Banned
Paul Ryan's stimulus request letters:

http://abcnews.go.com/images/Politics/2012_08_13_10_36_08.pdf

I thought this passage was good...

Paul Ryan said:
In addition, I was pleased that the primary objectives of their project will allow residents and businesses in the partner cities to reduce their energy costs, reduce greenhouse gas emissions, and stimulate the local and area economy by creating new jobs. For example, the applicant believes that the business portion of their project will improve the energy efficiency of 96,000,000 square feet of buildings, result in $41 million in reduced utility bills, reduce greenhouse gas emissions by 2,628,655 million metric tons of CO2 and retain approximately 7,600 new jobs over the 3 year grant period and the subsequent 3 years. In addition, the residential portion of their project is designed to serve at least 14,200 homes, save approximately $12 million in utility bills and 10,035 metric tons of CO2
Click to expand...

Dreamcaster said:
Minor pet peeve - does it seem odd that anytime Biden's wife is brought up, the press is adamant that she is referred to as DOCTOR Jill Biden (thanks to her Doctorate in Education received in 2007)? After the debate when the wives come up it was "And the VP is greeted by his wife, Dr. Jill Biden" not "And there is the VPs wife, Jill."

I don't think actual medical doctors in Congress are referred to as Doctor, though Ron Paul is occasionally introduced as Dr. Ron Paul.

I have no idea what this bothers me! I guess I'm in the "If you're not a medical doctor, you're not really a DOCTOR camp."
Click to expand...

You're in the wrong camp. I am friends with a geologist who has his doctorate. Professionally he is referred to as doctor. You don't have to be a medical doctor to be referred to as a doctor.
 
W

WaltJay

Member
Black Republican said:
gonna watch the debate now, did Biden say literally a million times?
Click to expand...

I don't recall him saying literally even once. It dawned on me when they hit their closing statements.

RE: The Letters

When Biden brought up the letters than Ryan sent, I swore he was going to storm off the stage crying, "How dare you! Those letters were PRIVATE!" That was the ultimate rebuttal to Ryan's anti-stimulus stance. So, so good.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
effzee said:
The reaction to the debates is so laughable. They knowingly acknowledge spin alley yet still cater to it.

WTF is wrong with our political media? Is it money and sponsorship? Why do let politicians and their teams dictate the narrative?

Also maybe I am thinking in very simplistic terms but whenever Romney and Ryan bring up working across the aisle, why don't Obama and Biden counter with solid concrete examples?

Isn't it well documented that many Republicans on TV claimed just days after Obama got into office that their #1 goal now was to make him a 1 term President? That by definition that meant they wouldn't work with him to help recover the economy? Last night again Ryan brought up how they would work with Democrats. Then to highlight that point more he claimed Romney worked with his mostly liberal state when he was Governor. Well why not hit back and mention that the governor Romney was practically a liberal himself who was pro Obamacare and pro choice?

I don't get why these points are made more often.
Click to expand...
CNN was riding Ryan's cock all day yesterday. They're desperately trying to shake their "liberal" image. They stuffed more Republicans in their poll than Democrats. They're hiring more dumb GOP bobble heads than any other. And Peter Gergen is just plain embarrassment, and when he wrote that valiant Bain defense article he should've been marched out of the news room. Yesterday is the day I've decided to stop watching CNN as my 'default' news channel. They've gone way over On to MSNBC. I'll tolerate Ed Schultz, Lawrence O Donnell and Martin Bashir. Chris Matthews is always fun to watch (whether you think he's a fool or not), you can never go wrong with Rachel Maddow and of course Oblivion's waifu SE Cupp for your daily dose of slightly dumb.

MSNBC all the way to the victory speech.
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
WaltJay said:
I don't recall him saying literally even once. It dawned on me when they hit their closing statements.

RE: The Letters

When Biden brought up the letters than Ryan sent, I swore he was going to storm off the stage crying, "How dare you! Those letters were PRIVATE!" That was the ultimate rebuttal to Ryan's anti-stimulus stance. So, so good.
Click to expand...

Is anyone in the media talking about the letters?
 
T

Tim-E

Member
Dreamcaster said:
Minor pet peeve - does it seem odd that anytime Biden's wife is brought up, the press is adamant that she is referred to as DOCTOR Jill Biden (thanks to her Doctorate in Education received in 2007)? After the debate when the wives come up it was "And the VP is greeted by his wife, Dr. Jill Biden" not "And there is the VPs wife, Jill."

I don't think actual medical doctors in Congress are referred to as Doctor, though Ron Paul is occasionally introduced as Dr. Ron Paul.

I have no idea what this bothers me! I guess I'm in the "If you're not a medical doctor, you're not really a DOCTOR camp."
Click to expand...

It's standard practice to refer to anyone with a doctorate as "Doctor," regardless of what it's in.
 
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