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PoliGAF 2013 |OT2| Worth 77% of OT1

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D

Diablos

Member
Aaron Strife said:
I think everyone endured stress at some point during the election about Romney winning, even those of us who were sure Obama had it. Even me (with my spot-on early prediction) for a couple days during the debate fiasco, though I don't think I ever admitted it.
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Ohhh now you admit it. Hahaha.

jamesinclair said:
My dad said Obama will be out of office by the end of the year
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lmao

Knowing Obama he already has all of his bases covered should the time ever come that he has to testify about one of the three things nipping at his heels. He's not an idiot. And even if something shady happened at some point, I don't even expect him to be dumb enough to have his own "I did not have sexual relations with that woman" type of moment. Barack is too smart, and sadly, that's part of the problem that fuels the disconnect between him and the neanderthals polluting DC (left and right).
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Diablos said:
Ohhh now you admit it. Hahaha.
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Well, my feeling wasn't "Oh god Romney's gonna win!" it was more "Oh shit, there is a possibility now of him winning." That mostly subsided by election day when polls showed almost no path to victory for Romney.

Speaking of polls, it was always of great comfort to know at least Democrats would still have a majority in the Senate. I never doubted that for a second. And the knowledge that Paul Ryan would never be able to cast the tiebreaking vote was like damn ether for my soul.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
jamesinclair said:
I could, but it would lead to more trouble. I've learned to simply not engage. "Thats nice" and move on.

You could have God himself list the facts, and hed be wrong.
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See, the right really has its base already wound up thinking these scandals will have Obama impeached. They are going to look pretty silly when these things just fade away.


Then again, that base forgets things faster than a stoner. It still amazes how much they think they are the party of fiscal responsibility when Bush raised the deficits pretty much every year and Saint Reagan ran up more debt than every president that came before him combined. They forget so fast.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
speculawyer said:
See, the right really has its base already wound up thinking these scandals will have Obama impeached. They are going to look pretty silly when these things just fade away.

Then again, that base forgets things faster than a stoner. It still amazes how much they think they are the party of fiscal responsibility when Bush raised the deficits pretty much every year and Saint Reagan ran up more debt than every president that came before him combined. They forget so fast.
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Everyone fucking forgets that shit. The media always plays up the Republicans as genuinely concerned about the deficit, moreso than Democrats. Obama promised to halve the deficit and by 2015 he'll have cut it down to a quarter of what it was when he entered office. Meanwhile Wonderboy Ryan's budget cuts spending by 6 trillion, then cuts taxes by 6 trillion and through some bullshit voodoo magic that equals a balanced budget. Yeah ok and Romney would have created 10 million jobs in his first year.
 
K

Keylow415

Member
Then again, that base forgets things faster than a stoner. It still amazes how much they think they are the party of fiscal responsibility when Bush raised the deficits pretty much every year and Saint Reagan ran up more debt than every president that came before him combined. They forget so fast.
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That's because they live in some fantasy world and not the real world.
They lie so much they actually believe all the bullshit that say. And the media is so fucking stupid they just stand there and say ok when we and they should all know its bullshit coming from there mouths
 
A

Aaron

Member
speculawyer said:
Then again, that base forgets things faster than a stoner. It still amazes how much they think they are the party of fiscal responsibility when Bush raised the deficits pretty much every year and Saint Reagan ran up more debt than every president that came before him combined. They forget so fast.
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They are powerless and delusional. They don't forget. They just come up with a twisted justification in their own mind, and even if that's obvious bullshit, it's enough for them to move on. This is the result of replacing reason with faith. Belief triumphs over reality, even when in fact doesn't. They don't consider Obama the actual president because they believed he would never win, and how can their beliefs be wrong? Since Bush Jr was a valid president, what he did was justified, because they believe it's so.

These people believe in ghosts over global warming. They are overgrown children.
 
M

Mario

Sidhe / PikPok
speculawyer said:
See, the right really has its base already wound up thinking these scandals will have Obama impeached. They are going to look pretty silly when these things just fade away.
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If history is anything to go by, these things will become "evidence" of a corrupt leadership and liberal media bias for the far right, on Facebook pic lists alongside the likes of Fast and Furious and trotted out when the next "scandal" comes along.

"Remember Benghazi" was already a thing after it faded the first time.

Hopefully it spurs the GOP to run on it in 2014 and 2016 because they'll remember their own spin and the fervor it caused while crucially forgetting there was actually no substance and the public at large doesn't care. The biggest failure of the GOP strategy in the last 4 years has been falling for their own hype.
 
J

jamesinclair

Banned
speculawyer said:
See, the right really has its base already wound up thinking these scandals will have Obama impeached. They are going to look pretty silly when these things just fade away.
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I was forced to listen to fox news for 15 minutes. The lady was tripping over herself jumping from one scandal to the other.

Then their super special honored guest on set to give his opinion?

The lawyer who bought Bush his presidency and represents the Koch bros. I almost threw up.
 
S

Sirpopopop

Member
speculawyer said:
See, the right really has its base already wound up thinking these scandals will have Obama impeached. They are going to look pretty silly when these things just fade away.


Then again, that base forgets things faster than a stoner. It still amazes how much they think they are the party of fiscal responsibility when Bush raised the deficits pretty much every year and Saint Reagan ran up more debt than every president that came before him combined. They forget so fast.
Click to expand...

The House can impeach Obama.

I wouldn't be surprised if they do so. Nothing will come of it in the Senate of course, but all the House needs is a 'majority' to get Obama on what they consider to be a "high crime and misdemeanor."
 
P

pigeon

Banned
I'm starting to think this might go badly for Republicans, not because they overstepped in their claims any more than usual, but because they burned their reporter by giving him false information and claiming it was true. The primary concern of the media is the media, and playing the sides against each other gives them staying power...but if you allow one side to deliberately manipulate you, you're going to get marginalized.

Of course, I thought this last year, too, so maybe I'm wrong.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Tea Party Sees IRS Debacle as Chance for Movement’s Rebirth

Wonderful.

DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) — Is the tea party getting its groove back? Shouts of vindication from around the country suggest the movement’s leaders certainly think so.

They say the IRS acknowledgement that it had targeted their groups for extra scrutiny — a claim that tea party activists had made for years — is helping pump new energy into the coalition. And they are trying to use that development, along with the ongoing controversy over the Benghazi, Libya, terrorist attacks and the Justice Department’s secret seizure of journalists’ phone records, to recruit new activists incensed about government overreach.

“This is the defining moment to say ‘I told you so,’ ” said Katrina Pierson, a Dallas-based tea party leader, who traveled to Washington last week as the three political headaches for President Barack Obama unfolded.
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G

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
I'd rather they just "go away" than have something backfire (Which I also doubt. See: 2010)
 
F

Fenderputty

Banned
Averon said:
Love Cloving, but him being perm'd is all on him. He knew he was on thin ice with the mods due to him trolling/baiting Ninty fans (he said as much after he came back from his previous ban). Given the high tensions due to E3 season, and the fact that the mods will be extra active to cull the fanboy insanity every E3 brings, he should've avoided the gaming side altogether.
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Wait he's done? What happens to his bet with PD?
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
New-page post...whatevs, but I gotta ask about this. I may come off as incredibly stupid, but whatever.

I was reading about student loans and I stopped about halfway into the fourth paragraph because I couldn't follow it. Does anybody have any handy links that easily explain how student loans work? Also what interest rates are. That's the amount it increases in value per year, right?
 
G

Gotchaye

Member
Dax01 said:
New-page post...whatevs, but I gotta ask about this. I may come off as incredibly stupid, but whatever.

I was reading about student loans and I stopped about halfway into the fourth paragraph because I couldn't follow it. Does anybody have any handy links that easily explain how student loans work? Also what interest rates are. That's the amount it increases in value per year, right?
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Try here first, I'd say: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stafford_Loan

With an ordinary loan, a lender gives you a lump sum. Repayment terms typically involve interest rates, where the idea is that, at specified times, whatever you owe (at that time) is multiplied by some factor. For example, you can take out a loan for $1000 with 4% interest, compounded annually. If at the end of the year you still owe $1000, that's multiplied by 1.04 and becomes $1040 that you owe. Maybe you pay back $300 over the second year, so that you owe $740 before that year's interest. That $740 is multiplied by 1.04 so that you owe $769.60 in total. I should note that interest rates are typically given in an annualized form, even if interest is compounded more often. Many things accrue interest monthly or even daily, but the quoted interest rates give growth over a year, so you have to do a little math to get the factor by which amounts increase per day or month.

With a normal loan, the interest rate offered typically depends strongly on the degree to which the borrower is seen as likely to default. If I'm at risk of declaring bankruptcy, lenders will demand higher interest rates from me to compensate for the risk that I will end up defaulting and not paying them back. Student loans are special in that the government guarantees payment (and as part of this also doesn't allow student loan debt to be discharged in bankruptcy like other kinds of debt). So the interest rate on student loans has nothing to do with the particulars of a borrower's situation. Edit: I guess the government directly offers student loans now, so it's not so much guaranteeing payment as it is willing to eat a loss.

With subsidized student loans, the government pays the interest for some period of time (also the interest rate has been lower, but like the article says it's going up to match the unsubsidized rate).
 
C

Chichikov

Member
Dax01 said:
New-page post...whatevs, but I gotta ask about this. I may come off as incredibly stupid, but whatever.

I was reading about student loans and I stopped about halfway into the fourth paragraph because I couldn't follow it. Does anybody have any handy links that easily explain how student loans work? Also what interest rates are. That's the amount it increases in value per year, right?
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As I understand it, his main point is that because the student loan rate is below t-bills yield and because we fund our deficit with t-bills, the profit the government makes on a loan (and it still makes money on a non-defaulted individual loan) is not enough to cover the interest pay on the extra debt we accrued to finance it.
That's a really weird and simplistic way to look the deficit, the budget and the public debt.
And I'm definitely against the measure he seem to be advocating - let the market set the rates for these loans.
 
G

Gotchaye

Member
Chichikov said:
As I understand it, his main point is that because the student loan rate is below t-bills yield and because we fund our deficit with t-bills, the profit the government makes on a loan (and it still makes money on a non-defaulted individual loan) is not enough to cover the interest pay on the extra debt we accrued to finance it.
That's a really weird and simplistic way to look the deficit, the budget and the public debt.
And I'm definitely against the measure he seem to be advocating - let the market set the rates for these loans.
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That's not what the article is saying. It's not concerned with where the money financing student loans is coming from. It's saying that when the CBO talks about the profitability of student loans it's not actually considering the real rate of default (rates of partial default) - it assumes that the rate of default on student loans is the same as the rate of default implied by the interest rate of Treasuries, which is crazy. The point of talking about market rates is to say that student loans are probably only going to be profitable at something like those rates*. I don't think the article is advocating for market-based student loans at all.

*It's important to note that we're talking about first-order profitability here: Is the government making more back on student loans than it's paying out? When we're talking about the government, obviously it can run a program at a first-order loss while still making money through secondary effects (more economic growth in general, higher taxes from the beneficiary of the loan, etc). It can also be the case that student loans are good to have even if they don't pay for themselves, even indirectly (the article notes this). We spend on lots of things that don't pay for themselves but which are worth the money.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Sirpopopop said:
The House can impeach Obama.

I wouldn't be surprised if they do so. Nothing will come of it in the Senate of course, but all the House needs is a 'majority' to get Obama on what they consider to be a "high crime and misdemeanor."
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I still have yet to hear someone tell me what the alleged "high crime or misdemeanor" is! Lying to the public is not a crime. Every politician would be in jail if it were.
 
B

Blatz

Member
Link said:
I commented on this earlier. Where's the outrage over this? It's a much more serious thing to me that all these groups are receiving non-profit status when they obviously shouldn't be.
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I think the tax law is written so poorly it's nearly impossible to prosecute/revoke tax exempt status, IIRC. I believe this is something the Obama admin is trying to address. But GOP will probably filibuster it.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Yes.... Beuno.

Michele Bachmann Presidential Campaign Investigation Joined By FBI

The FBI has jumped into a multi-pronged investigation of alleged misconduct by the failed presidential campaign of Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minn.), the Minneapolis Star Tribune reported on Sunday.

While the FBI wouldn't confirm or deny any involvement in the probe, sources with knowledge of the campaign and the investigation told the Star Tribune that the FBI had made inquiries about former Bachmann chief of staff Andy Parrish, as well as other former staffers.

News that Bachmann's campaign had drawn an ethics investigation first broke in March, and the extent of alleged violations has only expanded since then. Newer claims include allegations of secret payments to campaign aide and Iowa state Sen. Kent Sorenson (R), as well as improper use of Bachmann's leadership PAC funds to pay a political director for the campaign.
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Bring that cunt down.
 
C

Chichikov

Member
Gotchaye said:
That's not what the article is saying. It's not concerned with where the money financing student loans is coming from. It's saying that when the CBO talks about the profitability of student loans it's not actually considering the real rate of default (rates of partial default) - it assumes that the rate of default on student loans is the same as the rate of default implied by the interest rate of Treasuries, which is crazy. The point of talking about market rates is to say that student loans are probably only going to be profitable at something like those rates*. I don't think the article is advocating for market-based student loans at all.

*It's important to note that we're talking about first-order profitability here: Is the government making more back on student loans than it's paying out? When we're talking about the government, obviously it can run a program at a first-order loss while still making money through secondary effects (more economic growth in general, higher taxes from the beneficiary of the loan, etc). It can also be the case that student loans are good to have even if they don't pay for themselves, even indirectly (the article notes this). We spend on lots of things that don't pay for themselves but which are worth the money.
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That's what I got from this sentence (and similar ones in the original article) -
But just about all these plans have one feature in common: they set the interest rate on student loans below the market rate. And because they’re below the market rate, that costs the federal government money.
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I guess I can interpret that as saying that the government lose money because it could've made more profit, but that's an even weirder way to look at things.

The point on default rate is so fucking nebulous I'm not sure how to respond to it.
He need to decide if he's talking about individual loans or about the program as a whole, but even if he talks about the latter, just throwing 4-5% default rate mean fucking nothing.

Again, the main point is that the government makes money on a non-defaulted student loan, now you can argue that non-defaulted student loans need to pay for the defaulted one, but I think it's bullshit, there are more worthy people to get that money from.
 
CHEEZMO™

CHEEZMO™

Obsidian fan
Wilsongt said:
Yes.... Beuno.

Michele Bachmann Presidential Campaign Investigation Joined By FBI



Bring that cunt down.
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4Z6Afm5.png
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
Oh for fuck sakes.

Obama administration spied on Fox News reporter James Rosen: Report

The Justice Department spied extensively on Fox News reporter James Rosen in 2010, collecting his telephone records, tracking his movements in and out of the State Department and seizing two days of Rosen’s personal emails, the Washington Post reported on Monday.

In a chilling move sure to rile defenders of civil liberties, an FBI agent also accused Rosen of breaking anti-espionage law with behavior that—as described in the agent's own affidavit—falls well inside the bounds of traditional news reporting. (Disclosure: This reporter counts Rosen among his friends.)

The revelations surfaced with President Barack Obama’s administration already under fire for seizing two months of telephone records of reporters and editors at the Associated Press. Obama last week said he makes “no apologies” for investigations into national security-related leaks. The AP's CEO, Gray Pruitt, said Sunday that the seizure was "unconstitutional."
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BenghaziGate, IRSGate, APGate, UmbrellaGate, now SpyGate?
 
S

speculawyer

Member
G

GaimeGuy

Volunteer Deputy Campaign Director, Obama for America '16
Wilsongt said:
Oh for fuck sakes.

Obama administration spied on Fox News reporter James Rosen: Report



BenghaziGate, IRSGate, APGate, UmbrellaGate, now SpyGate?
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lol @ spying

The Washington Post article said:
When the Justice Department began investigating possible leaks of classified information about North Korea in 2009, investigators did more than obtain telephone records of a working journalist suspected of receiving the secret material.

They used security badge access records to track the reporter’s comings and goings from the State Department, according to a newly obtained court affidavit. They traced the timing of his calls with a State Department security adviser suspected of sharing the classified report. They obtained a search warrant for the reporter’s personal e-mails.
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What the hell is the problem?
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Fenderputty said:
2014 would see Dem's take the house. PD said nu uhh.
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I can take the reins!

We'll start with this one

TPM said:
Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-MN) could be in for an extremely tight re-election contest next year if a poll released Monday is any indication.

The latest survey from Democratic-leaning Public Policy Polling showed Democratic hotel magnate Jim Graves edging Bachmann among voters in Minnesota' Sixth Congressional District 47 percent to 45 percent. Graves announced recently that he will challenge Bachmann once again next year after falling to the tea party champion in a close race last year.

Facing a campaign finance investigation, Bachmann has been pegged as one of the leading Democratic targets in 2014. The poll, which was reported on by Politico, was conducted May 15 using automated phone interviews with 500 voters. It has a margin of error of 4.4 percentage points.
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T

The Librarian

Banned
Thanks for the posts about student loans, guys. I'm glad I don't have to worry about them.
Cyan said:
No idea if it's illegal or not, but it's certainly creepy as hell.
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The WaPo article says they obtained a search warrant, but I guess by "illegal" you meant "unconstitutional"?
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Jooney said:
Honestly why would you want to? It was already a tough ask. Now add all these scandals and you're likely to see accelerated GOP turnout / depressed DEM turnout.
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Someone has to. Besides, PD was dead wrong last year (his three big predictions - Romney victory, Scott Brown victory, Todd Akin victory - were all busts) and I was right. Let's see if that holds.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Guys, I has question.

From what I understood of the Iran-Contra thing, Reagan sold Iran weapons so that he could fund the Contras. But apparently there were hostages involved as well?
 
C

Chichikov

Member
Oblivion said:
Guys, I has question.

From what I understood of the Iran-Contra thing, Reagan sold Iran weapons so that he could fund the Contras. But apparently there were hostages involved as well?
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The US sold weapon to Iran in order to free the hostages and "aid moderates", the hostages were not freed and moderates were not aided (the CIA got duped once again) but the money from that sale went to a CIA black account.
Later, because congress explicitly prohibited funding the Contra, that money was used to piss all over the constitution.
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Chichikov said:
The US sold weapon to Iran in order to free the hostages and "aid moderates", the hostages were not freed and moderates were not aided (the CIA got duped once again) but the money from that sale went to a CIA black account.
Later, because congress explicitly prohibited funding the Contra, that money was used to piss all over the constition.
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That is just astounding. It's bad enough that Reagan sold weapons to terrorists, but also dared to NEGOTIATE with them?! Isn't that a particularly egregious wingnut violation?

I know, I know. Reagan did a billion things that would otherwise piss off the teabagger set, but in most cases (tax hikes, amnesty, etc.) they could provide plausible deniability by blaming it on the Dems. But with this? Hell, the Dems were the ones AGAINST it.
 
T

TacticalFox88

Banned
Pete Santiili said:
I want to shoot Hillary Clinton right in the vagina and I don't want her to die right away. Barack Obama needs to be shot and anyone who has a problem with that is an enemy of the state
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From a rising right-wing conservative internet host.

Just fucking wow. So they're dropping all the pretenses, huh?
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Oblivion said:
That is just astounding. It's bad enough that Reagan sold weapons to terrorists, but also dared to NEGOTIATE with them?! Isn't that a particularly egregious wingnut violation?
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As I said . . . they have an amazing ability to forget. Well, at least forget the selling weapons to Iran and negotiating with terrorists part. The funding of the war in Nicaragua was viewed by many on the right as the good patriot Ronnie fighting the good fight against those commies despite the Dems attempts to not have such a proxy war.

The death squads that we supported in El Salvador, Nicaragua, and Guatemala are legendary in their brutality and human rights abuses.
 
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