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PoliGAF 2016 |OT5| Archdemon Hillary Clinton vs. Lice Traffic Jam

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S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
Retromelon said:
1. If someone's made their mind up against hillary on the internet, they will probably not be swayed no matter the facts and it will be throwing money into the trash.
2. It isnt good optics for a politician within the framework of a democracy to have on their side a paid online defense force, especially when they're battling the perception (whether false or not) of being the establishment candidate in the pocket of wall street
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People were convinced by online information to be against Hillary. How many people are really that committed against her? Most people just go with the flow.
 
E

East Lake

Member
It doesn't bother me that much because it seems more or less like a commercial in disguise, but for example if Jeb! had an online army of trolls correcting the record on the Iraq war, would that be different?
 
N

NihonTiger90

Member
itschris said:
pmSzosJ.jpg


If you count by square miles, Bernie won New York!
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Ah, how I knew they'd go here:

Bernie won more counties! That means he REALLY won New York state!

Technically, yes, you're right on the first part; he did win more counties. Unfortunately, the counties he lost were home to five of the six most populous cities in the state of New York that make up approximately 50-55% of the state's population.

So yeah, you lost Wall Street. And Long Island. And most of the major metropolitan areas upstate that still have a ton of blue-collar jobs and college kids.

He lost by less than Obama did in 2008! And he has more delegates than Obama did after New York in 2008! He can still come back and win easily!

Again, both answers technically correct. However, there's the problem of leaving out the facts that a.) New York's 2008 primary was on Super Tuesday, in February, and there were 27 elections held afterward compared to the 18 remaining in 2016, meaning fewer delegates had been awarded by that point; and b.) OBAMA WAS LEADING AFTER SUPER TUESDAY, NOT DOWN 200 DELEGATES. He ultimately took the lead and never looked back, even when Hillary had a good run toward the end of the campaign. Bernie's path is much more difficult if he wants the pledged delegate lead by June and requires him to essentially deny Clinton any further wins while crushing her in most of the remaining states.

But hey, I know I'm preaching to the choir here.
 
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
royalan said:
Honest question: can somebody explain to me why Correct the Record spending money to engage with Hillary detractors online is such a bad idea?
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Is this a serious question? Having paid people defend you online is a bad look, especially from a super PAC, for a candidate who isn't really generating much excitement online. There are all types of jokes and Orwellian comparisons to be made here. It's just laughable...but I don't really think it matters. The shit is already baked into the cake at this point.

Thank god the Republican Party decided to commit suicide or else I'd be sweating.
 
E

East Lake

Member
ivysaur12 said:
We really need to get rid of David Brock. Not like, kill him. But like, maybe he goes to Mars.
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Some people even want to go to Mars long term, but I've done the science and I'm pretty sure that after whatever gmo's you have to eat and the low gravity you come back looking like gumby.
 
R

royalan

Member
Cesare Borgia said:
Is this a serious question? Having paid people defend you online is a bad look, especially from a super PAC, for a candidate who isn't really generating much excitement online. There are all types of jokes and Orwellian comparisons to be made here. It's just laughable...but I don't really think it matters. The shit is already baked into the cake at this point.

Thank god the Republican Party decided to commit suicide.
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Yes, it's a serious question. lol

I find it hard to see this as a bad idea simply because Hillary is such a unique case. This woman has almost 30 years of false smears working against her. She has been the focal point of GOP attack for far longer than almost any other Democrat in recent memory. And those attacks have had an effect. Just look at hotsauce-gate, people are so primed to think that Hillary is just so intrinsically dishonest, than even when it came out that Hillary actually DOES carry hotsauce on her, people were still looking for still looking for reasons to view it as some form of dishonest pandering. That's how effective the GOP's long-game of smearing Hillary Clinton has been.

I mean, I guess I can see why it would be viewed as a bad idea, but I can't blame Hillary's camp for wanting to address the insane amount of misinformation that exists online. I guess we'll just have to see what form this takes.
 
A

ampere

Member
backslashbunny said:
Yep. Like I said before, part of the reason why we can't just "simplify" taxes is because business IS becoming more and more complex as the entire world grows.

Someone in this thread was like "oh yeah we should totally simplify the tax code, look at what these experts say," and then posted webpage about getting get of a few personal deductions that aren't even that complicated itself. It was a pretty /faceplant moment for me, because that won't "simplify" the tax code anything like where the actual complexities are. MOST people's tax returns are really simple, which is why people that actually study taxation don't care about the tax returns of 80% of Americans. The people at H&R Block need a 12 hour tax course and they're good to go for most returns. Personal taxes aren't that complicated for most people.

It's complicated BECAUSE it attempts to be simple in a system where it can't be simple.

I hate your finger on your hand.

I hate your ring finger on your dominant hand. (What if you have 6 fingers?) I hate the 4th from the right finger in the hand on your dominant hand. (What if you have 3 fingers?) I hate your 1st finger on your dominant hand. (What if you have 5 fingers but one is only 1/3rd of a finger?) I hate the 4th from the right 1/3rd of the finger on your dominant hand. (What if the finger was actually someone else's finger that you received in a transplant?) I hate the 4th from the right finger that you received on a transplant on June 10th, 2022, on your dominant hand. Or rather, I hate the 4th from the right finger that you will probably receive on a transplant on June 10th, 2022, on your dominant hand, unless you don't get the transplant, and in that case I'll hate the 3rd from the right finger on your dominant hand providing it exists.

By the way, what's a dominant hand?
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I enjoy your posts on taxation. It's quite true, my returns (unmarried, no kids, no house, some retirement investments) are incredibly simple. There's not much they could do to simplify my return without maybe assuming everything was the same from the year before, which Turbotax kinda already does.

The finger analogy is amusing. It seems like tax code is much like security software for say, purchasing things online. You could make it extremely simple like, enter CC and address, press buy, no encryption, but that'd get exploited to hell. So you add little rules and protections for exceptions and security loopholes and wow all of a sudden the sum total of the code is quite complicated.
 
J

johnsmith

remember me
Sanders allies plot meeting to discuss future of the movement | MSNBC - www.msnbc.com
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/sanders-allies-plot-meeting-discuss-future-the-movement

Key allies of Bernie Sanders are planning to meet in Chicago after the final votes have been cast in the Democratic presidential primary to plot the future of the movement galvanized by Sanders’ presidential campaign.

Sanders’ loss in New York’s primary this week has put the Democratic nomination almost certainly out of reach, leading many to wonder what will become of the millions of people who donated, volunteered, and supported his campaign, including many who seem unready to settle for likely nominee Hillary Clinton.

The two-day People’s Summit is timed for mid-June in order to fall between the final set of primaries in California and elsewhere on June 7, and the Democratic National Convention in late July. It aims to continue building the “political revolution” Sanders often invokes and to develop a “People’s Platform” of issues important to the movement.
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Ugh, I really hope they focus their efforts on taking seats from Republicans and not primarying sitting Democrats.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
C

Cesare Borgia

Banned
royalan said:
Yes, it's a serious question. lol

I find it hard to see this as a bad idea simply because Hillary is such a unique case. This woman has almost 30 years of false smears working against her. She has been the focal point of GOP attack for far longer than almost any other Democrat in recent memory. And those attacks have had an effect. Just look at hotsauce-gate, people are so primed to think that Hillary is just so intrinsically dishonest, than even when it came out that Hillary actually DOES carry hotsauce on her, people were still looking for still looking for reasons to view it as some form of dishonest pandering. That's how effective the GOP's long-game of smearing Hillary Clinton has been.

I mean, I guess I can see why it would be viewed as a bad idea, but I can't blame Hillary's camp for wanting to address the insane amount of misinformation that exists online. I guess we'll just have to see what form this takes.
Click to expand...

All true. But doesn't it also reinforce views about her authenticity when a multi million dollar super PAC is paying people to defend her online? A lot of people simply don't believe she is trustworthy and you could argue stuff like this is part of the reason why.

I'd also argue she does herself no favors by being on multiple sides of multiple issues at various points in time depending on the political climate of the times. It's rather easy for people to look things like that up today on YouTube or elsewhere, which will make this truth taskforce's job harder.

Grand scheme wise it doesn't matter. I just feel like it's not the story I'd want my candidate named in if I was trying to convince people my candidate is trustworthy, authentic, just like you/me, etc.
 
B

brainchild

Banned
Retromelon said:
1. If someone's made their mind up against hillary on the internet, they will probably not be swayed no matter the facts and it will be throwing money into the trash.
2. It isnt good optics for a politician within the framework of a democracy to have on their side a paid online defense force, especially when they're battling the perception (whether false or not) of being the establishment candidate in the pocket of wall street
Click to expand...

'sup, retro
 
T

Thequietone

Member
royalan said:
Bernie will likely win San Francisco and the surrounding counties.

It's Southern California where he'll get stomped.
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I feel the AA and Latino populations is more centered around Oakland. San Fran you might be right. Then again even though I live here I am no expert on population.
 
H

Holmes

Member
royalan said:
Bernie will likely win San Francisco and the surrounding counties.

It's Southern California where he'll get stomped.
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Clinton will have some areas of strength in the Bay Area though. She should win Oakland but will get shut out in Berkley. She'll win Solano, Napa and probably Yolo, as well as San Mateo and probably San Joaquin (which is borderline Bay Area). She won't be as weak in Santa Clara (San Jose) as some people think - a lot of the whites there are affluent and the lower income there are mostly latino and African-American. Asians might actually be his best demographic in San Jose.
 
A

ampere

Member
HUELEN10 said:
Yeah, I can see Southern Cali not being too Bernie friendly. He is getting less likely to win the dam nom, isn't he?
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Do you follow the primary race at all? Bernie has been effectively "not able to catch up" since the results on Super Tuesday, March 1st. Anyone who has been saying "he's still in it!" after that day is delusional.
 
R

royalan

Member
Thequietone said:
I feel the AA and Latino populations is more centered around Oakland. San Fran you might be right. Then again even though I live here I am no expert on population.
Click to expand...

There is a high concentration of AAs and Latinos in and around Oakland, so she'll likely take that too. But the highest concentration of the two groups in the state is still Southern Cali, mostly LA and the surrounding counties.

Of course, I'm basing my prediction of Hillary's performance on 2008. If Obama couldn't take the Southland from Hillary, I really don't see Bernie doing it.

Frankly, I have a hard time seeing it even be close.

Holmes said:
Clinton will have some areas of strength in the Bay Area though. She should win Oakland but will get shut out in Berkley. She'll win Solano, Napa and probably Yolo, as well as San Mateo and probably San Joaquin (which is borderline Bay Area). She won't be as weak in Santa Clara (San Jose) as some people think - a lot of the whites there are affluent and the lower income there are mostly latino and African-American. Asians might actually be his best demographic in San Jose.
Click to expand...

I agree with all this.

Do you think Bernie has a chance to do better in Cali than Obama did?
 
C

CCS

Banned
I think if Bernie stays in and doesn't wind down until Cali, he'll probably do better than Obama did. I don't expect him to win, and he's certainly not going to win by enough to change things, but given how all in his campaign is going on the California or bust strategy I'd expect him to do reasonably well there. Of course that will cost him in terms of less attention being given to other states.
 
F

FyreWulff

Member
ciaossu said:
I enjoy your posts on taxation. It's quite true, my returns (unmarried, no kids, no house, some retirement investments) are incredibly simple. There's not much they could do to simplify my return without maybe assuming everything was the same from the year before, which Turbotax kinda already does.

The finger analogy is amusing. It seems like tax code is much like security software for say, purchasing things online. You could make it extremely simple like, enter CC and address, press buy, no encryption, but that'd get exploited to hell. So you add little rules and protections for exceptions and security loopholes and wow all of a sudden the sum total of the code is quite complicated.
Click to expand...

yep. you have to deal with all the jerks that do the "but i'm not touching you" while their finger is an half an inch away from your face.


govt: "alright, we're gonna give a tax credit for farmers. let's make it so you get it for farming."

rich guy mcfuck: "okay, I planted some tomatoes and bought like 3 chickens. My property is now a farm. gimme money."

govt: "okay. that's not what we meant. farming. as in you help society, not yourself. let's make it so you have to have 80% of the land tilled and a minimum of 50 chickens"

rich guy mcfuck: "but my tomatoes!"
 
T

thezerofire

Banned
Holmes said:
Clinton will have some areas of strength in the Bay Area though. She should win Oakland but will get shut out in Berkley. She'll win Solano, Napa and probably Yolo, as well as San Mateo and probably San Joaquin (which is borderline Bay Area). She won't be as weak in Santa Clara (San Jose) as some people think - a lot of the whites there are affluent and the lower income there are mostly latino and African-American. Asians might actually be his best demographic in San Jose.
Click to expand...
this seems basically right to me. I live in Oakland
 
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