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PoliGAF 2017 |OT2| Well, maybe McMaster isn't a traitor.
- Thread starter ItWasMeantToBe19
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Officerrob
Banned
It's gonna happen.
nintendoman58
Member
Why are people so convinced of this right now?
And don't give me the "Republicans always fall in line" or "Bad things always happen" excuse.
I'm seeing a back and forth here. It can go either way. Stop acting like you know the damn future when you don't.
Seems like they found common ground w the HFC and are rewriting it. So it seems like yes.
You're right. But at the same time, there's been a noticeable change in tone from the HFC tonight as Ryan scrambles to change the bill to get their votes.
shinra-bansho
Member
If they could actually hold them to this it would make sense. But lol. Not gonna happen.
Scalia's seat does not actually matter. It's Ginsberg's. Or Kennedy's.
Scalia's seat does not actually matter. It's Ginsberg's. Or Kennedy's.
nintendoman58
Member
So there's a last-minute change going on? Do you guys even know what the changes to this thing are?
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
Good fucking Lord. If the stakes weren't so high this would be high comedy
They probably don't even know.
Officerrob
Banned
http://www.vox.com/2017/3/22/150302...s-freedom-caucus-cbo-byrd-rule-reconciliation
Removing Essential Health Benefits (EHB).
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
I think it will, but I guess this will be a good chance on to see who's better keyed into republican politics.
EDIT: wait, what is "this"? I assume you mean republican vote for ACHA.
In the short term I guess, but every seat matters when we're talking about decades long positions, and I'm not convinced giving up on gorsuch gives any leverage at all for Ginsberg or Kennedy fights.
And a 4-4 court is better than a 5-4 court as long as we can keep it.
I'm happy to know that the FBI has been investing this since July, at least they aren't idiots. Any layman paying attention to Trump and his campaign since at least Spring 2016 could see some weird shit going down with Russia. The only question now is what do they have and will it be enough to bring charges.
BoogieWoogie
Banned
Holy shit, so many people would die.
VendettaRed07
Member
Was all just a show so they could get what they want. Don't expect moderate GOP members to oppose it regardless of what the freedom caucus changes. Or not enough at least.
Vestal
Junior Member
Its a very difficult situation to manage. Personally while I understand the uproar against such a compromise from the Ds, I am on the fence regarding the strategy. Optics are hazy, but we are not in the room. End of the day if they have guarantees(they can trust) regarding future appointees it might be worth it. Lets be honest, RBG is an amazing jurist but she is getting up there in age. Its not like she is in her 60s, she is in her 80s. This is a situation that something like what occurred in The West Wing would be a perfect fit. You get one and we get one.
Fuck republicans
We've seen this time and again. I'm not expecting the Senate to actually be any different on this. I expect one or two senators to vote against this to claim they are independent and for everyone else to fall in line.
(Is Pence allowed to break a tie on reconciliation? If so, that would say how many senators could claim "independence" on this.)
ugaboga232
Member
Oh yay the amazing plan to let patients figure out what their risks are and what they really should have covered. Can't wait to see lots of people write off mental health care (which is a big source of cost) and then have even worse problems when they inevitably present. I wonder who knows enough about medicine and risk to tell a patient what they should be covered about? Maybe we should standardize the process and have them be licensed after a rigorous graduate education program.
They should also have to do PhD's. But seriously this is just an absolute stupid idea that completely misses the point of insurance and what it means to be a patient
They are absolute evil. Nothing will ever convince me otherwise. Those people are the worst scum in the world right up there with isis. Both get gratification at seeing people suffer.
Officerrob
Banned
Let me ask you a question, why wasn't it going to pass?
Is it supposed to be surprising Republicans shit on their base to give millionaires tax breaks?
Did people honestly think moderates and HFC members were never going to agree on enough to pass a bill? Why? Did you seriously think they were going to hang Trump out to dry? Seriously?
Did Dems seriously put their faith in the fucking HFC to not compromise?
Did people not realize Trump doesn't give a fuck about what's actually in the bill?
Are we pretending like the Republicans were ever going to care what the CBO score was?
When you have all the power and have no moral compass, bet on those people to get bad shit done.
If the Dems are going to pull that West Wing gambit for RGB's seat they need to go further left than Garland. Garland is fine to replace Kennedy, but not Ginsburg.
No one knows. Earlier today we were all certain it was DOA. Now it seems to be 50/50.
Senate has been quiet too. No Cruz or Cottons to say the bill won't pass.
Boy was THAT a source of embarrassment last week.
Just wait until the CBO report comes out. THAT will show Republicans!
I just...
I think people really believed the negative press, and the negative public reaction, were actually going to stop the GOP from blowing up America's healthcare system.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
The leader of the moderate republican wing literally just announced he won't vote for the bill. I get that the election traumatized liberals but just saying "every bad thing will happen now" doesn't make it so. This is a complex issue, republicans are not a monolithic block. If you don't believe the bill will pass you need a better explanation than "because."
VendettaRed07
Member
The alternative of not allowing it to pass is just letting the ACA stay.
Why would any republican want that to happen. The freedom caucus will end up supporting it same way Bernie sanders voted for the gutted version of the ACA
Why would any republican want that to happen. The freedom caucus will end up supporting it same way Bernie sanders voted for the gutted version of the ACA
nintendoman58
Member
Well, on the off chance that it does pass the house it's only going to get even more negative.
The thing is, people need to keep believing in this kind of anger and negative press and continue making sure their voices are heard. Be it at town halls, in calls to congressman, or otherwise.
Because they don't have any better idea.
They can give the ultra wealthy another tax cut!
Passing the AHCA is political suicide.
Not "repealing and replacing" Obamacare after running on it for eight years is political suicide.
I certainly think the GOP can win the Trump coalition in 2018 if they don't repeal/replace Obamacare and/or pass the AHCA, but I don't know if the GOP believes that.
Not "repealing and replacing" Obamacare after running on it for eight years is political suicide.
I certainly think the GOP can win the Trump coalition in 2018 if they don't repeal/replace Obamacare and/or pass the AHCA, but I don't know if the GOP believes that.
"Show me on the doll where the 2016 Election touched you."
VendettaRed07
Member
Neither do I.
Another thing that hasn't really gotten much coverage is how very few of the Clinton GOP reps have turned on the bill. They're true Reaganite believers in suburban, college educated white districts. Very different from Trump coalition who will be devastated by AHCA.
I guess they're a) true believers and happy to go down with the ship, and b) betting that, absent Trump, they're still closer to conservativism than progressivism?
There are no guarantees with the GOP.
If the Democrats want to play with Lucy and the football yet again, I'm done and will work to primary every one of them.
They don't fucking get it.
neurosisxeno
Member
Also known as how to follow through on your promises and get completely stomped in the preceding midterm election. If the AHCA passes the House and Senate in that state, by 2018 I can't imagine a single Republican will have an easy win. It literally will be a "Health Care Bill" that targets every demographic except healthy people who make millions each year. Something like 97% of Americans will be completely thrown on the streets and healthcare prices will rise even faster for most people than they did before.
The silver lining is that if Democrats clean house in 2018 and then in 2020 maybe we get Single Payer through.
Fenderputty
Banned
The ones that don't will just lose their homes!
ugaboga232
Member
Even worse, you make people under 26 possibly lose mental healthcare in their most sensitive and formative years because of their parents heal insurance choices (which may not/shouldn't really be thought of as malicious! it's not the patients job to know medicine well enough to make informed decisions on exactly what to pay for). And given the increasing rates of mental health concerns in the youngest generation (blame reality, modernity, technology, and biology for that) this could be a really bad thing.
I'm not just saying that because this is what I want to research and treat
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
Most of them are still probably pretty safe absent a wave election. Price still got elected with 60% of the vote even while his district massively shifted at the presidential level. If Ossoff can win the special election they might have a different tune but for now I think they probably should be confident.
Lord_Byron28
Member
Obama must be feeling pretty good right about now. He knew that Republicans would never be able to agree on an actual repeal or replacement plan. I'm starting to have this slight optimistic feeling that 2017 will be a wakeup call to conservatives/moderates and deliver a giant slap in the face to Trump and Republicans.
However, who knows how much damage Trump.and Republicans will cause before they get voted out or impeached.
However, who knows how much damage Trump.and Republicans will cause before they get voted out or impeached.
Incumbency is powerful, especially in the House, but if 2016 was really a realigning election, some of them are bound to start losing their seats.
Plus, everything about Trump's approval ratings and the ACHA does scream wave election. Probably 2006-style wave, but hey, that'll be enough. Same map, too.
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