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PoliGAF 2017 |OT4| The leaks are coming from inside the white house

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N

neurosisxeno

Member
I honestly hope the Republicans pass their entire agenda; crash the economy, steal peoples healthcare, and start ripping rights away. Maybe then these backwards inbred pieces of shit will realize being Pro-Life shouldn't be enough to secure a vote for a politician that will literally wreck your entire world in the name of personal gain.
 
R

royalan

Member
Y2Kev said:
I think it's tough to say he didn't campaign well, Royalan.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying that. From what I know, he is running a top notch campaign. But I also thought the same thing about the Clinton campaign. A well-run campaign is not without its flaws.

I noted this in this thread during the debate. When Ossoff was standing there calm and placid, while Handel was throwing everything she could think to throw. Sloppy? Maybe. Personally invested? Undeniable. And my problem with this wasn't that particular debate in itself, it was in knowing that at the point, Ossoff was being guided by the Democratic elite, and hoping to hell that this wasn't a clue into the Democratic strategy nationally moving forward.

My big fear is that the ultimate lesson Democratic leadership is taking from 2016 is that we didn't talk about policies enough. That may be true to some extent, but there was also a visible lack of pathos in our campaigning. I don't see that being addressed, and I think going forward that is going to make a big difference in turnout.
 
S

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
At this point it's fair to say that the problem isn't candidates, it's voters and systems. We vote for these fucks with these systems. Both halves are letting down logic. We always get one appalling candidate and one that's never good enough.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
royalan said:
I noted this in this thread during the debate. When Ossoff was standing there calm and placid, while Handel was throwing everything she could think to throw. Sloppy? Maybe. Personally invested? Undeniable. And my problem with this wasn't that particular debate in itself, it was in knowing that at the point, Ossoff was being guided by the Democratic elite, and hoping to hell that this wasn't a clue into the Democratic strategy nationally moving forward.

My big fear is that the ultimate lesson Democratic leadership is taking from 2016 is that we didn't talk about policies enough. That may be true to some extent, but there was also a visible lack of pathos in our campaigning. I don't see that being addressed, and I think going forward that is going to make a big difference in turnout.
Click to expand...

Yep. That was my complaint, too. He just seemed...there. Calm and collected, but it came off as if he was above it all. It was the epitome of the "elitist" moniker republicans use.
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
neurosisxeno said:
I honestly hope the Republicans pass their entire agenda; crash the economy, steal peoples healthcare, and start ripping rights away. Maybe then these backwards inbred pieces of shit will realize being Pro-Life shouldn't be enough to secure a vote for a politician that will literally wreck your entire world in the name of personal gain.
Click to expand...

So the Kansas situation is going to be very instructive here. Because it seems like Brownback has discovered the limit. He's found out how far you can cut before people actually get sick of your bullshit

But

But

Is their response to that going to be a (more) progressive backlash that reinvests properly? Or has discovery of that limit also meant discovery of just how far you can go before hitting the limit? Are people happy to return to "slightly better than Brownback"?
 
P

Poodlestrike

Banned
Stinkles said:
At this point it's fair to say that the problem isn't candidates, it's voters and systems. We vote for these fucks with these systems. Both halves are letting down logic. We always get one appalling candidate and one that's never good enough.
Click to expand...

I'mma take issue with the phrasing on that last bit there. We get one appalling candidate and one candidate who ranges from "uninspiring" to "fantastic" and regardless of quality around 40% of the population never votes anyway.

There is a real systematic personal failure in this country that has little to do with systems and parties. Republicans wreck the country and in response people don't vote them out, they just stop voting.
 
S

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
Poodlestrike said:
I'mma take issue with the phrasing on that last bit there. We get one appalling candidate and one candidate who ranges from "uninspiring" to "fantastic" and regardless of quality around 40% of the population never votes anyway.

There is a real systematic personal failure in this country that has little to do with systems and parties. Republicans wreck the country and in response people don't vote them out, they just stop voting.
Click to expand...



That's exactly why I phrased it that way. they're never saintly nor perfect enough, even as the opponent is literally a sexual assaulter, racist and criminal.

Secure Online voting would solve it overnight.
 
G

Grexeno

Member
Stinkles said:
That's exactly why I phrased it that way. they're never saintly nor perfect enough, even as the opponent is literally a sexual assaulter, racist and criminal.

Secure Online voting would solve it overnight.
Click to expand...
Secure Online voting just cannot exist. An online election is the holy grail for cyberattacks.
 
T

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Not that we shouldn't be running good inspiring candidates but yes also we need to figure out how to get turnout up without running good inspiring candidates because Obamas are a limited resource
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
neurosisxeno said:
I honestly hope the Republicans pass their entire agenda; crash the economy, steal peoples healthcare, and start ripping rights away. Maybe then these backwards inbred pieces of shit will realize being Pro-Life shouldn't be enough to secure a vote for a politician that will literally wreck your entire world in the name of personal gain.
Click to expand...

I've lived in rural areas where people like this are the majority. Let me be the first to tell you that it won't change their vote in the least. They will still vote GOP because the right-wing media told them to.
 
D

daedalius

Member
The Technomancer said:
So the Kansas situation is going to be very instructive here. Because it seems like Brownback has discovered the limit. He's found out how far you can cut before people actually get sick of your bullshit

But

But

Is their response to that going to be a (more) progressive backlash that reinvests properly? Or has discovery of that limit also meant discovery of just how far you can go before hitting the limit? Are people happy to return to "slightly better than Brownback"?
Click to expand...

This is basically what the new republican moderates are.

They'll actually fund things like school, but I wouldn't expect a whole lot more out of them.
 
C

CygnusXS

will gain confidence one day
neurosisxeno said:
I honestly hope the Republicans pass their entire agenda; crash the economy, steal peoples healthcare, and start ripping rights away. Maybe then these backwards inbred pieces of shit will realize being Pro-Life shouldn't be enough to secure a vote for a politician that will literally wreck your entire world in the name of personal gain.
Click to expand...

OTOH, it could be that increased desperation makes that demographic even more pliable. You may find that they end up supporting power in exchange for employment and privilege in the ever-growing security state.
 
Z

Zolo

Member
Plinko said:
I've lived in rural areas where people like this are the majority. Let me be the first to tell you that it won't change their vote in the least. They will still vote GOP because the right-wing media told them to.
Click to expand...

Yep. There'll always be an excuse given by Right-wing Fox News & radio as to why they should vote Republican that they'll use no matter what happens.
 
A

Autodidact

Banned
Ten years ago we had some smart Republicans who saw the Ohio race as a portent of their coming losses. If they hadn't died, retired, or been booted by Tea Party loons, they'd be sounding alarms over GA and especially SC, which nobody expected to be close. This current bunch seems ill-equipped to see the implications of the results.
 
C

Carpe Libertatem

Member
Autodidact said:
Ten years ago we had some smart Republicans who saw the Ohio race as a portent of their coming losses. If they hadn't died, retired, or been booted by Tea Party loons, they'd be sounding alarms over GA and especially SC, which nobody expected to be close. This current bunch seems ill-equipped to see the implications of the results.
Click to expand...

I dunno, even Newt Gingrich sounded the alarms in 2005
 
JetBlackPanda

JetBlackPanda

Member
neurosisxeno said:
I honestly hope the Republicans pass their entire agenda; crash the economy, steal peoples healthcare, and start ripping rights away. Maybe then these backwards inbred pieces of shit will realize being Pro-Life shouldn't be enough to secure a vote for a politician that will literally wreck your entire world in the name of personal gain.
Click to expand...

Yeah no sorry. I live in a rural town in Utah and people don't give a fuck and will chock it up to a bad candidate but will vote R for life. Young old it makes no difference the GOP is right and liberals are evil.

It's that simple to them.
 
N

Necrovex

Member
We may lose GA-6, but the SC-5 results excites me to no end. All the coverage surrounding GA-6 seems to have backfired on Ossof while the non-existent coverage of SC-5 was a boon for Parnell closing the margins.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
BoogieWoogie said:
I'm going to keep on fighting but Jesus I'm tired.
Click to expand...

The biggest fight is coming next week and it has nothing to do with an election. This is a really poor time to get tired, right before 10 million people lose healthcare instantly, and a dozen million more lose it over the next few years

Necrovex said:
We may lose GA-6, but the SC-5 results excites me to no end. All the coverage surrounding GA-6 seems to have backfired on Ossof while the non-existent coverage of SC-5 was a boon for Parnell closing the margins.
Click to expand...

Yea, it's too bad the SC result won't get any attention. It's arguably the worst result in a special election Republicans have had this year.
 
G

gaugebozo

Member
JetBlackPanda said:
Yeah no sorry. I live in a rural town in Utah and people don't give a fuck and will chock it up to a bad candidate but will vote R for life. Young old it makes no difference the GOP is right and liberals are evil.

It's that simple to them.
Click to expand...
My own mother today told me she credits Donald Trump's amazing turnaround of the economy with me getting a job. I got a job in September.
 
R

royalan

Member
JetBlackPanda said:
Yeah no sorry. I live in a rural town in Utah and people don't give a fuck and will chock it up to a bad candidate but will vote R for life. Young old it makes no difference the GOP is right and liberals are evil.

It's that simple to them.
Click to expand...

And this is the ultimate goal of the Southern Strategy.

Have the electorate so dumbed down. Party identification so intrinsic, so necessary to personal identity...that you could literally put up anyone and any policy and get the vote.

And Republicans are nationalizing this strategy, while Democrats are still stuck on stupid and thinking this is about policy.

The culture war isn't "coming". We are in it now.

And black people have been knowing this. We're just angry though...
 
A

Autodidact

Banned
Carpe Libertatem said:
I dunno, even Newt Gingrich sounded the alarms in 2005
Click to expand...

Newt may be a lying, philandering, bigoted, hypocritical sack of shit, but I wouldn't describe him as dumb. He got the Republicans huge majorities in '94, and even though the impeachment fiasco lost them seats, it gave the right-wing base pounds upon pounds of red meat and exacerbated polarization to degrees unseen before then. And as you acknowledge, he correctly warned them about the 2006 midterms.
 
N

neurosisxeno

Member
The Technomancer said:
So the Kansas situation is going to be very instructive here. Because it seems like Brownback has discovered the limit. He's found out how far you can cut before people actually get sick of your bullshit

But

But

Is their response to that going to be a (more) progressive backlash that reinvests properly? Or has discovery of that limit also meant discovery of just how far you can go before hitting the limit? Are people happy to return to "slightly better than Brownback"?
Click to expand...

Plinko said:
I've lived in rural areas where people like this are the majority. Let me be the first to tell you that it won't change their vote in the least. They will still vote GOP because the right-wing media told them to.
Click to expand...

CygnusXS said:
OTOH, it could be that increased desperation makes that demographic even more pliable. You may find that they end up supporting power in exchange for employment and privilege in the ever-growing security state.
Click to expand...

JetBlackPanda said:
Yeah no sorry. I live in a rural town in Utah and people don't give a fuck and will chock it up to a bad candidate but will vote R for life. Young old it makes no difference the GOP is right and liberals are evil.

It's that simple to them.
Click to expand...

Then I say let them burn.
 
B

Blader

Member
dakini said:
Same. I know these tight races are a good sign, but something more would be nice.
Click to expand...

We're in a good spot to win two governors races in November, which are arguably more important and with greater long-term implications (i.e. 2020 census and redistricting) than a couple House seats that will be up again next year.
 
A

Autodidact

Banned
Yeah, Ossoff has definitely built the infrastructure and strategy to run again next near. He strikes me as the type to learn from mistakes, if he made any, and Trump - and Handel, by extension - can only go down from here.
 
C

Carpe Libertatem

Member
Unkl3 J0se said:
How much did trump win this district by? Good sign of the gap has closed since.
Click to expand...

Ossoff is doing worse than Hillary did in this district, although barely.

Autodidact said:
Newt may be a lying, philandering, bigoted, hypocritical sack of shit, but I wouldn't describe him as dumb. He got the Republicans huge majorities in '94, and even though the impeachment fiasco lost them seats, it gave the right-wing base pounds upon pounds of red meat and exacerbated polarization to degrees unseen before then. And as you acknowledge, he correctly warned them about the 2006 midterms.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Newt is smart even if he's a shitty person. I just think there is somebody who will be sounding the warning bells - they just won't do it publicly.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
We're pretty much at the point of no return for Ossoff. Not really enough votes left for him to win.

Also that Politico page was reporting backwards the entire night... Ossoff was the one running behind
 
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