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PoliGAF 2nd Pres. Debate 2008 Thread (DOW dropping, Biden is off to Home Depot)

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Nabs

Nabs

Member
thefro said:
Nah, they just released the URL this morning... I can't find any comments before an hour ago.

And yes, it's a web video, not an ad, zzzzz.
Click to expand...

Just aired it on Fox. (on fox and friends, not a reg. ad)
 
G

gcubed

Member
obama made a scathing but factual ad about me and the keating 5... quick quick, make some shit up about him and Ayers
 
A

AniHawk

Member
gcubed said:
obama made a scathing but factual ad about me and the keating 5... quick quick, make some shit up about him and Ayers
Click to expand...

Actually, Keating 5 was posted as a response to Ayers, before McCain could officially bring Ayers up.
 
A

AniHawk

Member
Haunted said:
I commented several pages back on this already, but again, in short: I blame both the Cold War and the Republicans for this. It's quite irritating to see it flung around as an insult or smear, to be honest.
Click to expand...

Hell, Republicans got away with turning "liberal" into a fucking swear word while they plunged the country into shit.
 
M

mAcOdIn

Member
Don't tell me that deep down that you honestly do not want the upper class bled dry to prop up the lower and middle class.

I want to know how giving the people the illusion of power and then redistributing what they earn is any different than just dictating what they earn in the first place.

Democrats want to make it to where you can not fail in life. They want to guarantee a standard of living to all citizens. You are essentially wanting to eliminate the lower class by squeezing the upper class just enough that they still make enough at the end to warrant staying in the country, and as long as there is an upper class the now larger working class would have something to look forward to as opposed to true socialism where they had nowhere to go.

That is socialism, a far smarter breed of it, that recognizes that yes people need to be able to think that they can succeed so you keep an upper class around but it's still socialism.


Edit: And I'm not using socialist as a smear, I just wish you'd be upfront about it. Tell me that you don't want what I just described. Tell me that you still want there to be a lower class and a super rich class and I'll shut my mouth.
 
J

jorma

is now taking requests
mAcOdIn said:
Don't tell me that deep down that you honestly do not want the upper class bled dry to prop up the lower and middle class.

I want to know how giving the people the illusion of power and then redistributing what they earn is any different than just dictating what they earn in the first place.

Democrats want to make it to where you can not fail in life. They want to guarantee a standard of living to all citizens. You are essentially wanting to eliminate the lower class by squeezing the upper class just enough that they still make enough at the end to warrant staying in the country, and as long as there is an upper class the now larger working class would have something to look forward to as opposed to true socialism where they had nowhere to go.

That is socialism, a far smarter breed of it, that recognizes that yes people need to be able to think that they can succeed so you keep an upper class around but it's still socialism.


Edit: And I'm not using socialist as a smear, I just wish you'd be upfront about it. Tell me that you don't want what I just described. Tell me that you still want there to be a lower class and a super rich class and I'll shut my mouth.
Click to expand...

Do you really think that everyone in Europe has the same salary after taxes are paid? Europe is essentially a free market, capitalist economic zone with traces of social democracy (buckets full of social democracy if you are neoliberal), and not socialist.
 
L

Leonsito

Member
Haunted said:
I think America is one of the very few educated countries of the world where 'socialist' can even be considered an insult. :lol

I commented several pages back on this already, but again, in short: I blame both the Cold War and the Republicans for this. It's quite irritating to see it flung around as an insult or smear, to be honest.


edit: I also agree with jorma and souldriver, the difference is jarring, really.

Imagine someone using the label 'patriotic' as an insult. I believe most Americans would go "wtf?" :p
Click to expand...

In Spain, being too patriotic is treated like being a fascist :lol
 
S

syllogism

Member
Cheebs said:
Wait the McCain campaign's game changer they told all the media to get ready for today is a web ad? :lol
Click to expand...
They never said that or even that it was a big announcement. That was just Internet being stupid again.
 
M

mAcOdIn

Member
jorma said:
Do you really think that everyone in Europe has the same salary after taxes are paid? Europe is essentially a free market, capitalist economic zone with traces of social democracy (buckets full of social democracy if you are neoliberal), and not socialist.
Click to expand...
No, of course I don't think that.

What I think is that the goal in Europe is to have 2 classes, a large working class and then of course the upper class. Of course everyone's salary is different after taxes, that's why I said that people have to believe that they can move up, and they can of course move up. But what I'm saying is that you want to destroy the huge separation of classes that we have and replace it with classes that are much closer together yet just far enough apart that people still have the drive to look forward yet can't fail and fall behind.
 
J

jorma

is now taking requests
mAcOdIn said:
No, of course I don't think that.

What I think is that the goal in Europe is to have 2 classes, a large working class and then of course the upper class. Of course everyone's salary is different after taxes, that's why I said that people have to believe that they can move up, and they can of course move up. But what I'm saying is that you want to destroy the huge separation of classes that we have and replace it with classes that are much closer together yet just far enough apart that people still have the drive to look forward yet can't fail and fall behind.
Click to expand...

You dont want this? That sounds absolutely peachy to me! It does not have very much to do with the EU and her goals however.
 
M

mAcOdIn

Member
jorma said:
You dont want this? That sounds absolutely peachy to me! It does not have very much to do with the EU and her goals however.
Click to expand...
I would be happy if it came about on it's own, yes, but I don't think it should be forced.

And no, I don't believe it's the goal of the EU, but I do think it's where most of Western Europe is going.
 
K

KRS7

Member
Cheebs said:
Has anyone else noticed that since the campaign started Megan McCain has gained A LOT of weight?
Click to expand...

She should be reminded the same way I am reminded almost every time I visit this thread.

fan2h1.jpg
 
S

SpeedingUptoStop

will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
MThanded said:
This attack will not work. Sorry. I guarantee that. It will get the right wing base energized. They weren't going to vote for obama anyway. It will not take away any supporters.
Click to expand...
This happpens everytime mccain does anything:lol
 
J

Jason's Ultimatum

Member
I hate to say this, but McCain and Palin are basically no different than Hitler when it comes to speaking to a crowd. The two inject even more hatred, fear-mongering, and bigotry to their supporters, thus resulting to the kind of comments we hear about Obama. Makes me sad to be an American.
 
B

Brobzoid

how do I slip unnoticed out of a gloryhole booth?
Cheebs said:
Has anyone else noticed that since the campaign started Megan McCain has gained A LOT of weight?
Click to expand...
you saying there's a bun in that oven too? did you bake it?? :eek:
 
I

iapetus

Scary Euro Man
JayDubya said:
Of course, that is what I was implying by the "'real'" in the first place.

As in, in reality, this is what happens.
Click to expand...

In reality, any of the extreme utopian forms of politics tend to fail horribly. That doesn't mean that the resultant mess is their true form - it's just a sign of their true form being unattainable.
 
D

Desperado

Member
mAcOdIn said:
Democrats want to make it to where you can not fail in life. They want to guarantee a standard of living to all citizens.
Click to expand...
The first sentence is bullshit, and as for the second, take a class on poverty.
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
Haunted said:
I think America is one of the very few educated countries of the world where 'socialist' can even be considered an insult. :lol

I commented several pages back on this already, but again, in short: I blame both the Cold War and the Republicans for this. It's quite irritating to see it flung around as an insult or smear, to be honest.


edit: I also agree with jorma and souldriver, the difference is jarring, really.

Imagine someone using the label 'patriotic' as an insult. I believe most Americans would go "wtf?" :p
Click to expand...

JayDubs thinks "left" is an insult, too. I'm pretty sure he's on a right turn only policy when he's driving (like those UPS drivers during Christmas) :lol
 
D

Desperado

Member
Ayers attack ad said:
But Obama's friendship with terrorist Ayers isn't the issue.
The issue is Barack Obama's judgment and candor.
When Obama just says, "This is a guy who lives in my neighborhood."
Americans say, "Where's the truth, Barack?"
Click to expand...

:lol what the fuck? SURE, the first 90% of the ad didn't imply that his "friendship" with Ayers is the issue. SURE.
 
S

syllogism

Member
artredis1980 said:
BREAKING NEWS: JOb NUmbers OUT


20,000 less jobs

478,000 less jobs

which is better than they expected!

Market may go up because of this
Click to expand...
Actually that's about what they were expecting
 
D

DenogginizerOS

BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
Jason's Ultimatum said:
I hate to say this, but McCain and Palin are basically no different than Hitler when it comes to speaking to a crowd. The two inject even more hatred, fear-mongering, and bigotry to their supporters, thus resulting to the kind of comments we hear about Obama. Makes me sad to be an American.
Click to expand...
I agree. They are doing NOTHING to address people saying things like "kill him" or "off with his head" or "terrorist" when they ramp up their attacks. I seriously am concerned that one of these rallies may yield a mob that is motivated and desperate enough to try something.

In addition, I find myself disliking people I know who are supporting McCain Palin. It is not because they are not voting for Obama but because they are falling for the fear mongering and lies. Makes me very sad and frustrated.
 
T

The Librarian

Banned
Desperado said:
:lol what the fuck? SURE, the first 90% of the ad didn't imply that his "friendship" with Ayers is the issue. SURE.
Click to expand...
"I don't need lessons on how to tell the truth to the American people."

"My friends."
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
The Lamonster said:
Heh, $3 million is not that much money for something this badass. McOldman should chill the fuck out.
Click to expand...

Fuck no.

$3 million for a tool used to educate and inspire the next generation of scientists, astronomers, mathematicians and physicists? I'd pass that bill any fucking day of the week.
 
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