They really oughta bring that Balkans photo up as Exhibit A.Freedom = $1.05 said:http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=4495865&page=1
Seems that Obama's campaign is on the offensive. I would say that this is a negative attack if it weren't for the fact that they are casting doubts on her character. And who hasn't
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PoliGAF Interim Thread of Tears/Lapel Pins (ScratchingHisCheek-Gate)
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:lol
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/9149.html
Her own campaign acknowledges there is no way that she will finish ahead in pledged delegates. That means the only way she wins is if Democratic superdelegates are ready to risk a backlash of historic proportions from the partys most reliable constituency.
Unless Clinton is able to at least win the primary popular vote which also would take nothing less than an electoral miracle and use that achievement to pressure superdelegates, she has only one scenario for victory. An African-American opponent and his backers would be told that, even though he won the contest with voters, the prize is going to someone else.
People who think that scenario is even remotely likely are living on another planet.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0308/9149.html
Her own campaign acknowledges there is no way that she will finish ahead in pledged delegates. That means the only way she wins is if Democratic superdelegates are ready to risk a backlash of historic proportions from the partys most reliable constituency.
Unless Clinton is able to at least win the primary popular vote which also would take nothing less than an electoral miracle and use that achievement to pressure superdelegates, she has only one scenario for victory. An African-American opponent and his backers would be told that, even though he won the contest with voters, the prize is going to someone else.
People who think that scenario is even remotely likely are living on another planet.
typhonsentra
Banned
Gallup has me happy today.
DeathbyVolcano
Banned
Where did you hear that, tanod.
Wait, didn't many of the media pundits say that Americans were too stupid to understand Obama's speech, and that it may have actually hurt him. As a working-class white male in Ohio, I certainly shouldn't have been receptive of his speech. I hope we can now stop with all this demographics bullshit.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
JCreasy said:
Interesting. I doubt the MSM cares though.
electricpirate
Member
I really wish they weren't going negative in this way, it's crossing that line from policy attack to personal attack. I have a fear of it backfiring on him.
On the other hand, she has been truly duplicitous this campaign. If she wasn't so good about controlling the media, no one calls her on it. They haven't called her on it with the FL MI situation, they've let her slide about her tax reports, they've given her a free pass on. She talks about landing into sniper fire in Kosovo. I'm not quite sure what else could be done if no one calls her on bullshit.
On the other hand, she has been truly duplicitous this campaign. If she wasn't so good about controlling the media, no one calls her on it. They haven't called her on it with the FL MI situation, they've let her slide about her tax reports, they've given her a free pass on. She talks about landing into sniper fire in Kosovo. I'm not quite sure what else could be done if no one calls her on bullshit.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
JCreasy said:
dp
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Just chiming in to state my support for Bill Richardson as VP.
Smiles and Cries
Member
tanod said:
link?
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
KRS7 said:
Wait, didn't many of the media pundits say that Americans were too stupid to understand Obama's speech, and that it may have actually hurt him. As a working-class white male in Ohio, I certainly shouldn't have been receptive of his speech. I hope we can now stop with all this demographics bullshit.
Other great point by someone on GAF. Why do so many pudits on TV assume that whites in the middle of the country who makes under 50,000, aren't liberal, aren't in college, and are older than 30 years old can't understand the speech by Obama?
And why does the MSM group those people so tightly. That demographic is pretty specific imo.
electricpirate
Member
Does anyone have links to these Richardson TV ads, I have never seen them before.
Smiles and Cries
Member
JCreasy said:Reading things like this gives me that warm fuzzy feeling
it would be better if she dropped out now and endorsed Obama, the dems are really pushing it right now. I fear the GOP will own the GE vote
Son of Godzilla
Banned
Uh, if she's backed by the Dems in 2012 I'd say the Dems already lost.gkrykewy said:
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Triumph said:
Those are great.
topsyturvy
Member
So all the posts after this latches on to this pic as if the trip wasn't dangerous because of a little girl and her daughter? Republicans, media and secret service alike came forward and said that it was a dangerous sniping hotspot before regardless. Take the first lady in regard and you have to protect her. If you guys give obama the benefit of the doubt on every accusation, then please give something as simple as over protection in a danger zone to hillary clinton.syllogism said:http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/03/hillarys_balkan_adventures_par.html
Greeting ceremony, Tuzla military airport, Bosnia, March 25, 1996.
"I remember landing under sniper fire. There was supposed to be some kind of a greeting ceremony at the airport, but instead we just ran with our heads down to get into the vehicles to get to our base."--Hillary Clinton, speech at George Washington University, March 17, 2008.
What lead you to believe this? Look, the Clintons isn't this power hungry, evil, mafia type family because her husband was in office. Jesus Christ.gkrykewy said:
XxenobladerxX
Member
Nah
Deus Ex Machina
Member
And I thought I had fox news all figured out:
FOX & Friends Anchor Walks Off The Stage Over Obama Dispute
http://www.redlasso.com/ClipPlayer.aspx?id=19ba5a61-9510-4da5-abeb-e9a546cdc33a
FOX news: Chris Wallace rails own Network on coverage of Obama racial controversies
http://www.redlasso.com/ClipPlayer.aspx?id=b9797761-37d1-4b7d-8d27-d72bb37e5516
FOX & Friends Anchor Walks Off The Stage Over Obama Dispute
http://www.redlasso.com/ClipPlayer.aspx?id=19ba5a61-9510-4da5-abeb-e9a546cdc33a
FOX news: Chris Wallace rails own Network on coverage of Obama racial controversies
http://www.redlasso.com/ClipPlayer.aspx?id=b9797761-37d1-4b7d-8d27-d72bb37e5516
Beer Monkey
Member
gkrykewy said:
Anybody who is so evil as to want multiple republican Supreme Court appointees as long as their chances of getting elected in four years is boosted, well, they are a great example of what is wrong with American politics
NO SPIN ZONE! NO SPIN ZONE! NO SPIN ZONE!topsyturvy said:
Ask yourself, how would you be reacting if the shoe was on the other foot and it was Obama? You'd be saying "well this just proves he's all hype and no substance" or some shit like that. So excuse me if I don't necessarily buy into your theory, sir or madam as the case may be.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
topsyturvy said:
You got to be kidding me.
topsyturvy
Member
but unlike you guys i gave obama the benefit of the doubt, What did anyone of you give hillary?Triumph said:
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Deus Ex Machina said:
Seriously now! What's the problem here? I don't see why people are still making a big deal out of this.
Hillary isn't stupid. If she wins, it will be because she dragged Obama down into the dirt so much that he's not electable to the super delegates. She can't win the nomination with a majority of the pledged delegates, more states won or more of the popular vote. If she does win, it will destroy a young generation's confidence in the political process after they finally got off their asses, not to mention alienating the core Democratic voting bloc: African-Americans.topsyturvy said:
So, she can't win the nomination through "democratic" means. And if she does win it, she'll pretty much be guaranteed to lose in the general, not to mention torpedo the dems chances of adding to the progress they made in Congress in 2006.
So why is she still in it? To cripple him enough to make him unelectable in the general, giving her an opportunity to run again and win. It's the only answer that fits. Be honest with yourself for a change.
KilledByBill
Member
topsyturvy said:
Did you follow the original link and watch the archival video from CBS news?
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/rich-n...y-shot-96-no-media-mention-bosnia-sniper-fire
There was no ducking and covering, unless you count bending over to kiss a little girl.
typhonsentra
Banned
Holy shit @ Brian Kilmeade. Good for him, that was pretty intense. Did he come back?
Freedom = $1.05
Banned
Triumph said:
.
topsyturvy
Member
I gave him props and the benefit of the doubt that he would cream mccain in the GE, that the red phone ad is bullshit, that he would unite the party,etc etc etc....I even quit the hillary defense force for awhile saying that he would win. So whatever.harSon said:
triumph said:
I thought it was painfully obvious that shes holding out for the convention for some miracle super delegate jump. But your conspiracy theory is nothing new among these parts. :/
JCreasy
Member
topsyturvy said:
Just wondering if you read the story. But just in case you didnt:
http://blog.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2008/03/hillarys_balkan_adventures_par.html
Hillary Clinton has been regaling supporters on the campaign trail with hair-raising tales of a trip she made to Bosnia in March 1996. In her retelling, she was sent to places that her husband, President Clinton, could not go because they were "too dangerous." When her account was challenged by one of her traveling companions, the comedian Sinbad, she upped the ante and injected even more drama into the story. In a speech earlier this week, she talked about "landing under sniper fire" and running for safety with "our heads down."
There are numerous problems with Clinton's version of events.
The Facts
As a reporter who visited Bosnia soon after the December 1995 Dayton Peace agreement, I can attest that the physical risks were minimal during this period, particularly at a heavily fortified U.S. Air Force base, such as Tuzla. Contrary to the claims of Hillary Clinton and former Army secretary Togo West, Bosnia was not "too dangerous" a place for President Clinton to visit in early 1996. In fact, the first Clinton to visit the Tuzla Air Force base was not Hillary, but Bill, on January 13, 1996.
Had Hillary Clinton's plane come "under sniper fire" in March 1996, we would certainly have heard about it long before now. Numerous reporters, including the Washington Post's John Pomfret, covered her trip. A review of nearly 100 news accounts of her visit shows that not a single newspaper or television station reported any security threat to the First Lady. "As a former AP wire service hack, I can safely say that it would have been in my lead had anything like that happened," said Pomfret.
According to Pomfret, the Tuzla airport was "one of the safest places in Bosnia" in March 1996, and "firmly under the control" of the 1st Armored Division.
Far from running to an airport building with their heads down, Clinton and her party were greeted on the tarmac by smiling U.S. and Bosnian officials. An eight-year-old Moslem girl, Emina Bicakcic, read a poem in English. An Associated Press photograph of the greeting ceremony, above, shows a smiling Clinton bending down to receive a kiss.
"There is peace now," Emina told Clinton, according to Pomfret's report in the Washington Post the following day, "because Mr. Clinton signed it. All this peace. I love it."
The First Lady's schedule, released on Wednesday and available here, confirms that she arrived in Tuzla at 8.45 a.m. and was greeted by various dignitaries, including Emina Bicakcic, (whose name has mysteriously been redacted from the document.)
You can see CBS News footage of the arrival ceremony here. The footage shows Clinton walking calmly out of the back of the C-17 military transport plane that brought her from Ramstein Air Force Base in Germany.
Among the U.S. officials on hand to greet Clinton at the airport was Maj. Gen. William Nash, the commander of U.S. troops in Bosnia. Nash told me that he was unaware of any security threat to Clinton during her eight-hour stay in Tuzla. He said, however, that Clinton had a "busy schedule" and may have got the impression that she was being hurried on her way.
According to Sinbad, who provided entertainment on the trip along with the singer Sheryl Crow, the "scariest" part was deciding where to eat. As he told Mary Ann Akers of The Post, "I think the only 'red-phone' moment was: 'Do we eat here or at the next place.'" Sinbad questioned the premise behind the Clinton version of events. "What kind of president would say 'Hey man, I can't go 'cause I might get shot so I'm going to send my wife. Oh, and take a guitar player and a comedian with you."
Replying to Sinbad earlier this week, Clinton dismissed him as "a comedian." Her campaign referred me to Togo West, who was also on the trip and is a staunch Hillary supporter. West could not remember "sniper fire" himself, but said there was no reason to doubt the First Lady's version of events. "Everybody's perceptions are different," he told me.
Clinton made no mention of "sniper fire" in her autobiography "Living History," published in 2003, although she did say there were "reports of snipers" in the hills around the airport.
The Pinocchio Test
Clinton's tale of landing at Tuzla airport "under sniper fire" and then running for cover is simply not credible. Photographs and video of the arrival ceremony, combined with contemporaneous news reports, tell a very different story. Four Pinocchios.
mckmas8808 said:
Because it is so easy to do. You can take small snippets from anyone, and without putting them in context, you can make them sound bad. Does anyone actually believe that Obama holds any racial prejudices? He is half white, and was raised in a white household, to believe he thinks all whites are racist is absurd.
The best news is that we are still very far away from the next primary, the media has blown its load on this race issue, and people are getting tired of trying to be offended. I really don't think they can keep this pace for the next 6 weeks.
Another thing to keep in mind is that most Americans do not watch Fox, MSNBC, or CNN. Network news programs like NBC Nightly News and ABC World News each garner several times the viewership of all three 24 hour news networks combined. If anyone watches those cable networks for long periods of time they are bound to get fed up and annoyed.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
topsyturvy said:
i agree.. sinbad is a liar. he probably wasnt even there. why would they send a comedian to such an important political meeting!!?
topsyturvy
Member
Again, your sarcasm is just terrible....just terrible (charles)quadriplegicjon said:
EDIT: oh triumph :lol
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