PoliGAF Thread of THE END and FIST POUNDS (NYT: Hillary drop out/endorse Saturday)

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T

Tamanon

Banned
Ponn01 said:
So wait, I only caught half of Hillary's speech on the way home on the radio but it sounded like she was finally giving in. Did she not?

W....T...F!!

Is everyone just going to move on to the ignore her stage and pretend she isn't there? Sounds like it to me.
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She had her last moment in the Ivory Tower surrounded by her closest admirers before having to come outside. Remember nobody really concedes on the day they lose, they always wait a day or two.
 
K

Killthee

helped a brotha out on multiple separate occasions!
Tamanon said:
hillarycat.jpg
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:lol
 
S

Sharp

Member
Gaborn said:
I didn't say there WAS a good solution. He shouldn't have said it if he wasn't going to address the man's concern though. I think the best solution in all honesty is to increase the supply of oil. I don't have a problem with other things, encouraging new research, working to convince companies to adopt other forms of energy usage, etc. But I think the best way to lower prices is two fold. You have to decrease demand, but you also have to increase supply, that lowers prices naturally.
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"Increase the supply of oil" is easier said than done. Regardless of whether or not you think drilling in the Alaskan reserves is a good idea, there isn't enough oil there for it to be anything but a stopgap solution, and a lot of the remaining oil we have access to is very hard to get at, usually pretty deep down. Ethanol is not cost-effective unless you have access to tons of sugar-cane, so that argument will not be viable in the short-term, and probably not even the long-term. I'm also curious as to how you intend to decrease demand, since so far the only thing that seems to be effective in driving a decrease in demand for oil in the U.S. is raising its price. Or do you think that public service announcements encouraging public transportation and HOV lanes are really going to make that big of an impact? If you really are a libertarian, you are a very idealistic one.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
Obama has accepted a tremendous amount of responsibility in picking our hopes and dreams and running with them. I hope to god he's ready to fight global warming because he's the most passionate, moving figure I've seen in my short lifetime and I want it to be so, so true that he's the dream candidate that finally gets his shot.
 
T

The Crimson Kid

what are you waiting for
Gaborn said:
None of which addresses our addiction to oil in the next 4 years. I want to know his solution for that man that can't afford to pay his gas.
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Therein lies the problem.

Our addiction to oil can't be solved in 4 years by anyone. It is literally impossible. For the short term, that man is SOL, aside from some government program to help pay for gas for the poor, although I don't want something like that and you certainly don't either. Aside from that or widespread government regulation on oil prices, there isn't much that can take oil prices down, and neither of those are guaranteed to work. If he can't even afford to get to work, his employer should give him a raise so he can actually afford to get there. That, or find a new job, preferably one closer to his residence.

The only things that Obama can really do (in his first year at least) is up the funding for alternative fuel research, encourage businesses to wean themselves off of oil with tax breaks or something, and maybe work with auto manufacturers to get them to move more in the direction of hydrogen and electric cars (more of a move towards mass adoption, not just experimental stuff). All he can do is really get the ball rolling. After 8 years of Bush, we sadly have to start at square one with this. If we had a President who was willing to face the energy realities of the 21st century in 2001 or even 2004, we would be in better shape energywise. The problem wouldn't be anywhere near solved, but the wheels would at least be turning.

EDIT: Just to clarify, I'm talking about motions that, while the short-term effects may not be as pronounced, will effect the long term in greater ways. The last couple of decades (at least) have been filled with nothing but stopgap, short term solutions, and look how far that has gotten us.
 
J

Jason's Ultimatum

Member
Now bear in my mind that my mother hardly follows politics, but she says Obama is a bullshitter and has no experience. Hillary would be a great president because she has experience. She also says when Obama isn't giving a speech and someone interviews him, he doesn't sound articulate at all. All he says is "um, this, um, um, um, that." :lol
 
V

vitaflo

Member
This is the dumbest conversation on MSNBC. Like Hillary somehow owns everyone who voted for her. Like they won't support Obama unless she says they can.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Jason's Ultimatum said:
Now bear in my mind that my mother hardly follows politics, but she says Obama is a bullshitter and has no experience. Hillary would be a great president because she has experience. She also says when Obama isn't giving a speech and someone interviews him, he doesn't sound articulate at all. All he says is "um, this, um, um, um, that." :lol
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Tell her that's called "thinking."
 
D

Deleted member 22576

Unconfirmed Member
Jason's Ultimatum said:
Now bear in my mind that my mother hardly follows politics, but she says Obama is a bullshitter and has no experience. Hillary would be a great president because she has experience. She also says when Obama isn't giving a speech and someone interviews him, he doesn't sound articulate at all. All he says is "um, this, um, um, um, that." :lol
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At least your mom doesn't talk about "young and attractive" he is, like mine.
 
S

Sharp

Member
Jason's Ultimatum said:
Now bear in my mind that my mother hardly follows politics, but she says Obama is a bullshitter and has no experience. Hillary would be a great president because she has experience. She also says when Obama isn't giving a speech and someone interviews him, he doesn't sound articulate at all. All he says is "um, this, um, um, um, that." :lol
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Ask her to read his policies. Ask her about John McCain's policies. Ask her what the difference between Obama and Hillary's policies are. Ask her who would be the better president between McCain and Obama. Ask her why saying "um" is a bad thing. If she says it implies lack of experience, call her out on it every time she says "um" or "er." She'll stop.
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
:lol :lol :lol :lol Terry is hilarious and parodying himself right now.

"Your strategy is if we act deranged enough, they'll give us the country"
 
G

Gaborn

Member
Sharp said:
"Increase the supply of oil" is easier said than done. Regardless of whether or not you think drilling in the Alaskan reserves is a good idea, there isn't enough oil there for it to be anything but a stopgap solution, and a lot of the remaining oil we have access to is very hard to get at, usually pretty deep down.
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Experts are divided on that and they made the same claim about Prudhoe Bay, our largest source of oil. Some experts say there is 20 years worth of oil, some say there is 6 months. The truth? probably in between, and if so there's MORE than enough to make a difference.


Ethanol is not cost-effective unless you have access to tons of sugar-cane, so that argument will not be viable in the short-term, and probably not even the long-term. I'm also curious as to how you intend to decrease demand, since so far the only thing that seems to be effective in driving a decrease in demand for oil in the U.S. is raising its price. Or do you think that public service announcements encouraging public transportation and HOV lanes are really going to make that big of an impact? If you really are a libertarian, you are a very idealistic one.
Click to expand...

I do agree that ethanol is not the answer at the moment. I think the best way to decrease demand is things like research into various technologies. Although I'm not an enormous fan of government funded research that's one of the later areas I would cut, and if they're going to spend the money anyway they should be spending it on useful technology to increase energy efficiency and make some of the tech more viable and cost effective to consumers and businesses.
 
B

besada

Banned
That was a hell of a speech. I've watched more than twenty-five years of American political theater and not seen many that were so well crafted and so well delivered.
 
H

harSon

Banned
TiVo said:
Shuck n jive, when you blackmail corporations to get your relatives share or positions in the company and claim you are doing it for aff action or the people.

That can be considered s & j'ing
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It's a term that came to light during the Slave and Jim Crow eras, it's original (and present) meaning have absolutely nothing to do with blackmail.
 
T

Trakdown

Member
The Speeches tonight really summed up all the three campaigns quite nicely.

McCain- Failing to generate proper excitement, hesitant and inadequate support. Attacks don't work, and his attempts to separate from Bush fail at every turn.

Clinton- Fails to concede, even if that would unite the party. Doesn't allow information against her campaign to be put forth (no tvs or blackberry/wireless). Doesn't go after McCain. Everything is about her.

Obama- Unity. Change. Issues. Hits McCain hard as hell, invalidating McCain's points as he's speaking them. Victory is not about him- it's about America and progress. Classy and respectful, even about his enemies. Magnanimous. Wants to talk policy, not make ad hominem attacks.
 
S

Sharp

Member
Gaborn said:
Experts are divided on that and they made the same claim about Prudhoe Bay, our largest source of oil. Some experts say there is 20 years worth of oil, some say there is 6 months. The truth? probably in between, and if so there's MORE than enough to make a difference.
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I said it would be a stopgap solution, and it would. It might help a little bit within four years, but it would (A) have detrimental effects on the Alaskan preservation, which means that as a Democrat Obama is not going to support it anyway, and (B) if the price of oil keeps rising elsewhere it might make less of a difference than it seems right now.
Gaborn said:
I do agree that ethanol is not the answer at the moment. I think the best way to decrease demand is things like research into various technologies. Although I'm not an enormous fan of government funded research that's one of the later areas I would cut, and if they're going to spend the money anyway they should be spending it on useful technology to increase energy efficiency and make some of the tech more viable and cost effective to consumers and businesses.
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Which is what Obama is doing. So it seems you agree with him then?
 
V

vitaflo

Member
Watching the local news in Minneapolis, they sort of compared and contrasted Obama and McCain's speech and my god does McCain looks amazingly old. This is Clinton/Dole all over again x100.
 
T

The Crimson Kid

what are you waiting for
Jason's Ultimatum said:
Now bear in my mind that my mother hardly follows politics, but she says Obama is a bullshitter and has no experience. Hillary would be a great president because she has experience. She also says when Obama isn't giving a speech and someone interviews him, he doesn't sound articulate at all. All he says is "um, this, um, um, um, that." :lol
Click to expand...

Never let ignorance slide. You may come off as a bit of a douche at first, but it's the right thing to do.
 
S

sangreal

Member
You guys are parsing this way too much

Maybe if he went to Pennsylvania and met the man who lost his job but can't even afford the gas to drive around and look for a new one, he'd understand that we can't afford four more years of our addiction to oil from dictators. That man needs us to pass an energy policy that works with automakers to raise fuel standards, and makes corporations pay for their pollution, and oil companies invest their record profits in a clean energy future—an energy policy that will create millions of new jobs that pay well and can't be outsourced. That's the change we need.
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It's just a rhetorical device
 
I

Illuminati

Member
Y2Kev said:
Obama has accepted a tremendous amount of responsibility in picking our hopes and dreams and running with them. I hope to god he's ready to fight global warming because he's the most passionate, moving figure I've seen in my short lifetime and I want it to be so, so true that he's the dream candidate that finally gets his shot.
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Oh please, he does not hold a candle to: http://youtube.com/watch?v=mWWJuuF_mM0
 
A

Azih

Member
Sharp said:
Ask her to read his policies. Ask her about John McCain's policies. Ask her what the difference between Obama and Hillary's policies are. Ask her who would be the better president between McCain and Obama. Ask her why saying "um" is a bad thing. If she says it implies lack of experience, call her out on it every time she says "um" or "er." She'll stop.
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Acting like an ass tends to turn the people you're talking to obstinate.
 
S

Sharp

Member
Azih said:
Acting like an ass tends to turn the people you're talking to obstinate.
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Normally, yes. But when people refuse to listen to logic about something as simple as "um" that is the time to be an ass, just to remind them of how assholish they are being.
 
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