• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

PoliGAF Thread of THE END and FIST POUNDS (NYT: Hillary drop out/endorse Saturday)

Status
Not open for further replies.
G

GrotesqueBeauty

Banned
Hitokage said:
The only thing keeping this from looking like My First Photoshop is the lack of lens flare.
Click to expand...
mccainflare.jpg
 
G

Gaborn

Member
reilo said:
He's just adapting to whatever the free market requires of him, amirite?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure that it's completely accurate to call a political campaign a free market (or free anything) but I suppose that's not way off base.
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Gaborn said:
absolutely, but I'd rather a candidate flipped to a generally unpopular position that I agree with than away from it to appear more electable. I think that any candidate or any person for that matter is going to change their opinion over the course of their life. They're certainly flips, and they're inconsistencies, and that's not a good thing usually. However, I think it's human nature to respect more if someone flips to a position closer to your beliefs. Obama abandoned a position I greatly respected him holding, Barr has chosen to adopt several I respect after previously supporting several I find odious. As I said, he's NOT my ideal candidate, he's just better than the others.

And, oddly, probably increases the credibility of the Libertarian party marginally because he's slightly higher profile having been a prominent former Republican in the House.
Click to expand...

I just have a hard time accepting that there is a gay man who is going to vote for Bob Barr of all people. Though I suppose his current positions match your political beliefs well. I guess I'm just still biased against Barr for his actions in Congress but until I see some action to back up his apparent change in belief I doubt my opinion of Barr is going to rise anytime soon.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
grandjedi6 said:
I just have a hard time accepting that there is a gay man who is going to vote for Bob Barr of all people. Though I suppose his current positions match your political beliefs well. I guess I'm just still biased against Barr for his actions in Congress but until I see some action to back up his apparent change in belief I doubt my opinion of Barr is going to rise anytime soon.
Click to expand...

and I totally understand what you're saying. All I'm saying is look at the current candidates. None of them match my political positions very well. As I said, I'd prefer Bob Barr was not the Libertarian party's candidate, but I believe... well, several things, 1, he's not going to win, but he's got a chance to influence the election in a few states (which I'd say is about 20% chance of happening) 2. the campaign he's going to run is probably looking like a right leaning libertarian. Though the media won't cover his positions much so they don't "matter' necessarily, he seems intent on running as a principled libertarian on key issues, such as foreign policy of non-intervention, taxes, drug laws, and civil rights (including getting rid of the patriot act and DOMA)
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Brown shirt guy: "I mean GAAAAAAAAY as the DAAAAAAAAAAAAY is long, I am."

"I see that, I see that."

Brown shirt guy: "I mean, come on."

"I know, I hear ya."

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Gaborn said:
and I totally understand what you're saying. All I'm saying is look at the current candidates. None of them match my political positions very well. As I said, I'd prefer Bob Barr was not the Libertarian party's candidate, but I believe... well, several things, 1, he's not going to win, but he's got a chance to influence the election in a few states (which I'd say is about 20% chance of happening) 2. the campaign he's going to run is probably looking like a right leaning libertarian. Though the media won't cover his positions much so they don't "matter' necessarily, he seems intent on running as a principled libertarian on key issues, such as foreign policy of non-intervention, taxes, drug laws, and civil rights (including getting rid of the patriot act and DOMA)
Click to expand...

Well as long as he doesn't actually get elected I suppose I'll be indifferent for now. But really, Barr is no Ron Paul (even though I disagree with alot of libertarian positions I actually have respect for Paul unlike Barr....)
 
T

Triumph

Banned
I have to say, I'm fucking impressed with how the Senators and Congressmen handled her crazy ass today. Someone else got it right when they said that what changed today was that THERE WERE NO MORE FREAKING CONTESTS LEFT. Everyone had held off on their endorsements even tho it was obvious that Obama was going to be the nominee in deference to her, but when she thought she could keep playing they told in her in very clear terms, "Sorry, the casino is closed. Also, about that house money you've been playing with..."

I honestly didn't think these bastards had it in them, and it's obvious that she and Bill didn't either. That must have been one awesome conference call. :D I wonder who the senior staffers were that threw it together- Wolfson? Terry? Not Ickes, I bet.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
reilo said:
Brown shirt guy: "I mean GAAAAAAAAY as the DAAAAAAAAAAAAY is long, I am."

"I see that, I see that."

Brown shirt guy: "I mean, come on."

"I know, I hear ya."

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
Click to expand...

Yeah... I mean, I respect people of all types. I think flaming gay guys get a lot of the worst flack because they're so... obvious. But still, I wish "normal" gay guys got more air time, it seems like perceptions gay men are all a bit flaming trickle into the media and mostly eliminate normal gay role models.

Grandjedi - true, Barr is no Paul but at least he's 10,000x better than Mary Ruwart, the runner up who advocates that possessing child porn (but not producing it) should be protected under the first amendment.
 
T

Triumph

Banned
Gaborn said:
Yeah... I mean, I respect people of all types. I think flaming gay guys get a lot of the worst flack because they're so... obvious. But still, I wish "normal" gay guys got more air time, it seems like perceptions gay men are all a bit flaming trickle into the media and mostly eliminate normal gay role models.

Grandjedi - true, Barr is no Paul but at least he's 10,000x better than Mary Ruwart, the runner up who advocates that possessing child porn (but not producing it) should be protected under the first amendment.
Click to expand...
:lol :lol :lol and you guys wonder why liberarians don't get elected to anything!

"Down with roads and health care for poor children, up with pollution and kiddie porn!"
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Triumph said:
I have to say, I'm fucking impressed with how the Senators and Congressmen handled her crazy ass today. Someone else got it right when they said that what changed today was that THERE WERE NO MORE FREAKING CONTESTS LEFT. Everyone had held off on their endorsements even tho it was obvious that Obama was going to be the nominee in deference to her, but when she thought she could keep playing they told in her in very clear terms, "Sorry, the casino is closed. Also, about that house money you've been playing with..."

I honestly didn't think these bastards had it in them, and it's obvious that she and Bill didn't either. That must have been one awesome conference call. :D I wonder who the senior staffers were that threw it together- Wolfson? Terry? Not Ickes, I bet.
Click to expand...

No one messes with Pelosi

Gaborn said:
Grandjedi - true, Barr is no Paul but at least he's 10,000x better than Mary Ruwart, the runner up who advocates that possessing child porn (but not producing it) should be protected under the first amendment.
Click to expand...

You know this is why libertarians are the butt of all jokes.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
neonglow said:
2n05u9v.jpg


What is the purpose of that stand with a piece of glass on it? Is it a teleprompter of some sort?
Click to expand...

It reflects the text off of a teleprompter. The prompter is somewhere below the stage, and the glass is positioned so that Obama can read the prompter.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
grandjedi6 said:
You know this is why libertarians are the butt of all jokes.
Click to expand...

It's also why, while Barr is NOT a purist libertarian, he's got a chance to mainstream the party a little bit more, which long term could cause interesting effects. I think we can all agree right now the libertarians, though they have some effect on local races, and even arguably national races (in Montana's senate race in 2006 for example the Libertarian candidate's total was more than double the Democrat's slim margin of victory, arguably costing the Republican the race), broadly speaking Libertarians don't matter. A little more mainstream for a little more relevance is a good thing long term, especially if it's more a matter of areas of emphasis than compromising principle.

As I said, candidates like Ruwart are a non-starter, that's why I'm glad she didn't get the nomination.
 
G

GrotesqueBeauty

Banned
I just saw a commercial while watching Colbert that had Al Sharpton and Pat Robertson sitting on a couch together talking about how important the environment is.

:lol
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Colbert: "We'll use that power fulfill our dream of eliminating maximum occupancy rules in elevators and suggested age ranges on board games. If I want my 3 year old to play ganip-ginop, he's going to! Choking hazard..."

:lol :lol :lol :lol

"In the past, most libertarians voted with the republicans, or anyone else who was willing to end the tyranny of the FDA and drink lead paint. But now they may leave John McCain and support the official libertarian candidate, former republican gongressman Bob Barr."

babar.jpg


"No.... No, not Babar... BOB Barr."


:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Gaborn said:
It's also why, while Barr is NOT a purist libertarian, he's got a chance to mainstream the party a little bit more, which long term could cause interesting effects. I think we can all agree right now the libertarians, though they have some effect on local races, and even arguably national races (in Montana's senate race in 2006 for example the Libertarian candidate's total was more than double the Democrat's slim margin of victory, arguably costing the Republican the race), broadly speaking Libertarians don't matter. A little more mainstream for a little more relevance is a good thing long term, especially if it's more a matter of areas of emphasis than compromising principle.

As I said, candidates like Ruwart are a non-starter, that's why I'm glad she didn't get the nomination.
Click to expand...

The only parties that can survive in American politics are Big Tent parties. Otherwise they don't appeal to enough people or get enough talent to compete in bigger offices. Of course becoming a big tent party would effectively kill off the libertarian part of the Libertarian Party
 
Smiles and Cries

Smiles and Cries

Member
reilo said:
It reflects the text off of a teleprompter. The prompter is somewhere below the stage, and the glass is positioned so that Obama can read the prompter.
Click to expand...
Both McCaine and Obama are reading the speeches yet the delivery is a huge difference between the two

I also wonder how MLK did such an awesome job without a prompter seems kinda cheating to use it :D
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
:lol

Good god, Colbert is on a roll. He's interviewing Bob Barr.

Colbert: "You are big on privacy, is that why you voted for the Patriot Act?"
 
G

Gaborn

Member
grandjedi6 said:
The only parties that can survive in American politics are Big Tent parties. Otherwise they don't appeal to enough people or get enough talent to compete in bigger offices. Of course becoming a big tent party would effectively kill off the libertarian part of the Libertarian Party
Click to expand...

Well, but I'm not sure the goal is to become a big tent. The goal for the Libertarians should be to have a "seat at the table" as it were to influence policy. Getting a little more relevant with slightly more credible candidates would help with that. In all honesty in some states (the montana example being most noticeable) they're a LOT closer to breaking through a bit than the larger parties want to admit. Ron Paul is also probably going to have a positive, longer term effect than people want to admit, he's overnight become a player. Not necessarily a huge player, or one always taken seriously, but with a devoted and visible following.

What I see potentially happening is Libertarians being able to get 10-15% of the vote soon (not now, not in 4 years, but soon enough, 10 years, 15, maybe more maybe a little less) and being in the kingmaker position. having enough of a voice that the Democrats and Republicans will have to react to them by becoming a little more accomodating of their views and perspectives. THAT would be a major accomplishment, and it wouldn't require massive compromises.
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
Holy shit, Colbert is hammering him on his flip-flopping. Wow.
 
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Gaborn said:
Well, but I'm not sure the goal is to become a big tent. The goal for the Libertarians should be to have a "seat at the table" as it were to influence policy. Getting a little more relevant with slightly more credible candidates would help with that. In all honesty in some states (the montana example being most noticeable) they're a LOT closer to breaking through a bit than the larger parties want to admit. Ron Paul is also probably going to have a positive, longer term effect than people want to admit, he's overnight become a player. Not necessarily a huge player, or one always taken seriously, but with a devoted and visible following.

What I see potentially happening is Libertarians being able to get 10-15% of the vote soon (not now, not in 4 years, but soon enough, 10 years, 15, maybe more maybe a little less) and being in the kingmaker position. having enough of a voice that the Democrats and Republicans will have to react to them by becoming a little more accomodating of their views and perspectives. THAT would be a major accomplishment, and it wouldn't require massive compromises.
Click to expand...

Getting 10%-15% of the vote would require becoming a big tent party. And even then it would be pretty hard considering the two party system doesn't favor such a large percentage for a 3rd party
 
R

reilo

learning some important life lessons from magical Negroes
grandjedi6 said:
Getting 10%-15% of the vote would require becoming a big tent party. And even then it would be pretty hard considering the two party system doesn't favor such a large percentage for a 3rd party
Click to expand...

10-15% of the vote in 2004 would have been 10-15million votes...

Not happening.
 
G

Gaborn

Member
grandjedi6 said:
Getting 10%-15% of the vote would require becoming a big tent party. And even then it would be pretty hard considering the two party system doesn't favor such a large percentage for a 3rd party
Click to expand...

I disagree, it'd require some tweaks, some emphasis on more mainstream issues (efficiency in government, equal rights for all Americans, liberalization of gambling laws, etc), and a few more "credible" candidates with a more national focus/appeal/experience. Ron Paul or Bob Barr, though neither was perfect, were both US Congressmen (heck, Paul still is and should be for as long as he wants to be till death) and that brings instant credibility to a degree a businessman or someone who hasn't served in government before doesn't have. I think that many people support enough elements of libertarian ideas they could vote for a Libertarian... if they were a credible candidate with a chance to accomplish something. Again, it'll take time, but I don't think it's completely out of the realm of possibility. The big problem is clearing out the tax deniers and the truthers. Well, and the kiddy porn possession advocates.

Edit: I was too kind to Dr. Ruwart apparently:
Children who willingly participate in sexual acts have the right to make that decision as well, even if it's distasteful to us personally. Some children will make poor choices just as some adults do in smoking and drinking to excess. When we outlaw child pornography, the prices paid for child performers rise, increasing the incentives for parents to use children against their will.
Click to expand...

So yeah, the biggest problem for libertarians, both l and L, is finding credible candidates with your views. And the Mary Ruwarts of the world, or even Badnarik (who was an income tax denier) are... simply not credible. Or sane. So it's harder to make progress. As I said, I've had many disagreements and reasons to dislike Barr in the past, assuming he's changed as much as he claims I'll have no problem voting for him though.
 
Z

Zen

Banned
Whenever I try to view a dailyshow clip etc it keep saying that the video isn't available. I'm assuming that means that it won't play outside of the USA... is there any way to get around this, I work late and end up missing the CS/CR. :lol
 
D

Deus Ex Machina

Member
Tom Davis (R): Jindal has a good "credential of color"

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/06/04/another-turn-in-the-guessing-game-for-mccains-vp
Rep. Heather Wilson of New Mexico lost Tuesday to a more conservative Republican in a primary fight for the open Senate seat in her state, but Virginia Republican Rep. Tom Davis suggested she might make a good running mate for John McCain.

Davis–who hasn’t been shy about criticizing his party and telling Republicans how they need to turn things around in a challenging campaign environment–said that choosing a woman might help “balance the ticket” and broaden McCain’s appeal, particularly if Barack Obama doesn’t pick Hillary Clinton as a running mate.

“If you fill that bill in a strategic way, you can make history, we can make history,” said Davis, who is not running for re-election.

He also said Bobby Jindal, the young, newly elected governor of Louisiana, would be a smart choice. “It’s a young credential, it’s a good credential, it’s a credential of color,” Davis said of Jindal, who is Indian-American. “It doesn’t turn off anyone in particular.”
Click to expand...
Wow...
 
K

Kildace

Member
Zen said:
Whenever I try to view a dailyshow clip etc it keep saying that the video isn't available. I'm assuming that means that it won't play outside of the USA... is there any way to get around this, I work late and end up missing the CS/CR. :lol
Click to expand...

I'm in France and I can watch them, if that helps.
 
G

GrotesqueBeauty

Banned
G

grandjedi6

Master of the Google Search
Gaborn said:
I disagree, it'd require some tweaks, some emphasis on more mainstream issues (efficiency in government, equal rights for all Americans, liberalization of gambling laws, etc), and a few more "credible" candidates with a more national focus/appeal/experience. Ron Paul or Bob Barr, though neither was perfect, were both US Congressmen (heck, Paul still is and should be for as long as he wants to be till death) and that brings instant credibility to a degree a businessman or someone who hasn't served in government before doesn't have. I think that many people support enough elements of libertarian ideas they could vote for a Libertarian... if they were a credible candidate with a chance to accomplish something. Again, it'll take time, but I don't think it's completely out of the realm of possibility. The big problem is clearing out the tax deniers and the truthers. Well, and the kiddy porn possession advocates.
Click to expand...

Nope, what you suggest is pretty much impossible. The only way for a 3rd party to grow that big is to effectively dethrone one of the Major 2. Americans naturally choose either Democrats or Republicans, and the system is set up to discourage people "wasting" their vote on a 3rd party.

That's not to say that the libertarian party can't grow larger or become a more powerful force, but 10-15% is never going to happen consistenly in the current situation. Its either replace one of the big two by becoming a big tent (which is pretty near impossible in the 1st place) or to become a slightly meaningful 3rd party

Edit: I was too kind to Dr. Ruwart apparently:

So yeah, the biggest problem for libertarians, both l and L, is finding credible candidates with your views. And the Mary Ruwarts of the world, or even Badnarik (who was an income tax denier) are... simply not credible. Or sane. So it's harder to make progress. As I said, I've had many disagreements and reasons to dislike Barr in the past, assuming he's changed as much as he claims I'll have no problem voting for him though.
Click to expand...

What a nutjob. Luckily she didn't get the nom.
 
Z

Zen

Banned
Kildace said:
I'm in France and I can watch them, if that helps.
Click to expand...

I'm wondering if it might be a Canada specific thing. When I try to join the community it refuses to accept any Canadian Zip/Postal code...?!
 
M

mosaic

go eat paint
So, Michelle Obama is scheduled to be a host of The View -- the women's talk show -- on June 18th.

Admit it, men of PoliGAF, you're going to turn in your testicles that day and tune-in.
 
D

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
"Let’s not be afraid to teach our kids the very best science."

That's Bobby Jindal, defending the insertion of intelligent design into science class.

Pro Patriot Act, pro flag burning amendment, anti-abortion, anti-science, anti-stem cells, etc. I dislike him already, which means he's not ruled out as McCain's VP.
 
Smiles and Cries

Smiles and Cries

Member
mosaic said:
So, Michelle Obama is scheduled to be a host of The View -- the women's talk show -- on June 18th.

Admit it, men of PoliGAF, you're going to turn in your testicles that day and tune-in.
Click to expand...
If I had a TV I wud I wait for the youtube just hope she does not mess up
 
Smiles and Cries

Smiles and Cries

Member
did you guys see Oprah does Happy Dance story on CNN.com sorry can't link on Wii
She said if he wants her to she is ready to go door to door I guess campaigning again
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

  • Locked
Time: Person of the Year! (not doing Politics: HARD MODE)
40
1K
SJRB replied
WWE and Endeavor (UFC) announce 21 billion dollar deal.
40
3K
thefool replied
Big Business and Government: Grand conspiracy or ramblings of a mad man?
3
2K
Soodanim replied
A record of Segas reactions, mistakes, missteps, poor or misguided decisions, JUST in 1996.
2 3
138
19K
kvltus lvlzvs replied
  • Locked
2 in 10 Clinton Primary Voters Weren't Going To Vote For Obama (2008 Flashback)
16
4K
ModBot replied
Top Bottom