If you already left the ecosystem and went to PC before the console even released, i somehow doubt you were that invested in PS to atleast wait until more info came out over speculation.
PS4 Pro PR has been terrible
- Thread starter Caipirinha
- Start date
If you already left the ecosystem and went to PC before the console even released, i somehow doubt you were that invested in PS to atleast wait until more info came out over speculation.
I agree. I thought it was confirmed moving forward all goes had to have a pro mode where they rendered at least at 1080p. But then the latest "is it worth it for 1080p TV owners" thread made it sound like that was still just a rumor and we don't know if pro mode is mandatory moving forward.
I'm considering cancelling my preorder daily and just getting a slim instead, probably won't though, I still think in the long run the extra $100 will be worth it.
I'm considering cancelling my preorder daily and just getting a slim instead, probably won't though, I still think in the long run the extra $100 will be worth it.
Always-honest
Banned
Lol, no you won't.
LeeRoyBrown
Banned
Ill buy one once some games I want get some significant upgrades. More interested in spending my money on a switch at this point.
OK
I had a PSX, PS2 & PS4 at launch. I've owned a Vita & PSTV. All great systems. The PS4 Pro specs & reveal came out and fell flat.
Why invest $800 in an iterative platform and early adopter VR when I have the cash to build a high end PC? I can still play Persona 5 and The Last Guardian so there's no real reason to dump money into a product line that no longer suits my needs.
Was that really necessary? Like, how is it an insult?
To begin with, your post made it sound like their PR had put you off Pro specifically and you even said you'd have VR and Pro right now if not for their PR specifically
So why are you now posting about prices with VR added in as if that was a factor?
Has no bugs wtf?
Haven't they specifically said that it's rather things like better shadows, better LOD and those kind of things that will be better with a 1080p output? That's like the one specific thing I've picked up on.
Yes, but its common sense that rendering at a higher resolution would automatically give downsampling benefits for those 1080p owners. I guess devs should be highlighting that that will be the case because it seems like there are a crazy number of people who dont know what downsampling even is
*Edit*
...how does the prevailing notion continue to be that 4K televisions are necessary to take advantage of the pro? I don't get it.
Jasper Avenue
Member
I ended up cancelling my pre-order. It just doesn't seem worth it for those of us without 4K sets.
now i remember why i don't post in console war threads
yeah, if the PS4 Pro PR came out and had some serious machinery under the hood, i'd have own pre ordered along with a VR
with the emphasis on 4K, it seems like i'd need a new tv to get the most of it. so now if i'm spending a few grand, it seems a better value proposition to build a new PC.
Always-honest
Banned
All those things and more. Depending on what devs will provide.
Standard patch will be the game downscaling to 1080P and fps improvement.
But they can do much more.
Not really. But since you've migrated to pc it doesn't matter.
GinoFelino
Member
Nothing, which was my point to start with. Out of that list, I doubt we'll see better textures, by the way.
Person I was replying to implied you could use the PS4P's power at 1080p to create visuals way beyond what you can do at 4K...Which is true, but you'd need games built from the ground up for PS4P specs at 1080p-only.
Perfect.
In terms of info about potential benefits to owners the info has been out there for a while if you don't know it then you're have either missed it or are ignoring it.
PR in terms of things like showing side by side comparisons in supported games and such has indeed been terrible + actual marketing for the device.
Best post so far.
You know Scorpio will use these same "faux" 4K techniques...
You shouldn't have to imagine, Sony should be showing the difference. That is their job.
Is this mandatory from Sony to all devs? The game won't follow the chosen resolution of the PS4 Pro? Can a game run on two resolutions depending on what the user selected in the PS4 options (1080p/4K)? Or are Pro games which supports 4K/checkboard method will only run on that resolution?
But...you don't need a 4K TV to get the most out of it.
If your going to accuse members of console warring, atleast make sure there is console warring going on. I'm not defending the Pro, so much as clarifying misinterpretation about downsampling because it comes up almost every post and it makes no sense to me.
Muchi Muchi Pink
Member
This console does nothing for me, if I don't own a 4K TV. And I don't play on TVs anyways.
FPS improvement would have been nice, but surprise it won't do that for most games.
FPS improvement would have been nice, but surprise it won't do that for most games.
Always-honest
Banned
The textures will be better in a lot of games. Especially new games to come. Since they will be higher res textures, downscaled to 1080P.
WAAAY beyond? No, nonsense. But you can use all that power for 1080P mode too. And some devs do just that. Like Tombraider.
There is a difference between internal resolution of a game and what your TV is rendering. Instead of relegating the conversation to what setting you have in menu's the TV's own res will matter more. If you have the checkerboard rendering mode enabled on a 1080p TV for example, the higher resolution will be automatically downsampled.
This is how Horizon works, and how basically every other game that renders in a higher resolution works. They can't lock you out of internal resolution changes because of what TV you have.
My intepretation is that if there are multiple pro modes, they will change depending on the your TV, but you can also change them manually on a per game basis.
What will the Pro do for games in general? We don't know, right? It's up to devs.
What does Sony mandate in regards to PS4 Pro patches?
Can devs only add the checkboard scaling to games without any other improvements?
Can devs let the game run on same 1080p resolution and only up the AF?
Can devs let the game run exactly the same, but only with improved shadows?
etc. you get the jist.
What does Sony mandate for the Pro?
GinoFelino
Member
I hope you're right about the upcoming games. But using Tomb Raider as an example, it uses the base textures and displays them at 4K. They're not higher res or different textures, unfortunately. But that may change in the future.
Regarding your 1080p comment: I don't think 1080p mode will ever truly use -all- the PS4P's power. Whatever it has to spare, it will probably use for downsampling. Which is fine by me.
You may be missing the fact that devs want their game to shine. You probably don't even need to mandate a damn thing.
Acquiescence
Member
I haven't been following PS4 Pro news much, but I do know that the reveal event for it was a minor disaster. They made it available to watch for the general public, except nobody watching the stream was able to differentiate between standard footage and Pro footage. It should have been a press-only event, and even then, apparently no one in the audience was able to tell the difference either until they got hands-on time after the conference. How's that for a first impression!
I've no interest in the Pro. It doesn't seem like a substantial enough upgrade to invest in one. I'll just wait for the PS5.
I've no interest in the Pro. It doesn't seem like a substantial enough upgrade to invest in one. I'll just wait for the PS5.
Which means they did a bad job explaining it.
If you have a problem with the perception of your product and your answer is the problem comes for your audience, you're not off to a great start (which is hypothetical only since I'm sure no PR department would ever react that way)
But you then mention TR yourself....
Okay so Sony doesn't mandate anything, you can just run the game exactly the way it is on a OG PS4, same resolution, same everything. As long as it's compatible with the Pro. Gotcha.
GinoFelino
Member
Yep. Though some are really being deliberately dense about the whole thing.
This is something that Sony may have intended; there will be no shortage of YouTube videos, Digital Foundry type articles, overview articles etc. etc. once the Pro drops. Why put in a ton of effort to explain something the gaming media will comprehensively cover anyway? The difference will be clear soon enough.
Mandates are mostly NDA, so we don't know. But some have suggested that all new games need to be Pro-enhanced, and some have said Sony requires those enhanced games to have performance at least equal to OG PS4.
Why would my Tomb Raider example dispute anything? I'm not sure what you mean.
You said Sony doesn't need to mandate a damn thing, cos devs wants their games to shine, then you mention that TR doesn't have higher res textures, but the same old textures, for 4K. As you said, it's "unfortunate". That would have a negative effect on IQ at 4K, no?
"Pro enhanced". That term is so vague. Like I said, it's possible some Pro version games will only have better AF, Pro enhanced! Gamers will never know what they get with a Pro. Some games might have tons of Pro enhancements, while other barely have anything noteworthy.
Wishmaster92
Member
It's already plenty cheap with the 1tb hdd which i still don't know why they did that, along with double the gpu, cpu overclock, and extra ram.
The fact that i will be getting the original graphics the developers intended with Death Stranding and tlou2 is plenty reason for me to get one if only to future-proof myself.
Sad Affleck
Member
Are you satisfied with the visuals that the PS4 provides? If the answer is yes, don't buy the Pro. Do you want higher visual fidelity? If yes, buy the Pro.
Jacksinthe
Banned
Aside from Sony stating the benefits more than once and the zillions of threads that followed.
Aside from myself and other devs clearing the air in a zillion of these threads.
We still get these threads.
This is tiring. I'm honestly convinced it's either ignorance or purposeful trolling to create FUD. When you've got people saying the Pro is unknown so they will get Scorpio instead - that's just absurd.
Aside from myself and other devs clearing the air in a zillion of these threads.
We still get these threads.
This is tiring. I'm honestly convinced it's either ignorance or purposeful trolling to create FUD. When you've got people saying the Pro is unknown so they will get Scorpio instead - that's just absurd.
Always-honest
Banned
Ah i didn't know about the textures. Do they use the same textures on PC?
Anyway, Tombraider is an example for a game that gives more options with two 1080P modes. It's also not a new game.
Downsampling will be automatic...
Of course! Which is why all games released since new 3ds came out run at higher frame rates and have more aa. The power is there, devs want games to shine, so they all use it. Obviously.
Saberus
Member
This isn't the thread for that, "This thread was created for one purpose"
Anyway..lots of threads to explain the benefits..if they don't convinced you, then don't waste your money and move along.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Some people are making things harder to understand than they should be .
First it's up to devs to use the power how they want so Sony really can't say much other it can do 4k with CBR.
When it comes to games most devs telling us what they doing so it not hard to find out .
If you play on 1080p tv you will get downsample IQ at least .
When it comes to marketing that not going to be hard , it's better PS4 and people will understand that .
The new 3ds is very poor eg to use.
Most of the devs who would go all out on Pro don't even make handheld games and won't.
First it's up to devs to use the power how they want so Sony really can't say much other it can do 4k with CBR.
When it comes to games most devs telling us what they doing so it not hard to find out .
If you play on 1080p tv you will get downsample IQ at least .
When it comes to marketing that not going to be hard , it's better PS4 and people will understand that .
The new 3ds is very poor eg to use.
Most of the devs who would go all out on Pro don't even make handheld games and won't.
GinoFelino
Member
Using the same textures has a negative effect, yes, but it's also a minor point, and understandable given the timing of Tomb Raider PS4's release.
The term is vague, but you're being overly pessimistic here if you truly think improved AF will be the only thing devs will do. I wouldn't be surprised if checkerboard 4K is one of the base requirements for Pro support. Thing is, we can only guess at the moment.
It's only automatic if they're rendering the game at a higher resolution than 1080p.
Actually, many games benefit from improved framerate on New 3DS. Your sarcasm just blew up in your face, ha!
Always-honest
Banned
Depends on what you read. Nobody should tell anyone what they should do. But people HAVE explained what benefits there are and everyone will have to decide for themselves if it's worth it. For you, it's not worth it. And that's fine.
Always-honest
Banned
Ofcourse.
One good thing for the pro is that PS5 will hopefully support the pro versions of the PS4 games as well as the original versions. ALthough i dont know how that works, by that time, the power will be there to surely do it.
You don't have to technically be convinced really, because it was always going to be an uphill battle that IMO, Sony was never going to really be able to adequately explain or sell until outlets like DF and NX gamer got their hands on it, this was always a niche product.
In general, you get higher resolutions in many cases, better graphics in certain cases, better FPS in certain cases than the current PS4, and all of it is dependent on what developers want to use the power on hand for.
If that's not enough to really sell one on the console, then its not worth it to buy.
……forgetit
Member
Then why make it? This is a terrible arguement because it implies the VR and Slim are higher priority then the pro. Add to that the fact that the VR marketing hasn't been great and you have to wonder what Sony is even doing.
Confused Cheeseburger
Member
There's so much info out there on this thing, it boogles the mind how people are still being deliberately obtuse about the pro.
Because this is a first of its kind in console gaming.
Crimson_Gold
Member
Individuals that work in retail have said that the pro is doing quite well. I feel the forum is looking past the obvious in search of information that cannot exist. Each dev is free to as he/she pleases. It does what the ps4 does, but better. It's that damn simple. How much better? Depends on the game. It'll be the same for the Scorpio
gundamkyoukai
Member
This is not a new gen and sometimes it's better to do marketing after the product is out .
It will be easier to see what extra stuff the games going to get .
Also the VR marketing was as good as it can be for what type of product it was.
I'm not being pessimistic, but trying to get answers whether Sony have some basic requirements for enhanced graphics other than Pro compatibility. I'm not saying ALL devs will only provide an AF bump. But asking if something like that will be okay to Sony. Like I said quite a few times in my previous posts. It's kind of a gamble for Pro owners. They never know what enhancements they get. My actual sincerest hope is that each Pro game will get a ton of improvements. I want to see huge graphical improvements!
If you're a new customer buying a Pro over a PS4 it doesn't matter, Sony haven't lost a sale.
If you're an existing owner buying a Pro, Sony have had two sales out of you.
If you buy a PSVR, you've either already got a PS4, or you're getting a new one to go with it, be that PS4 or Pro.
Either way, Sony have sold at least one console + the expensive, profit making PSVR unit, probably along with a good number of game buys from the store if the PSVR OT is anything to go by.
If you don't but PSVR but get a Pro, guess what? Sony have still made a sale, got a customer in their ecosystem, got them buying PS4 games.
Please explain to me where in these scenarios Sony lose a sale of some piece of hardware, which is the definition of cannibalising sales.