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[Rocco Schiavone]

Wait does this means the liquid metal will be gone next?

Makes no sense. Liquid metal is why the GPU can keep the high clocks.

 

[existensmaximum]

Cheaper to produce yet they increase the price....

Yeah I just don't get it! Why would a company want to make more money instead or less money, when the demand for their product is astoundingly high? Why!?

 

[Beechos]

Makes no sense. Liquid metal is why the GPU can keep the high clocks.

Thats what im wondering since itll be more efficient, less power hungry, produce less heat. Maybe they can cheap out on that too and use regular thermal paste.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

So now not only you need to still look out for the chance to buy a PS5, you also need to be lucky to get the right version, FML.

Considering they always sell out, ija month all will be the new version so don't worry

 

[SlimySnake]

I am surprised that they increased the price of the console despite being able to go on a smaller node. I said this in the price increase thread, but prices typically go down as the years go by, node shrinks allow for smaller chips and thus smaller heatsinks and smaller consoles. Even if the smaller node is more expensive, they wouldve seen the cost remain the same by producing more chips per wafer.

Makes no sense. Liquid metal is why the GPU can keep the high clocks.

not really. the PC GPUs go way to 2.6-2.7 ghz. they dont need Liquid metal. Just simple thermal paste with better heatsinks/vapor chambers will do.

If the die has received a node shrink then it very likely runs cooler than the original which would reduce the need for a larger heatsink and liquid metal thermal paste.

 

[Physiognomonics]

Not exactly.
I posted this in the other thread.
Austin's numbers aren't adding up.

Now it pleases me someone is also paying attention on that subject. Currently people around the web like here or here are finding the 1000 model is consuming about max 220W while it was about max 205W at launch. So that would mean there was an unexpected increase of power consumption at some point!

It occurred about the same moment PS5 was patched (3.1) and performance suddenly increased in some games / scenes by one of a few frames depending of the game (notably in DMC5 and Control).

My (wild) theory is that after testing games on PS5 for more than a year Sony decided it was OK to increase the maximum number of instructions available for the game leading to a small increase of performance in some demanding scenes at the cost of ~15W more Watts (as power consumption is not linear with frequency increase).

Wait does this means the liquid metal will be gone next?

Unlikely. They are very probably saving money on the cooling (heatsink and fan) by using liquid metal. Besides they already did the RD on it so they might as well use it.

 

[Max_Po]

I am surprised that they increased the price of the console despite being able to go on a smaller node. I said this in the price increase thread, but prices typically go down as the years go by, node shrinks allow for smaller chips and thus smaller heatsinks and smaller consoles. Even if the smaller node is more expensive, they wouldve seen the cost remain the same by producing more chips per wafer.


not really. the PC GPUs go way to 2.6-2.7 ghz. they dont need Liquid metal. Just simple thermal paste with better heatsinks/vapor chambers will do.

If the die has received a node shrink then it very likely runs cooler than the original which would reduce the need for a larger heatsink and liquid metal thermal paste.

#1. They don't use razor to cut 1 nm and run to Kutaragi and say ...look daddy I save us 100 g of playstation ... its a whole new process and new manufacturing. Consider the attached cost.

#2. Compare the PC GPU space and cooling vs PS5. no way PS5 can use regular thermal paste cooling and not make the ps5 sound like a jet engine....

 

[Loxus]

Now it pleases me someone is also paying attention on that subject. Currently people around the web like here or here are finding the 1000 model is consuming about max 220W while it was about max 205W at launch. So that would mean there was an unexpected increase of power consumption at some point!

It occurred about the same moment PS5 was patched (3.1) and performance suddenly increased in some games / scenes by one of a few frames depending of the game (notably in DMC5 and Control).

My (wild) theory is that after testing games on PS5 for more than a year Sony decided it was OK to increase the maximum number of instructions available for the game leading to a small increase of performance in some demanding scenes at the cost of ~15W more Watts (as power consumption is not linear with frequency increase).


Unlikely. They are very probably saving money on the cooling (heatsink and fan) by using liquid metal. Besides they already did the RD on it so they might as well use it.

You really think Sony would raise power consumption 20W+ for 2fps?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

With the aforementioned smaller die and lighter cooler enabled by lower power consumption, we estimate that each new PS5 going forward costs Sony around 12% less to make overall, which helps to recoup program development costs sooner than if no die shrink took place.

So it costs cheaper to make, but every region but the US increased prices and the US stayed the same. Capitalism at work.

Probably the first time in console history costs go down with revisions and a maker increased the price.

 

[jhjfss]

So it costs cheaper to make, but every region but the US increased prices and the US stayed the same. Capitalism at work.

Probably the first time in console history costs go down with revisions and a maker increased the price.

Even in the US they raised prices with the forced bundles.

 

[Ezekiel_]

Cheaper to produce yet they increase the price....

So it costs cheaper to make, but every region but the US increased prices and the US stayed the same. Capitalism at work.

Probably the first time in console history costs go down with revisions and a maker increased the price.

in·fla·tion
a general increase in prices and fall in the purchasing value of money.
"policies aimed at controlling inflation"

ex·change rate
the value of one currency for the purpose of conversion to another.
"the exchange rate of the dollar against the Deutschmark"

 

[lh032]

Raise price AND reduce cost!?
Jimbo is a fucking genius.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

#2. Compare the PC GPU space and cooling vs PS5. no way PS5 can use regular thermal paste cooling and not make the ps5 sound like a jet engine....

Not really true.

There are many design parameters that they can vary to achieve a low noise level and high cooling efficiency console design.

They can make the fan larger and run at lower RPMs. They can use a higher heat flux phase-change heat sink, e.g. vapour chamber, or more heat pipes. They can massively increase the chassis size to reduce the pressure drop and allow a larger volumetric flow of air through the system.

They don't need liquid metal at all. It was just a feature of the launch design. They can cut it out with a chip that generates and thus needs to dissipate 18% less heat, with a minimally redesigned system and cooling design.

 

[solidus12]

Had my PS5 for more than a year now; it is the original one with all the copper and the bigger heatsink.
Do I need to get this new one to have a slightly cooler console? I haven't heard the fans spin mind you !!

 

[remember_spinal]

Hmmmm how can I as a consumer be upset about this?

 

[Amiga]

Dose this still use liquid metal on the chip, I would imagine it's more complicated and limits factory expansion, thus slowing production growth.

 

[remember_spinal]

Dose this still use liquid metal on the chip, I would imagine it's more complicated and limits factory expansion, thus slowing production growth.

 

[Xyphie]

Of course they'll want to phase out using liquid metal at some point, it's a very costly and messy thermal interface material with low tolerances for error. If they can get the chip within tolerances with regular thermal paste they'll opt for that.

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Who gives a crap about internal optimization of the PS5, and its potential cost reduction, I'm here still waiting for PS5 exclusive games taking advantage of the hardware nearly two years after launch. :'(

 

[kyliethicc]

Who gives a crap about internal optimization of the PS5, and its potential cost reduction, I'm here still waiting for PS5 exclusive games taking advantage of the hardware nearly two years after launch. :'(

play Returnal

 

[Godot25]

smaller chip
lighter console (reduced shipping costs)
less material on cooling assembly
higher cost?

Something is not adding up

JIIIIIIIIM!

 

[sankt-Antonio]

play Returnal

I will, once its cheaper - not gonna spend 69EUR on a roguelike game. But still, you get the idea.

 

[Banjo64]

I will, once its cheaper - not gonna spend 69EUR on a roguelike game. But still, you get the idea.

Everyone gets a free 7 day trial for Premium/Extra and one month of Extra is £10.99. Just play it on that?

 

[remember_spinal]

I will, once its cheaper - not gonna spend 69EUR on a roguelike game. But still, you get the idea.

 

[Lysandros]

I didn't know that so many posters considered PS5 liquid metal paste to be superfluous, interesting.

 

[Zathalus]

in·fla·tion
a general increase in prices and fall in the purchasing value of money.
"policies aimed at controlling inflation"

ex·change rate
the value of one currency for the purpose of conversion to another.
"the exchange rate of the dollar against the Deutschmark"

fan·boy

a boy or man who is an extremely or overly enthusiastic fan of someone or something

 

[kyliethicc]

I will, once its cheaper - not gonna spend 69EUR on a roguelike game. But still, you get the idea.

Why? It’s the best game on PS5 and has endless replay with the arcade high score mode.

It’s a 20-30 hour story and of very high quality. Amazing gameplay, art, sound, and a cool creepy story.

Sounds like you don’t want great a PS5 game. You just want to bitch and moan.

 

[ShakenG]

Why? It’s the best game on PS5 and has endless replay with the arcade high score mode.

It’s a 20-30 hour story and of very high quality. Amazing gameplay, art, sound, and a cool creepy story.

Sounds like you don’t want great a PS5 game. You just want to bitch and moan.

Doesnt Returnal come with the second tier sub? Which in Aus is something like $15.

 

[kyliethicc]

Doesnt Returnal come with the second tier sub? Which in Aus is something like $15.

Yeah it’s in PS Plus Extra as well.

 

[Corndog]

1200 model PS5 uses 6nm SoC

Bit smaller die, uses less energy, allowed Sony to shrink the heatsink.

They can produce more of these dies per wafer as well. (TSMC is moving most of its N7 to N6.)

http://[URL]https://www.angstronomics.com/p/ps5-refresh-oberon-plus

[/URL]



6nm on the left, 7nm on the right

Probably done to improve yields.

 

[Corndog]

I am surprised that they increased the price of the console despite being able to go on a smaller node. I said this in the price increase thread, but prices typically go down as the years go by, node shrinks allow for smaller chips and thus smaller heatsinks and smaller consoles. Even if the smaller node is more expensive, they wouldve seen the cost remain the same by producing more chips per wafer.


not really. the PC GPUs go way to 2.6-2.7 ghz. they dont need Liquid metal. Just simple thermal paste with better heatsinks/vapor chambers will do.

If the die has received a node shrink then it very likely runs cooler than the original which would reduce the need for a larger heatsink and liquid metal thermal paste.

Die shrinks help, but going down to a smaller node is not as financially beneficial as it was in the past.

 

[Naru]

But is it 50 Euros better?

 

[sankt-Antonio]

Why? It’s the best game on PS5 and has endless replay with the arcade high score mode.

It’s a 20-30 hour story and of very high quality. Amazing gameplay, art, sound, and a cool creepy story.

Sounds like you don’t want great a PS5 game. You just want to bitch and moan.

Dude wtf, chill out. Its 69EUR for a repetitive shooter, I'll get it once its reasonably priced. I share your enthusiasm for the game, but sadly its the only game of its kind (real PS5 exclusive that smells next gen) and its a launch title ... That is my main problem.

 

[Max_Po]

On a side note, I been trying to find a freakin DIGITAL ED for a second ps5 once the homebrew becomes available. ...

Piece of crap is non existant in KANADA

 

[vito_don_corleone_]

Cheaper to produce yet they increase the price....

Increase the price outside of US.
Have you seen the exchange rate for EUR or GBP? Think before commenting...

 

[kyliethicc]

Dude wtf, chill out. Its 69EUR for a repetitive shooter, I'll get it once its reasonably priced. I share your enthusiasm for the game, but sadly its the only game of its kind (real PS5 exclusive that smells next gen) and its a launch title ... That is my main problem.

 

[GymWolf]

Cheaper to produce yet they increase the price....

 

[jm89]

New ps5 fifa bundles dropping in a few retailers in the UK today.

If the retailers images of the bundle are accurate, still the cfi-1116a model.

Edit: ps direct have the same bundle and it seems to read cfi-1216a.

 

[Physiognomonics]

You really think Sony would raise power consumption 20W+ for 2fps?

I don't think Sony cares about your energy bills. I think with the PS5 design their inital target was ~220W for the box + cooling system + PSU. But the dynamic clock system was a completely new feature, never done before in a mass produced item, so they needed time to fully test at ~200W before committing with their initial target.

 

[Roman Empire]

I'd kill for a Slim model. I don't like how bulky the PS5 is compared to everything in the room hahaha.

 

[Mephisto40]

Wait does this means the liquid metal will be gone next?

 

[Panajev2001a]

On top of rising inflation outside of USD areas…

smaller chip

Improves yields, does it reduce costs? Remains to be seen. Sony’s biggest focus was to streamline the supply chain and make more consoles rapidly.

lighter console (reduced shipping costs)

Not as much as if they reduced console’s size and thus the volume of each box, but we can keep the list of usual talking points going .

less material on cooling assembly

That yes is a saving, I still think they are being gouged like everyone else on existing materials and costs of shipping that have been rising sp this may not be offsetting things as much as people think.

higher cost?

Something is not adding up

JIIIIIIIIM!

 

[V1LÆM]

Waiting for PS5 Slim.

 

[STARSBarry]

Hah called it

Just watched the video (had been avoiding as dislike the guys video)

But they didn't remove the heatsink from the board, due to improved cooling and power consumption I was wondering if it could be the possible 6nm chip reported on in May rather than the standard 7nm in prior versions.

Guess we will need to wait longer to find out.

Nice to know I'm not losing my touch when it comes to hardware.

 

[V1LÆM]

I'd kill for a Slim model. I don't like how bulky the PS5 is compared to everything in the room hahaha.

They really blew it by making it so damn huge. I respect them going for a whacky new design that isn't basically a black box but did it really need to be that big? Going by the hardware revisions...the answer is no. They went completely overboard with cooling in the launch model because all anyone ever done last gen was cry that their PS4 sounded like a jet engine.

 

[kirby007]

Its mining money

 

[Ezekiel_]

Dude wtf, chill out. Its 69EUR for a repetitive shooter, I'll get it once its reasonably priced. I share your enthusiasm for the game, but sadly its the only game of its kind (real PS5 exclusive that smells next gen) and its a launch title ... That is my main problem.

It's included with PS+ Extra

 

[vito_don_corleone_]

smaller chip
lighter console (reduced shipping costs)
less material on cooling assembly
higher cost?

Something is not adding up

JIIIIIIIIM!

Use your brain, it doesn't hurt...

 

[DeepEnigma]

This is how they're going to hit their numbers they seemed confident on.

 

[MHubert]

fan·boy

a boy or man who is an extremely or overly enthusiastic fan of someone or something

There is not a lot of education fanboys in this thread, that's for sure.