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[Bojji]

We should want it to be even better than DLSS right or do we have a agenda?

I don't know if it's better.
I see better in stills but that isn't enough to convince me.
Need more.

On still images even FSR can look good. True test of quality of reconstruction is in motion.

Both DLSS and XeSS started in much worse position then they are now, but it takes time. What's annoying is that PS fanboys love to jump the gun with some silly conclusions before any evidence appears. PSSR better than DLSS because Sony have upscaling in their tvs for years (like it's similar to real time game rendering)? False, 8K games on PS5 Pro?... LOL.

 

[SKYF@ll]

On still images even FSR can look good. True test of quality of reconstruction is in motion.

Both DLSS and XeSS started in much worse position then they are now, but it takes time. What's annoying is that PS fanboys love to jump the gun with some silly conclusions before any evidence appears. PSSR better than DLSS because Sony have upscaling in their tvs for years (like it's similar to real time game rendering)? False, 8K games on PS5 Pro?... LOL.

We'll only know the quality of PSSR once the game is patched when the PS5 Pro launches in November.
Let's hope it evolves from α ~ β versions we're seeing today.

 

[ChiefDada]

We'll only know the quality of PSSR once the game is patched when the PS5 Pro launches in November.
Let's hope it evolves from α ~ β versions we're seeing today.

True. Insomniac in particular have been known clear fidelity and performance quirks on their games up to final release.

 

[Mister Wolf]

DLSS has no image issues?

Not as many as PSSR in comparison. You'll see this on full display when DF covers the Alan Wake 2 patch.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Not as many as PSSR in comparison. You'll see this on full display when DF covers the Alan Wake 2 patch.

I'll wait for reputable places to compare.

 

[Bojji]

I'll wait for reputable places to compare.

What places? Many people dislike DF but it's usually because their hurt they feelings, not because they are wrong about hard data sometimes they are, but so is everyone

VG is great but produces too little content, NXG has obvious bias for Sony and is wrong about stuff more than DF. I don't know about anyone else that is even close to them, rest of comparisons on the Internet are usually pure nonsense.

 

[Darkkahn]

Guys, what if PSSR is not as good as DLSS?

 

[ChiefDada]

Guys, what if PSSR is not as good as DLSS?

Simple:

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

What places? Many people dislike DF but it's usually because their hurt they feelings, not because they are wrong about hard data sometimes they are, but so is everyone

VG is great but produces too little content, NXG has obvious bias for Sony and is wrong about stuff more than DF. I don't know about anyone else that is even close to them, rest of comparisons on the Internet are usually pure nonsense.

Those two are better and not biased like DF is known for.

 

[Gaiff]

Would be nice if Tim from HU analyzed it. He’s terrific when it comes to image technologies.

 

[Roni]

You are all trying too hard.

They never disappoint. $700 for 3080/4090 features. What a steal! /s

 

[Codeblew]

Guys, what if PSSR is not as good as DLSS?

I am just glad it is better than FSR which makes everything look like it was smeared with vaseline.

 

[Senua]

We should want it to be even better than DLSS right or do we have a agenda?

Expecting Sony to beat DLSS right off the bat was very optimistic. We shall wait for monday but from all impressions. But I'm sure you'll not trust DF anyway, as they won't tell you what you want to hear...Speaking of agendas.

 

[winjer]

Would be nice if Tim from HU analyzed it. He’s terrific when it comes to image technologies.

Yes, he does great comparisons.
Even better than DF or Ancient Gameplays.

 

[ap_puff]

On still images even FSR can look good. True test of quality of reconstruction is in motion.

Both DLSS and XeSS started in much worse position then they are now, but it takes time. What's annoying is that PS fanboys love to jump the gun with some silly conclusions before any evidence appears. PSSR better than DLSS because Sony have upscaling in their tvs for years (like it's similar to real time game rendering)? False, 8K games on PS5 Pro?... LOL.

If PSSR is even 95% as good as DLSS it's a win for console, FSR is complete dogshit especially when devs don't put any effort into making it look good.

 

[amc]

So the leading AI deep learning and reconstruction tech that's powering the world's current AI revolution is going to be upstaged by Sony due to their TV picture upscale algorithm knowledge. OK.

I hope PSSR is good, great even but silly hyperbole just feeds sad war know nothings.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Expecting Sony to beat DLSS right off the bat was very optimistic. We shall wait for monday but from all impressions. But I'm sure you'll not trust DF anyway, as they won't tell you what you want to hear...Speaking of agendas.

Agendas can't answer simple questions I asked you for all to see.

It's not right off the bat.
Don't trust them but that doesn't mean they are never right.

 

[Loboxxx]

Is it known or is there any indication if the console has dedicated hardware to handle PSSR?

 

[MisterXDTV]

Is it known or is there any indication if the console has dedicated hardware to handle PSSR?

"We added custom hardware for machine learning"

From Cerny's presentation

 

[winjer]

Is it known or is there any indication if the console has dedicated hardware to handle PSSR?

It does. We just don't know yet if it's something like an NPU. Or if it's WMMA extensions.

 

[Ronin_7]

So the leading AI deep learning and reconstruction tech that's powering the world's current AI revolution is going to be upstaged by Sony due to their TV picture upscale algorithm knowledge. OK.

I hope PSSR is good, great even but silly hyperbole just feeds sad war know nothings.

Idk why people are assuming is better, if it's at least 85% as good it'll still be incredible.

 

[pasterpl]

What a waste of OP. Most images are comparing games on ps5 vs ps5 pro and your main thesis, at this point, is mute and wishful thinking. Next I propose you show us and analyse how it compares to ps4 pro version of the games.

 

[lmimmfn]

There's a lot of copium in here

 

[rnlval]

I would wait for some direct capture of the real thing, before jumping to conclusions one way or the other

They are just nitpicking on a video trailer right now....

One thing is for sure:

PSSR will destroy FSR2 and that's the whole point of it...

AMD has recently announced AI-based FSR4.

 

[twilo99]

AMD has recently announced AI-based FSR4.

It will be very strange if they didn't...

AMD's next generation of GPUs will be very interesting in terms of price vs. performance .. everyone is writing them off but I've got a good feeling about it, at least from a consumer standpoint

 

[MisterXDTV]

AMD has recently announced AI-based FSR4.

Sure, let's see it in 2026

PS5 Pro is launching in 2 months, not 2 years

 

[Madjako]

We’ve know about PS5 Pro for years, we’ve known that PSSR was a core part of this system for years, we know that Sony has been investigating upscaling since CBR on PS4 Pro and anti aliasing algorithms since PS3 (MLAA). This isn’t like AMD farting out FSR to quickly have something to put next to Nvidia. They’ve been working on these problems for a long time, longer than Nvidia, and their work has influenced developments elsewhere.

There’s no reason not to think PSSR will be an excellent solution, outside of being a Nvidia fanboy.

I remember the amazing divX upscale on the PS3

 

[Lumpyoatmeal]

I was curious and went looking back on DF comparisons of PS5 resolution/fidelity modes with a 4090 DLAA max settings, and preliminary comparison suggests to me that PSSR is potentially a vastly superior solution. I gathered the limited samples from today's Cerny tech talk where base PS5 fidelity mode was compared to PS5 Pro that doubled frame rate in addition to improving effective resolution. For the DF comparisons, I have Spider-Man Miles Morales and Horizon Forbidden West where, again, Alex compares 4K DLAA max settings image quality to PS5 fidelity modes (unfortunately, DF didn't use Fidelity mode for their Ratchet PC analysis). I won't point out the differences, instead I'll let you be the judge and see which ML upscaling technique appears to provide more impressive uplifts. Of course this is early days and I'm not claiming PSSR is definitively better, as 3rd party games might be a completely different scenario. But I still think the possibility of even first party games on PS5 Pro besting top of the line GPUs in image quality is a big deal.

PS5 Pro PSSR vs PS5 Fidelity Mode (Spider-Man 2/Ratchet):

4090 DLAA Max Settings vs PS5 Fidelity Mode (Spider-Man Miles Morales):

4090 DLAA Max Settings vs PS5 Fidelity Mode (Horizon Forbidden West):

Where ChiefDada at?

Does the PS5 Pro best the top of the line graphic cards like the 4090 in image quality or nah? Shit we didn’t even make it to next year and we already got developers like Remedy Entertainment making excuses, games are only going to get more demanding from this point on especially when the Unreal Engine 5 receive updates to its feature set with more graphical features in the next years.

 

[octos]

That's 100% correct, PSSR delivers better image quality than DLSS, but currently inferior to DLSS2 and DLSS3.

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

So the leading AI deep learning and reconstruction tech

DLSS is not the leading deep learning tech. It's the leading image reconstruction tech. in gaming, but if you look at research papers it's already a decade behind.

that's powering the world's current AI revolution

DLSS is not powering the world's AI revolution. You're making wholly absurd claims.

is going to be upstaged by Sony due to their TV picture upscale algorithm knowledge. OK.

I hope PSSR is good, great even but silly hyperbole just feeds sad war know nothings.

DLSS is an algorithm. How it works is not hidden to anyone. All the major technologists in this field working on image reconstruction tech know how it works. Just as they know how FSR works and they'll eventually know how PSSR works once it's out in the wild and the documentation is in the hands of devs.

There's nothing specifically special about looking at an algorithm, understanding how it works and therefore how to make it better. Any engineer worth their socks is able to do this. What has held back FSR up until now hasn't been the software algorithm part of things, rather the lack of dedicated hardware support in silicon, e.g. tensor cores.

With PS5 Pro, AMD has closed the gap with the dedicated hardware support for AI computation (i.e. low precision matrix math arrays with large registers and a reasonable amount of on-die cache). Now they have the hardware, writing a software imagine reconstruction algorithm that performs better than DLSS is trivial.

It would not surprise me if DLSS is beaten by PSSR, and then the next iteration of DLSS comes out soon after and beats PSSR. Technology is always evolving, and what is implemented in actual processors in the wild is nothing close to the cutting edge in the research domain. It ALWAYS lags behind.

 

[VolticArchangel]

Would be nice if Tim from HU analyzed it. He’s terrific when it comes to image technologies.

Yes, he does great comparisons.
Even better than DF or Ancient Gameplays.

Tim's pretty good at mostly everything image quality related.

My go-to techtuber source for new monitor reviews, too. Very in-depth analysis.

 

[Physiognomonics]

The Pro is absolutely weaker compared to the 4070 going off Sonys own performance estimates and the specifications of the GPU. The difference isn’t exactly massive and would probably not really matter to the average person so saying the 4070 best matches the Pro makes sense.

And NXGamer? Honest? The same guy that kept comparing the PS5 vs his 2070? A card that going by the raw specs alone is something like 20% worse then the PS5?

According to DF the 4070 Super is performing 45% better than PS5 in pure rasterization benchmark in a heavily GPU limited scene (a cutscene). This is real life comparison using a 4070 Super. You know usually it's better than paper specs.

 

[Zathalus]

According to DF the 4070 Super is performing 45% better than PS5 in pure rasterization benchmark in a heavily GPU scene. This is real life comparison using a 4070 Super. You know usually it's better than user paper specs.

On average across a wide variety of games? Or just in a single game? If it’s just a single game that’s a poor metric to judge performance by. With that you can claim that the PS5 is no more powerful than a 2060 Super. Or the 7900 XTX is more powerful than a 4090.

 

[Bojji]

On average across a wide variety of games? Or just in a single game? If it’s just a single game that’s a poor metric to judge performance by. With that you can claim that the PS5 is no more powerful than a 2060 Super. Or the 7900 XTX is more powerful than a 4090.

4070 super is pretty much 2x performance of PS5 in almost all games they tested. LoU is the outlier but of course only this game shows TRUE DIFFERENCE in performance according to usual suspects here

 

[Physiognomonics]

On average across a wide variety of games? Or just in a single game? If it’s just a single game that’s a poor metric to judge performance by. With that you can claim that the PS5 is no more powerful than a 2060 Super. Or the 7900 XTX is more powerful than a 4090.

Sure everytime a PS5 port doesn't perform twice as well as on PS5 it must be a bad port, right? the 45% is already an average from Cerny based on their own testings. It's not an average done on specs and has never been! They have done internal benchmarks and have arrived at this average. Only XBox fanboys will use the specs. Specs are meaningless. before doing comparisons people thought XSX would outperform PS5 by 20% on average. It's not the case.

 

[poppabk]

I am just glad it is better than FSR which makes everything look like it was smeared with vaseline.

I use FSR all the time, and in quality mode upscaling to 4K it looks fine. Part of the problem with FSR is that it sucks with lower resolutions, but the Pro is already fixing that side of the equation without PSSR. The advantage of DLSS and PSSR will be that you can get the same or better quality from 1080p that FSR gets from 1440p.

 

[Zathalus]

Sure everytime a PS5 port doesn't perform twice as well as on PS5 it must be a bad port, right? the 45% is already an average from Cerny based on their own testings. It's not an average done on specs and has never been! They have done internal banchmarks and have arrived at this average. Only XBox fanboys will use the specs. Specs are meaningless. before doing comparisons people thought XSX would outperform PS5 by 20% on average. It's not the case.

But TLOU is a bad port. I’m not even sure how anyone can debate otherwise? And why should this specific game be elevated above all others, some even being Sony ports themselves? Even using this game on average a Pro would perform well under a 4070 Super with the very rare game (one?) having them have equal performance.

 

[Physiognomonics]

But TLOU is a bad port. I’m not even sure how anyone can debate otherwise? And why should this specific game be elevated above all others, some even being Sony ports themselves? Even using this game on average a Pro would perform well under a 4070 Super with the very rare game (one?) having them have equal performance.

It is not. Only because the 4070 S doesn't run it twice as good as PS5, but only 45% better. So now we are openly cherry picking which games we must select to judge PS5 vs PC? You are reasonning like a Xbox fanboy.

 

[FireFly]

It is not. Only because the 4070 S doesn't run it twice as good as PS5, but only 45% better. So now we are openly cherry picking which games we must select to judge PS5 vs PC? You are reasonning like a Xbox fanboy.

I mean cherry picking would be selecting a single game only. A more balanced approach would be to measure across a wide range of titles.

 

[poppabk]

It is not. Only because the 4070 S doesn't run it twice as good as PS5, but only 45% better. So now we are openly cherry picking which games we must select to judge PS5 vs PC? You are reasonning like a Xbox fanboy.

It should be fairly obvious that Sony games would be the least representative.

 

[adamsapple]

It is not. Only because the 4070 S doesn't run it twice as good as PS5, but only 45% better. So now we are openly cherry picking which games we must select to judge PS5 vs PC? You are reasonning like a Xbox fanboy.

???

TLoU Part 1 was a NOTORIOUSLY bad port which took almost a years worth of patching to get it to an acceptable modern state. It was extremely well covered in most websites, how do you even forget something like that?

 

[Zathalus]

It is not. Only because the 4070 S doesn't run it twice as good as PS5, but only 45% better. So now we are openly cherry picking which games we must select to judge PS5 vs PC? You are reasonning like a Xbox fanboy.

Cherry picking would be using a single game to compare to the PS5. A single game that had severe performance bugs, broken settings, and game breaking bugs on launch. A game that almost nothing else on PC performs like, not even other Sony ports. Being fair and balanced would be comparing performance across a wide variety of games.

 

[sono]

Relax pc brothers. 5090 will be out soon. Sonys can’t upgrade the pro so it will only be a little while before the comeback

 

[Justin9mm]

You Sony fan boys are setting yourself’s up for failure with this nonsense.

Like when Series X and PS5 was announced and people were laughing at PS5 specs over X? Look how that turned out! I wouldn't be dismissing the capabilities of PSSR just yet.

 

[Taycan77]

4070 super is pretty much 2x performance of PS5 in almost all games they tested. LoU is the outlier but of course only this game shows TRUE DIFFERENCE in performance according to usual suspects here

I just watched the latest DF vid on God of War Ragnarok in which the PS5 version is visually superior to a 4090.

Yes, I know that is down to porting issues and the nature of games designed for console, but it highlights how underutilised PC hardware is.

PC gamers should be welcoming PS5 Pro with open arms, as it's only now devs will start pushing features PC excels at.

In real world scenarios I think we will struggle to differentiate between PS5 Pro and high end PC, unless you are pushing extreme framerates, or it's one of the few titles built from the ground up on PC.

 

[Wolfpact1983]

PC is becoming really inefficient for gaming. Will be obsolete in a few years.

 

[Kazdi]

If PSSR is close to to DLSS which nvidia has been improving for the last 5 years it is a win situation. PSSR will keep improving over time also.
Real question is if sony brings frame generation in the future. Pro certainly has enough tops to do it.

 

[Randall365]

Relax pc brothers. 5090 will be out soon. Sonys can’t upgrade the pro so it will only be a little while before the comeback

5090 will be over £2k and will likely melt the power wires.

 

[Gaiff]

It is not.

 

[Bojji]

I just watched the latest DF vid on God of War Ragnarok in which the PS5 version is visually superior to a 4090.

Yes, I know that is down to porting issues and the nature of games designed for console, but it highlights how underutilised PC hardware is.

PC gamers should be welcoming PS5 Pro with open arms, as it's only now devs will start pushing features PC excels at.

In real world scenarios I think we will struggle to differentiate between PS5 Pro and high end PC, unless you are pushing extreme framerates, or it's one of the few titles built from the ground up on PC.

This is another mediocre port, done by 3 people or so. Full of bugs and technical problems, looks like they didn't really care (there should be bigger team doing this).

Anything released by Sony on PC but not done by nixxes is usually in bad state for months.