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RAGE |OT| "It's done when it's done"

A

angular graphics

Banned
I H8 Memes said:
Maybe this game on PC doesnt deserve serious "they shot themselves in the foot" levels of outrage, but I wonder what this means for quakecon. Why would PC gamers bother showing up anymore?
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It'll turn into turn into BethesdaCon anyway..
 
J

jett

D-Member
Marco1 said:
Love this post.
So when Doom 4 arrives and it looks and plays absolutely great, PC gamers won't buy it? Give me a break FFS.
This is like COD4:MW2, remember the petitions because of no dedi servers? First week it was the most played game on steam.
Remember the annoying stutter on oblivion and fallout3 and NV? It needed a mod to fix and people still bought it.
A good game is a good game no matter what way or what on you play it.
The honest truth is that the money is and will be on consoles, that is why they come first. A business does not run on goodwill and loyalty to a format that is just not there.
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medium_accomplished-1.jpg
 
M

Mastperf

Member
plagiarize said:
Carmack didn't mess up at all, because unlike Epic who design their technology to be licensed by anyone, Carmack developed the technology for ID, and only Bethesda are going to be using it.
Click to expand...
But do we know if that was the plan all along or just the result of being too late to the market?
 
J

jett

D-Member
Mastperf said:
But do we know if that was the plan all along or just the result of being too late to the market?
Click to expand...

It's result of getting gobbled up by Bethesda. id Tech 5 was supposed to be licensed to third parties. Personally I doubt Bethesda will be using it at all. It's nothing but a failure of an engine, its priority number one was to ease game development but Rage ended up taking 7 years to make, lolz.
 
T

thetrin

Hail, peons, for I have come as ambassador from the great and bountiful Blueberry Butt Explosion
Marco1 said:
Love this post.
So when Doom 4 arrives and it looks and plays absolutely great, PC gamers won't buy it? Give me a break FFS.
This is like COD4:MW2, remember the petitions because of no dedi servers? First week it was the most played game on steam.
Remember the annoying stutter on oblivion and fallout3 and NV? It needed a mod to fix and people still bought it.
A good game is a good game no matter what way or what on you play it.
The honest truth is that the money is and will be on consoles, that is why they come first. A business does not run on goodwill and loyalty to a format that is just not there.
Click to expand...
LOL, you just got trolled, son.
 
P

plagiarize

Banned
junkster said:
I know its a beta but aside from maybe God of War 3 I haven't seen too many miracles... you haven't played the console Battlefield beta have you?

That's an example of why I think targeting 60fps for consoles is a necessary evil.
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i don't think it's an evil at all, honestly... and i sort of expect that next gen we'll see more 60 fps 720p titles than we did this gen. kind of like PS1 to PS2 gen.

you look at the best selling titles, and the percentage of them that are 60 fps is much more notable than the percentage of console titles that are 60 fps. i don't think the average consumer understands frame rate or anything like that, but i genuinely believe they feel the difference even if they don't see it.

i don't think Netherrealms broke their backs getting UE3 to 60 fps without good reason. i don't think the Forza team did so much to reach it without good reason. i don't think sports titles were wrong to trump hitting it after a couple of versions.

will Epic build another engine that basically can't go beyond 30 fps next gen? i seriously doubt it, and just that alone will hopefully bring us more 60 fps titles.

Rage's tech seems just a shade beyond the current consoles. the cost of 60 fps is clearly more than some people want to pay... so i think it's too early to be sad it isn't going to get licensed much. hopefully by the time the next consoles roll around, they'll rethink that... but then again if UE4 (or whatever) can do 60 fps next time, it won't be a big issue.
 
M

Mastperf

Member
jett said:
It's result of getting gobbled up by Bethesda. id Tech 5 was supposed to be licensed to third parties. Personally I doubt Bethesda will be using it at all. It's nothing but a failure of an engine, its priority number one was to ease game development but Rage ended up taking 7 years to make, lolz.
Click to expand...
Was id forced ( so to speak) to sell in order to stay afloat? I assume they had very little income coming in.
 
P

plagiarize

Banned
jett said:
It's result of getting gobbled up by Bethesda. id Tech 5 was supposed to be licensed to third parties. Personally I doubt Bethesda will be using it at all. It's nothing but a failure of an engine, its priority number one was to ease game development but Rage ended up taking 7 years to make, lolz.
Click to expand...
Carmack has always made his engines for ID first. sure, they've licensed them, but they weren't designed with being licensed in mind. they only ever included what ID needed for their next game.

Epic on the other hand designed their engines to be capable of just about anything, to allow easy movement of content between versions, to be modular so as to allow a developer to write their own renderer, but still use the unreal tools... and much more.

the Quake 3 engine that Carmack built didn't allow for mid level saving. because Quake 3 Arena didn't need mid level saving. so they didn't code it. licensees had to code it. ID Tech 4 was good at making games that looked like Doom 3, because that was all it was coded to do.
 
J

jett

D-Member
Mastperf said:
Was id forced ( so to speak) to sell in order to stay afloat? I assume they had very little income coming in.
Click to expand...

They were probably afraid of going down in case RAGE wasn't a big success.
 
A

AwRy108

Member
Mrbob said:
You might want to look at what Epic has stated their future priorities are before saying they wrote off pc. If anything they are about to make the jump back in and having nothing left for consoles after Gears 3. PC/iOS future for them at the moment. Infinity Blade getting a sequel on December 1 with Shadow Complex 2 being completely ignored says a lot right there.
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I see zero PC announcements in this comment. Unreal Tournament III was EPIC's most recent PC title (2007), and it was a pretty big failure for them. 360 exclusives and selling their engine for console/iOS use have made them rich, which doesn't speak well for their future with the PC market.

I just hope we don't see id take the same route, though their release of a shoddy version of RAGE for the PC does raise questions.
 
S

subversus

I've done nothing with my life except eat and fap
I think this situation may be a glimpse into the future. This texture pop-in and general perfomance problems are problems of API overheads according to Carmack. They were able to code texture streaming close to the metal on consoles but they had to ask hardware vendors to help them with this on PC and the result is still not good enough as it should have been 120 hz game on PC for most configs + no streaming problems whatsoever.

So if Unreal Engine and other engines will be developed with consoles in mind for the next gen PC superiority in graphics might end there for a long time.

Except Epic are much more level-headed and their market is huge and includes F2P, MMOs, Mac, indie developers and even browsers since yesterday. So I think Unreal Engine may perform equally good on all systems.
 
T

Truant

Member
I'm enjoying the game a lot, but it sucks how the enemies are using different weapons that you can't pick up. Saw a 1911 pistol and a bunch of assault rifles. I wish there was more weapon variety.
 
M

MrBig

Member
Truant said:
I'm enjoying the game a lot, but it sucks how the enemies are using different weapons that you can't pick up. Saw a 1911 pistol and a bunch of assault rifles. I wish there was more weapon variety.
Click to expand...
I've only been two towns and seen quite a bit of weapons available for purchase. Don't know why we can't pick up weapons though
 
J

jett

D-Member
plagiarize said:
Carmack has always made his engines for ID first. sure, they've licensed them, but they weren't designed with being licensed in mind. they only ever included what ID needed for their next game.

Epic on the other hand designed their engines to be capable of just about anything, to allow easy movement of content between versions, to be modular so as to allow a developer to write their own renderer, but still use the unreal tools... and much more.

the Quake 3 engine that Carmack built didn't allow for mid level saving. because Quake 3 Arena didn't need mid level saving. so they didn't code it. licensees had to code it. ID Tech 4 was good at making games that looked like Doom 3, because that was all it was coded to do.
Click to expand...

Well, all right, but id tech 5 always seemed to me like it was made with other developers in mind.
 
M

Mastperf

Member
Yeah, the whole mega texture talk made it seem like they were trying to sell it. I still believe that at one point they were. I'm thinking the engine quirks would have made support a nightmare so they decided otherwise.
 
M

Mrbob

Member
AwRy108 said:
I see zero PC announcements in this comment. Unreal Tournament III was EPIC's most recent PC title (2007), and it was a pretty big failure for them. 360 exclusives and selling their engine for console/iOS use have made them rich, which doesn't speak well for their future with the PC market.

I just hope we don't see id take the same route, though their release of a shoddy version of RAGE for the PC does raise questions.
Click to expand...

You mean the same engine that runs on PC as well? Oh and now it runs on flash too. Epic is covering all their bases.

Epic has already announced they are making a PC exclusive. They want to outsource Shadow Complex 2 while working on being a heavy driver in the iOS market. How exactly are they dedicating anything to consoles anymore outside of being a Gears studio and a multi platform engine provider? With new consoles coming on the horizon it makes zero business sense for Epic to go exclusive for anything they do next.
 
D

Doc Holliday

SPOILER: Columbus finds America
A couple of observations after playing RAGE for a little more time..

- Rage is an an ID game through and through. It feels just like Quake 1, Quake 2, Quake 3, and Doom 3. Which is fine if the game has a deathmatch component. Quake 1, 2, and 3 had amazing mulitiplayer that completely overshadowed the crappy campaign modes imo. This game so far is pretty dated, in terms of gameplay.

- This engine despite not having deathmatch seems to be built for competitive online play. Smooth Framerate, flat lighting, responsive controls, and small indoor areas. Hopefully this bodes well for Quake 5 or Doom 4.

- The last few years have turned me into an FPS pussy. I keep trying to take cover and be stealthy. Fuck that! You can actually rush most opponents and rely on old school reflexes to take out a room pretty easily.

- Not sure how I feel about megatexturing. You have an amazing variety of textures but they look like crap.
 
Truespeed

Truespeed

Member
Mastperf said:
Some have believed for a while now that there might be some sort of bottleneck with the PS3. We've seen instances where PS3 games with required installs have only matched the 360 version running from dvd.
Click to expand...

And we've seen many games that don't require mandatory installs. That bottleneck you're referring to often comes down to competence or porting effort.
 
G

Geoff9920

Member
Picked up and put a little time into the 360 version during my lunch break. Very nice change to be able to focus on the actual game. I <3 the AI in this game. The framerate is nice, but that AI makes all the difference in the world.
 
bloodydrake

bloodydrake

Cool Smoke Luke
I think some people aren't keeping things in perspective about PC performance.
Has there ever been a PC specific engine that's completely new feature sets and design that ran flawlessly at launch?

UE2 wasn't perfect day one on 3 gens of each main Video card manufactures series of card.
Crytec's engine wouldn't run well on just about anything except top end when it launched.

Hell you can't play any Dice games the first week due to clusterfuck that they call servers.(well thats as much EA)

Bad performance,texture thrashing/flashing/crashing/defective matchmaking, its all business as usual in PC gaming land. Couple months of driver updates and patches and we'll be good for any games that comeout based on idtech5.

Its never been plug and play..thats always been what consoles are for..

I just don't get the OMG id sucks and failed, they use to be so good look how low they've fallen hyperbole.
 
M

Mastperf

Member
Truespeed said:
And we've seen many games that don't require mandatory installs. That bottleneck you're referring to often comes down to competence or porting effort.
Click to expand...
And Rage suffers from neither...
 
K

KPunk

Member
my biggest issue with this game is terrible screen-tearing with a Dell IPS on a 560ti, any movement what so ever has screen-tearing directly in the middle of the screen. Pop in was a a slightly annoying until i enabled GPU transcode and .cfg file, however screen-tearing just wont go away :(
 
L

Lothars

Member
I played an hour of the 360 version last night and wow it's one of the best looking games on the 360.

I am very impressed by it and I look forward to playing more of it.
 
D

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
bloodydrake said:
I think some people aren't keeping things in perspective about PC performance.
Has there ever been a PC specific engine that's completely new feature sets and design that ran flawlessly at launch?

UE2 wasn't perfect day one on 3 gens of each main Video card manufactures series of card.
Crytec's engine wouldn't run well on just about anything except top end when it launched.

Hell you can't play any Dice games the first week due to clusterfuck that they call servers.(well thats as much EA)

Bad performance,texture thrashing/flashing/crashing/defective matchmaking, its all business as usual in PC gaming land. Couple months of driver updates and patches and we'll be good for any games that comeout based on idtech5.

Its never been plug and play..thats always been what consoles are for..

I just don't get the OMG id sucks and failed, they use to be so good look how low they've fallen hyperbole.
Click to expand...
Doom 3 was the first game to use idtech 4 and that happened to run absolutely flawlessly out of the gate for most people. It was a fantastic launch with very few issues. I don't think it was unreasonable to expect id to pull that off again with Rage.
 
N

nel e nel

Member
Chief_Falcon said:
The textures are nothing like what id advertised in their trailers. Am I getting some kind of hardware detection bug or is this what the game really looks like
Click to expand...

I noticed the same thing and mentioned it in my posts earlier in the thread. It has been mentioned it many of the reviews as well that the textures look great in mid-long range areas, but kinda break down under close scrutiny.

The character models, however, are pretty effin' amazing.
 
F

Fantasmo

Member
bloodydrake said:
I think some people aren't keeping things in perspective about PC performance.
Has there ever been a PC specific engine that's completely new feature sets and design that ran flawlessly at launch?

UE2 wasn't perfect day one on 3 gens of each main Video card manufactures series of card.
Crytec's engine wouldn't run well on just about anything except top end when it launched.

Hell you can't play any Dice games the first week due to clusterfuck that they call servers.(well thats as much EA)

Bad performance,texture thrashing/flashing/crashing/defective matchmaking, its all business as usual in PC gaming land. Couple months of driver updates and patches and we'll be good for any games that comeout based on idtech5.

Its never been plug and play..thats always been what consoles are for..

I just don't get the OMG id sucks and failed, they use to be so good look how low they've fallen hyperbole.
Click to expand...
Totally. Wolfenstein sucked on a 286, Doom sucked on a 386, Quake sucked until GLQuake, and Doom3 sucked on a GeForce3.

This one is a liittle different. I have a feeling this one is actually going to run fine on most gaming PCs after some drivers and patches. Day 1 is usually a bad day with new tech in PC land lol.
 
G

garath

Member
Actually played the game some instead of just tinkering with cvars and I'm enjoying it :)

When do we get to use the crimson armor from the Anarchy edition? I'm only on the second mission so I'm sure it's coming up but I didn't see anything in the menu about equipping armor so I was curious.
 
L

Lothars

Member
AgentOtaku said:
lol

didn't realize you had to install BOTH DISCS to run it off the HDD, not just one at a time

...still installing
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So on 360 you have to install both discs to have it run off the HDD?
 
M

Mastperf

Member
Truespeed said:
As long as you use a SSD on the PS3.
Click to expand...
I was referring to "That bottleneck you're referring to often comes down to competence or porting effort."
Rage suffers from neither incompetence nor lack of effort.
 
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