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[JaseC]

So I spent the better part of my weekend battling the gargoyles boss. Dying multiple time and each time making my way back to it and reclaiming my souls. I ended up accumulating around 20,000 souls. And I can't wait to defeat him and I am thinking of all the nice ways that I am going to spend those souls. So I decide maybe I should grind a little bit before attempting the fight again. I wander around fighting those skeletons mobs and one of them that I usually have no problem killing almost destroys me. So barely have any vitality left and he still coming after me. I sprint away, he is chasing me, navigating through the corridors, gotta make my way back to the bond fire where I will be safe. But no, wrong camera angle, and I end up falling to my death and losing those 20,000 souls that I spent two days accumulating. I get so angry that I quit the game, take the disk out and put it back in its gamefly envelop. I am returning that piece of crap. I need to have be able to have fun with my games and not be angry all the time. Was about to drop the game in the mail this morning but so happen to forget it on my desk. So I am listening to weekend confirmed on my way to work and listening to Jeff Kennata talking about his experience with Dark Souls managed to get me excited again and now I can't wait to get back home and give this another shot.

It seems you've wandered into the wrong thread.

 

[nel e nel]

My only gripe is that there was no final boss battle, which is something I assumed the game was leading up to when you received the pulse rifle complete with some BFG ammo. What's the point of offering the player a BFG without an end character to waste it on?

That was my gripe too. It's not that it was a poor level, mechanics wise, it's just that they build up all this hype: "No one knows what's in there!" "Everyone who has gone there has never returned!" "No one has ever seen Gen. Kross and lived to tell the tale!" (ok, that last one is a bit hyperbolic, but you get the idea) and then you spend half of it crawling through an air duct.

I think that they could have cut 50% out of Wellspring, added it to the capital city section, and had more of a proper 3 act game, instead of the 1.75 acts they gave us.

That doesn't mean I didn't enjoy myself and that I won't go back to play on nightmare and collect all the CCG cards.

 

[Mr_eX]

I guess I'd say it's not really an apt comparison because they are attempting different things, but I enjoyed the FO3 levels a lot more in terms of exploration, Rage's levels are very generic, straight path ordeals. Certainly they have a higher density of design work, but the game is also a fourth of the size. I have mixed feelings about Rage, but in terms of level design, I think it's weak compared to it's peers.

While the levels are linear I don't think I'd say they're generic. Of corse that could just be the art style hiding the genericness of them. There's just something about the art style that makes the entire game look unique to me, not sure what it is though.

 

[Echoplx]

edit: wrong thread

 

[fizzelopeguss]

I think it has more to do with the fact that the amount of data you would need for texture maps would be astronomical. There is no way you could even fit the entire overworld on one disk (perhaps not even a blu-ray), so things would have to be broken up.

With the way rage is (prebaked right down to texture specularity) i'd say even openworld basics like day and night cycle are completely infeasible.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Traversal and environment navigation in this game is ridiculous to the point of affecting gameplay, looks as if the jump button doesn't have a proper use. Really surprised this issue hasn't pop in many reviews or user opinions.

At one time a 2 feet obstacle prevented me from optimally navigate the environment because i couldn't jump it so i had to circle around it. In another occasion i couldn't flank an enemy because i wasn't able to jump over a box. Doesn't make any sense.

That's leaving outside all the restrictions the levels impose on the player. Fucking incredible this game hasn't been grilled more in reviews.

While the levels are linear I don't think I'd say they're generic. Of corse that could just be the art style hiding the genericness of them. There's just something about the art style that makes the entire game look unique to me, not sure what it is though.

Level design is functional, not much imagination went into it. The visual look is a different matter.

 

[Mr_eX]

Traversal and environment navigation in this game is ridiculous to the point of affecting gameplay, looks as if the jump button doesn't have a proper use. Really surprised this issue hasn't pop in many reviews or user opinions.

At one time a 2 feet obstacle prevented me from optimally navigate the environment because i couldn't jump it so i had to circle around it. In another occasion i couldn't flank an enemy because i wasn't able to jump over a box. Doesn't make any sense.

That's leaving outside all the restrictions the levels impose on the player. Fucking incredible this game hasn't been grilled more in reviews.

I noticed this too but after about 20 minutes I adjusted and stopped trying to jump over things. It doesn't really bother me.

 

[Deadbeat]

With the way rage is (prebaked right down to texture specularity) i'd say even openworld basics like day and night cycle are completely infeasible.

Also there is no physics at all in the environment. Everything is bolted down. But hey that sure helped getting those 60fps. Also no AA and the resolution scaling down to obscene levels.

I wonder how many people that talk about how "amazing" this game's graphics are have downplayed Mirrors Edge's graphics saying prebaked lighting didnt count. But it counts with id for some reason.

 

[Mr_eX]

If they release an add on that adds a few more modes and increases the player limit I could see myself getting really addicted to the mulitplayer.

I don't suppose that after you finish the campaign it unlocks online multiplayer for the card game?

 

[Refreshment.01]

I noticed this too but after about 20 minutes I adjusted and stopped trying to jump over things. It doesn't really bother me.

Lucky, if you are willing to give that issue a pass, but it's a clear limitation that gets in the way of the other wise good shooting mechanics and AI.

Also there is no physics at all in the environment. Everything is bolted down. But hey that sure helped getting those 60fps. Also no AA and the resolution scaling down to obscene levels.

Another very valid complain that many people are overlooking. Almost non existent environment interaction or any type of physics simulation. No objects populating the levels, just that static plastic like geometry. Im surprised the game is avering over 8, the game is more a 7 game. It just ignores many of the advancements we more or less take for granted in this gen of consoles, a super charged previous gen game definitely sums up the Rage experience.

The game ranges from "ok" to good, not great like some people are portraying.

 

[54-46!]

I'm not really sold on the "kill boxes", I have no problem with linearity and corridors but when I can stand in one cover position and kill 15 enemies without them trying to flank me and whatnot it's kind of underwhelming.. I love the gunplay, there's punch in the weapons and the hit / kill animations is a nice feedback but it's hard to get excited when the enemies aren't giving me any reason to move around and be creative.

Does it get better later on? I've just entered the Authority prison.

 

[popsicle_sundays]

So my PC copy will be here sometime this week, I had a question though:

I noticed the patch notes; does the patch now not require modifying files for better textures, etc..? Or is the update just a simple update and going the route discussed in this thread earlier the better way?

 

[JaseC]

So my PC copy will be here sometime this week, I had a question though:

I noticed the patch notes; does the patch now not require modifying files for better textures, etc..? Or is the update just a simple update and going the route discussed in this thread earlier the better way?

The patch renders the texture size and vsync cvars present in custom config files redundant, yes. Personally, the patch completely eradicated texture pop-in. AMD GPU users, being stuck with the worst driver support ever, are still experiencing problems, however.

 

[Wallach]

So my PC copy will be here sometime this week, I had a question though:

I noticed the patch notes; does the patch now not require modifying files for better textures, etc..? Or is the update just a simple update and going the route discussed in this thread earlier the better way?

If you update the game, you can just use the in-game settings. You might need to force sync via drivers instead of in-game.

 

[Alex Connolly]

I wonder how many people that talk about how "amazing" this game's graphics are have downplayed Mirrors Edge's graphics saying prebaked lighting didnt count. But it counts with id for some reason.

Nobody has said anything either way, as far as I know. I loved Mirror's Edge's prebaked lighting, not because it was prebaked, but because it just worked so cohesively with the art direction and colour palette. id's effort here is worth discussing...new engine, new tech...prebaked lighting is simply part of the experience.

Not worth being a bleeding heart over.

 

[garath]

Lucky, if you are willing to give that issue a pass, but it's a clear limitation that gets in the way of the other wise good shooting mechanics and AI.

Another very valid complain that many people are overlooking. Almost non existent environment interaction or any type of physics simulation. No objects populating the levels, just that static plastic like geometry. Im surprised the game is avering over 8, the game is more a 7 game. It just ignores many of the advancements we more or less take for granted in this gen of consoles, a super charged previous gen game definitely sums up the Rage experience.

The game ranges from "ok" to good, not great like some people are portraying.

I don't think reviewers (or people playing the game) are necessarily "ignoring" the lack of free roam environments or physics enabled objects. I've seen quite a few reviewers mention the level design is still very corridor based. That's not necessarily a bad thing though. It's how they designed the levels to fit the gameplay. I haven't really felt hampered by it any more than I felt hampered by say a game like dead space in its corridors.

As far as the lack of physics based objects in the world. I say good. I've never found knocking over barrels as I run past them or kicking tiny objects around the world to be beneficial to the gameplay at all. In fact in a lot of games it's detrimental to the gameplay. I don't consider that a negative at all. Not all advancements in technology belong in all games.

 

[54-46!]

I wonder how many people that talk about how "amazing" this game's graphics are have downplayed Mirrors Edge's graphics saying prebaked lighting didnt count. But it counts with id for some reason.

Huh? I thought everyone loved Mirrors Edge's art direction, there are always screenshots posted in various "Amazing graphics" threads.

 

[Wallach]

Huh? I thought everyone loved Mirrors Edge's art direction, there are always screenshots posted in various "Amazing graphics" threads.

Shh. He's looking for clouds to yell at.

 

[Deadbeat]

Huh? I thought everyone loved Mirrors Edge's art direction, there are always screenshots posted in various "Amazing graphics" threads.

There is. But the argument of the game not counting as technical prowess has come up. Thats what Im referring to.

Shh. He's looking for clouds to yell at.

But the skybox is pretty nice. Why would I yell at that?

 

[Bumhead]

Another very valid complain that many people are overlooking. Almost non existent environment interaction or any type of physics simulation. No objects populating the levels, just that static plastic like geometry. Im surprised the game is avering over 8, the game is more a 7 game. It just ignores many of the advancements we more or less take for granted in this gen of consoles, a super charged previous gen game definitely sums up the Rage experience.

The game ranges from "ok" to good, not great like some people are portraying.

Wellsprings is still one of the most detailed and convincing towns I've ever visited in a game of this type. Not having individual items in the landscape is an oversight at worst, in my opinion. I certainly wouldn't suggest that it was detrimental enough to knock a score off a theoretical review. Not when the rest of the gameplay is so strong.

As for a previous gen experience? Personally this is the most fun I've had with a shooter this entire generation.. the crowning achievement in a genre which has absolutely saturated this gen. If it took some old school design decisions to get there then so be it, for me. Id be happy to sacrifice more of these current gen "advancements" if more shooters were simply fun to play as RAGE is.

 

[popsicle_sundays]

The patch renders the texture size and vsync cvars present in custom config files redundant, yes. Personally, the patch completely eradicated texture pop-in. AMD GPU users, being stuck with the worst driver support ever, are still experiencing problems, however.

Good to hear. I'm using a GTX 570 with the 285 Beta drivers so I should be okay, but thanks for the heads up.

If you update the game, you can just use the in-game settings. You might need to force sync via drivers instead of in-game.

Awesome, thanks guys. Now is there a FOV issue? I remember seeing people modifying the FOV.

 

[JaseC]

Good to hear. I'm using a GTX 570 with the 285 Beta drivers so I should be okay, but thanks for the heads up.

You're golden.

Awesome, thanks guys. Now is there a FOV issue? I remember seeing people modifying the FOV.

There's no FoV issue per se, it's just that many are dissatisfied with its default value. The g_fov cvar increases the default FoV of the game - 80 - by the value of your choosing. The 10-20 range seems to be the sweet spot.

 

[Wallach]

Awesome, thanks guys. Now is there a FOV issue? I remember seeing people modifying the FOV.

The default FOV is 80 I think. If you want it higher you can use a Steam launch property to change it to whatever you want; +cvaradd g_fov 10 for example would change the FOV to 90 since the g_fov modifies the default by the value specified.

 

[54-46!]

Any way I can disable the auto save that occurs after pressing Enter when I start the game? seems like the most pointless thing ever.

 

[JaseC]

Any way I can disable the auto save that occurs after pressing Enter when I start the game? seems like the most pointless thing ever.

I don't believe so. Really, disabling it would be the most pointless thing ever seeing as it only lasts a few seconds.

 

[Echoplx]

Feltrite worth keeping?

 

[54-46!]

I don't believe so. Really, disabling it would be the most pointless thing ever seeing as it only lasts a few seconds.

But I have an itchy trigger finger!

 

[JaseC]

Feltrite worth keeping?

I found no use for Feltrite. The items others received as a result of trading it I obtained by doing side-missions; for example, you're rewarded the defib. upgrade when you assist the recluse Russian doctor/scientist/mineral hobbyist.

Edit: My educated guess is that Feltrite exists to purchase particularly special items if you happen to miss their intended method of acquisition.

Edit 2: Oh, I wasn't aware you could upgrade the defib. more than once.

But I have an itchy trigger finger!

Just click when the auto-save appears and pretend you're shooting it.

 

[Metal-Geo]

Careful with that FOV though! The arms of the players clip through the camera quite fast.

Unless you're not bothered by it that much.

 

[Wallach]

Feltrite worth keeping?

You'll have the opportunity to trade it instead of just selling it for cash later.

Spoiler-ish details:

Spoiler

It's used to upgrade your defibrillator down the line, which can be done multiple times.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Also there is no physics at all in the environment. Everything is bolted down. But hey that sure helped getting those 60fps. Also no AA and the resolution scaling down to obscene levels.

I wonder how many people that talk about how "amazing" this game's graphics are have downplayed Mirrors Edge's graphics saying prebaked lighting didnt count. But it counts with id for some reason.

I noticed every time there was a "change" in the environment it was preceeded by a loading screen of some kind. You'd do a mission and come back to town and hey! new object.

The baking is far far more than even mirrors edge though, it is literally more like a polygonal version of a resident evil backdrop or those old adventure games. And the return of the lens flare!

Ballsy move they pulled.

 

[popsicle_sundays]

You're golden.

Awesome

There's no FoV issue per se, it's just that many are dissatisfied with its default value. The g_fov cvar increases the default FoV of the game - 80 - by the value of your choosing. The 10-20 range seems to be the sweet spot.

The default FOV is 80 I think. If you want it higher you can use a Steam launch property to change it to whatever you want; +cvaradd g_fov 10 for example would change the FOV to 90 since the g_fov modifies the default by the value specified.

Thanks guys. As long as it's not 60 like Dead Island was I doubt I'd feel the need to change it, although 90 seems to be my usual for PC games. I bought it off Newegg ($20 coupon from Dark Souls Fiasco) so no Steam version for me.

 

[Wallach]

Thanks guys. As long as it's not 60 like Dead Island was I doubt I'd feel the need to change it, although 90 seems to be my usual for PC games. I bought it off Newegg ($20 coupon from Dark Souls Fiasco) so no Steam version for me.

It's Steamworks, so you're in there with Steam anyway.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

You'll have the opportunity to trade it instead of just selling it for cash later.

Spoiler-ish details:

Spoiler

It's used to upgrade your defibrillator down the line, which can be done multiple times.

Aww is that all? that's a bit shit.

EDIT: the quad damage sound for the augmentor item was a classy touch.

 

[Wallach]

Aww is that all? that's a bit shit.

Yeah, it doesn't sound like the most useful thing in the world to me. Though, I kind of don't mind that since Feltrite also has a decent sell value.

 

[thetrin]

I found no use for Feltrite. The items others received as a result of trading it I obtained by doing side-missions; for example, you're rewarded the defib. upgrade when you assist the recluse Russian doctor/scientist/mineral hobbyist.

Edit: My educated guess is that Feltrite exists to purchase particularly special items if you happen to miss their intended method of acquisition.

Edit 2: Oh, I wasn't aware you could upgrade the defib. more than once.



Just click when the auto-save appears and pretend you're shooting it.

The feltrite trade ups defib charge time, not total defibs.

 

[StuBurns]

I think we've a misunderstanding here. When you said "Bethesda games" I assumed you were referring to Bethesda Game Studios (the developer) rather than Bethesda as a whole, inclusive of publishing partnerships.

I was just referring to them as a publisher yeah, for example I could imagine a Prey 3 for PS480 being idTech 5.

 

[JaseC]

I was just referring to them as a publisher yeah, for example I could imagine a Prey 3 for PS480 being idTech 5.

Yeah, absolutely. In fact, there may have been some early speculation (or rather wishful thinking) of Prey 2 being developed using id Tech 5.

 

[Metal-Geo]

I really doubt they'd switch to id Tech 5 at this point of development. Especially after all their hard work* on modifying the id Tech 4 so heavily.

*(I don't know whether it really was hard work or not. )

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Kingpin 2, id tech 5.

Believe.

 

[JaseC]

I really doubt they'd switch to id Tech 5 at this point of development. Especially after all their hard work* on modifying the id Tech 4 so heavily.

*(I don't know whether it really was hard work or not. )

Well, yeah, that's obvious now. Prior to Prey 2 being unveiled, however, it wasn't clear how far along development was, so naturally - since id was gobbled up by ZeniMax - there was hope the game would also use id Tech 5.

 

[JaseC]

Kingpin 2, id tech 5.

Believe.

I think the original Kingpin was the first game to make me lament the lack of a 3D accelerator in my then-current PC.

Edit: Bah, missed the "Edit" button.

 

[Wallach]

Kingpin 2, id tech 5.

Believe.

All I remember about Kingpin was mashing the "fuck" button until some guy was so mad he tried to kill me. #realpcgaming

 

[Refreshment.01]

I don't think reviewers (or people playing the game) are necessarily "ignoring" the lack of free roam environments or physics enabled objects. I've seen quite a few reviewers mention the level design is still very corridor based. That's not necessarily a bad thing though.

garath, it has nothing to do with the corridor based design of the game, i just gave 2 tangible examples on how the obnoxiously limitation of the player navigation hampers the game. Can't go over a waist tall box, really?

As far as the lack of physics based objects in the world. I say good. I've never found knocking over barrels as I run past them or kicking tiny objects around the world to be beneficial to the gameplay at all. In fact in a lot of games it's detrimental to the gameplay. I don't consider that a negative at all. Not all advancements in technology belong in all games.

At the most simple level, physics driven objects enrich the game's visuals. At the most integral level it benefits the gameplay, with what some developers call "emergent gameplay". That Ghost the player took down collided with that Raid making it explode and at the same time killing a hole covenant unit. A set of crates that an explosion send flying now become another place for the player or the enemy to cover. Hell, use the power mode to throw a fridge to that soldier. Some examples of many that invalidate your point.

Wellsprings is still one of the most detailed and convincing towns I've ever visited in a game of this type. Not having individual items in the landscape is an oversight at worst, in my opinion. I certainly wouldn't suggest that it was detrimental enough to knock a score off a theoretical review. Not when the rest of the gameplay is so strong.

Mat C, you are taking it a bit out of context. The somewhat serious flaw that should have been the subject of heavy criticism is the limitation of environment traversal, that deserves to drop the scores the game is getting. Not so much the lack of physic's driven objects.

Also Wellsprings feels detailed just like a pre rendered Final Fantasy back drop feels detailed. Towns folk in Wellsprings don't even feature any sort of varied routine or even react in different ways to the player. If you are willing to overlook that it's ok some other's won't.

As for a previous gen experience? Personally this is the most fun I've had with a shooter this entire generation.. the crowning achievement in a genre which has absolutely saturated this gen. If it took some old school design decisions to get there then so be it, for me. Id be happy to sacrifice more of these current gen "advancements" if more shooters were simply fun to play as RAGE is.

No, objectively speaking Rage doesn't hold on top of some shooters we have getting this cycle. One example: System Shock Light a.k.a Bioshock, a 2007 game holds a lot more merits than Rage. Shooting goes to Rage everything else Bioshock is the better game.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

All I remember about Kingpin was mashing the "fuck" button until some guy was so mad he tried to kill me. #realpcgaming

"don't choo be lookin' at my bitch motherfucker!"

Megatexture's got nothing on kingpins "squirmy face" texture technology.

Game was some next gen shit alright.

 

[Wallach]

"don't choo be lookin' at my bitch motherfucker!"

Megatexture's got nothing on kingpins "squirmy face" texture technology.

http://happypenguin.org/images/kingpin.jpg

Game was some next gen shit alright.

Hahaha, that's right Kingpin was the fuckin' game with jello people! So good.

Edit - Oh man, nostalgia just kicked my ass with this game. Remember what the locational damage looked like? Shit was so gross back then.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

lol, the game opens up with your dude covered in pain skins.

The rats fucking exploded when you shot them aswell, i miss old school goodness like that.

And the flamethrower that sent dudes screaming.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lU-0qkTgifI&feature=related

 

[garath]

garath, it has nothing to do with the corridor based design of the game, i just gave 2 tangible examples on how the obnoxiously limitation of the player navigation hampers the game. Can't go over a waist tall box, really?

At the most simple level, physics driven objects enrich the game's visuals. At the most integral level it benefits the gameplay, with what some developers call "emergent gameplay". That Ghost the player took down collided with that Raid making it explode and at the same time killing a hole covenant unit. A set of crates that an explosion send flying now become another place for the player or the enemy to cover. Hell, use the power mode to throw a fridge to that soldier. Some examples of many that invalidate your point.

I wouldn't say it invalidates my point. I feel (and apparently most reviewers) feel it's a non-issue in RAGE. The shooting is excellent and is the primary focus. Physics based objects would run the risk of simply getting in the way and not enhancing the gameplay while possibly taxing consoles to the point where we'd lose the 60fps. I would NOT trade 60fps and the draw distance we're given for some beer bottles that fall over or some boxes you can push around. It's not worth the trade off to me.

You've named a couple good examples where physics based objects enhanced gameplay but I don't feel like picking up things to throw at enemies would benefit RAGE at all. It's a shooting game at it's core, not a throw things at bad guys game. I don't need or want tricks to kill enemies in RAGE. I want to shoot them.

As far as not being able to jump over boxes, we'll just have to disagree. It has not hampered my enjoyment of the game in the slightest. I noticed I couldn't jump over some things, realized it was part of the corridor based level design and left it at that. I wouldn't want to deal with falling deaths in a game with no health bar either.

 

[Boards of Canada]

I'm only an hour and a half in on the PC version, but this is definitely one of the visually best designed games I've ever played. Can't believe how well it runs on my frickin laptop.

 

[Refreshment.01]

I wouldn't say it invalidates my point. I feel (and apparently most reviewers) feel it's a non-issue in RAGE. The shooting is excellent and is the primary focus. Physics based objects would run the risk of simply getting in the way and not enhancing the gameplay while possibly taxing consoles to the point where we'd lose the 60fps.

garath, it invalidates your point because you said and i quote: "As far as the lack of physics based objects in the world. I say good. I've never found knocking over barrels as I run past them or kicking tiny objects around the world to be beneficial to the gameplay at all."
The examples provided disapprove that claim and shooters from past and this generation have made good use of physics based systems for play.

As far as not being able to jump over boxes, we'll just have to disagree. It has not hampered my enjoyment of the game in the slightest. I noticed I couldn't jump over some things, realized it was part of the corridor based level design and left it at that. I wouldn't want to deal with falling deaths in a game with no health bar either.

That's what amounts to, you are speaking in subjective terms. For whatever reason you are willing to close your eyes to some of the game's flaws or issues and that's fine if you actually believe so and it's no some sort of apologist defense mechanism. And no, not being able to jump over low height obstacles has anything to do with Rage's corridor design.