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Future visuals with RT…
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But it is inferior, did you see the new Unreal Engine 5.2 showcase where they showed the jungle demo. Tell me that UC4 looks close to this and that we still haven't made big improvements. Do you still think "you need a hell lot of imagination to see the graphics improvements since uc4 lol that is correct".I don't care how.
I see results. Every graphics is "cheating and shortcuts".
It seems unfair to look at rasterized techniques as inferior if they are giving similar results
But it is inferior, did you see the new Unreal Engine 5.2 showcase where they showed the jungle demo. Tell me that UC4 looks close to this and that we still haven't made big improvements. Do you still think "you need a hell lot of imagination to see the graphics improvements since uc4 lol that is correct".
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But it is inferior, did you see the new Unreal Engine 5.2 showcase where they showed the jungle demo. Tell me that UC4 looks close to this and that we still haven't made big improvements. Do you still think "you need a hell lot of imagination to see the graphics improvements since uc4 lol that is correct".
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To add
Find me a better lighting in horror games
That uncharted 4 room looks comically bad compared to this
Jungle?
Graphics have stopped at Uncharted 4
Why are we comparing trailers and cgi to real games that are released ?
am I missing something
But there are games out now that have better lighting and graphics than UC4, we have surpassed that a while ago.Why are we comparing trailers and cgi to real games that are released ?
am I missing something
It doesn't matter what the OP thinks. Real time RT is the future and where we are heading there steadfast. It will take a while for hardware, engines and developers to fully get there, but there we will get.I can't tell if the OP is trolling or just that dim. It's like he's a guy from the late 19th century saying "These horseless carriages are a waste of resources, nobody will ever want one".
RT is an amazing feature and it's the future of 3D rendering in games. One day we will achieve modern AAA games rendered entirely by RT, not just shadows or reflections.
This take is ridiculous. RT is the future period…Just because a person doesn’t care for it doesn’t mean it isn’t the future of graphics…
I got raytracing on PS5 too.You are conveniently forgetting that one requires a 1500 Eurodollars GPU and the other came with a PlayStation.
Is that why so many recent console titles are running at 30fps? I mean, just think about it, 30 fps is doubly as much as 15 fps!The future of this, the future of that. I've heard lame assertions like that so many times. The point is that devs and publishers focus on what people want, if it is high frame rates, then that will be the objective. Period.
I can't tell if the OP is trolling or just that dim. It's like he's a guy from the late 19th century saying "These horseless carriages are a waste of resources, nobody will ever want one".
RT is an amazing feature and it's the future of 3D rendering in games. One day we will achieve modern AAA games rendered entirely by RT, not just shadows or reflections.
“the fool who is fiddling with a buggy that will run without being hitched to a horse.” My banker called on me to say: “Winton, I am disappointed in you.”
That riled me, but I held my temper as I asked, “What’s the matter with you?” He bellowed: “There’s nothing the matter with me. It’s you! You’re crazy if you think this fool contraption you’ve been wasting your time on will ever displace the horse.”
The point is that devs and publishers focus on what people want, if it is high frame rates, then that will be the objective. Period.
if it is high frame rates, then that will be the objective. Period.
if it is high frame rates
Is that why so many recent console titles are running at 30fps? I mean, just think about it, 30 fps is doubly as much as 15 fps!
I think some people are expecting too much too soon...
There was a poll here some time ago, people prefer performance modes. It's not even controversial.
Ah yea, Neogaf, the representation of the gaming world
How's that going so far? 4k 60fps i mean?
It is data... What you got?.
A brain
How's that 4k 60 fps going on consoles? Devs should listen to neogaf polls right? Still waiting.
By Neogaf's standard, Switch would be DOA. So many other examples of neogaf not being representative of the gaming industry. I wouldn't even know where to start.
You can argue that Nvidia's market speak is overselling it's features vs reality and I kind of agree. But raytracing is an incredibly difficult problem solve, especially full path tracing. What they managed to do with 2080 was at least 2-4 years earlier than I expected. I have tons of offline 3D rendering experience for over 25 years now, and the fact that 2080 can even do RT at all is amazing to me. You've also have to start somewhere and chip away at the problem. It's a chicken and the egg problem. If there is no hardware then the developers can't start learning to program for the hardware, building engines and eventually games for it. So of course there won't be much that utilizes the RT capabilities of the first generations, this is such a huge and difficult thing to do it's going to take time and iterations to get there. This is what I mean people are expecting too much too soon. It will take a couple of generations for the performance to trickle down to the low end and for techniques and engines to be available for everyone. UE5 and some other engines are starting to get us there now but it will be a while longer until we go full path tracing and leave rasterization completely behind.Why would people "expect too much too soon"? Nobody was talking about this shit until Nvidia needed to come up with a reason to justify the existence of the 2080 cards. Nvidia put it out as a major feature, so obviously people are goign to expect it to be, you know, a major feature.
Because you thought that graphics stopped at uncharted 4? Upcoming games-tech from an engine that just released maybe?
The idea we stop at Uncharted 4 is so fucking cute Rofif, you really like to make posts that age like milk.
Listen. I am not here to break down uncharted 4 tech.But there are games out now that have better lighting and graphics than UC4, we have surpassed that a while ago.
So you say that games like Horizon: FBW, Demon Souls, Cyberpunk 2077, Atomic Heart, Forza Horizon 5, A Plague Tale Requiem, Flight Simulator, Metro Exodus Enhanced, Red Dead Redemption 2, Ratchet And Clank Rift Apart and The Callisto Protocol look inferior compared to those 4 games you mentioned. I knew you was crazy when you where praising Forespokens graphics .Listen. I am not here to break down uncharted 4 tech.
All I know is when a screenshot from that game comes up on my randomizer, it's usually the best looking one, with Death Stranding right next to it.
And when I replay that game year on year, I am somehow always more impressed.
The game just looks good. better than most stuff nowadays. Better than re4 remake even I would say for some part...
It's not better than tech demos of ue5 nowadays... but nothing is... We are either talking cg here, tech demos or games and as far as games Go, I put tlou2 on first place, uc4 on 2nd and death stranding on 3rd.... and now come to think of it, re4 remake models deserve a good spot somewhere up there
I go back and forth.
The raytraced reflections in Hogwarts Legacy have me happily playing at 30fps. The world just looks so much richer.
Elden Ring's raytracing is...fine. It's okay.
RTX onI would never sacrifice gameplay for graphics.
RTX on
60 fps off
Imagine if that was the attitude taken by developers in the 90s when they moved to 3d. It looked colossally shit but we've persevered and things look great now.
It's not a new phenomenon.
It's not the same fucking thing. We had fully 3d games that ran at playable framerates on consoles back when final fantasy 7 released. We don't have a single fully raytraced game on consoles that runs well.I remember when Final Fantasy 7 debuted and there were people like OP complaining at how Cloud looks with his popeye arms, and how sprites were so much better, and that 3D gaming was a waste of time because it looked bad on 32-bit hardware with how few polygons they could push.
Good baked lighting can look miles better than RT lighting. I don’t GAF if I can move my shadow is realistic with RT.
They are theorectically inferior when it comes to how much work you have to set them up. From a tech standpoint you always had raytracing features on 3D modeling software and devs basically had to "downport those features" to real-time rendering. Cube maps, light placement, pre-baked shadows, pre-baked lightning, selective light sources... In theory this can all go away in time.I don't care how.
I see results. Every graphics is "cheating and shortcuts".
It seems unfair to look at rasterized techniques as inferior if they are giving similar results
I don’t remember anyone saying that.When Quake came out, people whinged about needing to have such a powerful computer to run a game that looked almost the same as DOOM, but not as colourful ...
Quake never "looked almost the same as DOOM"When Quake came out, people whinged about needing to have such a powerful computer to run a game that looked almost the same as DOOM, but not as colourful ...
that's not true, everyone knew Quake was a generation ahead of Doom, and once VQuake/GLQuake came out people were running to the store to get 3D cards. Some people preferred Duke 3D, but Duke 3D's engine was significantly more advanced than Doom and had interactivity etc. going for it.When Quake came out, people whinged about needing to have such a powerful computer to run a game that looked almost the same as DOOM, but not as colourful ...
"Playable" framerates when the entirety of ocarina of time ran at 20fps, FF7 at 15fps in battles!It's not the same fucking thing. We had fully 3d games that ran at playable framerates on consoles back when final fantasy 7 released. We don't have a single fully raytraced game on consoles that runs well.
3d was a paradigm shift that would change video game design forever. Raytracing is a lighting overhaul. Not the same damn thing
RT is the future, RTGI for example is unmatched.
its just a waiting game for the hardware to catch up and for that to happen we need AMD to actually make an effort and give Nvidia a scare.
This.Uncharted 4 used prebaked lights and probes like there's no tomorrow. It's a work made by artists and you can't have the same results with any other game if you're not Naughty Dogs with Sony behind it.
UC4 has many issue when the character is not under the sun and other 150 light sources placed by hand, like caves and big areas.
But it is inferior, did you see the new Unreal Engine 5.2 showcase where they showed the jungle demo. Tell me that UC4 looks close to this and that we still haven't made big improvements. Do you still think "you need a hell lot of imagination to see the graphics improvements since uc4 lol that is correct".
and with what kind of algorythms do you think that baked static lighting was calculated in the first place?Good baked lighting can look miles better than RT lighting. I don’t GAF if I can move my shadow is realistic with RT.
This.
However, rofif unquestionably got a point. When it all works, it's pretty fucking hard to find something looking better than UC4 (and this is all on PS4 Pro):
Those animations as well, not even Naught Dog improved upon how stunningly fluid and responsive U4 controlled while looking like this:
And in a way, those games did use some form of RT, all the way back to TLOU on PS3:
Resident Evil 4 Remake or Dead Space: Remake, both just released a whopping 7 years after Uncharted 4, are literal generations behind in this regard.
Honest to God, visually all I could think while watching that footage 2 days ago was that it looked like a less stable, ghosting Lost Legacy, with next generation geometry.
Just talking visually here of course, but I'm sure I could trick many people into thinking some portions of that Demo are from Lost Legacy. Don't have a video to compare as Streamable deleted all LL videos I had except for this one:
But in short, to me everyone is right in this case. Uncharted 4 is not a good example for gaming as a whole as U UnNamed said, and at times it certainly looks lacking as you all are saying.
And many bigger, outdoor chapters would improve drastically with the use of ray traced shadows.