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[Major Williams]

Joke post?

I think he's saying in the original trilogy, you have fun with the characters, and don't care about the plot holes. You just experience a fun story that is a ride.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Juices is here, so moonman can't be the new him. Maybe the new eazy, with all of that shit about reticule bloom.

I was referring to juice's "I wish I could quit you" syndrome during Halo 3's peak, during which he regularly popped in to rage post about how shitty the game was while racking up thousands of games in it. It's just something that amuses me: when I don't like a game I'll make a post explaining why, stop playing it, and move on. But we have regulars who do that first part, then keep playing it and then keep on explaining why they don't like it - for a very long time. Which is fine, I just find it weird and amusing, in equal measures.

Joke post?

Nice avatar.

 

[Walshicus]

Okay, once again the "betrayal" detector has failed. "Team-mate" gets hit by my boosting Revenant in the heat of battle, I'm out the game. Fucking awesome.

 

[Ajemsuhgao]

The closest thing we get is when Jorge calls Halsey, mom. But we don't know why they have this apparent closer relationship.

Ma'am.

- He just single handedly dismissed one of the things that made Halo:CE so awesome in matchmaking and campaign.:lol

They've said that the Halo CE pistol was a mistake. Something that quickly changed at the end to balance Campaign, and it ended up being overpowered in Multiplayer, but they kept it.

So... (plasma launcher, sword, hammer, rocket launcher, sniper rifle, shotgun, grenade launcher, spartan laser, concussion rifle)
... this is how you balance out the weapons? Flood the game with power weapons, while making the lesser weapons less powerful? This is one of my bigger gripes with Reach. I can't compete with everyone running around with power weapons when my "should-be" decent starting weapons suck. And then combining that with bloom AND armor abilites such as armor lock and sprint just multiply the problem exponentially.

DMR can easily take out most of those at the range it's meant to be used. And AR/Pistol is great at close range. Arguing that the maps are "flooded" with these is stupid.

It seems that most of the complaints about Reach(strictly talking about gameplay, at least) comes down to the fact that some people just can't adapt, and bitch.

I can't be competitive with bloom gimping my every shot. I dont want a game telling me how fast I have to fire a gun to be accurate, and no competitive game should EVER gimp/handicap the player's skill, especially the 4th installment of a game that thrives on precision, accuracy, and quick shots. This is the biggest game ruiner of Reach for me. GAME RUINED!!

There's that failure to adapt, and bitching again.

What are Halo's 3 golden rules?
Grenades? Broken and unreliable. I suspect the shield mechanics have a big part in this.
Melee? Broken and unreliable. The shield mechanics DEFINITELY have a big part in this.
Weapons? Completely unbalanced and further ruined by bloom

None of these things are broken.

Grenades are grenades. They aren't the mini nukes they were in the beta, and they actually feel right now.
Melee..there's nothing wrong with it. They changed shields. Adapt(read: get better).
I don't see how weapons are unbalanced, at all. They each have their own role, and you can counter each weapon with...starting weapons pretty much. Halo games have always had you racing to grab power weapons, but it doesn't punish you if you don't have them. Not like you're starting with the Halo 2 SMG, and Halo 2 Magnum. Your starting weapons are actually useful now.



So overall:

Adapt to the new game.
Suck less.
Quit bitching.

Or don't play.

 

[Louis Wu]

I think he's saying in the original trilogy, you have fun with the characters, and don't care about the plot holes. You just experience a fun story that is a ride.

That's how I saw Reach, actually.

(There are PLENTY of ridiculous plot holes in the original trilogy - he didn't say he ignored them, he said he wasn't left with any. That's absurd.)

 

[Major Williams]

That's how I saw Reach, actually.

(There are PLENTY of ridiculous plot holes in the original trilogy - he didn't say he ignored them, he said he wasn't left with any. That's absurd.)

Ah. haha. I am truly glad you had a fun time with the characters. But most of the people I've played with and ran into in MM have had similar issues with identifying with the characters and 'having fun' with the story.

 

[xxjuicesxx]

I was referring to juice's "I wish I could quit you" syndrome during Halo 3's peak, during which he regularly popped in to rage post about how shitty the game was while racking up thousands of games in it. It's just something that amuses me: when I don't like a game I'll make a post explaining why, stop playing it, and move on. But we have regulars who do that first part, then keep playing it and then keep on explaining why they don't like it - for a very long time. Which is fine, I just find it weird and amusing, in equal measures.

To be fair all I ever wanted was change. Most of the playlists needed fixed, that much is and was obvious. I was a forefront icon in HaloGAF regarding Team Snipers playlist. A mistake they are making AGAIN in REACH. Team Snipers has been a designated playlist since H2 for a reason...its in demand. How they make the same blatant mistake for H3 and now Reach is just ridiculous.

There's many other problems too but until they hire some help that knows what they are doing, well forgive my rage posts.

I like to think I've been quite level headed since my return too.

 

[electricpirate]

Juices is here, so moonman can't be the new him. Maybe the new eazy, with all of that shit about reticule bloom.

Yea, but Eazy's posts actually made sense, MoonMan's are just diffused rage about a game he can't get a handle on.

I HATE THIS GAME SO MUCH THAT I CARE ABOUT IT SO DEEPLY THAT BLOOM GRENADE POWERWEAPON CE

*scanners head explode.gif*

 

[CrazedArabMan]

Another completely unbalanced map with gametype, stockpile on The Cage. Also The Cage sucks as a map. Blue team can just jump right down grab the flag and throw it off within a few seconds.

 

[Veelk]

No matter how you cut it, a great story is delivered by the characters, and the audience's ability to identify and struggle with the main characters story arc.

I'd disagree with this. A great story CAN be delivered by characters, but there are other ways. Many people read Lord of the Rings, for example, because they like the excellent world that Tolkien built, not the characters (though the characters there were pretty decent too). Alan Wake's story is filled with character cliche's or atleast they weren't very complex or even likable, but they are still incredibly interesting when you find out that

Spoiler

reality has been altered and uncovering the truth has been like trying to find a way through an MC Escher dungeon.

There are books that have completely flat and uninteresting characters, but it's still excellent because the story works excellently on a symbolic level. And Halo 1's story was certainly not interesting because of the characters, but by the setting, trying to figure out what this huge ring was for. Atleast for me. I don't know about anyone else, but I'd be surprised if anyone was at all effected when Keyes was turned into flood. Sometimes, the characters were just there to give perspective and exposition. They don't need to be deep or even make you feel anything, so long as there is something else for the audience to sink their teeth into. I believe this is the kind of story they were trying to deliver with Halo Reach. Think of it not as a story of Noble Team's last days, but as Reach's last days. In this sense, the story is quite excellent, I believe, better than the other Halo's.

 

[Kai Dracon]

It's crazy to call melee in Reach broken; you mean someone is crying now that there is /an actual combat system/ in place? There's a better meta-game surrounding sheilds, shield pop, and close quarters combat in Halo now; this is not bad, it's good.

The new shield mechanics fix the game as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Deputy Moonman]

Anyway the rest of your post is just rage so maybe just stop playing? Sorry you don't like bloom, buddy.

I think rage entails a lot of screaming and weak arguments, but I have already quit playing. I don't know why I can't let the game go. I really need to for everyone else's sake. Too much time invested throughout the entire series of Halo games, I guess. Anyway, I'm incapable of saying anything good right now so I'll do everyone a favor and stop. sorry.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Yea, but Eazy's posts actually made sense, MoonMan's are just diffused rage about a game he can't get a handle on.

I HATE THIS GAME SO MUCH THAT I CARE ABOUT IT SO DEEPLY THAT BLOOM GRENADE POWERWEAPON CE

*scanners head explode.gif*

Easteregg powerweapon?

 

[Gui_PT]

Moonman, why u still playin' the game? =\

 

[metareferential]

I'd really like to know how in a game where an entire planet is going down, playing as a squad of soldier (they've always been soldier. There's even an indoctrination department inside ONI. They're war tools trained to hide emotions, they'ready and willing to sacrifice) desperately running against time, could we have had believable and well executed excursuses about their background stories.

Maybe you would have liked MGS4's style of ridicolous story-telling: poor little girls kidnapped and forced to fight when a bunch of fishermen-hating terrorists burnt a swedish village?

Not to defend Bungie: there are some points where they should have lingered more onto some aspects (the forerunners on reach is an example, of course).

But again, it's a prequel. It is aimed at those who already know the story of Halo.

And those are Spartans. I don't think they spend that much time speaking about the old times or their inner feelings.

Dialogues between characters reveal more than you would expect, in Halo: Reach. More than a user thought that Jorge said "mom". If this is the general attention gamers pay to dialogues, it's not hard to understand why so many games get so much criticism towards their storytelling.

Again, Reach has its faults. But I don't think those are to be sought in characters' development. Because we don't need that: these are soldiers who don't have a life or a real background story. Their story is war.

They always act the same, therefore they appear to us as underdeveloped or stereotyped characters. And I guess that's by design.

Moreover, there are games that are much worse in that department that never get any criticism at all.

 

[Genesis Knight]

Any bets on DLC content? $15 is a given, pretty much, but as far as maps I'm going to guess...

- 1 New Firefight Map
- 2 Forge World Multiplayer Maps
- 2 "New" Maps

 

[Hey You]

- 2 Forge World Multiplayer Maps

Bungie's not that greedy.

 

[Kuroyume]

I don't think Firefight needs any more new maps. Honestly, when I play Firefight it doesn't feel like I'm using the maps. Just pop out of a corner blew shit up and then run back to let health recharge.

 

[The Lamonster]

That's how I saw Reach, actually.

(There are PLENTY of ridiculous plot holes in the original trilogy - he didn't say he ignored them, he said he wasn't left with any. That's absurd.)

I meant that if there were plot holes in Star Wars Ep. IV, they weren't central to the main story, or weren't as obvious as "why are Forerunner structures on Reach (and Earth too)?"

As well as calling out Bungie's poor storytelling skillz, I'm also actually wanting to know the answer so if anyone wants to humor me, please go ahead.

And for clarity, I love the stories themselves, just complaining about the delivery method of the story in the games.

 

[ManCannon]

Any bets on DLC content? $15 is a given, pretty much, but as far as maps I'm going to guess...

- 1 New Firefight Map
- 2 Forge World Multiplayer Maps
- 2 "New" Maps

Whenever hypothetical DLC is released, it's not going to officially include any Forge World creations. We will be adding Forged maps to matchmaking ad hoc as we can (for free, not tied to any purchase created by Bungie people and the community.

 

[CrazedArabMan]

I don't think Firefight needs any more new maps. Honestly, when I play Firefight it doesn't feel like I'm using the maps. Just pop out of a corner blew shit up and then run back to let health recharge.

Yes it does, I really want a more open vehicle oriented one like in ODST, that's what I believe Reach is missing.

 

[The Lamonster]

I'd rather the dudes spend their time making new competitive multiplayer maps (which have been underwhelming so far, aside from Forge World).

 

[Ajemsuhgao]

I don't think Firefight needs any more new maps. Honestly, when I play Firefight it doesn't feel like I'm using the maps. Just pop out of a corner blew shit up and then run back to let health recharge.

Could use some more maps that have vehicles. Currently there's only...Beachhead?

I mean starting vehicles, not Ghosts/Wraiths that get dropped off.

 

[Major Williams]

I was going to write a huge writeup talking about what makes a story a story is a character arc (characters can be planets too) and the audience's ability to understand and identify with it, but I'm clearly not making sense to many people, or I'm making too much sense.

The way the story was told in-game, I felt nothing for Reach, or Noble Team. I only sort of cared when I saw the helmet I spent 15000cR for stuck in the ground. That's not very compelling IMO.

As Lamonster said - the story itself is fantastic. The delivery is shady to say the least.

 

[Sai-kun]

2 Flag Pro on Countdown was fucking amazing. I love it :lol :lol :lol

 

[The Lamonster]

I was going to write a huge writeup talking about what makes a story a story is a character arc (characters can be planets too) and the audience's ability to understand and identify with it, but I'm clearly not making sense to many people, or I'm making too much sense.

The way the story was told in-game, I felt nothing for Reach, or Noble Team. I only sort of cared when I saw the helmet I spent 15000cR for stuck in the ground. That's not very compelling IMO.

As Lamonster said - the story itself is fantastic. The delivery is shady to say the least.

The only emotion I felt about the story was a result of the music.

 

[MrBig]

I was going to write a huge writeup talking about what makes a story a story is a character arc (characters can be planets too) and the audience's ability to understand and identify with it, but I'm clearly not making sense to many people, or I'm making too much sense.

The way the story was told in-game, I felt nothing for Reach, or Noble Team. I only sort of cared when I saw the helmet I spent 15000cR for stuck in the ground. That's not very compelling IMO.

As Lamonster said - the story itself is fantastic. The delivery is shady to say the least.

I agree with everything in this post.

 

[NullPointer]

As Noble6 you fill the shoes of a spartan who died, but he may as well have not existed. We never know who the previous spartan was, how he died, or what he meant to the rest of the group. So it's hard to care that I'm replacing him.

So I guess you never saw this then?
Deliver Hope: Extended

And bloom reduces competition? How in the universe does that make sense? Placing a mechanic that reduces the effectiveness of spamming is less competitive? It "gimps" your shots?

Let me know if this was just a joke post and I missed teh funny, because I'm honestly scratching my head here.

The only emotion I felt about the story was a result of the music.

Its been like this for all Halo games imho. Without Marty's music there would be no argument for emotional impact at all.

 

[Gr1mLock]

i would pay ten bucks to remove pinnacle from every playlist. seriously one of the worst multiplayer maps in history of gaming

 

[The Lamonster]

i would pay ten bucks to remove pinnacle from every playlist. seriously one of the worst multiplayer maps in history of gaming

Not a Halo 2 vet, I take it. You need to play some Tower of Power on that map

King of the Hill is pretty good there, too. Unfortunately you won't find these things in matchmaking :lol

 

[Hugbot]

2 Flag Pro on Countdown was fucking amazing. I love it :lol :lol :lol

Countdown is quickly becoming my favorite map, other than Powerhouse. It never seemed to come up for me the first week and a half, but the matches I've had on it so far have been really good. It makes for some really tight 3-Plot and Headhunter matches, although the initial spawn in Team Slayer is real iffy.

 

[Victrix]

Invasion is in dire need of better maps, and better design in general

Accidentally backspawning at the rear of Spire and not having a vehicle present can fuck your team over completely. Why the hell aren't there fast spawning mongooses back there, or mancannons, or teleports?

Ignoring that 2/3rds of that level is unused for Invasion

Boneyard at least focuses most of the conflict in the second half of the map, but the first stage is pretty bleh.

I think Invasion is a cool idea in general, but the maps just don't seem to support it well. And there's the whole 'Elites have EMP on all their builds but Spartans have to wait till Tier 3' thing.

I have a feeling that a 4v4 Invasion map created with a lesser focus on giant maps and vehicles would probably play a lot better. It'd be a three stage multi-objective game that moved the focus of the match around the map in the same way that Crazy King can, which is more interesting than Spire camping with a pile of energy swords.

 

[Sill4]

I think he's saying in the original trilogy, you have fun with the characters, and don't care about the plot holes. You just experience a fun story that is a ride.

This is exactly my point, except with Halo, it's a game. It's gameplay driven, with just bare bones story.

The meat of the lore is in other media. Hoestly, if you've been onboard since CE and your still expecting a Character Driven FPS ( I strongly disagree with your previous examples of Knoxx and MW2 climax),especially in the Halo series, you can expect nothing but disapointment.

And again, so this discussion doesn't go in circles or turn into a "lol fanboy" type of thing : I, Sill4, famous neogaf poster of less than a year, agree that the story is off in many ways, especially in games.

 

[Steve o 3000]

Any bets on DLC content? $15 is a given, pretty much, but as far as maps I'm going to guess...

- 1 New Firefight Map
- 2 Forge World Multiplayer Maps
- 2 "New" Maps

I'm hoping we get a good mix of remakes and new MP and Firefight Maps.

I'll go with:
- 4 MP maps (2 new, 2 remakes)
- 2 Firefight maps (1 new, 1 remake)

I don't think we'll see any new Forgeworld until at least the 2nd batch of DLC.

 

[Ajemsuhgao]

i would pay ten bucks to remove pinnacle from every playlist. seriously one of the worst multiplayer maps in history of gaming

It was fun in Halo 2. Starting to hate it in Reach. :lol

 

[The Lamonster]

Invasion is in dire need of better maps, and better design in general

Accidentally backspawning at the rear of Spire and not having a vehicle present can fuck your team over completely. Why the hell aren't there fast spawning mongooses back there, or mancannons, or teleports?

Ignoring that 2/3rds of that level is unused for Invasion

Boneyard at least focuses most of the conflict in the second half of the map, but the first stage is pretty bleh.

I think Invasion is a cool idea in general, but the maps just don't seem to support it well. And there's the whole 'Elites have EMP on all their builds but Spartans have to wait till Tier 3' thing.

I have a feeling that a 4v4 Invasion map created with a lesser focus on giant maps and vehicles would probably play a lot better. It'd be a three stage multi-objective game that moved the focus of the match around the map in the same way that Crazy King can, which is more interesting than Spire camping with a pile of energy swords.

This made me realize that Invasion would be perfect on the Halo 2 map Headlong.

 

[Shake Appeal]

More than a user thought that Jorge said "mom".

Only because he speaks with an English accent.

 

[The Lamonster]

Only because he speaks with an English accent.

And says it 3 times within like 3 minutes. QA should've caught that. I bet 90% of players are hearing "mom."

 

[GriffD17]

Well all that playing to be listed at the very bottom tier in arena. Yaaaay

 

[Shake Appeal]

I bet 90% of Americans are hearing "mom."

Fixed.

 

[Stinkles]

I think rage entails a lot of screaming and weak arguments, but I have already quit playing. I don't know why I can't let the game go. I really need to for everyone else's sake. Too much time invested throughout the entire series of Halo games, I guess. Anyway, I'm incapable of saying anything good right now so I'll do everyone a favor and stop. sorry.

Moonman, if I can get it, anyone can get it. Stick with it. Use my new Golden rule with the DMR: Torso, Torso, Torso, Torso, CLANG, Head.

 

[The Lamonster]

Fixed.

haha fair enough.

 

[Sill4]

I'd disagree with this. A great story CAN be delivered by characters, but there are other ways. Many people read Lord of the Rings, for example, because they like the excellent world that Tolkien built, not the characters (though the characters there were pretty decent too). Alan Wake's story is filled with character cliche's or atleast they weren't very complex or even likable, but they are still incredibly interesting when you find out that

Spoiler

reality has been altered and uncovering the truth has been like trying to find a way through an MC Escher dungeon.

There are books that have completely flat and uninteresting characters, but it's still excellent because the story works excellently on a symbolic level. And Halo 1's story was certainly not interesting because of the characters, but by the setting, trying to figure out what this huge ring was for. Atleast for me. I don't know about anyone else, but I'd be surprised if anyone was at all effected when Keyes was turned into flood. Sometimes, the characters were just there to give perspective and exposition. They don't need to be deep or even make you feel anything, so long as there is something else for the audience to sink their teeth into. I believe this is the kind of story they were trying to deliver with Halo Reach. Think of it not as a story of Noble Team's last days, but as Reach's last days. In this sense, the story is quite excellent, I believe, better than the other Halo's.

Generic, thank you very god damn much you magnificent bastard

I was trying to put this into words,but I deleted it from my post because I couldn't get it into words without making myself look stupid.

Not everybody relies on characters to enjoy a story, and I hate so much when I read reviews, from media or people on forums, that totally glaze over an amazing background and atmosphere and focus on characters. Maybe it's the artist in me, or maybe I'm just an uncultured heathen.

I was going to write a huge writeup talking about what makes a story a story is a character arc (characters can be planets too) and the audience's ability to understand and identify with it, but I'm clearly not making sense to many people, or I'm making too much sense.

I'm not saying anyone's opinion is wrong, however, you really need to be able to differentiate your personal opinion from fact (story a story because of character arc).

 

[TommyT]

It was fun in Halo 2. Starting to hate it in Reach. :lol

Different weapons change the way maps are played.

 

[LAUGHTREY]

Whenever hypothetical DLC is released, it's not going to officially include any Forge World creations. We will be adding Forged maps to matchmaking ad hoc as we can (for free, not tied to any purchase created by Bungie people and the community.

I think he meant like, two forge world type canvas maps.


Which doesn't really make any sense. Why would they even release a "new" canvas map ala Foundry and Sandbox in 3, Sandbox was just made because Foundry had such limited space and those two weird rooms sticking out.

Besides different items, Forge World is basically the perfect Forge map.

 

[Vigilant Walrus]

I'm hoping we get a good mix of remakes and new MP and Firefight Maps.

I'll go with:
- 4 MP maps (2 new, 2 remakes)
- 2 Firefight maps (1 new, 1 remake)

I don't think we'll see any new Forgeworld until at least the 2nd batch of DLC.

what are the chances of more campaign?

 

[The Lamonster]

I think he meant like, two forge world type canvas maps.


Which doesn't really make any sense. Why would they even release a "new" canvas map ala Foundry and Sandbox in 3, Sandbox was just made because Foundry had such limited space and those two weird rooms sticking out.

Besides different items, Forge World is basically the perfect Forge map.

I want a snow map. And more maps on Halos. If a Forge canvas is the only way Bungie will do it (if they continue to create campaign-only envirnments), then I'd love to see more.

what are the chances of more campaign?

Zero. Only if they decide to make an 'expansion' a la ODST.

 

[GDJustin]

My DLC prediction:

1 new vehicle-centric Firefight map
2 new Invasion / Big Team maps
1 new smaller MP map
1 Remade MP map (fucking Zanzibar pls!)

 

[Slightly Live]

what are the chances of more campaign?

None.

 

[LAUGHTREY]

Honestly the only thing I see them doing is making a smaller area so there can be more item budget with more items.


But the geometry pieces are so detailed you can make any shape you want within reason on Forge World now.


And really, Snow map? Another map on Halo? Are these really the things you base your purchases on?