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Robber with AK-47 shot by Waffle House customer
- Thread starter War Eagle
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We don't do vigilante justice in modern society. There are several arguments as to why. A "good guy with a gun" doesn't execute someone in the parking lot after following them.
Let's call the gun by its name - AK-47... We don't need 5 pages of trying to define what an "assault rifle' is.
jakonovski
Member
You guys realize you live in a damn warzone?
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
Its Texas, its fine. Let us not forget Joe Horn shooting someone who burglarized his neighbor, all the while the 911 operator was telling him that police were on the way and to not engage.
Done.
But if the wife is driving, there's reasonable concern that she won't/won't be able to answer her phone. The shooter doesn't know exactly where she is or how close she is, so he decides to risk his own life to potentially keep her out of danger. It's important to remember that these things happen in the blink of an eye and the people involved do not have the luxury to sit at our computers and think about/debate other solutions.
If it were my wife/mom/dad, I'd have done the same thing
if I had the balls to.
The Lamonster
Member
gun nuts vs. criminals
letthemfight.gif
letthemfight.gif
Well the article says he turned and pointed the AK at the guy before he shot him, so you could get away with it on that. I assume that's why he didn't shoot him in the back instead of calling out to him, and why people in old westerns tell their opponent to go for his gun.
RowdyReverb
Member
He may not be a good guy, but it sounds like he shot a bad guy
I own firearms and am ok with stronger gun control. There are too many firearms though. More than people here. I am a former NRA member...the politics there are weird. The members want better gun control, but the people in charge do not.
Corronchilejano
Member
I beg your pardon, but if someone is going around with an AK47 robbing people, that guy is a hell of a lot more dangerous that the guy that managed to shoot him down. Stopping the guy is a positive.
Unless the AK47 was actually a toy gun.
No, if I shot a robber in the back as he walked away trying to escape without harming anyone or pointing a gun at anyone, that would be murder and I should be arrested.
I'm not defending the customer in this case. IMO they were both aggressors and the one trying to steal people's stuff got shot instead of the other guy. Stupid, yes, playing hero looking for glory as if in a videogame, probably not quite the dominant motive as is being assumed.
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
Tons of speculation on a situation on stuff we know nothing about. We know that the person with the AK-47 didn't shoot anyone on the scene, why would you assume he would shot some random person pulling into a restaurant when he is leaving the scene and already got what he came for?
If it was like the old westerns, we should see about 5 or 6 minutes of stare down on surveillance cameras plus blaring orchestras.
minor effort
Banned
You do realize people don't automatically have the license to shoot "bad guys", right?
This.
GoldenEye 007
Member
It is very rare to use guns like these in common gun crimes. I want to say the most recent percentages were in the 2-4% range. Of course guns like these seem to be the weapon of choice in mass shooting events, though.
So yeah it is very weird to have someone use this in a robbery. Kind of bulky and difficult to walk around with.
Would you risk the life of your wife on that thought? I'm not trying to sound condescending or sarcastic or anything. Honestly, visualize yourself in that position. Would you?
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
I wouldn't follow someone out into the parking lot that just pointed an AK-47 in my face. I would have called my wife and the police.
Pretty much this.
the-pi-guy
Member
Someone coming into a situation like that is very different from already being in it.
For example, if there was a cop in there, and the robber was able to take control of the situation (and ensure that the cop say loses his gun). That's a very different situation, from say a cop breaking down the door.
A.) It's surprising.
B.) There's an opportunity to lose control of the situation.
Given those 2 things, they can very well act differently.
As an American who hasn't even seen an AK-47, it is pretty ridiculous.
No, of course not. I wouldn't be risking my life, but the life of anybody in that Waffle House (or around that area) that could be caught with stray bullets.
The likelihood of anything happening to her is so astronomically slim. Unless she was pulling into the parking lot at that moment, I don't see how he would have harmed her. Even then, he probably would have just left the scene - he never shot anybody in the restaurant so what would make you think he would shoot somebody after the fact that would pose absolutely no threat?
The wife thing just came off as an excuse because he wanted to kill someone and be a hero.
What I visualize is realizing everyone in the store is safe, and the robber is leaving. If you still had my phone I would call my wife. If not, see if I could use someone else's or the stores' if it wasn't in use. Either way, I would feel my wife would be safe.
Or potentially put her in danger, if his initial encounter with the robber didn't end in a clean kill and instead led to a shootout in the parking lot where a stray bullet could have hit his wife just as she drove in...
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
Yep, 100% agree with this.
I'm going to follow someone with an AK-47 and try to put him down, never mind the fact that he hasn't shot anyone, never mind the fact that its an AK-47 and a stray bullet can hit someone in the restaurant, my wife is on her way!
When did the wife arrive on the scene, I mean she did show up right, cause she was on her way right then.
He probably wasn't the most rational when he did this, not that that's an excuse from scrutiny.
So I take it you have a way to take all the legal and illegal guns off the street? Cause there is a lot of illegal guns.
If you consider the racial angle to the situation, there might be more to it than that too.
That is why gun's are so fucking dangerous in the hands of a normal civilian. They will act on impulse and put their lives, and everyone else's, in danger.
If the intent was, at any point in this story, to have people reconsider this country's absolutely insane gun laws in a more positive light, I don't think that objective was met.
Maybe we, as a society, can eventually get to a point where people can go to a Waffle House and just eat waffles.
Maybe we, as a society, can eventually get to a point where people can go to a Waffle House and just eat waffles.
We're well past that point now. There won't be an outright gun ban for the foreseeable future. So yeah, water is wet?
No, it's a Carbine round. Much less powerful than even moderate hunting rifles.
It's the 7.62x39
I agree, however the current reality is the state of things as they are at this moment. It is what it is, until such time as we as a nation can get any headway on the issue.
The guy didn't want an "uncle Ben" situation on his hands.
Link
The Autumn Wind
Seriously. What I just read was a story about a guy going out of his way to murder someone.
SirClinksAlot
Member
Nah man. Gotta be strapped all the time! That's what our countries founders wanted.
I dont know why any of you, if placed in that situation would give this guy any benefit of doubt with "oh he hasn't shot anyboy yet" Guns are not toys you can just wave around and say "just kidding bro". I've had family members armed and wave guns around like idiots, you expect an emotionless response to some unknown robber? GTFO
Valkyr1983
Banned
OK so we ban guns
How so we stop criminals from getting them?
I know most crimes are committed with legally owned guns. But don't think they will all just magically disappear
I could go on Craigslist right now and buy a gun from someone with no background and for cash
This is what I call over thinking to fit an agenda.
Imperfected
Member
The justification doesn't work at all.
You can say you followed him into the parking lot out of concern for your wife, fair; you have now put yourself in a position where you can observe and see if your wife pulls into the parking lot while the robber is still there. (Though, given the fact the robber had not shot anyone at this point, there is no particular reason to assume his wife would be in any more danger than the other customers.)
There's no particular reason to go out and flag down the robber when you don't even see your wife entering the lot. Maybe if he had spun his yarn a little better ("He noticed me following him and pointed the rifle at me," instead of "I called for him and then shot him.") this could have worked as a shaky foundation for justifying his actions, but as it stands it's frankly indefensible.
You can say you followed him into the parking lot out of concern for your wife, fair; you have now put yourself in a position where you can observe and see if your wife pulls into the parking lot while the robber is still there. (Though, given the fact the robber had not shot anyone at this point, there is no particular reason to assume his wife would be in any more danger than the other customers.)
There's no particular reason to go out and flag down the robber when you don't even see your wife entering the lot. Maybe if he had spun his yarn a little better ("He noticed me following him and pointed the rifle at me," instead of "I called for him and then shot him.") this could have worked as a shaky foundation for justifying his actions, but as it stands it's frankly indefensible.
minor effort
Banned
I've been fortunate enough to have never been in an armed robbery situation, but I'd hope my first instinct would not be to prolong and exacerbate a deescalating situation.
But it sounds like you're also not giving armed customers inside the benefit of the doubt to be cool and collected in tense situations, which is why so few of these hero scenarios pan out well.
There was definitely an element of 'get my stuff back going on, as well as perhaps a dogmatic sense of 'you won't get away with it'.
Robber was bad (duh) , but customer made it a shootout.
Does the punishment (death) fit the crime ? Really supposed you can just do this ...
I find it a wild west , vigilante attitude that does nothing to make the country (world) safer.
Imagine it becomes common for people to do this.. guess what... robbers will start shooting first and become more violent, not go away , not stop robbing. It will just escalate.
Too many people walk around with their "good guy" guns just waiting till they can actually shoot as opposed to last resort hoping they never have to use it.
Does the punishment (death) fit the crime ? Really supposed you can just do this ...
I find it a wild west , vigilante attitude that does nothing to make the country (world) safer.
Imagine it becomes common for people to do this.. guess what... robbers will start shooting first and become more violent, not go away , not stop robbing. It will just escalate.
Too many people walk around with their "good guy" guns just waiting till they can actually shoot as opposed to last resort hoping they never have to use it.
Link
The Autumn Wind
This is akin to saying why have laws at all if people are just going to break them?
All illegal guns were legal guns at one point. Getting legal guns off the streets will reduce the number of illegal guns down the line. All this bullshit about how it wouldn't be a magical, immediate fix is so disingenuous.
Was going to say that but was afraid of the dog pile and deleted it.
Being in that situation is a lot different from people here commenting on it after the fact, sure it was scary as fuck and probably just wanted to make sure his wife would be safe regardless. In a fucked up way it's kind of romantic I suppose.
What did he mean by this?
Member
I think he shot the robber in the back as he escaped then police advised him the exact right things to say ("I went outside for my wife" "I called out to him" "He aimed at me" "I feared for my life") to avoid charges.
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