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[carlo6529]

Just something I want to throw out there. Do you think nintendo is worried of losing a lot of the casual support to apple in the next gen and thus want to solidify a strong core market early on with this console once again knowing that the core will always be around to buy the quality games?

Basically, what I am saying is, the industry is going through crazy changes and the future is starting to look a little shaky. If nintendo wants to maintain making these high quality games and not have to resort to making these dollar app's, then they have to make sure they appeal to the core gamer.

 

[Lupin the Third]

Just something I want to throw out there. Do you think nintendo is worried of losing a lot of the casual support to apple in the next gen and thus want to solidify a strong core market early on with this console once again knowing that the core will always be around to buy the quality games?

Basically, what I am saying is, the industry is going through crazy changes and the future is starting to look a little shaky. If nintendo wants to maintain making these high quality games and not have to resort to making these dollar app's, then they have to make sure they appeal to the core gamer.

I think you're on the right track, if said rumors about hardcore appeal are true.

 

[DECK'ARD]

Damn, that other Cafe thread killed this one...

It's a bit annoying, as most of the other thread is "ARE THOSE PICS REAL!", and where is the next rumour going to be posted. Here, there, another new thread?

I liked all the rumours being kept contained and evaluated in this thread personally, until we get the first official word from Nintendo.

 

[brb]

Damn, that other Cafe thread killed this one...

Just think of it at |OT2|

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Just something I want to throw out there. Do you think nintendo is worried of losing a lot of the casual support to apple in the next gen and thus want to solidify a strong core market early on with this console once again knowing that the core will always be around to buy the quality games?

Basically, what I am saying is, the industry is going through crazy changes and the future is starting to look a little shaky. If nintendo wants to maintain making these high quality games and not have to resort to making these dollar app's, then they have to make sure they appeal to the core gamer.

core casual hardcore IT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING

Seriously, none of that stuff means anything, like at all. It is a waste of time to even think about the market using those terms. More time should be spent thinking about the validity of using those terms, if there actually are definitions for them, and why people still cling onto them.

tl;dr: casual/core idea is bullshit, stop thinking in those terms please

 

[Grampa Simpson]

The exact ownership of Dragon Quest X won't prevent Nintendo from offering up a bunch of engineers to make sure that the game runs exceptionally well on both generations of system. They may even spend some time making sure that it renders at a variety of resolutions and includes HUD textures to match those resolutions.

 

[carlo6529]

core casual hardcore IT DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING

Seriously, none of that stuff means anything, like at all. It is a waste of time to even think about the market using those terms. More time should be spent thinking about the validity of using those terms, if there actually are definitions for them, and why people still cling onto them.

tl;dr: casual/core idea is bullshit, stop thinking in those terms please

They have different meaning to everyone. So you can't give it one definative definition.

You can say all you want that those terms don't exsist, or that there is no meaning to them, but you can't deny that there are different classes of videogame players, ones that take games more seriously, that need the latest and greatest software. Those are the core gamers imo.

So don't give me that shit that they don't exist. Calling someone a core or casual gamer is just an easier way to determine how important games are to that particular person.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

They have different meaning to everyone. So you can't give it one definative definition.

You can say all you want that those terms don't exsist, or that there is no meaning to them, but you can't deny that there are different classes of videogame players, ones that take games more seriously, that need the latest and greatest software. Those are the core gamers imo.

So don't give me that shit that they don't exist. Calling someone a core or casual gamer is just an easier way to determine how important games are to that particular person.

Nope. Those terms exist but they really are useless. I mean, they're completely subjective. Let's just take a look at your definition (which is one of a million).

How do you define how important games are for someone? How do you define taking games seriously? I'm guessing that even if someone does take software seriously, it has to be a certain type off software to matter?

Subjective ideas on top of subjective ideas on top of subjective ideas....i.e., bullshit.

Let's try and think critically about all of this instead of just lumping people into groups. True, it's the easy way out (and is an industry trend), but that doesn't make it right.

 

[ASIS]

Damn, that other Cafe thread killed this one...

well.. it's locked now, back to this thread I guess.

 

[swerve]

And back to sanity. It's amazing how people respond to images - even fake - more than text and ideas.

The 'screen stream' thing made no sense for single or two player games, nor for *any* examples of 'private data' gaming from Nintendo's past.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Good.
I think I prefer the other kind of Colbert report.

Who did the 3DS browser? Nintendo themselves? Is there any video of it?

It's meant to be Netfront, but I can't confirm.

 

[ThatObviousUser]

Who did the 3DS browser? Nintendo themselves? Is there any video of it?

 

[EricDiesel]

I really hope they at least show the controller at this investor meeting, like they did at that one TGS (I think???) with the Wii Remote. Something substantial. I can wait for E3, but... Urgh. The anticipation is killing me.

 

[dwu8991]

And back to sanity. It's amazing how people respond to images - even fake - more than text and ideas.

The 'screen stream' thing made no sense for single or two player games, nor for *any* examples of 'private data' gaming from Nintendo's past.

Uh, what else do you need a friggien 6 inch touchscreen for then?

 

[Graphics Horse]

Uh, what else do you need a friggien 6 inch touchscreen for then?

Touch controls for starters.

 

[radioheadrule83]

It's meant to be Netfront, but I can't confirm.

If it is access / netfront I hope it uses webkit like their smartphone browser..

 

[Lonewolf_92]

Damn, and I was gonna respond to one of the posts there. For what it's worth (and since Graphics Horse will probably return to this thread):

You laugh now, but in 30 years your thumbs won't be laughing!
It isn't much, still makes fighters awkward. I think swapping the dpad for a button diamond would be the best improvement.

I posted this a couple of times in the other (this) thread, and my Paint skills are hardly laudable, but I think this setup would work (keep in mind that it's meant to have slide pads for analog and the buttons would be more like the "bean shaped" GCN controller buttons and larger than pictured).

Combined with something like these as the touchscreen and it's mounting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4bv85Vkt44

Nice thing about this design is it can have a screen protector built in, and as the nunchucks are plugged and/or wired into it, no need for a condom or straps. As for the D-pad, I'd move it to the surface of the touchscreen frame (same with the power button and Start, Home, and Select). All the convenience of a traditional controller, and able to handle doubling as a remote/nunchuck combo for motion and pointer controls.

 

[Raide]

^

I really don't see anything that you stick onto your arm being great for longterm use. Holding your arm at that angle for any length of time will just be painful. I cannot see Nintendo making a control device that is actually more painful to use than a traditional pad or even the Wii Remote. Cool idea but a little impractical.

 

[neoanarch]

Who did the 3DS browser? Nintendo themselves? Is there any video of it?

I assumed it was still Opera doing it. I can't find any videos of the browser running. i'm guessing it hasn't been released yet.

 

[Jocchan]

well.. it's locked now, back to this thread I guess.

Thankfully. The other one was too focused on those pictures and had too many people believing they were real (or connected to the IGN article).

Spoiler

And, yes, I'm still disappointed at how the OP had my post with the other picture without the paragraph I added to clarify it made the other pics less likely to be real, if coming from the same source).

 

[Graphics Horse]

I think a dual stick split controller is a decent enough idea, but they'd probably just make each half identical, so you can throw 2 of them in the box, letting you play a complex single player game or a simple 2 player game from the start. But people were expecting Sony's Move to have dual analog and that never went anywhere...

One idea I had was to put a thin screen along the left hand side of the remote instead of on the top side, so you could just angle the remote towards you and the screen would be right there in your hand. I still think the actual rumoured design, 6" iPad with dreamcast edges, is what it will be. Pointing motion stylus makes sense also if they can make it.

 

[Ushojax]

This.

PES Pointer controls must get mainstream.

Absolutely. I just can't go back to the pad after playing the Wii versions. If they can avoid the mutant player likenesses of the HD games, the Wii2 versions will be godly.

 

[Lonewolf_92]

^

I really don't see anything that you stick onto your arm being great for longterm use. Holding your arm at that angle for any length of time will just be painful. I cannot see Nintendo making a control device that is actually more painful to use than a traditional pad or even the Wii Remote. Cool idea but a little impractical.

What angle? They fit tightly to the forearm which can swing free. Two of those were designed for runners, the other for the army. Compared to the Frankentrollers we've seen pass through this thread, it seems plenty practical to me.

 

[beelzebozo]

^

I really don't see anything that you stick onto your arm being great for longterm use. Holding your arm at that angle for any length of time will just be painful. I cannot see Nintendo making a control device that is actually more painful to use than a traditional pad or even the Wii Remote. Cool idea but a little impractical.

i like the idea of it being on a strap around your wrist because the use of it would be instant checking or adjustment of things, not a constant state of keeping your eye on it while you're playing the game. that would preclude a lot of constant interplay between the tv screen and the satellite screen, but for things like switching visors/beams in metroid prime, looking at a map or adjusting inventory in adventure games, changing equipment or navigating a leveling grid in an rpg, a screen attached to the wrist could be pretty useful and fun.

What angle? They fit tightly to the forearm which can swing free. Two of those were designed for runners, the other for the army. Compared to the Frankentrollers we've seen pass through this thread, it seems plenty practical to me.

i agree that the screen being a largely isolated element from the main controller seems more likely to me than the huge 8" wide controllers proposed in here. that's not to take anything from people doing mock-ups--some of them are beautiful and inspired--but they seem overly complicated in some ways, like concept cars you know will never make it to market.

 

[Graphics Horse]

I don't really think strapping a screen to your wrist is the type of pick up and play system Iwata is after, unless it's designed for you to wear all day long.

 

[beelzebozo]

i guess i don't see how putting the little elastic strap around your wrist would be that cumbersome or laborious. certainly no more so than slipping the wii remote loop around your wrist.

 

[Woffls]

I don't think we'll see the controller at the investors meeting, it's too big a deal. Price will be saved for last because that's how it's always done, so expect that at E3 as well. Uhh, games at E3 obviously.

I think we'll, from the meeting, get a philosophical statement, a name, a HUGE focus on 3rd parties and reassurance that core gamers are important to them.

Spoiler

Superior thread wins. Real discussion happens here

 

[Lonewolf_92]

I think a dual stick split controller is a decent enough idea, but they'd probably just make each half identical, so you can throw 2 of them in the box, letting you play a complex single player game or a simple 2 player game from the start. But people were expecting Sony's Move to have dual analog and that never went anywhere...

One idea I had was to put a thin screen along the left hand side of the remote instead of on the top side, so you could just angle the remote towards you and the screen would be right there in your hand. I still think the actual rumoured design, 6" iPad with dreamcast edges, is what it will be. Pointing motion stylus makes sense also if they can make it.

Well, keep in mind that the Wii, which was considered the ultimate party system, only came with one Wiimote.

I'm hoping the Dreamcast-Pad thing is just a devkit unit and not the final product, because that just doesn't sound comfortable. I have big hands with long fingers and it seems to me like I would have to struggle to reach the center of the screen without taking one off the side of the controller to do it, I doubt very much my kids would be able to use the thing.

 

[swerve]

Uh, what else do you need a friggien 6 inch touchscreen for then?

I'm not saying it won't stream things to the controller. However, it won't stream 1/4 of the screen to the controller, it'll stream *other stuff*, which will add to the gameplay experience rather than simply move it somewhere else.

-I'm *sceptical* it will be able to reliably stream to 4 controllers at once
-I do think it will allow users to interact with the base unit when the TV is off, but not with the same experience as when the TV is on.

 

[Graphics Horse]

i guess i don't see how putting the little elastic strap around your wrist would be that cumbersome or laborious. certainly no more so than slipping the wii remote loop around your wrist.

Well it's elastic for starters, it needs to be stretched out to fit your hand through. Hard to pass around, needs adjusting for different body shapes. Putting on a glove would be easier, but lets not go there.

 

[Woffls]

Well it's elastic for starters, it needs to be stretched out to fit your hand through. Hard to pass around, needs adjusting for different body shapes. Putting on a glove would be easier, but lets not go there.

6" screen strapped to the back of your hand, biometric sensors in the finger tips, motion sensors on each finger??? That's it, all the mockups are wrong, try again ;D

 

[Jocchan]

I don't think we'll see the controller at the investors meeting, it's too big a deal. Price will be saved for last because that's how it's always done, so expect that at E3 as well. Uhh, games at E3 obviously.

I think we'll, from the meeting, get a philosophical statement, a name, a HUGE focus on 3rd parties and reassurance that core gamers are important to them.

Spoiler

Superior thread wins. Real discussion happens here

Yes. Investor meetings aren't press events. Unless Nintendo decides to turn it into one, we won't be getting an announcement there. The best we can realistically hope for is Iwata answering some questions, considering how widespread the rumors are now, and mentioning an E3 reveal for more details.

I'm not saying it won't stream things to the controller. However, it won't stream 1/4 of the screen to the controller, it'll stream *other stuff*, which will add to the gameplay experience rather than simply move it somewhere else.

-I'm *sceptical* it will be able to reliably stream to 4 controllers at once
-I do think it will allow users to interact with the base unit when the TV is off, but not with the same experience as when the TV is on.

I'm honestly quite dubious about the whole streaming aspect. More details would be really appreciated.

If the console was powerful enough to output two 1080p pictures at (at least) 30 fps, with the first sent to the TV and the second one, split in four parts, streamed to four 960x540 screens (a resolution not *that* unlikely, considering the mixed reports about them being HD or not), we could have different applications for the latter in different games, be them single portions of split-screen games, or the same picture as the main screen at 1/4 of the resolution, or different stuff altogether like a menu/inventory screen.

Problem is: the console would need quite a bit of horsepower to do it. Dual 1080p seems way too insane.

 

[Captain Chaos]

Its never going to wirelessly transmit a 1080p signal to a 6 inch screen. For a start the tech is too expensive.

 

[Bidermaier]

Hardcore and motion sensing games on the TV/Monitor.
Casual games on the display/controllers.

Touch screen will double as an great extra interface for hardcore single games.

It is clever it is an original concept, it makes sense and will appeal a wide range of people.

 

[ThatObviousUser]

Ooh I wonder if this means we can go back to Animal Island in AC Cafe.

 

[First Children]

Not sure if this was addressed yet.

http://i.imgur.com/Y4lNb.jpg

-Integrated Ai-Live framework

but it should read AiLive as Ai-Live is something completely different.

http://www.ailive.net/
vs
http://ai-live.com/

Ou, ok o_o

 

[Always-honest]

Hardcore and motion sensing games on the TV/Monitor.
Casual games on the display/controllers.

Touch screen will double as an great extra interface for hardcore single games.

It is clever it is an original concept, it makes sense and will appeal a wide range of people.

can't you just drop these ridiculous terms and be more specific.

 

[which1spink]

ST

Spoiler

R

EAM

:O

 

[MYE]

Surprised to see my Project Café mockup as the news header pic on that Nintendo site you Go to

Seems like every gaf mock-up (and others) are also in here

 

[NemesisPrime]

With those specs it should just be slightly better than PS3/360 but probably with MUCH better IQ. Nice...

 

[The Bookerman]

I fail to see how the "Stream" looks like a SNES.

 

[NemesisPrime]

I fail to see how the "Stream" looks like a SNES.

Because it is fake?

 

[Bidermaier]

can't you just drop these ridiculous terms and be more specific.

I think it is easy to understand


By hardcore I meant games that you really want to be enjoyed at HD. Call it Zelda, Metroid, BF3. Games you want to play on your own. The TV mode will suit this kind of game nicely.

On the other hand you will use just the controller to play casual games
By casual games I mean things you play for a short period of time. And does not require too much attention for too long. Quick start games. I have not had a console in years but in my steam list I have games like... Altitude, Audiosuf, Gavitron 2, QuantZ.

The controller will be a great addiction for many hardcore single player games. And will be also great for multiplayer fun games. It is a win win concept IMO. And the perfect game for people who loves hardcore games but that also have a social life.

For the same price you have your 360 stereotypical games (plus a cool controller that works as trackpad, alternative screen, control console, etc) AND you get a iPad for games.

 

[Lonewolf_92]

Well it's elastic for starters, it needs to be stretched out to fit your hand through. Hard to pass around, needs adjusting for different body shapes. Putting on a glove would be easier, but lets not go there.

Doesn't have to be elastic, there are easily a dozen armband carriers for iPhones/iPods out there for use running and exercising, it's hardly new technology or even a new idea. If anything, given that this would be made specifically for the Stream's touchscreen, it would have several advantages over those third-party armbands.

 

[Always-honest]

I think it is easy to understand


By hardcore I meant .

by now you should know that definitions of hardcore are very subjective.
Rightfully so, cause it's a nonsense term.


but i agree with what you're saying in general.

 

[_Alkaline_]

by now you should know that definitions of hardcore are very subjective.
Rightfully so, cause it's a nonsense term.


but i agree with what you're saying in general.

I feel like I'm saying this all the time these days, but this hardcore/casual labelling is one of the worst things to grace this industry over the last decade. It's the new kiddy, but even less precise and even more elitist.

 

[boyshine]

The SNES-design comment is strange. Does that mean the japanese Super Famicom and european SNES.. or the design disaster that was the american SNES?

 

[Jocchan]

I feel like I'm saying this all the time these days, but this hardcore/casual labelling is one of the worst things to grace this industry over the last decade. It's the new kiddy, but even less precise and even more elitist.

It's nearly as annoying as HD used as a synonym for "PS360-level graphics".

The SNES-design comment is strange. Does that mean the japanese Super Famicom and european SNES.. or the design disaster that was the american SNES?

Hopefully the former.

 

[AceBandage]

The SNES-design comment is strange. Does that mean the japanese Super Famicom and european SNES.. or the design disaster that was the american SNES?

If it's real, I'd say more like the Japanese one.
Though, does that mean the Reset/Power buttons are just giant slide pads?
Also, would we load discs from the top of the unit?

 

[sphinx]

I feel like I'm saying this all the time these days, but this hardcore/casual labelling is one of the worst things to grace this industry over the last decade. It's the new kiddy, but even less precise and even more elitist.

But there is definitely a difference between a dedicated gamer and a casual gamer.

My sister enjoyed Super Mario Bros and Tetris but really doesn't give a fuck about games in general. It can be those games or Farmville or whatever keeps her from getting bored until she can go and do the stuff she really cares about.

A dedicated gamer invests time, mind and develops skills and such.

there are MILLIONS of both kind of gamers and pretending there isn't such division is delusional.