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[FunkMiller]

All the justifications of these drastic measures are therefore, for many Russians, simply counter-reactions to the West's actions. Putin can easily present it as if he had no choice and only re-acted, not acted. He can act like he is not the aggressor or the one who started it.

He literally invaded another sovereign country. If Russians believe that he is in some way not to blame for all of this… fuck them. They still have access to international media at the moment.

 

[Nikodemos]

He literally invaded another sovereign country. If Russians believe that he is in some way not to blame for all of this… fuck them. They still have access to international media at the moment.

Not really. Some younger Russians can still dodge the blocks via internet (at least, until Putin enacts his version of the great firewall), but older Russians have no info outlets apart from state media. All independent and foreign media were banned in the last few days.

 

[Corrik]

Get ready for more air to air fight

Its gona be scary man

Tbh im kinda wishing for more aa defence

The planes talked about being sent from Poland have no viability in the air. Ukraine isn't trained to use them and they are slow jets meant to be used with air superiority. It's a publicity stunt basically.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

Ofcourse they'll do more air to ground combat. Their ground forces are a complete mess. Their tactic is basically fire rockets / bombs from miles away. Kiev will be flattened when this is over.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

So a few weeks into this Neo-McCarthyism I want everybody to understand that this is how you will be othered if you stray into the realms of wrongthink.

Between Canada and Russia if you have the audacity to disagree with the ruling consensus you will be debanked, deplatformed, and imprisoned.

I don't fucking like Putin, but my neighbors don't deserve the shit they get.

 

[Wildebeest]

In essence, Putin's war may not be primarily about Ukraine, but about the formation of a stronger counterforce (Russia, China, India, ...) against the West.

What alliance? China is just buying Russian commodities and influence for cheap because they think Russians are idiots who just threw away everything for nothing. If anything, Russians will come to resent them more than anything if they tighten the screws. As for India, they are standing back shocked seeing that their old ally can't fight for shit and all the billions worth of arms they bought from them is a write-off, and they need to replace most of it. Maybe the smarter ones will see where strong man politics gets you, but I expect the concern about "weakness" to still be the larger one.

The real underlying story remains {SELF CENSORED TOO POLITICAL}. The world being so unable to act coherently drives policymakers to tears and is what gives this whole crisis its feverish nihilistic energy. The EU admitted many concerns about how they have been too slow last week, but for most it is an issue that they can't even look at rationally.

 

[ParaSeoul]

 

[betrayal]

He literally invaded another sovereign country. If Russians believe that he is in some way not to blame for all of this… fuck them. They still have access to international media at the moment.

You can't take your way of thinking and apply it to a large part of the Russian population, their socialization and way of life. This is one of the reasons why the situation between Western and non-Western countries has been tense for decades. First of all, it doesn't matter at all what is considered "good" or "bad". In the end, depending on the environment, it is purely a matter of interpretation.

You, I and many others see this war as a clear crime against humanity. Unfortunately, this does not mean that all people in all regions of our planet see it that way.

What alliance? China is just buying Russian commodities and influence for cheap because they think Russians are idiots who just threw away everything for nothing. If anything, Russians will come to resent them more than anything if they tighten the screws. As for India, they are standing back shocked seeing that their old ally can't fight for shit and all the billions worth of arms they bought from them is a write-off, and they need to replace most of it. Maybe the smarter ones will see where strong man politics gets you, but I expect the concern about "weakness" to still be the larger one.

The real underlying story remains {SELF CENSORED TOO POLITICAL}. The world being so unable to act coherently drives policymakers to tears and is what gives this whole crisis its feverish nihilistic energy. The EU admitted many concerns about how they have been too slow last week, but for most it is an issue that they can't even look at rationally.

I don't think it's that simple.

Trade between Russia and China increased by ~40% in the first two months of 2022 and it will continue to do so. China will certainly be the strongest country of a non-Western alliance. Russia knows that, and China knows that. The South American countries will also play a major role in the future. Should they clearly commit themselves to Russia, China and India, then the EU & USA will be inferior in all quantifiable aspects.

 

[IDKFA]

So this Ukrainian soldier is a far-right ultranationalist (Nazi?) That's bad, but does it justify the Russian army invading Ukraine and killing innocent citizens? No. Of course it doesn't.

No matter how you try and spin it, Russia is still in the wrong.

 

[Prison Mike]

Everyone stop the war now this guys sorted it.

 

[Wildebeest]

I don't think it's that simple.

Trade between Russia and China increased by ~40% in the first two months of 2022 and it will continue to do so. China will certainly be the strongest country of a non-Western alliance. Russia knows that, and China knows that. The South American countries will also play a major role in the future. Should they clearly commit themselves to Russia, China and India, then the EU & USA will be inferior in all quantifiable aspects.

So you say that Russia was already entering as a lesser partner in this relationship with the "strongest country" and I say this disparity is now even more one-sided. Is this how Russians really see themselves and will it cause any problems for them?

 

[betrayal]

So you say that Russia was already entering as a lesser partner in this relationship with the "strongest country" and I say this disparity is now even more one-sided. Is this how Russians really see themselves and will it cause any problems for them?

There is always a stronger or weaker partner. But that's not the point, or do you think that in NATO or the EU every country rejects cooperation as soon as it is supposedly weaker than the partners?

It's about common goals and cooperation that ultimately benefits everyone involved.

 

[M1chl]

Imagine being braindead to looking at this and thinking.... yeah they deserve it, Putin IS right.

Or sorry if I misunderstand you.

 

[Lukaku's First Touch]

It's actually hilarious, when you're country is infested with people beating up and hating gays / trans / ... people like the nazi's would do.

 

[Wildebeest]

There is always a stronger or weaker partner. But that's not the point, or do you think that in NATO or the EU every country rejects cooperation as soon as it is supposedly weaker than the partners?

It's about common goals and cooperation that ultimately benefits everyone involved.

There are larger members who dominate the EU in some ways, but things have to be agreed on by a vote of members. Maybe we are more talking of the relationship the USA has with other countries in the Americas.

 

[Hypereides]

Approximately 13300~ people have been arrested for anti-war protests across 59 Russian cities thus far.

Things inside Russia are literally getting off rails:

 

[EviLore]

Ruslan, a medical worker, breaks down while talking about how his former friends in Crimea believe all the Russian propaganda about the de-Nazifying liberation, while his family and the families of everyone he knows hide in their basements and he deals with piles of bodies of innocent civilians.

 

[M1chl]

Ruslan, a medical worker, breaks down while talking about how his former friends in Crimea believe all the Russian propaganda about the de-Nazifying liberation, while his family and the families of everyone he knows hide in their basements and he deals with piles of bodies of innocent civilians.

My father had, before war, around 20 Ukranians workers (all legal) in his company and he is still in contact with all of them and some of them have families on Crimea and they don't know anything, like that there is a war or that Putin is doing anything wrong. RU media is cancer.

From perspective of a westerner, this seems like impossible thought that people haven't got this info, but yeah, it's like during Bolshevik. Which we as a country experienced it.

 

[BigBooper]

It's amazing how powerful the labels like Nazi have become over the past few years and apparently reaching It's peak now. How about we look at actions instead? How about we call people who murder people murderers?

 

[EviLore]

Ukraine's parliament is only 2% far-right seats.

Germany's parliament, by comparison, is 11% far-right seats.

 

[Hypereides]

Ruslan, a medical worker, breaks down while talking about how his former friends in Crimea believe all the Russian propaganda about the de-Nazifying liberation, while his family and the families of everyone he knows hide in their basements and he deals with piles of bodies of innocent civilians.

I hope sooner or later this narrative will break and people will begin questioning if the media is actually being truthful to them. Especially, when they're continuously exposed to a consistent stream of people that tell them the opposite, true reality of the situation.

Right now the thing that Putin leverages the most is information warfare.

 

[prinz_valium]

Ukraine's parliament is only 2% far-right seats.

Germany's parliament, by comparison, is 11% far-right seats.

There is a huge difference between the Ukraine and German "far right".
Mostly it makes little sense to compare different country parliamentary compositions like that.


But the point stands. Ukraine has no Nazis in power.

 

[cormack12]

 

[betrayal]

Ukraine's parliament is only 2% far-right seats.

Germany's parliament, by comparison, is 11% far-right seats.

Seriously now? If anything, Svoboda is comparable to the German NDP, which doesn't even have a remote chance of any government participation.

It's really not that simple. And I say that as a German who thinks very little of the AfD (which is the party you obviously mean).

 

[Von Hugh]

We have gone from fake news to fake wars now? Amazing.

 

[TheDreadLord]

So, the latest news are saying that Biden administration is considering to bow to Venezuela (at this point basically a Russia/China vassal state) for more oil and gas so that the EU can reduce Russian imports. What a brilliant idea lol

 

[cormack12]

We have gone from fake news to fake wars now? Amazing.

Mostly peaceful wars

 

[EviLore]

Seriously now? If anything, Svoboda is comparable to the German NDP, which doesn't even have a remote chance of any government participation.

It's really not that simple. And I say that as a German who thinks very little of the AfD (which is the party you obviously mean).

Are you sure you don’t need liberating? Blink once if you do.

 

[STARSBarry]

Are you sure you don’t need liberating? Blink once if you do.

 

[Buggy Loop]

So a few weeks into this Neo-McCarthyism I want everybody to understand that this is how you will be othered if you stray into the realms of wrongthink.

Between Canada and Russia if you have the audacity to disagree with the ruling consensus you will be debanked, deplatformed, and imprisoned.

I don't fucking like Putin, but my neighbors don't deserve the shit they get.

 

[chromhound]

They seem to have created their own version of the swastika, a Z looking symbol .. wtf, I am starting to fear the worst ..

People coming from Belarus have the V symbol

 

[M1chl]

People coming from Belarus have the V symbol

Possibly because they go from the Východ (east), Z by internet account is for Západ (west). But...if that's true, why would they use Latin not Cyrillic?

I wrote it in Czech, but world direction has the same sounding word in Czech as in Russian.

 

[Nikodemos]

So the Red Cross says the tentative evacuation route out of Mariupol was mined. The Russians really trying for that "Ukrainians are shooting upon their own people" thing, huh?

OBTW, regarding neo-nazis, check out this "fine specimen": Dmitry Utkin, head of Wagner Group.

 

[LimanimaPT]

Possibly because they go from the Východ (east), Z by internet account is for Západ (west). But...if that's true, why would they use Latin not Cyrillic?

I wrote it in Czech, but world direction has the same sounding word in Czech as in Russian.

Isn't the Z a rotated N from nazi?

 

[Airbus Jr]

 

[M1chl]

Someone swapped street signs in Prague in Russia street (I lived there for quite a while)

"Russian warship, go fuck yourself"

 

[Stitch]

Taiwan, huh?

 

[Nikodemos]

Taiwan, huh?

The big "OOF".

 

[Alx]

That's a convenient list to tell other countries they should up their sanction game.
"Come on guys, even Monaco, San Marino and Montenegro made the list, what's your excuse ?"

 

[RAÏSanÏa]

The hand pointing fingers is also judged
Joy to the World

 

[Kittehkraken]

Taiwan, huh?

Imagine being upset with Iceland.

 

[RAÏSanÏa]

Taiwan, huh?

No Sugar tonight in my coffee. No sugar tonight in my tea.

 

[Rest]

The hand pointing fingers is also judged
Joy to the World

What am I supposed to be looking at?

 

[Loope]

Ukraine's parliament is only 2% far-right seats.

Germany's parliament, by comparison, is 11% far-right seats.

Exactly what i was saying to the other guy. There is far more extreme right across many countries in Europe on parliaments than on Ukraine.

In my country they got 7.3%

 

[RAÏSanÏa]

What am I supposed to be looking at?

The quote box must have gotten deleted in editing was talking to ParaSeoul

It was a comment about everyone facing judgement with a religious theme.

 

[ManaByte]

The number of people coming into this thread and trying to justify what Putin is doing is sickening. If you’re doing that, go fuck yourself.

 

[Teslerum]

There is a huge difference between the Ukraine and German "far right".
Mostly it makes little sense to compare different country parliamentary compositions like that.


But the point stands. Ukraine has no Nazis in power.

Pretty much. That's a bad comparison across countries.

The *left* in Ukraine wouldn't be considered particularly left in several western countries either. There are values Ukranians have across the board that could be considered right wing in another country.

But, as you said point still stands. There are no nazis in power, nor do they form much of a noteworthy presence.

 

[DrAspirino]

The number of people coming into this thread and trying to justify what Putin is doing is sickening. If you’re doing that, go fuck yourself.

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

 

[Mistake]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

My stance is and always will be “it’s not ok when anyone does it.” Ukraine is between a rock and a hard place, and it’s the civilians who suffer

Taiwan, huh?

I think this was a bad move by Taiwan, especially with how Ukraine is going

 

[DeepBreath87]

People need to step back from the moralizing. War is awful. It’s also pretty much the norm for human existence. Most of us have been incredibly blessed not to know any significant wars in our lifetime outside of a few regional conflicts. The problem is we are now so technologically advanced that the consequences of wide scale war wreck the planet, kill tons and tons of people and our economy is so dependent on international cooperation that most countries really cannot support themselves alone.

This is a purely pragmatic situation. You can be upset with Russia, but the goal here ultimately is to end the conflict as soon as possible while hopefully weakening Russia’s ability to create further conflict to the greatest degree reasonable. It’s not to inflict some righteous punishment upon Russia for doing evil things. Making that the goal would, essentially, turn this into a religious conflict.