Support NeoGAF

[Kraz]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

USA doesn't follow simple people's stories.

 

[NoLootBoxDev]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

Then what we just accept the murder of Ukrainian people by Russian invaders and say nothing?

This is a conflict in Ukraine not the USA vs another country (which they should be blamed too), but this is a threat about Russia invading Ukraine. If you want to complain about the USA vs another country go and make another threat. And before you can think, so you bla bla bla, support USA. I am from Costa Rica, I am against all wars, but this is about Russia and Ukraine.

 

[Deleted member 1159]

Important to remember how some of this stuff works because the Kremlin does always go back to its same bag of tricks. The secret laptop story was my favorite callback

 

[STARSBarry]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

There seems certainly a good few people in society who wish to think this way. That because the USA or UK for example have waged imperial wars in the past then its fine for Russia to wage there own.

Because America has in the past drone striked weddings then, Russia using unguided MRLS on civilian centers is fine. That it would be hypocritical to argue in favour of Ukraine when in the past you stood silent for others.

What a fucking awful way to think, that because people made wrong decisions in the past they should double down and stay silent now. What does this add? Is swinging the conversation towards Americas imperialist goals in Iraq now going to aid Ukraine? "To bad we can't decry Russia air striking your house and killing your wife and kids because my country hellfired a hospital once, sorry".

Fact the matter is at the time there is outcry

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protests_against_the_Iraq_War

But people seem to forget that as it tangles up there whole "but we are just as evil a society as the Russians" stance. The fact you are able to hold views counter to the narrative with little or no consequence outside of regular Joe's thinking your an insane nutjob if you voice them publically is a testament to the freedoms you have been given by Western society's.

 

[sw0mp_d0nk3y]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

Please link an example of someone on this forum saying it's OK when the USA does it. Should be easy since it's the "official" narrative.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Imagine being upset with Iceland.

But… why? Oh right, Björk twisted the knife

 

[ManaByte]

And this is why we have so many dicksplashes in here spreading bullshit about Nazis to defend Putin:

 

[DrAspirino]

Then what we just accept the murder of Ukrainian people by Russian invaders and say nothing?

Depends.

People commenting here that supported all other invasions done by the USA have absolutely no moral ground to even post about the tragedy that's going on in Ukraine, because as I said before, the USA has done exactly the same countless more times.

I, for one, living in a country whose democracy was utterly destroyed by foreign intervention (by Nixon + Kissinger, mind you), am all out against wars and foreign intervention in sovereign countries. Which is exactly what happened in Ukraine (because right now it isn't an intervention: it's a war).

And in times of peace, both Russia and Ukraine were equally despicable in their racism, xenofobia and homophobia. It's disgusting how they treat anyone that's not caucasian. Heck, there was a chilean doctorate student that married an ukraine woman and fled to Chile with her wife. When arriving, he told the radio how shitty he was treated by the ukrainian army. They even asked her wife, when they were searching them for documents and papers, how could she marry "a human trash that latinos are, and that she should've married an ukrainian man".

Anyway that was just to say that ukrainians are not "white doves" (by any mean), but they also didn't deserve that invasion, nor war.

 

[LimanimaPT]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

It's never ok. And let's not compare the violence and the indescrimination of the bombings.
And...please quote those who said that.

 

[ManaByte]

 

[SF Kosmo]

I'm not a huge fan of NATO but let's be realistic here. NATO would destroy Russian army in minutes. Their only chance is nukes. So currently NATO actually has an upper hand. For the first time ever.

Although it's worth mentioning that Russia has the better nukes, at least in an Armageddon scenario. Where the US has developed smaller more accurate and tactical nukes, Russia has shit that will wipe out three states and he totally impossible to defend against.

 

[Nikodemos]

There's apparently a longer video where they first call arty on that mech inf platoon.

 

[Kraz]

Depends.

People commenting here that supported all other invasions done by the USA have absolutely no moral ground to even post about the tragedy that's going on in Ukraine, because as I said before, the USA has done exactly the same countless more times.

I, for one, living in a country whose democracy was utterly destroyed by foreign intervention (by Nixon + Kissinger, mind you), am all out against wars and foreign intervention in sovereign countries. Which is exactly what happened in Ukraine (because right now it isn't an intervention: it's a war).

And in times of peace, both Russia and Ukraine were equally despicable in their racism, xenofobia and homophobia. It's disgusting how they treat anyone that's not caucasian. Heck, there was a chilean doctorate student that married an ukraine woman and fled to Chile with her wife. When arriving, he told the radio how shitty he was treated by the ukrainian army. They even asked her wife, when they were searching them for documents and papers, how could she marry "a human trash that latinos are, and that she should've married an ukrainian man".

Anyway that was just to say that ukrainians are not "white doves" (by any mean), but they also didn't deserve that invasion, nor war.

Joke

 

[STARSBarry]

Depends.

People commenting here that supported all other invasions done by the USA have absolutely no moral ground to even post about the tragedy that's going on in Ukraine.

 

[Wildebeest]

I don't recall supporting any invasion, so perhaps I should be one of the few with a permit to comment, unlike the ones who bring up excuses for Russia.

 

[Chaplain]

 

[Deleted member 1159]

Although it's worth mentioning that Russia has the better nukes, at least in an Armageddon scenario. Where the US has developed smaller more accurate and tactical nukes, Russia has shit that will wipe out three states and he totally impossible to defend against.

The Russians don’t have a single bomb which can wipe out three states. They depend on launching multiple “smaller” warheads just like we do. They don’t have tsar bombas just hanging around to drop on us

 

[STARSBarry]

I don't recall supporting any invasion, so perhaps I should be one of the few with a permit to comment, unlike the ones who bring up excuses for Russia.

Perhaps we should check with our Ministry of Morals, to make sure we are allowed an opinion on this.

Or perhaps the Joker could stop applying false equivalence across entire nations based on assumed inaction.

 

[DrAspirino]

THIS is what I'm worried about: the only ones winning in this war are the chinese, and forcing Russia out of Europe and into China's arms will only strengthen China...

...and we all know too well how authoritarian they are.

 

[Flash Junkins]

The Russians don’t have a single bomb which can wipe out three states. They depend on launching multiple “smaller” warheads just like we do. They don’t have tsar bombas just hanging around to drop on us

This is correct.

Also the Russians are well aware that we probably have 5-6 subs in striking range of Putin's location as we speak. They aren't going to do a damn thing but capitulate the Ukraine and go back to being grumpy.

What China does is honestly the world's biggest concern, it's clear now Russia is a has been.

 

[SF Kosmo]

The Russians don’t have a single bomb which can wipe out three states. They depend on launching multiple “smaller” warheads just like we do.

Look up the Poseidon bomb. They have torpedo like drones that can be launched and detonated underwater that can unleash a radioactive Tsunami taller than the highest building in New York. 200 megatons. And they have dozens of these fucking things in active service.

 

[STARSBarry]

This is correct.

Also the Russians are well aware that we probably have 5-6 subs in striking range of Putin's location as we speak. They aren't going to do a damn thing but capitulate the Ukraine and go back to being grumpy.

What China does is honestly the world's biggest concern, it's clear now Russia is a has been.

Considering Chinese equipment is commonly bad knock off's of Russian equipment if they haven't just bought Russuan export outright.

The diffrence will be how there communications and troop training holds up. While the west effectively trains its troops by consistant small scale conflicts and peace keeping duties. Places like China effectively have to Simulate combat which is very diffrent from the real thing. Even an army with some combat experience like Russia failed miserably. In many ways the spectre of the Red menace of Russia which has literally face planted face first for the world to see could quite easily be China as there military technology is equivalent to Russia rather than the west.

 

[Airbus Jr]

So it's OK when the USA does it (Afghanistan, Iraq, etc), but not when Russia does it.

Because as I've seen in this forum, that's the "official" narrative here.

Bullshit

But thats fine keep carrying those narratives

 

[Kraz]

Look up the Poseidon bomb. They have torpedo like drones that can be launched and detonated underwater that can unleash a radioactive Tsunami taller than the highest building in New York. 200 megatons. And they have dozens of these fucking things in active service.

Cthulhu gets us wet.

 

[Deleted member 1159]

Look up the Poseidon bomb. They have torpedo like drones that can be launched and detonated underwater that can unleash a radioactive Tsunami taller than the highest building in New York. 200 megatons. And they have dozens of these fucking things in active service.

But really, I don’t believe Putin…and such a weapon would be pointless when you’ve got the ability to just nuke port cities anyway, and any projected outcome would be hypothetical since it’s never been tested. The forces required to create a massive tidal wave are orders of magnitude beyond what a nuclear bomb could do. It’s like Trump nuking a hurricane….good luck

 

[NoLootBoxDev]

Depends.

People commenting here that supported all other invasions done by the USA have absolutely no moral ground to even post about the tragedy that's going on in Ukraine, because as I said before, the USA has done exactly the same countless more times.

I, for one, living in a country whose democracy was utterly destroyed by foreign intervention (by Nixon + Kissinger, mind you), am all out against wars and foreign intervention in sovereign countries. Which is exactly what happened in Ukraine (because right now it isn't an intervention: it's a war).

And in times of peace, both Russia and Ukraine were equally despicable in their racism, xenofobia and homophobia. It's disgusting how they treat anyone that's not caucasian. Heck, there was a chilean doctorate student that married an ukraine woman and fled to Chile with her wife. When arriving, he told the radio how shitty he was treated by the ukrainian army. They even asked her wife, when they were searching them for documents and papers, how could she marry "a human trash that latinos are, and that she should've married an ukrainian man".

Anyway that was just to say that ukrainians are not "white doves" (by any mean), but they also didn't deserve that invasion, nor war.

Sorry to hear that. I have been to Ukraine before and have never experienced any type of discrimination, I bet I was lucky. But I have to say all fucking countries are racists. France (racists), USA (racists, even Puerto Rican who are USA citizens get discriminated against by the mainland people). Costa Rica (racists), Mexico (racists), every country have racism in one way or another.

 

[Airbus Jr]

And in times of peace, both Russia and Ukraine were equally despicable in their racism, xenofobia and homophobia. It's disgusting how they treat anyone that's not caucasian. Heck, there was a chilean doctorate student that married an ukraine woman and fled to Chile with her wife. When arriving, he told the radio how shitty he was treated by the ukrainian army. They even asked her wife, when they were searching them for documents and papers, how could she marry "a human trash that latinos are, and that she should've married an ukrainian man".

Remind me again why this post about racism related to the war in ukraine?

Dude racism happens everywhere there always shitbags in every country it is not something exclusives to russia or ukraine

This is not the time nor place to discuss ( about racism) here

 

[Hypereides]

Russia abstained from attending the preliminary trial at the Hague. Shocking.

Putin probably doesn't give a shit or knew he couldn't stand a fight in the international judicial system unless he skewed or twisted the odds to his advantage. He needs to sway the rules or circumstances in his favour like he does on his own home turf.

If the alleged report about Russia cutting its internet off from the rest of the world is real, then the Russian regime will have set a massive environment for indoctrination.

 

[SF Kosmo]

But really, I don’t believe Putin…and such a weapon would be pointless when you’ve got the ability to just nuke port cities anyway, and any projected outcome would be hypothetical since it’s never been tested. The forces required to create a massive tidal wave are orders of magnitude beyond what a nuclear bomb could do. It’s like Trump nuking a hurricane….good luck

The "point" as I understand it is that we have a very advanced missile defense system that could shoot down airborne nukes, but we don't have anything that could stop a torpedo from detonating 100 miles off the coast line. It's impossible to defend against.

Yes it's largely theoretical and it's larger that the largest warheads that have ever been tested but I'd rather not take the chance.

 

[Kraz]

Yes it's largely theoretical and it's larger that the largest warheads that have ever been tested but I'd rather not take the chance.

Run

 

[chromhound]

Putin keeps taking L's

 

[Hari Seldon]

The "point" as I understand it is that we have a very advanced missile defense system that could shoot down airborne nukes, but we don't have anything that could stop a torpedo from detonating 100 miles off the coast line. It's impossible to defend against.

Yes it's largely theoretical and it's larger that the largest warheads that have ever been tested but I'd rather not take the chance.

That assumes they can sneak in a sub that can launch that torpedo close enough. I'm not sure that they can. If their navy is half as inept as their army then they definitely cannot haha.

 

[BlackTron]

The "point" as I understand it is that we have a very advanced missile defense system that could shoot down airborne nukes, but we don't have anything that could stop a torpedo from detonating 100 miles off the coast line. It's impossible to defend against.

Yes it's largely theoretical and it's larger that the largest warheads that have ever been tested but I'd rather not take the chance.

For that matter, what about hypersonic missiles? Isn't it true that these are extremely difficult or even impossible to shoot down, due to the insane speed and the nature of their flight path?

 

[Superkamikaze]

It’s interesting how many folks discuss or show concern regarding China’s military strength, when the real concern is their economic strength against the west if there’s ever a conflict between the two, assuming Taiwan will be a conflict. The US / West will probably have to stand by and just watch Taiwan be taken, any military action and the Chinese will hurt the west economically. The west can’t easily sanction China, sanctioning Russia was pretty pain free for the US all thing considered, sanctioning China would be brutal, total economic stand still / free fall in the west.

 

[Deleted member 1159]

The "point" as I understand it is that we have a very advanced missile defense system that could shoot down airborne nukes, but we don't have anything that could stop a torpedo from detonating 100 miles off the coast line. It's impossible to defend against.

Yes it's largely theoretical and it's larger that the largest warheads that have ever been tested but I'd rather not take the chance.

Our missile defense systems aren’t advanced enough to make developing such a weapon (which likely wouldn’t do anything like described) worth it. Russia has plenty of submarine based, air based, and land based nuclear options and we can’t defend against all of it, or really much at all. Worrying about some megaweapon creating a massive poison tsunami is a waste of time

 

[Hari Seldon]

It’s interesting how many folks discuss or show concern regarding China’s military strength, when the real concern is their economic strength against the west if there’s ever a conflict between the two, assuming Taiwan will be a conflict. The US / West will probably have to stand by and just watch Taiwan be taken, any military action and the Chinese will hurt the west economically. The west can’t easily sanction China, sanctioning Russia was pretty pain free for the US all thing considered, sanctioning China would be brutal, total economic stand still / free fall in the west.

After COVID and cold war 2 it is clear that we cannot be so dependent on authoritarian countries like China and politicians needs to run on decoupling us from them.

 

[Raven117]

It’s interesting how many folks discuss or show concern regarding China’s military strength, when the real concern is their economic strength against the west if there’s ever a conflict between the two, assuming Taiwan will be a conflict. The US / West will probably have to stand by and just watch Taiwan be taken, any military action and the Chinese will hurt the west economically. The west can’t easily sanction China, sanctioning Russia was pretty pain free for the US all thing considered, sanctioning China would be brutal, total economic stand still / free fall in the west.

Well, both need to be discussed overall, but to your specific point with this, you are absolutely right.

Heavy sanctions on China would throw everything off. China has to sell abandoned the west has to buy.

 

[LimanimaPT]

Putin keeps taking L's

Is this legit? Wouldn't this be kind of a good deal considering the circunstances?

 

[Kraz]

Worrying about some megaweapon creating a massive poison tsunami is a waste of time

 

[DrAspirino]

After COVID and cold war 2 it is clear that we cannot be so dependent on authoritarian countries like China and politicians needs to run on decoupling us from them.

Exactly, but that has costs that corporations don't want to assume. I mean, Apple and Walmart's own brands can perfectly bring back their operations to the USA, while keeping the same costs for end users, but would decrease their profits considerably. They'll still be profitable, but much less than they're today.

Heck, some factories could actually be reopened in my country, since now we bring everything from China.

 

[Kraz]

It’s interesting how many folks discuss or show concern regarding China’s military strength, when the real concern is their economic strength against the west if there’s ever a conflict between the two, assuming Taiwan will be a conflict. The US / West will probably have to stand by and just watch Taiwan be taken, any military action and the Chinese will hurt the west economically. The west can’t easily sanction China, sanctioning Russia was pretty pain free for the US all thing considered, sanctioning China would be brutal, total economic stand still / free fall in the west.

The lead up to the Olympics gave a look into their culture. Seems top heavy like Russia. Clay feet.

 

[Atrus]

Look up the Poseidon bomb. They have torpedo like drones that can be launched and detonated underwater that can unleash a radioactive Tsunami taller than the highest building in New York. 200 megatons. And they have dozens of these fucking things in active service.

They have planned 30 and have an unknown number completed. Similarly, they planned for 60 full production SU57's by 2015 and have only 4 full production planes as of 2022 (on top of 10 test planes) and of the 2,300 T-14 Armatas they planned by 2020, they have less than 100 for a "test batch".

Russia loves parading about new tech that will one day, possibly, be a threat to the West. Then they dither because weapons production or maintenance is a jobs program that isn't as profitable to oligarchs as other activities.

 

[Nikodemos]

Several Twitter accounts, including H. I. Sutton (famous submarine technology analyst) are claiming that Ukrainian forces lured a Russian patrol vessel close to the shore and set it ablaze with MLRS fire.

 

[STARSBarry]

Several Twitter accounts, including H. I. Sutton (famous submarine technology analyst) are claiming that Ukrainian forces lured a Russian patrol vessel close to the shore and set it ablaze with MLRS fire.

Yes just like Ukrainian forces "lured' the Russian forces across the border and just outside Kiev.

 

[Nikodemos]

Yes just like Ukrainian forces "lured' the Russian forces across the border and just outside Kiev.

Seems like they actually managed to pull it off:



It would be quite the catch, since said ship is one of the newest in the Russian Navy. If the 30 destroyed helicopters are also true, it would show that the Ukrainians punch way above their weight.

 

[Kraz]

Seems like they actually managed to pull it off:



It would be quite the catch, since said ship is one of the newest in the Russian Navy. If the 30 destroyed helicopters are also true, it would show that the Ukrainians punch way above their weight.

Nice catch.

 

[chromhound]

It's seems like Russia is lowering their Standards lol

 

[DeepBreath87]

Debating any outcomes regarding nuclear war is a waste of time. Everyone involved is aware that it is both suicidal and a foregone conclusion once the first weapons are fired. That’s why no one ever uses them because the consequences are immediate and well understood.

Honestly, had the consequences of this whole war been well understood in the same way, maybe it doesn’t happen. But leadership in the West was so wishy-washy in the lead up that it is possible Putin didn’t think anyone would really come at Russia too hard. You had Biden in the weeks just prior to this talking openly about disagreements among NATO members and how small incursions would be seen differently from full scale invasions. We essentially watched Russia amass an obvious invasion force on Ukraine’s border for months and waited for them to do anything before we showed them what the consequences would be. Maybe if we laid it out more clearly, Putin doesn’t do this. Of course maybe he was committed either way.

 

[Vestal]

It's seems like Russia is lowering their Standards lol

Such a bullshit offer.

 

[TwinB242]

It's seems like Russia is lowering their Standards lol

Not surprising. Their military is being embarrassed and they're facing economic ruin at home. Ukraine just needs to hold on a little longer and Russia will continue to lessen their demands.