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Russia begins Invasion of Ukraine

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BlackM1st

Banned
The problem dealing with tyrants that actually have working nukes is that if you push against them, they WILL push the button and use those nukes. So, are you suggesting that in an effort of dealing with a tyrant, it's better to end the life of hundreds of thousands (or even millions) with a nuclear war, instead of letting the tyrant have his wimps?

At least that's whay I got from your post: it's better to risk an all-out nuclear war to stop Putin than let him have his fit.

Ok....
 

MrMephistoX

Member
I don’t think Russia would get nuked for nuking Ukraine.

Nukes are legal weapons and Ukraine has no security guarantee from us. Heck, Russia could use a hypersonic missile and we wouldn’t even know it was happening until it was over. Not saying this is the outcome, but if Putin is losing and backed against a wall he can always argue that it was our material support of Ukraine that necessitated taking that action to end the war.
The pessimist in me wonders if they took Chernobyl to use a nuke while making it look like an accident. Like how would we know if they went in and detonated one of their doomsday devices they were working on in the 80’s and blamed it on a errant ukranian missile or intense fighting or something?
 

Wildebeest

Member
I don’t think Russia would get nuked for nuking Ukraine.

Nukes are legal weapons and Ukraine has no security guarantee from us. Heck, Russia could use a hypersonic missile and we wouldn’t even know it was happening until it was over. Not saying this is the outcome, but if Putin is losing and backed against a wall he can always argue that it was our material support of Ukraine that necessitated taking that action to end the war
I think they would and that it would quickly escalate into a full on nuclear exchange that would make agriculture and human life almost impossible across most of the earth. Probably a coin toss which one of us is right. Want to be the one to toss that coin?
 

chromhound

Gold Member
9nrr8US.jpg
 

QSD

Member
TBF, so do what few older pro russian people there were in the Ukraine. Romanticizing the USSR.
The collapse of the USSR is a complicated topic. IIRC following the collapse, during the Yeltsin years, Russia fell into poverty and many Russians were near starvation. Even now there are many Russians that lament the collapse, because the USSR provided jobs and income for many Russians that disappeared overnight, leaving them to fend for themselves in squalid conditions. I remember seeing a somewhat sensationalist documentary about a guy who got killed by a siberian tiger after stealing its prey. He, along with many in his village in the extreme east of russia, was basically thrown into a life of subsistence hunting because all the jobs disappeared after the collapse.
 
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Yeah, tomorrow we're gonna find out how much poorer we're going to be.

Gotta be honest with you, had a very dreadful weekend. Medvedev considers reinstating death sentence for the "worst kind of criminals", general-prosecutor made a public statement that any kind of donation or support for the enemy is considered a treason (20 year sentence) and Putin is escalating nuclear threats. It sucks being threatened by your government and feeling like a pariah to the whole world at the same time.

Hopefully, what we're seeing now is the agony of a dying regime. I hope to make it though and see Ukraine, Belarus and Russia free.

You guys did absolutely not deserve any of this. You're just innocent bystanders being witness to an insane man and his schemes.
 
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Batiman

Banned
Sorry for my ignorance, but what is the range on these nukes nowadays? How much damage is the worst one capable of?
 

Tumle

Member
The collapse of the USSR is a complicated topic. IIRC following the collapse, during the Yeltsin years, Russia fell into poverty and many Russians were near starvation. Even now there are many Russians that lament the collapse, because the USSR provided jobs and income for many Russians that disappeared overnight, leaving them to fend for themselves in squalid conditions. I remember seeing a somewhat sensationalist documentary about a guy who got killed by a siberian tiger after stealing its prey. He, along with many in his village in the extreme east of russia, was basically thrown into a life of subsistence hunting because all the jobs disappeared after the collapse.
Didn’t that happen before the collapse? I haven’t looked it up.. but seem to remember seeing long lines waiting to buy food from almost empty stores on tv.. but I was a kid around that time.. so could have been after the fall of the ussr.. sometimes it’s hard to remember the order of things happening 😊
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Interesting take by Russia considering they got by far the biggest land mass already in the world.

Too bad those idiots cant figure out how to build an awesome economy and high standard of living out of it. With endless natural resources to sell and tax, that alone should be enough get people earning sky high wages. Somehow they fail, while tiny countries with hardly anything can do better.

If people think Canada is too big as the #2 ranked country by size, googling says Russia is about 2x our size in land. How much more land do Russian want?
 
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QSD

Member
Didn’t that happen before the collapse? I haven’t looked it up.. but seem to remember seeing long lines waiting to buy food from almost empty stores on tv.. but I was a kid around that time.. so could have been after the fall of the ussr.. sometimes it’s hard to remember the order of things happening 😊
it's definitely after

here's some sobering figures from the Wikipedia article on the dissolution of the Soviet Union (the Gini ratio being the globally agreed-upon measure for economic inequality)

The breakdown of economic ties that followed the collapse of the Soviet Union led to a severe economic crisis and catastrophic fall in living standards in post-Soviet states and the former Eastern Bloc,[166] which was even worse than the Great Depression.[167][168] Poverty and economic inequality surged between 1988–1989 and 1993–1995, with the Gini ratio increasing by an average of 9 points for all former socialist countries.[169] Even before Russia's financial crisis in 1998, Russia's GDP was half of what it had been in the early 1990s.[168]

In the decades following the end of the Cold War, only five or six of the post-communist states are on a path to joining the wealthy capitalist West while most are falling behind, some to such an extent that it will take over 50 years to catch up to where they were before the end of communism.[170][171]
 
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StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Didn’t that happen before the collapse? I haven’t looked it up.. but seem to remember seeing long lines waiting to buy food from almost empty stores on tv.. but I was a kid around that time.. so could have been after the fall of the ussr.. sometimes it’s hard to remember the order of things happening 😊
I remember that too. Might had been late 80s or early 90s. A variety store down the street had more food in it.

There's articles of I think Yeltsin coming to the US and checking out a random grocery store which looked like a normal place. He thought it was staged as he didnt believe a store could be stocked with so much food and with so much variety. The guy obviously doesnt get out much because just about every store in any half decent country would have similar stocked stores whether its food, clothes or electronics.

It's not like a well stocked store is something that only came about in 1990. I'm sure stores were jammed with good shit when the Beatles hadnt even formed their band yet. Thats the kind of backwards thinking you get from some governments.
 
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Fluo

Member
You guys did absolutely not deserve any of this. You're just innocent bystanders being witness to an insane man and his schemes.
More like hostages, but thank you.

Interesting take by Russia considering they got by far the biggest land mass already in the world.

Too bad those idiots cant figure out how to build an awesome economy and high standard of living out of it. With endless natural resources to sell and tax, that alone should be enough get people earning sky high wages. Somehow they fail, while tiny countries with hardly anything can do better.
That's Kiselev, he's one of the bigger propagandists, likes to take ridiculous official stances and embellish them even further.

As for building an awesome economy - that's the thing, the regime is not interested in enriching its people. They actually want everyone stupid and barely scraping by.
 
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Michael Anthony McFaul (born October 1, 1963) is an American academic and diplomat who served as the United States Ambassador to Russia from 2012 to 2014. McFaul is currently the Ken Olivier and Angela Nomellini Professor in International Studies in the Department of Political Science at Stanford University, where he is the Director of the Freeman Spogli Institute for International Studies. He is also a Peter and Helen Bing Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution

 

RAÏSanÏa

Member

The Russian Embassy, who earlier tweeted that members of its staff have received threats, is referring to Greece’s condemnation of Russian action in Ukraine and in particular to the bombardment of the region near Mariupol, in eastern Ukraine, which resulted in the death of 10 ethnic Greeks.

The Embassy is blasting what it calls the silence of Greek politicians who as it says ignored for eight years “the martyrdom of Donbas which was brought about by the bullets, bombs and shells of the Ukrainian army and the nationalist fascist battalions.”

“While thousands of people were mourned there, and the villages and towns were covered in blood, no official building or fountain here in Athens was ever dressed in the colors of peace, no tweets were hastened to be posted on an official website and no action was taken,” the statement reads.
Greece irks Russia with the display of Ukrainian colors

The statement follows the move by the Greek Parliament to illuminate part of its facade with the Ukrainian flag to express its solidarity with the suffering Ukrainian people.

“The flag of Ukraine illuminates tonight the facade of the Greek Parliament, above the Monument of the Unknown Soldier, from 7 pm to midnight,” a Parliament press release said.
 

E-Cat

Member
More like hostages, but thank you.


That's Kiselev, he's one of the bigger propagandists, likes to take ridiculous official stances and embellish them even further.

As for building an awesome economy - that's the thing, the regime is not interested in enriching its people. They actually want everyone stupid and barely scraping by.
You need to rise up against Putin. All it takes is one hero brave enough to assassinate him. That is the only way out of this situation.

Or maybe he gets "Caesar'd" by the oligarchs?
 

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion

The Russian Embassy, who earlier tweeted that members of its staff have received threats, is referring to Greece’s condemnation of Russian action in Ukraine and in particular to the bombardment of the region near Mariupol, in eastern Ukraine, which resulted in the death of 10 ethnic Greeks.

The Embassy is blasting what it calls the silence of Greek politicians who as it says ignored for eight years “the martyrdom of Donbas which was brought about by the bullets, bombs and shells of the Ukrainian army and the nationalist fascist battalions.”

“While thousands of people were mourned there, and the villages and towns were covered in blood, no official building or fountain here in Athens was ever dressed in the colors of peace, no tweets were hastened to be posted on an official website and no action was taken,” the statement reads.
Greece irks Russia with the display of Ukrainian colors

The statement follows the move by the Greek Parliament to illuminate part of its facade with the Ukrainian flag to express its solidarity with the suffering Ukrainian people.


“The flag of Ukraine illuminates tonight the facade of the Greek Parliament, above the Monument of the Unknown Soldier, from 7 pm to midnight,” a Parliament press release said.
"Russian Embassy, go fuck yourself"
 

Fluo

Member
You need to rise up against Putin. All it takes is one hero brave enough to assassinate him. That is the only way out of this situation.

Or maybe he gets "Caesar'd" by the oligarchs?
I want to remind you that there are no opposition leaders active currently. Nemtsov's assassinated, Navalny's in jail, his supporters are either in jail or fled the country. It's not easy to self-organize, those who do, get beaten up and arrested. Nonetheless, you should expect bigger protests next week.

Putin is keeping distance from everyone, hard to tell if someone from his corrupt government has the balls to do the deed.
 
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I want to remind you that there are no opposition leaders active currently. Nemtsov's assassinated, Navalny's in jail, his supporters are either in jail or fled the country. It's not easy to self-organize, those who do, get beaten up and arrested. Nonetheless, you should expect bigger protests next week.

Putin is keeping distance from everyone, hard to tell if someone from his corrupt government has the balls to do the deed.
I guess that if he dies someone from the army would step in(?). He only governs because they let him.
 
This is a dumb question but if Putin started using nukes would that lead to WW3?
Only if it hits other countries. Besides that I don’t think anyone in Europe cares enough. People need to realize that countries such as Germany just started supporting Ukrainian war efforts after they realized that Russia wouldn’t steamroll them. Such countries are more interested in their economies than saving lives.
 
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QSD

Member
You need to rise up against Putin. All it takes is one hero brave enough to assassinate him. That is the only way out of this situation.

Or maybe he gets "Caesar'd" by the oligarchs?
Any situation like this would unfortunately be extraordinarily dangerous, a power struggle will likely ensue with a huge stockpile of nukes hanging in the balance. The best situation is if Putin somehow leaves the stage peacefully, but it's hard to imagine the circumstances where that could happen.
 

Fluo

Member
I guess that if he dies someone from the army would step in(?). He only governs because they let him.
No one knows. There's no successor, not even a candidate. Every top official is corrupt to the core. Probably someone's gonna flee, someone's gonna fight for power. It's gonna get worse before it gets better for us, that's for sure.
 

FunkMiller

Member
Any situation like this would unfortunately be extraordinarily dangerous, a power struggle will likely ensue with a huge stockpile of nukes hanging in the balance. The best situation is if Putin somehow leaves the stage peacefully, but it's hard to imagine the circumstances where that could happen.

We should hope for some sort of organised military coup. That way at least, we may get some stability through military strength. Where that leads, I have no idea.

I struggle to see Russian generals carrying out orders to launch nuclear weapons if Putin goes that raving mad.
 

Catphish

Member
We should hope for some sort of organised military coup. That way at least, we may get some stability through military strength. Where that leads, I have no idea.

I struggle to see Russian generals carrying out orders to launch nuclear weapons if Putin goes that raving mad.
Maybe he secretly detonates one of his own in his own territory for justification.
 

Stuart360

Member
Goit this horrible feeling that Putin is going to nuke Kyiv. He will get away with it too as the US, UK, no one are going to launch nukes against Russia, as Russia will instantly retaliate ,and it will be the end of the world.

People will laugh i'm sure but a couple of days a go talk of nuclear weapons was laughed off as ridiculous.
 
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