Seven Dead, Several Hospitalized in Isla Vista Mass Shooting

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Spine_Ripper said:
Not really. What kid complains to their parents that he can't get his dick wet and that this makes him feel immense rage against all women? Seriously.
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Um, I talked with MY mom and dad about being sexually frustrated, and they helped me get my shit together and probably prevented me from committing suicide. That being said, you have to meet the process halfway. And of course it seems like lots of people have weird, soulless, fake ass relationships with their parents so it might not have done any good regardless.
 
Dabookerman said:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...meditated-authorities-say-20140524-story.html

ZRRsGdM.jpg


That's a family gun o_o?
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Sounds like he came from a wealthy enough family for that not to be totally out of the question (not likely mind you, would also depend on the family's general policy on guns).
 
Wait did he seriously quote Hayden Christensen from Attack of the Clones?

On the six-minute video, he talks about feeling alienated and rejected by women.

“I will be a god compared to you. You will all be animals. You are animals, and I will slaughter you like animals. I hate all of you. Humanity is a disgusting, wretched, depraved species," he says.
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Both this guy and George Lucas should be ashamed.
 
Such a tragic situation. Sort of feel sorry for the guy not enough to condone murder but I've been rejected many times before and never had a boyfriend or girlfriend ever. so i see where he is coming from. RIP to all those that died. I somewhat feel like this could have been avoided if he had a friend or someone to lean on and talk to. Therapists can only do so much and at the end of the day its a paycheck for them.
 
Fiction said:
Men certainly do have issues that very much need to be addressed, but the majority of what you see coming out of MRA circles seems to be focused on blaming women for thier problems and trying to make women's problems insignificant. It's a very hateful movement in general.

Being angry and mysoginistic is not the way to affect social change.
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I go to a local men's groups that compromises a lot of frustrated men, mostly older men, and the long time guys have imparted me wisdom, strategies, and all kinds of things. Now that my life is back in order, I've started to go on a lot of dates recently. Women seem to like being around me. But thanks for lumping me with extremists. I can do it right back but that's both off topic and stupid. I figured I'd set the record straight however.
 
Dabookerman said:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/...meditated-authorities-say-20140524-story.html

ZRRsGdM.jpg


That's a family gun o_o?
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He then took off down Del Playa Drive and crashed into a parked vehicle, the Sheriff’s Department said. When deputies approached the vehicle they discovered the man was dead and recovered a semiautomatic handgun.
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That picture isn't for this mass shooting. Its also reported he did it drive by style, you can't do that with a semi automatic rifle.

I can't even tell what's in that picture either, it seems completely unrelated even though its in the article you posted.
 
Blackstarhat said:
hes hot
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Thing is there was nothing physically unattractive about him. It's obviously his social and mental issues that prevented him from finding a girl. I have problems on three levels: physical, social and mental but I don't have delusions of grandeur (I'm the opposite) and I don't go want to hurt or kill anyone. If someone made him realize all he needed to do was make some minor social changes and to keep receiving whatever therapy he needed, he might have been quite successful. On top, he was from a well off family and his father worked on a very popular movie so he almost had a "free pass" so to speak. Regardless, he was so far gone I would dare to say he was a sociopath and I doubt most people would disagree.

In the end the seven people he murdered and the other seven he injured I feel so sorry for and their families. What drives people to commit heinous acts like this is mind boggling, at least for me.
 
I really don't like cyber-psychological autopsies.

If his name is made public sure, but I'm sure NSA is building profiles using all sorts of algorithms and shit of suicides, killers etc. based on their internet/phone usage to see who is most "at risk".

/tinfoil
 
Fantasmo said:
I go to a local men's groups that compromises a lot of frustrated men, mostly older men, and the long time guys have imparted me wisdom, strategies, and all kinds of things. Now that my life is back in order, I've started to go on a lot of dates recently. Women seem to like being around me. But thanks for lumping me with extremists. I can do it right back but that's both off topic and stupid. I figured I'd set the record straight however.
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I didn't lump anyone with extremists. And 'a local men's group' is not 'MRA'. That's like getting pissed that people are putting down PETA because you work for the ASPCA.

MRA is the Red Pill and PUA.

I was simply explaining how the majority of the MRA movement appears in most media.
 
neojubei said:
Such a tragic situation. Sort of feel sorry for the guy not enough to condone murder but I've been rejected many times before and never had a boyfriend or girlfriend ever. RIP to all those that died. I somewhat feel like this could have been avoided if he had a friend or someone to lean on and talk to. Therapists can only do so much and at the end of the day its a paycheck for them.
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Why the hell would you feel sorry for him? His view of women is misogynistic and he thinks he is entitled to them.
 
So the parents claim he was getting psychiatric help. Sucks it couldn't do more if he had been doing it for awhile.

The human brain is terribly complex...
 
Fiction said:
MRA is the Red Pill and PUA.
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Wait, really? I feel like you're doing what others do when they lump feminists in with tumblr misandrists and blame all of feminism. I'm not familiar with any of those three groups except for the horror stories I occasionally read about RP/PUA but I'm pretty sure they're quite different.
 
block tower said:
sad to see someone get so crippled by minor things like being a virgin or feeling unattractive to girls.
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in the grand scheme of things it is definitely doesn't matter a whole lot, but to a young adults I would imagine it would be demeaning to hear other men circle jerking and stroke their egos about how many women they have slept with

MormaPope said:
This picture:

ALeqM5gH2_o9nxi0MwNrwA3jnmy1ckZREg
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why would you even need that much ammo?

EDIT: why the hell would the times even put that in the article!?!?!?
 
I've always wondered why so many shooters kill themselves at the end. Even under the threat of jail or the death penalty, it must take a lot to willingly end your own life.

With this dude, I wonder if it was that he just couldn't handle the mountain of evidence about how deliriously wrong he was in his life views. He was so convinced, even in the face of mockery, that his own beliefs were true, that he was the right and just victim and everyone else was wrong, to the point where murder/suicide was more appealing than rethinking his own stance on things.

What a sad, pathetic way to be.
 
Zornack said:
Wait, really? I feel like you're doing what others do when they lump feminists in with tumblr misandrists and blame all of feminism. I'm not familiar with any of those three groups except for the bullshit I occasionally read about RP/PUA but I'm pretty sure they're quite different.
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No, MRAs are a specific type of group. It was birthed on Reddit and such. (I used the PETA vs ASPCA analogy a few posts up)

Like I said, men very much have issues and they very much need to be addressed, but the hate and mysgony that comes out of MRA circles isn't the way to do it.
 
Fiction said:
I didn't lump anyone with extremists. And 'a local men's group' is not 'MRA'. That's like getting pissed that people are putting down PETA because you work for the ASPCA.

MRA is the Red Pill and PUA.

I was simply explaining how the majority of the MRA movement appears in most media.
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Media in general can often be extreme in nature. Why? Because it gets clicks and money. When you watch the telly or read about feminism in the media or extreme MRA sites, that's where the hatred is. The little stuff, the nice stuff, is in your local newspaper or on smaller sites.

My men's group showed me that. And that's when I buried the hatchet with feminism, because it's a good idea.

It's the extremists in ANYTHING that suck.
 
Zornack said:
Wait, really? I feel like you're doing what others do when they lump feminists in with tumblr misandrists and blame all of feminism. I'm not familiar with any of those three groups except for the horror stories I occasionally read about RP/PUA but I'm pretty sure they're quite different.
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Feminism has always been a positive movement ever since it was started.

MRA is almost always rooted in misogyny and that's the fault of the people who represent the group. If they were a positive group you would not hear people generalizing them.
 
Dabookerman said:
It was.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-27561127
The family of a gunman who killed six people in California say he was receiving psychiatric treatment and confirm his name as Elliot Rodger.

Of course this will -only- be about the mental health issues, and not the attitudes that would have attributed to these killings.
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He was being treated for Asperger's syndrome?

The Sandy Hook shooter was being treated for that and also exhibited disturbing behavior.

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2014/03/17/140317fa_fact_solomon?currentPage=all

Paul Appelbaum, a forensic psychiatrist at Columbia, points out that many young men are asocial and unhappy, spend too much time online, become video-game addicts—but cause no harm. The few dangerous ones are impossible to identify. “Even if we knew who they were or were likely to be, whether they’d actually accept treatment is an open question. Among the hardest people to engage in treatment are young males who may be angry, suspicious, and socially isolated. Coming to a therapist’s office for an hour a week just to pour their heart out doesn’t seem like a particularly attractive opportunity, in general.”

“Adam was not open to therapy,” Peter told me. “He did not want to talk about problems and didn’t even admit he had Asperger’s.” Peter and Nancy were confident enough in the Asperger’s diagnosis that they didn’t look for other explanations for Adam’s behavior. In that sense, Asperger’s may have distracted them from whatever else was amiss. “If he had been a totally normal adolescent and he was well adjusted and then all of a sudden went into isolation, alarms would go off,” Peter told me. “But let’s keep in mind that you expect Adam to be weird.” Still, Peter and Nancy sought professional support repeatedly, and none of the doctors they saw detected troubling violence in Adam’s disposition. According to the state’s attorney’s report, “Those mental health professionals who saw him did not see anything that would have predicted his future behavior.” Peter said, “Here we are near New York, one of the best locations for mental-health care, and nobody saw this.”
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So in these cases, they still commited the murders despite their families trying the best they could to help them cope with their illness. It seems as though there was no clear way to prevent it going from the experience of the psychiatrist.

That has to be a heart breaking experience.
 
MikeDown said:
why would you even need that much ammo?
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Well, semi automatic weapons can be fired as fast as you can pull your finger. With some experience you can go through a magazine/whatever in seconds. I've fired guns for fun in the past. Even double action revolvers can be pretty damn speedy.

So mass shooters probably buy magazines and ammo in bulk.
 
Wazzy said:
Feminism has always been a positive movement ever since it was started.

MRA is almost always rooted in misogyny and that's the fault of the people who represent the group. If they were a positive group you would not hear people generalizing them.
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There are dark sides to feminism and good sides to MRAs (being a place where male victims of sexual assault have been able to feel comfortable discussing their history.) Most things in the world are not black and white.
 
I'd give up all the pussy I've ever gotten to have half the privilege this little motherfucker grew up with. Driving around sunny, beautiful, California, in a BMW, with 30 dollar shades, crying about not being able to bust a nut? Are you fucking kidding me?!

I wish I could have a sit-down with every young man in the world and explain to them that sex is an awesome as fuck experience, but it is certainly NOT the alpha and omega of life they might think it is.

Condolences to the victims. To have your life shortened by such a little shit... just.. ugh
 
Underneath all that entitlement and bravado, you could tell how alienated he felt. It makes me wonder what kind of values his parents instilled in him where he would hang his self worth on a pair of $300 shades.

And all this talk of "losers" getting laid and finding love because he couldn't face the sad truth about himself. In that video by the road, "why won't women give me a chance?" becomes "why do women hate me?" Never stopping to think that maybe it was nothing so serious as hate, as just plain old apathy.

I mean, did his pops never take him aside and have a man-to-man with him? Tell him that it's okay to fail? Or that he isn't in fact the hottest shit on the planet, and that it's all right not to be? Did his mom ever talk to him at all? I ask because it's almost like he views the entire gender as being this hive of mindless status-groupies as opposed to people just like him. "I got the car, the clothes, and the sophistication -- why am I still alone?"

And the guy was only 22 years old. Did no one in his life tell him that he was still just starting out? That his life wasn't in fact over? To chill the fuck out?

The affluenza case and now this… What the hell is going wrong with these rich kids?

Edit: His parents did try to get him help :(
 
Actually, Fiction you make a good point. Most people that talk about the red pill are spreading hate instead of directing it at specific offenders in question. And moderate MRA groups might want to change it's name to men's groups. I'll concede that.
 
Forceatowulf said:
I'd give up all the pussy I've ever gotten to have half the privilege this little motherfucker grew up with. Driving around sunny, beautiful, California, in a BMW, with 30 dollar shades, crying about not being able to bust a nut? Are you fucking kidding me?!

I wish I could have a sit-down with every young man in the world and explain to them that sex is an awesome as fuck experience, but it is certainly NOT the alpha and omega of life they might think it is.

Condolences to the victims. To have your life shortened by such a little shit... just.. ugh
Click to expand...

It's easy to say these things when you have a normal sex life but unfortunately things aren't always that simple. I started having sex fairly late, with 20, and still felt that I had basically missed out in my teens. Add his psychological issues to that and it's easy to see how it could have built up to this point.

You also have to consider that this guy grew up with money and a comfortable life so these things will not be as special to him as they are to you. In contrast, sex and validation was what eluded him, so he started obsessing over it and making it the most important goal in his life. It's all about perspective.
 
kirblar said:
There are dark sides to feminism and good sides to MRAs (being a place where male victims of sexual assault have been able to feel comfortable discussing their history.) Most things in the world are not black and white.
Click to expand...
There absolutely is extremists for everything.

But MRA it seems the "extremists" are the only thing you hear about the group. It seems the people who actually champion MRA as being positive are far less common.

Compared to feminism where there's still been plenty of positives about the movement.

No one is denying there's no men's issues out there(though I'm not sure those issues are in need of their own seperate movement since many intertwine with feminism) but MRA has yet to show any positives.
 
Why didn't this dude just get a prostitute? He had money. He lived in Cali. With as much effort as he put into planning to murder these people and making those awful videos he could have bought himself a nice piece for a night or two. Blonde hair, blue eyes, slim, the works

But I guess that would have been "beneath" such a "supreme gentleman" as he.

I need to get out of this thread before I start popping off for real. Shit like this just angers me too much.
 
What's really sad about this tragedy, is it's becoming way too common. and all the victims, that affects their family and friends. :(
 
Fiction said:
No, MRAs are a specific type of group. It was birthed on Reddit and such. (I used the PETA vs ASPCA analogy a few posts up)

Like I said, men very much have issues and they very much need to be addressed, but the hate and mysgony that comes out of MRA circles isn't the way to do it.
Click to expand...

I totally agree. The Men's Rights Movement is a great idea in theory, but it is and has always been just a massive anti-feminist circlejerk. Depressed or disaffected young men (many in their early or mid teens) blame feminists for all their problems, and are convinced that feminism is, by nature, anti-male. Many MRAs on Reddit are really quite delusional, and describe at length how the majority of sexism is perpetuated against men, and that women hold the most power in Western society. Most MRAs seem to really hate women, and transmit all their frustration from loneliness, poor grades, poverty, or depression onto "the female sex".

The MRA community is absolutely not about helping men. It's a place to vent about feminists, and for men to bond over their anger at all women.
 
Wazzy said:
There absolutely is extremists for everything.

But MRA it seems the "extremists" are the only thing you hear about the group. It seems the people who actually champion MRA as being positive are far less common.

Compared to feminism where there's still been plenty of positives about the movement.

No one is denying there's no men's issues out there(though I'm not sure those issues are in need of their own seperate movement since many intertwine with feminism) but MRA has yet to show any positives.
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Politically (not in the academic version which is pretty even-handed) feminism is an interest group for women, by women. Men needing to organize separately for their gender specific issues is a real thing- the difference being that they really don't require an umbrella.group as large and are probably better off tackling them on a one-issue-at-a-time basis.

You only here about the extremes in everything because that's what gets attention- look at the Suey Park situation.
 
Wazzy said:
Why the hell would you feel sorry for him? His view of women is misogynistic and he thinks he is entitled to them.
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There are many sad, potentially relatable aspects to this situation, the experiences he must have had to shape such objectifying and toxic views, the sense of failure he must have experienced as a result of his failure to conform to what he perceived societal views of success were, pressure he may have faced due to his economic status, and (now that it has emerged) the failure of psychiatric services to adequately resolve his issues. It is possible to acknowledge many tragic elements within the event, while simultaneously acknowledging how deplorable the event (and indeed, aspects related to it, such as his misogynistic, cruel views of others) was. By somewhat dehumanising him, viewing him solely as evil or depraved, it seems almost fatalistic, as if the event could never have been stopped and nothing could have been done to prevent it. While that view is one that somebody could have, you're left wondering what you actually do with such deranged people in this instance? Do you simply lock them away? Do you feed into the feeling of persecution? There's not really an easy answer if you view it as something innate, it's just a matter of finding the least bad choice. At least if some degree of empathy can be found for the situation you can feel that he could receive 'more help'. EDIT: Although admittedly, I guess empathising with aspects of the event is different than sympathising as you're suggesting.

Forceatowulf said:
Why didn't this dude just get a prostitute? He had money. He lived in Cali. With as much effort as he put into planning to murder these people and making those awful videos he could have bought himself a nice piece for a night or two. Blonde hair, blue eyes, slim, the works

But I guess that would have been "beneath" such a "supreme gentleman" as he.

I need to get out of this thread before I start popping off for real. Shit like this just angers me too much.
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The idea that it's beneath him woul likely be some part of it, feeling that he is too good to resort to such methods, but it also extends far beyond a mere desire for sex. His issues are deep-rooted. He has a contempt for other people being happiness, and women's rejection of him. This is misogynistic in its suggestion that they should be 'his' as if women are an object, deluded in his feelings of grandeur and inflated sense of self-importance, and an indication of his inability to recognise the emotions of others. If he had a prostitute, it might not conform to his expectations and could illicit a volatile response. If he had a girlfriend, he would almost certainly not have been able to handle the dynamic and shifting relationship that occurs between intimate (again, not necessarily just sexually) two people, and if things worked out poorly, could further enhance the sense of rejection (and his anger would then be directed in a very specific direction as opposed to this broader rampage). Most of this is speculative, for obvious reasons, and deriving from his videos and posts, but he really did need help (and yes, he was receiving it as we now know, but these issues are what needed to be tackled more than his desire for sex). Perhaps it may have taken the edge off him momentarily, but it would have almost certainly been a stop-gap, and could have led to issues festering and manifesting in an altered manner.
 
Forceatowulf said:
I'd give up all the pussy I've ever gotten to have half the privilege this little motherfucker grew up with. Driving around sunny, beautiful, California, in a BMW, with 30 dollar shades, crying about not being able to bust a nut? Are you fucking kidding me?!

I wish I could have a sit-down with every young man in the world and explain to them that sex is an awesome as fuck experience, but it is certainly NOT the alpha and omega of life they might think it is.

Condolences to the victims. To have your life shortened by such a little shit... just.. ugh
Click to expand...

This, sadly most world media spins it the other way. Sex > everything else. Really has brainwashed many people (myself included) but thankfully I'm starting to wake up to the real world. As a guy running around with his Vcard still out of college, there is a ton of "fake" and self placed pressure to not be a virgin past 16 or 18 at the most thanks to shitty high school comedy movies and tv shows that really has to stop, just a silly trope that has not died since the mid 80s.
 
The One Who Knocks said:
There are many sad, potentially relatable aspects to this situation, the experiences he must have had to shape such objectifying and toxic views, the sense of failure he must have experienced as a result of his failure to conform to what he perceived societal views of success were, pressure he may have faced due to his economic status, and (now that it has emerged) the failure of psychiatric services to adequately resolve his issues. It is possible to acknowledge many tragic elements within the event, while simultaneously acknowledging how deplorable the event (and indeed, aspects related to it, such as his misogynistic, cruel views of others) was. By somewhat dehumanising him, viewing him solely as evil or depraved, it seems almost fatalistic, as if the event could never have been stopped and nothing could have been done to prevent it. While that view is one that one could have, your left wondering what you actually do with such deranged people then? Do you simply lock them away? Do you feed into the feeling of persecution? There's not really an easy answer if you view it as something innate, it's just a matter of finding the least bad choice. At least if some degree of empathy can be found for the situation you can feel that he could receive 'more help'. EDIT: Although admittedly, I guess empathising with aspects of the event is different than sympathising as you're suggesting.
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I agree with this.
 
Valhelm said:
I totally agree. The Men's Rights Movement is a great idea in theory, but it is and has always been just a massive anti-feminist circlejerk. Depressed or disaffected young men (many in their early or mid teens) blame feminists for all their problems, and are convinced that feminism is, by nature, anti-male. Many MRAs on Reddit are really quite delusional, and describe at length how the majority of sexism is perpetuated against men, and that women hold the most power in Western society. Most MRAs seem to really hate women, and transmit all their frustration from loneliness, poor grades, poverty, or depression onto "the female sex".

The MRA community is absolutely not about helping men. It's a place to vent about feminists, and for men to bond over their anger at all women.
Click to expand...

MRA : Feminism = Ayn Rand : Marx
 
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