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Shigeru Miyamoto: Games will still be fun without streaming

Leading Nintendo figures have agreed that cloud gaming is likely to have a big impact on the industry, but it sounds li…

www.gamesindustry.biz

During a Q&A with shareholders at the platform holder's AGM, veteran designer Shigeru Miyamoto discussed his views on streaming, virtual reality and online play.

"I think that cloud gaming will become more widespread in the future, but I have no doubt that there will continue to be games that are fun because they are running locally and not on the cloud," he said.

"We believe it is important to continue to use these diverse technical environments to make unique entertainment that could only have been made by Nintendo."

He noted that the number of people playing Nintendo games now -- even on other devices -- is growing, revealing that Super Mario Run has passed 300 million downloads.

"The fact that we've reached such a market means that opportunities for us are greatly expanding, so we would like to work on more and more unique projects."

He also assured that "we have not fallen behind with either VR or network services," pointing to the release of the Nintendo Labo VR kit earlier this year and assuring that the firm has been experimenting with this tech "from the very beginning."

"Because we don't publicise this until we release a product, it may look like we're falling behind," he admitted.

Nintendo president Shuntaro Furukawa said he doesn't expect all games to become cloud-based "any time soon" but acknowledges that "the technologies are definitely advancing."

"We see a future where cloud and streaming technologies will develop more and more as a means of delivering games to consumers," he said. "We must keep up with such changes in the environment.

"That being said, if these changes increase the worldwide gaming population, that will just give us more opportunities with our integrated hardware and software development approach to reach people worldwide with the unique entertainment that Nintendo can provide."

Senior executive officer Ko Shiota added the company is also investigating the possibilities afforded by 5G as the technology rolls out around the globe.

Subscriptions also came up, with Furukawa acknowledging this was a particularly hot topic at E3. He noted that subscription services are "becoming common in all sorts of industries, not just the games industry" and notes that Nintendo already offers one in the form of the NES games available to Switch Online subscribers (of which there are now more than 10 million).

"We believe that we need to further enrich these sorts of services in the future," he said. "Nintendo's policy is that we will consider whether each product we offer is suited to a subscription model as we expand our business in the future."

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Nintendo is "striving to create a controller that can be used with ease, and that will become the standard for the next generation"

During Nintendo’s 79th Annual General Meeting of Shareholders, one investor brought up how E3 featured the same sort of things we’ve been seeing from games over the past three decades in the sense that players look at the screen and play with a controller in their hand. This person wanted to...

nintendoeverything.com

During Nintendo’s 79th Annual General Meeting of Shareholders, one investor brought up how E3 featured the same sort of things we’ve been seeing from games over the past three decades in the sense that players look at the screen and play with a controller in their hand. This person wanted to know how developers feel about this and whether or not it will continue. That led to some very interesting comments from Nintendo.

Nintendo’s Shigeru Miyamoto, Shinya Takahashi, and Ko Shiota all commented here. Takahashi mentioned how Nintendo is always looking to innovate and pointed to 1-2 Switch and Labo VR. Miyamoto would add that Nintendo was the first to create the d-pad and additional buttons, as well as the analog stick which “is the clear winner.”

Miyamoto continued by saying that he also feels “we should quickly graduate from the current controller, and we are attempting all kinds of things. Our objective is to achieve an interface that surpasses the current controller, where what the player does is directly reflected on the screen, and the user can clearly feel the result. This has not been achieved yet.”


Below are the full comments from Takahashi, Miyamoto, and Shiota:

Takahashi:
We are always dreaming up new things. For example, for 1-2-Switch, the first game released for Nintendo Switch, we suggested that people play by looking at each other and not at the screen. And for VR, we thought about how we could change not just the controller but also the gameplay itself, and came up with the Nintendo Labo Toy-Con 04: VR Kit. The software exhibited at this year’s E3 just happened to be mostly the type that is played with controller in hand, looking at the screen. However, I think you can see from the software we’ve created that we are always trying out new ideas.

Miyamoto:
Nintendo was the first to create the style of playing video games with a plus-shaped directional pad and additional buttons, which has now become the industry standard. It was also Nintendo that changed the original plus-shaped directional pad, which operated digitally in eight directions, into the first analog input device that moves freely in all directions for Nintendo 64. This, too, is now common. We are proud to have created a variety of user interfaces that have now become industry standards.

And, as of now, in terms of accuracy and reliability, I believe this style is the clear winner.

At the same time, I also believe that we should quickly graduate from the current controller, and we are attempting all kinds of things. Our objective is to achieve an interface that surpasses the current controller, where what the player does is directly reflected on the screen, and the user can clearly feel the result. This has not been achieved yet. We have tried all kinds of motion controllers, but none seem to work for all people. As the company that knows the most about controllers, we have been striving to create a controller that can be used with ease, and that will become the standard for the next generation.

Shiota:
The hardware development team is also taking on this challenge related to controllers, but from all the devices born from this effort, only a handful will reach the consumer as products. We will only release a product into the world if it can be successfully used to control software well. We have not yet invented an all-purpose controller that is unlike any of the current devices. Then again, the conventional controller has slowly evolved from the traditional setup of a plus-shaped directional pad with A and B buttons. For example, when you take aim in Splatoon, the action may seem conventional, but the motion sensor gives a wonderful feel to the operation. So even if things may look the same, we are steadily embedding new technologies and finding good ways to use them. One of Nintendo’s strengths is that we do not just think about hardware, but are constantly thinking about it in conjunction with software. We will continue to put in our best efforts in this area.

 

[Jubenhimer]

At the same time, I also believe that we should quickly graduate from the current controller, and we are attempting all kinds of things. Our objective is to achieve an interface that surpasses the current controller, where what the player does is directly reflected on the screen, and the user can clearly feel the result. This has not been achieved yet. We have tried all kinds of motion controllers, but none seem to work for all people. As the company that knows the most about controllers, we have been striving to create a controller that can be used with ease, and that will become the standard for the next generation.

In other words, buisness as usual for Nintendo. Trying to one up itself in comming up with an innovative and intuitive controller interface for their platforms. I think the Joy-Con currently are near perfect in concept, so I'm interested in seeing what they do next.

 

[Thurible]

They keep trying to do something new. While that is admirable and I like how we now have several different ways to play games, I feel like they shouldn't try to reinvent the wheel. Don't fix what isn't broken if you catch my drift.

 

[DunDunDunpachi]

I hope Nintendo continues on this path of perfecting the Wiimote design, and please include some sort of pointer technology. There are plenty of updated examples (Vive, Rift) they could draw inspiration from.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

Meh. I like traditional controls just fine, and hated the Wii.

I'll withhold judgment, but will be skeptical as someone that's just old (by gaming standards), stuck in my ways and likes traditional games with traditional controls.

 

[stickkidsam]

You are a beautiful man Nintendo-san. Don't ever change.

They should really add a laser pointer to their next wiimote/joy-con design though.

 

[sendit]

 

[Mihos]

As long as they still make a 'pro' controller.

I absolutely hate the 'joycons'

 

[Eteric Rice]

They joycons could use a beefier version for people with bigger hands than the typical Japanese person. Something more ergonomic.

 

[daveonezero]

They keep trying to do something new. While that is admirable and I like how we now have several different ways to play games, I feel like they shouldn't try to reinvent the wheel. Don't fix what isn't broken if you catch my drift.

I'm glad you don't work at Nintendo.

Nintendo is in some ways the last bastion of new ideas in tech.

 

[Punished Miku]

This is great news. Most people still haven't even figured out that gyro is completely superior, and Nintendo is already working on the next thing.

 

[Cert.in.Death]

VR or bust

 

[Wonko_C]

Meh. I like traditional controls just fine, and hated the Wii.

I'll withhold judgment, but will be skeptical as someone that's just old (by gaming standards), stuck in my ways and likes traditional games with traditional controls.

Honestly the Wii controls were below par to how they advertised them. Not even with the motion plus adapter that was released late in the cycle they managed to get it into a decent state.

I'd like to see what their next take on it and how would they stack up against the Oculus Touch and the Valve Index Controllers.

 

[Paulistano]

.

 

[Lionel Richie]

ITT: people ignoring the fact that the Switch Pro Controller is hands down the best controller ever.

 

[Jubenhimer]

Honestly the Wii controls were below par to how they advertised them. Not even with the motion plus adapter that was released late in the cycle they managed to get it into a decent state.

The Wii Remote worked fine. The problem was that games like Red Steel over-advertised what the device was actually capable of. Meanwhile if you used it with games like No More Heroes or Metroid Prime 3, which were based around simple, linear gestures, then it's a very responsive controller.

Motion Plus was created to do more complex gestures the standard controller wasn't capable of. It's not that the controller was bad, it's just that technology for motion control was still too new for it to be as fleshed out as it could've been.

 

[Thurible]

I'm glad you don't work at Nintendo.

Nintendo is in some ways the last bastion of new ideas in tech.

Wasn't trying to be rude, I just think we don't need to keep trying to be different all the time. Motion controls, touch screens, etc, have led to some great games. I just wonder what is next, and if it is really necessary.

 

[Wonko_C]

The controllers were advertised as being 1-1 with your movements. It was nowhere near that.

 

[Birdo]

Can he please hurry up and retire.

I honestly think that the old guard are holding Nintendo back.

 

[Jubenhimer]

The controllers were advertised as being 1-1 with your movements. It was nowhere near that.

Not necessarily, it was more so advertising the fact that the controller responds to different gestures. The only instance of it being advertised like that was Red Steel, which was mostly the fault of Ubisoft. Besides, the pointer functionality was technically 1-1 as it can detect movement and position in a 3D space. Like I said, the technology of the Wii Remote was limited to what was widely available at the time, so basic gestures and such were what was possible in 2006.

Can he please hurry up and retire.

I honestly think that the old guard are holding Nintendo back.

Miyamoto hasn't been in charge of development since 2015. He's much more hands off now acting as a creative consultant rather than a decision maker. There's not really any "Old guard" holding Nintendo back now as most of the current upper management are from the SNES era onward.

 

[UltimaKilo]

So we’re supposed to believe Nintendo won’t fall behind with subscriptions, online or VR? Ok...

 

[cireza]

Looks like we are going to have shitty controllers again.

We invented the d-pad but forgot to put one on Switch

 

[Despera]

"we will consider whether each product we offer is suited to a subscription model as we expand our business in the future."

Cc EA

 

[Aidah]

Motion based aiming for me turns an FPS played with a controller from garbage to actually decent. It already works pretty well, but I'd love to see it expanded upon and rapidly improved, instead of just continuing to put band-aids on analog sticks with all sorts aim assists, like what most platforms and devs are doing.

 

[Hosam6xavi]

Don't change Nintendo .. this is really great news IMO

 

[Ozrimandias]

Almost Every Journalist praising Kojima for being a Genious, meanwhile he declares that cloud gaming is future, taking selfies between him an his hollywood friends and triying to deliver some complex messages trough games.......

On the other hand, we got Shigeru Miyamoto.................

A quiet nice guy, ten times more relevant than Kojima, less egomaniac, local will still be relevant, an only triying to deliver some fun experiences.

Gimme the second one, a hundred times.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

Honestly the Wii controls were below par to how they advertised them. Not even with the motion plus adapter that was released late in the cycle they managed to get it into a decent state.

I'd like to see what their next take on it and how would they stack up against the Oculus Touch and the Valve Index Controllers.

Even when the work well I'm not a fan of motion controls. They're ok in VR, but I struggle to enjoy that as I just don't enjoy wearing the headset (makes me sweat, fogs up, don't like being that shut off from what's around me.

ITT: people ignoring the fact that the Switch Pro Controller is hands down the best controller ever.

I wouldn't say that, it's more worry that they go "innovative" again and we don't get as many games playable with 100% traditional controls (I don't mind gyro assisted aiming like splatoon when it's done with a game pad). The Wii had a standard pad that plugged into the Wiimote, but it wasn't useable with many Wii games and was mostly useful for virtual console games. Wii U and especially Switch got me back into Nintendo as the games mostly had traditional controllers and controls (with a little gyro stuff in some games).

 

[Codes 208]

ITT: people ignoring the fact that the Switch Pro Controller is hands down the best controller ever.

Id argue it’s second best behind the xbox line of controllers (360 and up)

Even the wii u pro controller wasnt too bad. I certainly prefer them over the PS controllers (though DS4 was imo a huge improvement over that shitty ds3)

 

[Dthomp]

As long as they still make a 'pro' controller.

I absolutely hate the 'joycons'

Same, I can't see how anybody with adult sized hands is supposed to enjoy these things at all. I have large hands, not giant or anything and they are just super uncomfortable, even worse with the cradle thing to put them on, nothing like cramping my own hands playing your controller...

 

[Closer]

Just follow the Wii Remote path and I'll follow happily. Split controllers are the way to go.

 

[EightBit Man]

Are we backpedaling Miyamoto?

"It’s necessary for developers to learn to get along with [subscription services]...When seeking a partner for this, it’s important to find someone who understands the value of your software. Then customers will feel the value in your apps and software and develop a habit of paying money for them."

Miyamoto at CEDEC last year

 

[EightBit Man]

Can he please hurry up and retire.

There's actually a video on this very subject:

 

[Raziel]

Ever since the original PS1 dual shock, Nintendo literally can’t stand living in a timeline where they didn’t invent the standard for modern controllers.

 

[Alexios]

Something with the form factor of Oculus Touch but the capabilities (and straps) of the Valve Index, maybe a couple extra buttons, has all the necessary inputs for traditional games and the capabilities for motion gaming and VR gaming on top making it the best choice. I doubt they'll go for it...

 

[funkygunther]

Nintendo look over the fence, think "that's nice"

and then release this

they haven't been getting on the trend train early for decades

 

[zenspider]

They keep trying to do something new. While that is admirable and I like how we now have several different ways to play games, I feel like they shouldn't try to reinvent the wheel. Don't fix what isn't broken if you catch my drift.

That's the second time I heard that analogy today. The thing is, not only the has been innovation in wheels for centuries and centuries, but in the space the wheel was used for - i.e. flight, maglev, etc.

Sure, controllers are as good as they have ever been (on the shoulders of Nintendo designers, mind you), but they are obviously not the apex of human-computer interface.

 

[Zog]

Nintendo is in some ways the last bastion of new ideas in tech.

Which part of the Switch is new tech?

 

[mysticboy]

Which part of the Switch is new tech?

hd rumble

 

[Alexios]

Honestly the Wii controls were below par to how they advertised them. Not even with the motion plus adapter that was released late in the cycle they managed to get it into a decent state.

I'd like to see what their next take on it and how would they stack up against the Oculus Touch and the Valve Index Controllers.

Wii still had the infrared tracking pointer which pretty much had the potential to (and did) improve the vast majority of games (ie, all the first and third person action/shooter-type games every company makes these days in different styles, from RE4 to Metroid Prime and Call of Duty, also with similar controls but no shooting, just traversal as in Silent Hill: Shattered Memories and of course other types of games like the strategy of Pikmin seen in the GameCube ports or the point & click style adventuring of Another Code R or whatever else). It did have dodgy motion tracking (as in the QTE gestures of sadly, again, Silent Hill), but with the Plus they got it good enough for some solid and fun gameplay as seen in the likes of Wii Sports Resort and Red Steel 2 even if it was mostly angle detection rather than full 1:1 in 3D space (though the sword fighting in WSR was better than RS2, RS2 did have sweet 60fps shooting shenanigans on top and the whole Metroid-esque progression in its favor). It's pretty sad they ditched it with Wii U and only halfheartedly supported it in backwards compatibility and a handful of new experiences, an evolution of that concept would have done way better (and deserve the Wii name too) imo (just as Sony didn't bother with improving the Move and kept the original dodgy version which is what harmstrings their implementation of VR more than anything else and makes PC VR feel like a next gen leap in tracking and gameplay when it really didn't have to). Yeah it didn't work for other genres like fighting games or whatever else because it also had a weird form factor and lack of buttons which modern controllers in that vein have already solved for the most part which is why I'm saying they could/should copy that to some extent, so you can have everything, from retro to conventional to modern and future titles fully playable without utilizing the additional tracking features to make up for the lack of other inputs if they don't fit that game's design (and without needing a Pro/Classic controller for those).

Still, I dunno if they can reach the level of tracking seen in Oculus Touch/Valve Index without external hardware like cameras (whether stationary or on the HMD as in S) or the Valve Lighthouse or if they'd risk troubling people with paying for and setting up such hardware if they aren't going all-in with actual VR too. Which they could depending on when their next platform is set to arrive and if they want to keep the Switch or Switch successors going as well which means they could need something radically different to avoid competing with themselves rather than just more raw power.

Lol @ the Miyamoto hate/dissing though, haters gonna hate trying to rewrite gaming history & reality, thankfully it doesn't work, a few loud mouthed trolls aren't enough to bring a man of his stature down even with the caveat of how "he used to be good but now he's just old" or whatever bullshit.

 

[Zog]

hd rumble

LOL, ok. That's it?

 

[Barnabot]

I just hope Miyamoto doesn't create a game which you can't even relax and watch some animations in your big screen because you controller is doing its own thing and you are about to receive a game over screen because you haven't paid full attention to that.

Looking at you Star For Zero.

 

[mysticboy]

LOL, ok. That's it?

I mean it answers your question.

 

[Zog]

I mean it answers your question.

Yes it does but I wouldn't call that anything significant.

 

[nush]

Yes it does but I wouldn't call that anything significant.

Take the L.

 

[Deleted member 471617]

As long as I have the optional to use the respective console's standard and normal Pro Controller, im good. If not, their next console would be an easy pass.

 

[Lionel Richie]

Id argue it’s second best behind the xbox line of controllers (360 and up)

Even the wii u pro controller wasnt too bad. I certainly prefer them over the PS controllers (though DS4 was imo a huge improvement over that shitty ds3)

Xbox controllers are great as well, but the Switch Pro is just overkill with those godly enormous face buttons.

I wouldn't say that, it's more worry that they go "innovative" again and we don't get as many games playable with 100% traditional controls (I don't mind gyro assisted aiming like splatoon when it's done with a game pad). The Wii had a standard pad that plugged into the Wiimote, but it wasn't useable with many Wii games and was mostly useful for virtual console games. Wii U and especially Switch got me back into Nintendo as the games mostly had traditional controllers and controls (with a little gyro stuff in some games).

I get that fear and the waggle fest that was a lot of experiences on the Wii probably exacerbate that feeling when it comes to Nintendo being unorthodox with their controllers. However, for a company that hasn't really repeated a controller template over their entire console history, it's just fantastic how often they get it right. There are some criticisms you could point out, like the gamepad battery being absolute shit or the Wiimote being the Wiimote, but those feel circumstantial since IMO the problem there wasn't the idea but rather the tech.

 

[EightBit Man]

Lol @ the Miyamoto hate/dissing though, haters gonna hate trying to rewrite gaming history & reality, thankfully it doesn't work, a few loud mouthed trolls aren't enough to bring a man of his stature down even with the caveat of how "he used to be good but now he's just old" or whatever bullshit.

We're not trolls. I have the highest respect for what that man has done in the past, giving birth to some of my favorite franchises of all-time. However, we have to be objective and ask ourselves if he's still as relevant and important as he used to? What has he contributed ever since Pikmin? I think the answer is nothing worthwhile. He's treated as some sort of authority figure within the main office in Kyoto, holding back the younger and often creative young people there.

Not only that, but he's venerated by lots of gamers as some sort of god. That's not a smart thing to do, because it stands in the way of legitimate criticism, which in term harms Nintendo itself.

 

[Kdad]

Which part of the Switch is new tech?

Charging 300$ for a 150$ tablet? (Apple excluded I guess)

 

[Deleted member 752119]

I get that fear and the waggle fest that was a lot of experiences on the Wii probably exacerbate that feeling when it comes to Nintendo being unorthodox with their controllers. However, for a company that hasn't really repeated a controller template over their entire console history, it's just fantastic how often they get it right. There are some criticisms you could point out, like the gamepad battery being absolute shit or the Wiimote being the Wiimote, but those feel circumstantial since IMO the problem there wasn't the idea but rather the tech.

Oh I agree. NES controllers were pretty uncomfortable without a grip, but the SNES, N64, GC and the pro controller for Wii U and Switch have been great. They're also pretty traditional controllers, just with some unique layouts, gyro etc.

If that's all they're going for, I'm all for that. I'm just not into Wii waggle or other stuff too outside of the box as someone that just wants to play games with largely traditional controls left stick (or d-pad), right stick, face buttons, shoulder buttons and maybe some gyro assisted aiming.

I have a lot of respect for Miyamoto, but haven't been a fan of a lot of what he's done in more recent years. Pikmin just wasn't for me, the last time he took an interest in control innovations it was using Star Fox Zero to "show off" the gamepad and that game would have been way better with traditional controls IMO (maybe some gyro aiming, but not the two screen awkwardness). I know many loved that control set up though, and I'm fine with somethings just not being for me (even whole consoles like the Wii).

 

[SLoWMoTIoN]

As long as they still make a 'pro' controller.

I absolutely hate the 'joycons'

Same they are complete pieces of shit from the four I currently own. MM buttons were a mistake.