Shuhei Yoshida: Sony's not sure why PS4 is selling so well
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licktheenvelope
Member
Sony could have screwed it up though (see Ben Kuchera's insights).
I am pretty sure he was talki g about the comparison to Iphone sales.
PS4 sales are amazing but it is not selling a million a day
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Oswen
Member
Planet alignement basically.
-Long previous gen
-Good hardware
-Microsoft doing everything extremely bad
-Nintendo deciding they aren't in the market anymore
They knew they were going to do good but it turned out to be a smashing success by just playing it safe.
The internet also helps greatly nowadays and many people haven't understood that yet.
"Word of mouth" is heavily amplified on the net, the news of something "good" /"bad"/"worth"/etc travels extremely faster now and easily reaches a bigger audience.
-Long previous gen
-Good hardware
-Microsoft doing everything extremely bad
-Nintendo deciding they aren't in the market anymore
They knew they were going to do good but it turned out to be a smashing success by just playing it safe.
The internet also helps greatly nowadays and many people haven't understood that yet.
"Word of mouth" is heavily amplified on the net, the news of something "good" /"bad"/"worth"/etc travels extremely faster now and easily reaches a bigger audience.
aspiegamer
Member
I know he can't just up and say some of the more obvious things (and why he'd love for media and marketing to say it for him instead) but I don't doubt he's somewhat surprised.
Even if you account for the XB1 launch which has been a trainwreck by comparison this is, in total, a very fast start of a generation for Sony + Microsoft. Breaking records and whatnot. It's how Microsoft can collectively cherrypick numbers about having their fastest-selling device ever (factually accurate) and yet get murdered at the same time.
Not unreasonable to wonder why the total number of buyers into new hardware is larger this time when we can be entirely sure there were plenty of internal squabbles at both companies about "consoles are dying!" prior to release.
Even if you account for the XB1 launch which has been a trainwreck by comparison this is, in total, a very fast start of a generation for Sony + Microsoft. Breaking records and whatnot. It's how Microsoft can collectively cherrypick numbers about having their fastest-selling device ever (factually accurate) and yet get murdered at the same time.
Not unreasonable to wonder why the total number of buyers into new hardware is larger this time when we can be entirely sure there were plenty of internal squabbles at both companies about "consoles are dying!" prior to release.
Saved for November.
Ryouji Gunblade
Member
They could also try improving the PS4 with MP3 support and custom backgrounds. There's nothing wrong with making a good console into a great one.
figadapaura
Member
It's new and shiny.
BWJinxing
Member
after core gamers, i think word of mouth.
bad pr will lingerie for sometime. Mandatory Check In DRM, NSA-Kinect, Adam Orth insults, TV/Sports Watercooler, Power difference concerns without the cloud, "The cloud"
have these policies changed or been reversed, yep. However i see it as the damage has been done and MS is still on clean up.
Time will tell, but as it seems, people drop 1080p when talking about PS4 games and 900, 720p, 792p and the occasional 1080p drops when metnioing xbone.
Word of mouth, the larger number is greater, PS4 thus much be better. Thats how i see it.
A bit off topic, i heard a story once that A&W once offered a 1/3 pound burger to steal McD's customers and people didn't bite. Research as into why is because they felt they were being cheated of meat, as McD's was offering 1/4 pound burgers, thus more meat then then 1/3 pound burgers....
bad pr will lingerie for sometime. Mandatory Check In DRM, NSA-Kinect, Adam Orth insults, TV/Sports Watercooler, Power difference concerns without the cloud, "The cloud"
have these policies changed or been reversed, yep. However i see it as the damage has been done and MS is still on clean up.
Time will tell, but as it seems, people drop 1080p when talking about PS4 games and 900, 720p, 792p and the occasional 1080p drops when metnioing xbone.
Word of mouth, the larger number is greater, PS4 thus much be better. Thats how i see it.
A bit off topic, i heard a story once that A&W once offered a 1/3 pound burger to steal McD's customers and people didn't bite. Research as into why is because they felt they were being cheated of meat, as McD's was offering 1/4 pound burgers, thus more meat then then 1/3 pound burgers....
Wait, so who are these people who didn't own a PS3, a 360, or a Wii and are now buying PS4s? It's an audience that I would imagine would have at least purchased Wii last gen.
Maybe mobile is helping consoles by getting people who would have never played video games before to buy PS4s? Somewhere between the occasional video game, the media capabilities, and the hype they are deciding to buy a PS4.
Maybe mobile is helping consoles by getting people who would have never played video games before to buy PS4s? Somewhere between the occasional video game, the media capabilities, and the hype they are deciding to buy a PS4.
It's actually quite blatantly why it's selling so well:
-It's a dedicated gaming machine => No wasted resources.
-Great price / performance ratio => 399$/€ is a perfect starting point
-History shows that Sony is king when it comes to first party title. => Promise of great exclusives
-They didn't fuck up their PR nor included unnecessary DRM shit => positive mindset about PS4
-Most attractive out of the new gen consoles: Price + Power => almost no competition
Most people that bought a PS4 did so almost blindly. It's just the best deal and great games will come along a 100% + exclusives down the line.
Also
-It's a dedicated gaming machine => No wasted resources.
-Great price / performance ratio => 399$/€ is a perfect starting point
-History shows that Sony is king when it comes to first party title. => Promise of great exclusives
-They didn't fuck up their PR nor included unnecessary DRM shit => positive mindset about PS4
-Most attractive out of the new gen consoles: Price + Power => almost no competition
Most people that bought a PS4 did so almost blindly. It's just the best deal and great games will come along a 100% + exclusives down the line.
Also
Labombadog
Member
Great hardware, marketing and a great software lineup about sums up why it is doing so well.
They are suprised by the ammount of non-playstation users are pirchasing PS4. 48% off PS4 install base [unknown if USA or worldwide] never had PS3. I would have never expected something like that. But it happened.
As for "exausting core audience", we are very far from that point. Even if console gaming market shrunk, PS4 will easily continue to sell well for the next 3 years. 2015 will be "a year to remember", so many great titles are announced for it.
HawksWinStanley
Member
It's definitely not because of their timely firmware updates.
SerTapTap
Member
Perhaps the network effects of launch made it seem like there was really just one console to own this gen? Last gen you were missing something pretty significant without any one of the consoles--that's an intimidating choice and a lot to buy at once. Analysis paralysis can be a real problem.
Also--a certain amount of buyers would simply have been too young to buy a console. Wonder how that fits in? I can't imagine it's not related to gaming...as you've said, it's really not a great box for anything else, and unlike PS3 there's cheaper blue ray players now, like...the PS3.
vicoakland
Member
After the huge success of PS1 and PSOne, a ton of people bought PS2 slims late in console life at prices of $200 and under. Many for $100 or $125.
Huge brand awareness, something for everyone (all ages, all demos) and the PS2 slim was a compact, well-made console that still gets use in a ton of households.
Sony prices the PS3 too high. It's huge, capable machine with Blu-ray, but even now it's still too expensive. Sony messed up.
Fast forward to 2013, Sony launces PS4 at $399 (or so) to a worldwide audience, and runs a successful ad campaign that emphasizes PS4 as a game-playing machine you and your friends have "great escapes" with.
Just like 100s of millions of consumers have been doing on Playstation worldwide since 1995.
No suprise here that people are coming out of the woodwork to buy PS4s.
Huge brand awareness, something for everyone (all ages, all demos) and the PS2 slim was a compact, well-made console that still gets use in a ton of households.
Sony prices the PS3 too high. It's huge, capable machine with Blu-ray, but even now it's still too expensive. Sony messed up.
Fast forward to 2013, Sony launces PS4 at $399 (or so) to a worldwide audience, and runs a successful ad campaign that emphasizes PS4 as a game-playing machine you and your friends have "great escapes" with.
Just like 100s of millions of consumers have been doing on Playstation worldwide since 1995.
No suprise here that people are coming out of the woodwork to buy PS4s.
Wishmaster92
Member
The wobble is what sealed the deal for me.
In all seriousness It's selling well because it's a powerful console with great specs and awesome games that will be releasing soon.
If you ask me, the Wii U was designed as a way to "advance" casual gamers to more sophisticated gaming through a more involved controller setup. Sort of like how Wii Sports transitioned to Wii Sports Resort, and how they thought the players of those games would then translate to more advanced forms of gaming. They gave talks on this, proclaiming up how they were cultivating new console gamers with these casual gamers.
The problem with the Wii U's premise was that they didn't understand that this audience was already gone and was not really moving into more hardcore games like they thought- in other words they misunderstood their audience. They likely would have gone in another direction entirely with the Wii U if they had truly understood that in the first place.
Simple:
1) Wii did great at the beginning due to Waggle gimmick. Once X360 / PS3 got their own Waggle, graphics (power) became an issue and it was downhill for the Wii. Nintendo tried the gimmick again, but this time, nobody cared about touchscreen gamepad. Add in the weak power again, no wonder it failed from day one. That's one competitor down already.
2) X360 was successful early due to lower price and the better 3rd party ports made the X360, at worst, at least seen as powerful to the PS3. With the X1, it's was more expensive and noticeable less powerful. It's not hard to see why most people would get a PS4 instead.
So, yeah, both Nintendo and Microsoft fucked up so Sony wins be default.
And, these day with instant social media, very few diehard fanboys anymore. People readily move from X to Y to Z and back. If you product is much better than your competitor, people will take notice and buy it no matter what they had previously. So, we can drop the "diehard fanboy" argument.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
This is fantastic. If they don't know and we know, then things in the future look great.
I think it's a lot of factors, first of all, they managed the console's launch flawlessly, including the most relevant aspects, pricepoint and the hardware they chose. I can't remember any other launch getting anywhere near that. They also got a lot of help from the goodwill they created with the PS3, the way they started from the rock bottom, building new IPs and launching services like PS+, and went to finish in a high note, with The Last of Us, got their ball rolling and created a lot of momentum.
Compare this to how Nintendo dropped the ball with the Wii's last years and where they are now and you'll understand why momentum is so important.
Plus, they got a lot of help from MS too, it was incredible how instead of trying to compete with them for a bigger market share and attract some of their customers while they were at it, they decided to alienate their own costumers and fans and end up pushing them over Sony's side. So fucking dumb of MS
Compare this to how Nintendo dropped the ball with the Wii's last years and where they are now and you'll understand why momentum is so important.
Plus, they got a lot of help from MS too, it was incredible how instead of trying to compete with them for a bigger market share and attract some of their customers while they were at it, they decided to alienate their own costumers and fans and end up pushing them over Sony's side. So fucking dumb of MS
NeoGarrison
Banned
Huh? This doesn't make any sense. Didn't Sony made a huge detailed splash on the day they revealed the PS4 saying why this is the best system to play games in? Saying this is the best place for gamers? Giving us the most powerful console in the planet supposedly with some of the most amazing exclusives there is....and now it's like: I don't know why people are buying it! Seriously wtf is he thinking?
You know what, upon seeing how Sony is completely baffled and acting nonsensical when it comes to the PS VITA it appears some of these suits actually drank the "mobile phone gaming future" Kool-Aid from the new kids on the block. Which is about as stupid as a restaurant preparing to close up shop because a hot-dog stand opened up in the corner. Yes of course we want dedicated devices bro who in the world told ya that we didn't?
WAKE DA F<&% up bro it's selling because GAMERS are buying it. As far as new people coming into gaming well what do you expect for crying out loud?! It's an amazing medium in which more people are getting exposed and guess what.... more people get born every day. There will be tons of new kids which first system is a PS4.
You know what, upon seeing how Sony is completely baffled and acting nonsensical when it comes to the PS VITA it appears some of these suits actually drank the "mobile phone gaming future" Kool-Aid from the new kids on the block. Which is about as stupid as a restaurant preparing to close up shop because a hot-dog stand opened up in the corner. Yes of course we want dedicated devices bro who in the world told ya that we didn't?
WAKE DA F<&% up bro it's selling because GAMERS are buying it. As far as new people coming into gaming well what do you expect for crying out loud?! It's an amazing medium in which more people are getting exposed and guess what.... more people get born every day. There will be tons of new kids which first system is a PS4.
I wonder if Indie games are a much bigger selling point to non-core gamers than people realize. Mobile has introduced them to smaller games and now they want a similar experience with nicer graphics on their TV? Any media capabilities the PS4 does have would help to justify the purchase some more.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
You have to convince the people complaining now that that's the case. I don't think a large majority really have figured that out yet. Most people on GAF probably have, but I think there's still a majority out there still upset.
davepoobond
you can't put a price on sparks
There is no competition and Nintendo will be the secondary console of choice as always.
SerTapTap
Member
IMO the Wii U proposition was made more to the parents of kids that play games than Wii owners or even gamers. Off-TV is a not-so-subtle "your brats can play it even while you're watching the game!" But the Wii U has no one flaw, so it's really hard to tell what all went wrong, or how well it "should" be doing if it were doing well, considering the loss of all those Wii-only people.
CrimsonCrescendo
Banned
It's... refreshing how frank he is being. Though probably not the best thing for shareholders to hear.
For the core and casual gamers not on the PS3: I would say part of it is because of the momentum the PS3 started gaining near the end of the 7th gen. They had a lot of good exclusives, multiplats started to get better optimised, and developers like Valve changed their tune about the PS3. Another thing that helped them was how bad Microsoft fucked up with their PR/DRM fiasco which really helped tip people on the fence towards the PS4. I would also attribute their own PR, lower price range, and really getting their message across. Nintendo blew up on the launch bad and Microsoft shot themselves in the ass, and Sony was smart in how they took advantage of the situation.
As per why completely new people are jumping on board... that I can't explain. Xbone was specifically tailored to achieving that goal what with their message of the "All in one entertainment system", making tv shows, contracting people like Steven Spielberg, emphasis on Kinect, the NFL deal, etc. and has seemingly failed. Sony, on the other hand, has done next to nothing to cater to that crowd, and is seemingly winning. That is puzzling.
For the core and casual gamers not on the PS3: I would say part of it is because of the momentum the PS3 started gaining near the end of the 7th gen. They had a lot of good exclusives, multiplats started to get better optimised, and developers like Valve changed their tune about the PS3. Another thing that helped them was how bad Microsoft fucked up with their PR/DRM fiasco which really helped tip people on the fence towards the PS4. I would also attribute their own PR, lower price range, and really getting their message across. Nintendo blew up on the launch bad and Microsoft shot themselves in the ass, and Sony was smart in how they took advantage of the situation.
As per why completely new people are jumping on board... that I can't explain. Xbone was specifically tailored to achieving that goal what with their message of the "All in one entertainment system", making tv shows, contracting people like Steven Spielberg, emphasis on Kinect, the NFL deal, etc. and has seemingly failed. Sony, on the other hand, has done next to nothing to cater to that crowd, and is seemingly winning. That is puzzling.
SuperSonic1305
Member
Streaming hype. That's why the camera is also selling well.
Then why is Xbox One also selling relatively well compared to 360.
ForsakenLotus
Member
I feel like it's the right combination of consumer trust in Sony, consumer distrust in Microsoft, consumer disinterest in Nintendo and good timing after such a long generation.
I mean, I have a PS4. I love it. But it doesn't have a ton of really good games that the average consumer would know about (IE AAA titles). It's the most powerful console but it's not a generational leap the way PSOne and N64 were to the SNES and Genesis, or from that generation to PS2, GameCube and Xbox, or from that generation to Xbox 360 and PS3. There is a great foundation of a console, and hopefully it's software will continue to improve.
If there is one thing I'm not worried about with the PS4, it's that the console will get great games. At the end of the day, I think a lot of people feel the same. And that's one of the biggest reasons the console is selling so well right now.
I mean, I have a PS4. I love it. But it doesn't have a ton of really good games that the average consumer would know about (IE AAA titles). It's the most powerful console but it's not a generational leap the way PSOne and N64 were to the SNES and Genesis, or from that generation to PS2, GameCube and Xbox, or from that generation to Xbox 360 and PS3. There is a great foundation of a console, and hopefully it's software will continue to improve.
If there is one thing I'm not worried about with the PS4, it's that the console will get great games. At the end of the day, I think a lot of people feel the same. And that's one of the biggest reasons the console is selling so well right now.
KernelPanic
Member
It's selling well because it delivers what people want most. The best gaming system for the best price.
Microsoft's touted selling features were something that people clearly didn't care for, and the policies that they later on retracted turned off a lot of people. Plus it was more expensive.
Microsoft's touted selling features were something that people clearly didn't care for, and the policies that they later on retracted turned off a lot of people. Plus it was more expensive.
Sure. And I'm sure as a company they believed all that. But they didn't expect to have numbers 2x what they were estimating. They are looking at the current numbers/pacing and are bewildered by how quickly this generation has kicked off (in terms of the adoption rate and who is buying into the system).
I think it's fair to be surprised when sales far exceeded what you expected. And strategically, you have to now deliver products to this new user base. So it makes sense to find out why people are buying this to better serve their consumer base. I think people are taking this interview the wrong way.
Freeza Under The Shower
Member
Maybe it's just a perfect storm type scenario. MS fumbling has been a huge boon, but that's not a reliable factor (which is his point).
I do like the 'honest inside man' treatment though.
I do like the 'honest inside man' treatment though.
It's a powerful console at a decent price, that's all. That's why it's selling like hotcakes. But IMO, the console still doesn't have the library of top notch quality games to truly justify a purchase. All the buzz it's just because of the graphics it's capable to produce. Just remember the hype with games such as Killzone or Infamous Second Son, outstanding graphics but once you get to play them it's just a meh experience in terms of gameplay... Either way, congrats to Sony. Yoshida is such a nice guy.
In a big organization, seeing what the right thing to do can be very hard. Especially at the top. There are reasons why Atari, Nintendo, Sony, and MS seem to have made terrible decisions that made them lose a generation. Their successes obscured their mistakes and they couldn't tell mistakes from good decisions.
That's actually an interesting question - I could see that being true.
I mean, how many amazing games came out on PS3 in 7 years? And how many of those studios are now making games for PS4? It's just common sense that the PS4 has good games on its way.
I agree, the Wii U's troubles are due to a confluence of factors.
I will add one last point on the "importance of understanding your audience" thing with Nintendo.
They didn't understand that their newfound casual audience was craving new experiences all the time and thus, they bungled the system's momentum in the last several years of its life. Casuals decided weren't going to stick around Nintendo's ecosystem to get the small doses of gaming they were craving (because they just wanted something, quality or Nintendo's branding be damned), so these casuals partially decided to stick to mobile phones for their gaming fix.
I think it's mainly because 2 of their biggest competitors made huge mistakes.
Nintendo:
I know people like to mention that:
They fucked up the name.
They fucked up the first E3 presentation.
They fucked up the marketing.
That's all true. But the absolute worst thing they did is to force themselves to radically innovate again. Nintendo revolutionised the console market with motion controls and had huge success, but instead of calming down and capitalizing off of the incredibly established new "Wii" franchise, they had to bring another innovation out, the Wii U Gamepad. I mean, it is cool and shit, but it wasn't neccessary. They've already successfully introduced a radically new control sheme (motion controls) to the world, something you don't do every generation.
After the Wii, all they needed to create was a powerful console named Wii 2, with some improved Motion Controls, maybe introduce a new standard controller along the way (the Wii U Pro Controller) and have a logical evolution of the Wii concept. They should have went the PS1 to PS2 route, but no, they had to innovate again and confuse the shit out of everyone.
Microsoft:
While Nintendo did some curcial mistakes, Microsoft completely topped that by trying to force the most stupid, most anti-consumer policies you could imagine onto their customers, thus generating so much bad press that they even made it into the local news. I've never seen so much blantant stupidity in the videogame industry as with the whole Xbox One DRM drama. It must have been a grotesque sight for Sony to see one of their main competitors beating themselves up so badly, without them even doing anything!
Nintendo:
I know people like to mention that:
They fucked up the name.
They fucked up the first E3 presentation.
They fucked up the marketing.
That's all true. But the absolute worst thing they did is to force themselves to radically innovate again. Nintendo revolutionised the console market with motion controls and had huge success, but instead of calming down and capitalizing off of the incredibly established new "Wii" franchise, they had to bring another innovation out, the Wii U Gamepad. I mean, it is cool and shit, but it wasn't neccessary. They've already successfully introduced a radically new control sheme (motion controls) to the world, something you don't do every generation.
After the Wii, all they needed to create was a powerful console named Wii 2, with some improved Motion Controls, maybe introduce a new standard controller along the way (the Wii U Pro Controller) and have a logical evolution of the Wii concept. They should have went the PS1 to PS2 route, but no, they had to innovate again and confuse the shit out of everyone.
Microsoft:
While Nintendo did some curcial mistakes, Microsoft completely topped that by trying to force the most stupid, most anti-consumer policies you could imagine onto their customers, thus generating so much bad press that they even made it into the local news. I've never seen so much blantant stupidity in the videogame industry as with the whole Xbox One DRM drama. It must have been a grotesque sight for Sony to see one of their main competitors beating themselves up so badly, without them even doing anything!
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