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Sonic the Hedgehog Community Thread: Green Hills and Laughing Iizukas
- Thread starter Professor Beef
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Romanes Eunt Domus
There goes my Saturday night of happy fun fun time.
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
I liked Sky Troops too, but I will agree that Shadow the Hedgehog's soundtrack was very forgettable.
SpikedGunner
Member
No love for Blue Falcon?
It's an OK song, but I prefer the original to the remix.
Professor Beef
Banned
This one is probably the best song from Shadow the Hedgehog: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGPnk_m-bAc
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
^ Oh dammit. I knew that was going to be one of those songs. :lol
They were bashing Dear My Friend at the end of the LP. How disappointing. ;_;
Most of my favourite vocal songs probably didn't (originally) come from Crush 40, but I really like Live and Learn. I've started to like Free and Ungravitify lately, though. Dreams of an Absolution and His World are pretty decent.
They were bashing Dear My Friend at the end of the LP. How disappointing. ;_;
Most of my favourite vocal songs probably didn't (originally) come from Crush 40, but I really like Live and Learn. I've started to like Free and Ungravitify lately, though. Dreams of an Absolution and His World are pretty decent.
Shadow Hog
Member
Incidentally, going back to last page, am I the only one who actually likes Time Eater's theme?
Was never a fan, doesn't helped that it's accompanied with one of the worst boss fights in the franchise.
SpikedGunner
Member
fair enough.
I don't mind the song, thought it was okay...just not as memorable as other final boss music to me (which surprises me because it's Richard Jacques).
If theres a lyrical song beyond that link, you are dead wrong.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
It's not a bad villain/cutscene theme. It's just not a compelling boss theme, especially given the other boss themes in the series.
It's a guilty pleasure.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
The lack of any new themes or compositions is another aspect that made Generations a little less unique compared to previous entries. As probably the only original theme in the game, Time Eater's music was just okay.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
The Time Eater barely even had a theme. It was just super generic gothic chanting. Like, if somebody told me it was a pre-composed song pulled from an outsourced third party music library that Sega licensed, I would not be surprised in the slightest. Nothing about it stands out to me; it is about as "by the books" as you could get.
Not even the best Crush 40 track from that game, and most of the other vocal tracks are still better than it.
obligatory With Me plug goes here
Composed and arranged by Richard Jacques, of all people. Way below par for him.
edit:
ShtH doesn't have a great soundtrack, but there's more to it than that: Circus Park, Prison Island, Black Doom, Black Comet, Final Haunt
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Completely forgot how good With Me is.
Black Knight has such a crapton of good audio, but it's too bad that that good audio is associated with Black Knight. :/
This is excellent.
If somehow Sega licensed that song for the game...that would have been just unparalleled.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Should we discuss the Sega news in here with a Sonic-centric view since the other thread covers a broader range of stuff?
I don't think SoJ would quit with developing a lot of expensive stuff for their consoles. How much does the average Sonic game cost to develop, anyway? I'm curious.
I don't think SoJ would quit with developing a lot of expensive stuff for their consoles. How much does the average Sonic game cost to develop, anyway? I'm curious.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
The Werehog levels are so long. Time is money! 
Sonic levels are much shorter. Unless they want to add more big-ass ramps.
But seriously, I don't believe things are that drastic. I knew things were bad, but I didn't think they were that bad!
Sonic levels are much shorter. Unless they want to add more big-ass ramps.
But seriously, I don't believe things are that drastic. I knew things were bad, but I didn't think they were that bad!
Well as I said in the other thread, I think that post is an exaggeration. Even if it is true, it still doesn't effect the Sonic franchise itself due the profits the character brings in with Olympics, Sonic 4, Major releases, and Sonic Kart.
We have a new Sonic racing game coming out this year with an HD rerelease of Sonic Adventure 2. We don't even know if there will be any surprises at e3 just yet.
We have a new Sonic racing game coming out this year with an HD rerelease of Sonic Adventure 2. We don't even know if there will be any surprises at e3 just yet.
Professor Beef
Banned
I think it's not as serious as people are thinking it might be, but people do love to claim that the sky is falling. And that would hurt, especially since there are Diamonds in the Sky.
In a way, but that sort of thing has come part and parcel with the series ever since Sonic Spinball. Just enjoy the music for what it is.
As far as Sonic goes, I mostly fear for future PC ports if SoE vanishes.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
I don't put a lot of stock in the post either. The original French article was kind of unclear because in terms of structure and semantics, the article seemed to have more of a European-centric pov (so, SEGA Europe closing some of their offices including SEGA France). Or I could just be in denial.
I don't think Sonic's in any danger at all. It's their premier IP, and they're going to keep making games with it since it at least brings in some cash. If it didn't, they would've stopped churning out games by now.
And I totally brought it up in here because I wanted to bring some levity to the conversation with the puns, but you know GAF... doom and gloom, the sky is falling, etc.Professor Beef said:
Do the European branches do the porting? I didn't know that. That's unfortunate. Seems like more people lately are buying the PC versions of some stuff. Or at least, it seemed like a lot of people bought Generations on the PC based on what I've seen on GAF.
Didn't someone in this thread end up buying an M&S game because you posted all those links to the good remixes in those games? :lol
PeakPointMatrix
Member
If anything, the liquidated assets will leave the leftover resources for use on an even bigger budget Sonic game. (considering it's one of their safest bets for profit) Next gen is also around the corner. With Iizuka's latest comments concerning the future of Sonic and making the world more believable instead of realistic with better tech, I feel like the next big Sonic game will definitely be on next gen platforms. I can't see them risking the production of another mainline game on the currently withering HD consoles. I can totally see a teaser released this December, with a full reveal next to the PS4/720 announcements in 2013, set for release in 2014. And maybe a Wii U exclusive title in between all that (downported to the PS3/360 for good measure.)
They just can't fuck it up like they did with 06. The new tech, wildly different console architectures, over budget, looming Christmas deadline and the complete pillaging of the production team near the end of development really fucked up any chance 2k6 had of being halfway decent. The perfect storm of shit to fuck up any game. Hopefully now seven years later they can avoid these pitfalls in the next gen transition.
They just can't fuck it up like they did with 06. The new tech, wildly different console architectures, over budget, looming Christmas deadline and the complete pillaging of the production team near the end of development really fucked up any chance 2k6 had of being halfway decent. The perfect storm of shit to fuck up any game. Hopefully now seven years later they can avoid these pitfalls in the next gen transition.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
I don't know that they've ever given budget figures on how much any given Sonic game cost, but I can't imagine something like Unleashed was cheap given all the work that went in to their engine with the lighting tech and stuff. Like, they were so impressed with their lighting tech that they gave presentations just on how the engine worked.
Presumably it was meant to be licensed out or at least put to wider use within Sega but neither of those things apparently never came to fruition, especially now that Unreal Engine has its own global illumination lighting solution.
Sega also helped establish an animation studio more or less for Sonic games (Sega VE, or Marza Animation Planet as they are now known). Though they've finally started branching out away from doing CGI for Sega games and are now the main animation studio behind a Captain Harlock movie debuting next year (looks pretty, at least).
Despite all the money being spent on dragging the Sonic franchise kicking and screaming back in to moderately favorable territory, sales figures have not risen with it. Sonic 4 Episode 2, for example, despite being a better game than Episode 1, has struggled to sell even half as well as the original game. Sonic Generations, across 4 platforms, barely even sold a million and a half units. Dirty math puts that about 400,000 units per platform, which is quite low indeed.
Despite their best efforts to turn the things around with higher quality stuff, Sega just can't escape the shackles of their trouble past, it seems. I'm sure there's a bean counter somewhere in the company wagging his finger saying "SEE? I TOLD YOU GUYS THAT MAKING QUALITY SOFTWARE WAS A BAD IDEA! WE NEED TO CHEAP THIS SHIT UP AGAIN".
Box of Bunnies
Banned
There's a three letter word (or rather, a lack of it) that kinda explains those two, at least.
Yeah, most Sega PC releases originate from Sega Europe, ports and native titles alike. Maybe an increased focus on digital markets would save it anyway.
Mario & Sonic, uh... yes! I've also got an '06 purchase under my belt from a few years back.
Pretty sure the intent was always for this to be a major movie studio, it just took a while to get the ball rolling. They've held a couple of script submission contests over the last couple years, and some of Sega's investor reports have talked about their ambitions for the studio.
Here's a nice little artifact related to the above, incidentally:
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
I was hoping that there would be a Wii U title this year, not at launch because that would be a little silly, but launch window. Or maybe something for 3DS/Vita, which would be more plausible.
Let's just hope they've learned from Sonic 2006 with regards to scheduling, budgeting, and learning that it's okay to delay a game if it doesn't meet requirements, even if it misses a huge holiday push. Or at least, they needed to let their investors know that.
Reminds me of a certain other company. Unleashed looked very expensive. It had its own CG short, those expensive cutscenes, and the Hedgehog Engine's debut. They probably profited from that since it was released on four platforms. I'd hope.
I don't feel like they pissed away their money. Their games' bad reputation from last generation really didn't do them any favours. I mean, look at GAF. We still see stuff like "Sonic Cycle" being thrown around even though it isn't really warranted anymore. Or trepidation in Sonic Generations threads when presented with good reasons to purchase the game. Or some people looking for the worst opinions in the Episode II thread to justify not purchasing it. Edit: Or even people in the other thread saying that Sonic games are shit in general and that Nintendo should just purchase the Sonic IP to "finally churn out a good Sonic game".
You kind of have to admit that Sega sort of did this to themselves with their past mistakes, even though they're pumping out some quality stuff now, through either taking a chance and publishing stuff (which probably helped to get them in this scenario) and developing some good stuff.
Another key problem with the Sonic series is that it's schizophrenic in terms of branding and experience. It's only within the last 3 games (Unleashed, Colors, Generations) that there has been something resembling consistency in terms of game design, and even those 3 are very divergent when it comes to style. They've spent so long doing 'Sonic ____' with relatively little success that it has diluted the momentum of the brand.
And it's all well and good that Sonic games are decent again, but they've been churning them out at such a rate that it doesn't mean much and there's no room for the franchise to breath to build up any sort of casual audience hype with an upcoming release. Only Sonic fans and a few weird children buy Sonic games these days
Sega should just out and out define Sonic next gen and then give us a sequel to whatever they make, instead of semi reinventing the wheel after that.
And it's all well and good that Sonic games are decent again, but they've been churning them out at such a rate that it doesn't mean much and there's no room for the franchise to breath to build up any sort of casual audience hype with an upcoming release. Only Sonic fans and a few weird children buy Sonic games these days
Sega should just out and out define Sonic next gen and then give us a sequel to whatever they make, instead of semi reinventing the wheel after that.
If DLC is what you are getting I really doubt that would have helped with sales. Even if they got DLC for Generations out in a normal time frame most of the people who were going to buy that game would have done it already and if someone hasn't, the prospect that they can now buy the game and extra stuff too wouldn't be a huge sales booster.
Box of Bunnies
Banned
Oh woah, thats them?! I saw a lot about this film at Annecy last year. Pretty excited for it
Hey Sega1991, did you realize Mega64 used some clips from your 06 video?
I watched this video a while before I watched yours and just got reminded of the similarities.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lFrHx_s_UY
I watched this video a while before I watched yours and just got reminded of the similarities.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lFrHx_s_UY
Most likely it's SEGA Europe that gives the "green light" for PC releases, but they don't do the ports themselves (for example, Generations -> Devil's Details, S4Ep2 -> SEGA Shangai/Tose).
I'm actually curious as to how much Wii versions might have contributed to sales of those games.
Gotta keep on runnin.
BlazeHedgehog
Member
I didn't find out until weeks or months after the fact. I contacted Rocco about it and was like "Uh, you could've asked. I would've said yes."
He apologized, offered me some Mega64 merch, I said that no, it was okay, and that I'd feel like a jerk if I took some. I probably should have, but eh. Hope I didn't offend him.
I imagine the dropoff between Episode 1 and Episode 2 has a lot less to do with there not being a Wii version and a lot more to do with people learning from their mistakes, unlike Dimps.
If there is one thing they should bring back for the next 3D Sonic game it's challenge mode from Colours.
I just spent the last 2 or so hours playing through Colours again and challenge mode is a really minor thing but makes it feel just like playing through an old Sonic game.
And just in case anyone is wondering, that game is still pretty good. I really like the end of that game too, running down a space elevator to Earth is a really neat idea for a final level and I love that the final boss is just Sonic fighting against an Eggman mech instead of a Super Sonic space/planet/time thing.
I just spent the last 2 or so hours playing through Colours again and challenge mode is a really minor thing but makes it feel just like playing through an old Sonic game.
And just in case anyone is wondering, that game is still pretty good. I really like the end of that game too, running down a space elevator to Earth is a really neat idea for a final level and I love that the final boss is just Sonic fighting against an Eggman mech instead of a Super Sonic space/planet/time thing.
Also, according to Ken Balough (Sonic 4 Brand Manager), Episode 1 sold more on the XBLA, then on PSN, and then on the Wii.
Seven Force
Banned
Yeah, Terminal Velocity is by far my favorite finale for a 3D Sonic title. Even if the act before the boss level is a bit gimmicky, I can look past that because the level itself is just cool as hell to look at.
This is the only time I'm surprised a Sonic game sold badly on Nintendo hardware. Who buys stuff from WiiWare?
Shadow Hog
Member
Also, the music is amazing. I've always kind of liked it when Kenichi Tokoi breaks out the brass.
We got Budget figures on Colors. It was 20 million. Though I'll be damned if I can find the source at this point.
Source? Episode II had to cost more to make, and that combined with Sega anticipating a fallout from Episode I could be why III is a question mark.
Seven Force
Banned
Hell yeah, it is.
The combination of the visuals and the music left me with a grin on my face the whole way through.
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