Doesn't change the fact that PS4 R&D + end of this gen = reason for the loss this time
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Sony Announces Q1 Results
- Thread starter Parmenides
- Start date
SpoonyBard
Banned
But right now they should be making tons of money on PS3 hw and sw sales, so the actual investment is much more than 150 million. And PS4 is not as high tech, so to speak, as PS2 and PS3 were at the time. It looks like a much more conservative design...
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
The xbox division has been massively profitable? Where did you get that from?
DarkLordMalik
Member
You are talking like Nintendo can save a system alone. They weren't able to do it with Gamecube or Nintendo 64. The Nintendo potential on Wii U remains to be seen and what we have seen so far isn't exactly good. Titles like NSMB U and Nintendo Land didn't exactly lit charts on fire. Lego City: Undercover did nothing as well. Wii U is in a even worse shape than GC or N64 because third parties are pulling their support faster. At least the VITA is still getting some support despite being on the market for close to 2 years now.
Anyways, this conversation is getting silly now. It won't even matter in the end if the Wii U sells 9 million and the VITA sells 8 million.
HORRORSHØW
Member
It's amazing the PS3 and 360 are neck and neck even after the 360's year head start.
True, this money is in US dollars, so it may still be for AMD (not for TSMC, could be GlobalFoundries). Page 9 states that there is a high US denominated hardware cost, so probably not ps3 or vita.
Edit: It actually makes sense that it's GlobalFoundries. Would be much cheaper shipping wise (if partly assembling in US), since they are launching in US.
What ended Sega hardware lineage was a string of a few years of heavy losses totaling around 170000 billion yen which simply wasn't bearable by a "little" company like Sega.
Vita is very likely to have shipped more than PSP (as it should) but I'm not so sure about your 50K statement.
PSP is still outselling Vita in some market like France.
Maximilian E.
AKA MS-Evangelist
In what sense did PS3/Sony beat 360/MS?
Is having some more units sold a measure of winning?
I mean, specially when going from 150+ million to 81 million.. if thats winning then I guess it is a win then
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
Well, PSASBR sold 1M. Pretty sure Journey sold more than that though.
Duxxy3
Member
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
In what sense did PS3/Sony beat 360/MS?
Is having some more units sold a measure of winning?
I mean, specially when going from 150+ million to 81 million.. if thats winning then I guess it is a win then
Yes, in terms of units sold. That's how we determine the winner each generation.
And you are seeing more conservative losses.
The easiest way to compare is to look at the operating loss in the same quarter before launch for PS3.
That was circa $270m.
And that was with PS2+PSP offsets which I presume were at the time at least as large as PS3+Vita's offset today...
zomgbbqftw
Banned
Larger, for sure.
In what sense did PS3/Sony beat 360/MS?
Is having some more units sold a measure of winning?
I mean, specially when going from 150+ million to 81 million.. if thats winning then I guess it is a win then
Wait hasnt units sold always been used as a measuring stick as to who wins?.
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
I think they also spent a lot of money on promoting the PS4 this year.
It would if it wasn't so late (in a unusually long) in the generation lifespan.
In what sense did PS3/Sony beat 360/MS?
Is having some more units sold a measure of winning?
I mean, specially when going from 150+ million to 81 million.. if thats winning then I guess it is a win then
Marketshare, most unit sold, etc.
So yes, PS3/SONY won in that regard.
Even when Xbox360/MS had an one year headstart.
In what sense did PS3/Sony beat 360/MS?
Is having some more units sold a measure of winning?
I mean, specially when going from 150+ million to 81 million.. if thats winning then I guess it is a win then
well, the measure is easy, consoles sold. You could consider other factors as well, ones for and others against.
Against, coming from ps2 dominance it is a loss on sony's part (i wonder how many ps2's were sold after 6/7 years though, that would be the better comparison, not +10 years of ps2 sales vs 6 years of ps3 sales
Against, the same for MS, coming from 30 million XB they really did amazingly well with 360
For, well price, it has always been 'behind' competition
ALso, fud in the first years was huge against sony.
They also launched one year later, so those numbers are with 12 months less (in some markets even more) so, not that bad.
It's the opposite.
Sony stopped reporting the manufactured units during the PS3 era because PS3 was selling really badly
(if a console is selling like hot cakes no one will question the difference between produced and sold to retailers).Then Sony started to combine sales :-(
Nice try but the 81.5 million includes about three to four million PS2. And let's not forget that both lost to 100 million Wii.
I don't think they can even ship that many in the first year.
Maximilian E.
AKA MS-Evangelist
Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
NotSureIfSerious.gif
Canis lupus
Member
3 to 4m PS2s lol. You think PS2 sold as much as it did in FY2011?
Or 2 handhelds that sold combined around 235M for that matter.
Current gen won't match the previous achievements.
Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
For example you get more consumer positive feedback and put in better position for next gen.
It means that PS3 that still sells decently everywhere gets some japanese games that won't be released for 360
And yes, you win the console wars (well nintendo did). It is pointless but is a constant debate in forums. You for example seem to care as you are into the discussion too
How do you know this when PSP and Vita numbers are together?
Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
You win a kinect.
Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
Nobody said ps3 won this gen.
What people are saying is that PS3 is winning over 360 in terms of units sold.
The prize?
Baki
Member
Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
I'm quite sure that the PS3 will eventually sell more than the Wii (probably by 5 to 10m units).
Canis lupus
Member
IncandescentPrecept
Banned
Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
Well, we don't know how much the 360 or PS3 will end up selling.
1st Course
Member
PS3 numbers were down yoy in 2012.
We know that the PS3 sold less than 13.9m in 2012.
16.5 - 13.9 = 2.7m atleast.
Maximilian E.
AKA MS-Evangelist
No, my main point and this is what im trying to go after is, what does winning really mean?
Yeah, fanboys will argue that their console is the best, just because it has a sales lead. I argue that, if the difference is not crazy much, having a sales lead will not really make a difference and thus, you dont win anything.
Having a sales lead by 5-10 million, does not change anything for third parties (at least, between MS and Sony). Have a sales lead like 150 vs 50, then 3rd party will maybe focus on one platform, but Sony will not have this sales advantage ever again.
Both MS and Sony have already won massive 3rd party support and both coming machines will sell enough to make 3rd party happy.
The only metric I see of winning is, if you make the competitors go out of business or if you have this crazy sales lead that makes the platform the de facto standard.. THEN, you have truly won!
Change-up in their marketing too. I read somewhere that Sony Pictures had like $146 million marketing budget or something.
Dude, stop crying!Actually, if we are going to be proper then Wii won, right?
Ok, so most sold units is a measure of "winning" and what is it that you win? The console wars?
I mean, now that PS3 has the lead over 360, does that mean that it will get more games from thirdparty? Does that mean that multiplat games that before were "better" on 360, are now, suddenly, better on PS3?
So, what do you get by winning?
We're talking about marketshare world-wide.
Just... as always, in every generation, you know?
You act like it hurt your feelings when PS3 overtook the Xbox360 in world-wide sales.
Who's talking here about multi-plat games performing better on a certain system?
We're talking about SONY/PS3/sales/earnings/worldwide sales here.
It seems like you are in the wrong thread, my friend.
And yes, the Wii "won" this generation.
But people are mostly talking about the HD-gen with the PS3 and Xbox360.
Because PS3 sold 13.9m on FY 2011
PS3+PS2 sold 16.5m on FY 2012. If PS3 is down (13.8m or less, PS2 sold 2.7m or more)
Canis lupus
Member
Do we know for certain it was down YoY and PS2 was basically flat?
Still too early in the morning for number crunching lol.
me too, I bring it everywhere, my dslr kit is collecting dust, unless I need a strong flash
I bet sony is actually rather happy with how things turned out after an absolute disaster of a launch.
At this point those who are constantly bitching about others who say the ps3 must be ahead of the 360 to be a huge win are equally bad
Maximilian E.
AKA MS-Evangelist
The point im trying to make is, Sony taking over the sales lead NOW, does not make a difference whatsoever.
The people yelling "victory, finally this day has happened" etc etc.. are interesting for me because I wanted to know, what was the difference from before and now.
(obviously, the ones yelling victory are the narrow minded fanboys but still, and seeing how NeoGaf is infested with these types, I just wanted to know what they thought changed when SOny took over the sales lead).
Obviously, im not hurted by this.. because im still enjoying playing games, no matter what console.. you know.. a good game is a good game is a good game no matter what console, right?
My primer: Anything the company you like does is good and anything the company you dislike is bad.
Yeah, it's only of academic interest.
We know. I Just check
Sales decreased 12.2% year-on-year (a 15% decrease on a constant currency basis) to 707.1 billion yen (7,522
million U.S. dollars). Sales to external customers decreased 22.5% year-on-year. This significant decrease was
primarily due to a decrease in unit sales of PlayStation®3 (PS3) hardware
Page 3
http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/IR/financial/fr/12q4_sony.pdf
King Beyond the wall
Member
The guy you quoted answers your initial question:
There are some tangible benefits, but there are also the benefit for the playstation fans who can claim in Internet forums that Playstation stands victorious over the Xbox in the field of battle.
I can understand your last comment, but we have always used unit sales to rank the consoles at the end of a gen. I'm sure that you would argue that Xbox 1 beat the gamecube in their gen.