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Spider-Man: Homecoming review thread [92% RT]
- Thread starter jon bones
- Start date
SENPAIatLARGE
Banned
Cap did nothing wrong in civil war. The worlds governments had been infiltrated by Hydra just a few months before. He had no reason to trust any of them, and their desire to kill his best friend without a trial doubled down on it. Tony was acting out of guilt due to his mistakes, not the avengers.
Primethius
Banned
Cap was super redeemed the moment Trump became President (I'm assuming the movies follow the real world much like the comics).
Both here and in the comic Civil War, Caps actions were definitively in the right when you step back and realize who he's preventing the power from going to.
It just so happens in the comic he failed, Osborn came in and fucked shit up cause Tony's a moron.
A Terminator concluded his invincibility against humanity was a threat in itself, no matter if his current program of ethics was acceptable, the only appropriate solution to this was to disarm and execute himself. Fuck Cap, selfish cunt
Good then that Zemo was the one with the threat here.
Also, whats your stance on killing Hawkeye? Is Black Widow a cunt because she could have killed Clint instead of try to wake him up from mind control because she wanted to save her friend?
Twig and Berries
Member
Er, that's not what really happened. He didn't sign out of principle, sure, but the only reason he went out on his own was because they were going to kill Bucky. He would have done that anyway eventually but the Avengers didn't split up the moment he refused to sign. The nice thing about Civil War is that everyone has clearly defined motivations that were influenced by Cap but not completely dictated by him.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
I can totally see Ross as a Denethor from RotK type figure actually. Shutting out the world and refusing to act while it crumbles. Refusing to sanction The Avengers.
And then in a Thanos induced madness exposes himself to gamma radiation
Piku_Ringo
Banned
Twig and Berries
Member
Nah, this aint the Ultimates. As of last year, Ellis was still president. No idea who it is now.
MugiwaraCole
Member
Think the fact we elected a man like that to power is the point more than anything. Steve still believes in fighting for what's right, but he doesn't naively trust people anymore.
PeterLegend
Member
Do we know if there's any extra scenes after the movie? Just looking for a Yes/No answer since I'll be watching next Saturday...
Yes.
dancingphlower
Member
Yes, one mid and one post.
MugiwaraCole
Member
It's an MCU movie.
Why are we still asking this question in 2017? You stay till the credits are over.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
So your argument is that a flesh and blood human being with friends and feelings should come to the same conclusions as hyper rational robot with neither.
Can't argue with that flawless logic.
Twig and Berries
Member
It's funny in a very depressing way that despite being such a morose slog of a movie, BvS had a much more optimistic ending while Civil War more accurately reflected the world by showing how easily confused and frequently shitty people are.
That was the theme of 2016 - people suck.
MugiwaraCole
Member
More optimistic? Eh. BVS ends with the obvious tease that Superman's coming back while Batman remembers "oh yeah, killing guys is shitty", but we have no way of knowing if he's still gonna be the mopey one we've seen so far.
Civil War ends with the Avengers fragmented, but at least Cap drops Tony a line on some "when you need me (and you will), I'll slide through" while freeing Team Cap from the Raft.
They're kinda even.
MiloHoffman
Member
Twig and Berries
Member
The ending of BvS being underwhelming doesn't make it any less optimistic
BvS ends with the start of something new. Bruce has a new mission that, in spite of the rest of the movie, is hopeful.
Civil War is uncertain at best. Some people hate the letter because they think it undercuts the preceding conflict but it's unclear how Tony really feels, if he still wants Bucky dead, and what future lies ahead for the Avengers. It's not pessimistic but it's not optimistic either.
MugiwaraCole
Member
The ending of BvS being underwhelming doesn't make it any less optimistic
BvS ends with the start of something new. Bruce has a new mission that, in spite of the rest of the movie, is hopeful.
Civil War is uncertain at best. Some people hate the letter because they think it undercuts the preceding conflict but it's unclear how Tony really feels, if he still wants Bucky dead, and what future lies ahead for the Avengers. It's not pessimistic but it's not optimistic either.
I'm disagreeing on BVS, and that's completely centered around Superman. I don't care what anyone says about Batman being the true leader of the Justice League; Superman is the heart of that team. We don't know what kind of Clark Kent is coming out of the ground, to the point we're left just as uncertain as we are of Steve's letter to Tony. This is lessened a bit by the Wonder Woman movie since Diana looks to be able to pick up some of that hopeful slack, but then, I'd argue the same is true of Spider-Man.
Cap was right to not sign in CW. Bucky was framed and was being hunted down on shoot to kill orders. Cap had just personally gone through Shield being infiltrated by Hydra. There's no way he'd sign the accords. He was right that Zemo could have been activating the Winter Soldiers and take over the world in a matter of days. (Of course, he was wrong about Zemo's motivations and endgame...)
The magic trick CA:CW pulls is to gloss over the fact that the accords are presented to the Avengers as a done deal, out of nowhere, with no input from them. There's clearly a way for Cap to be ok with signing some version of the accords, but the "yes/no, this version, you have to decide this week" is the central conceit that you just have to ignore for the movie to work.
pretty done
Member
Nice scores
This is the only superhero movie I will see this year. Spidey will always be the GOAT.
This is the only superhero movie I will see this year. Spidey will always be the GOAT.
Shambala
Member
Forever the goat
Cap was right in NOT signing the accords and his heart was in the right place when it came to protecting Bucky etc.
But that doesn't mean he wasn't wrong as well in how he handled himself. His actions alone only give the accords a reason to exist.
Humans open to be reprogrammed like machines opens up that argument and brings up the same question of moral consequence of 1 person/ai holding so much destructive power, also, isn't Buckey machine like? Also fuck Cap
MugiwaraCole
Member
What actions were those?
Whats your stance on killing Hawkeye?
Why has it taken so long?
MugiwaraCole
Member
I count Lego Batman, still the best DC movie this year.
I wonder what movie will be the c-c-c-combo breaker. Thor or JL.
We all know it will be JL...
He says to Cap that part of the reason he comes back is because he owes a debt to Wanda for Pietro saving his life. First thing he does is spring Wanda from being imprisoned.
All Cap had to do was tell Hawkeye what Tony was doing with locking her up and he was probably all, "Wtf Tony? She's just a kid!" and Cap was all, "That's what I said!"
He's mad because they ending up sitting in a super villain prison for trying to help their friends, while Clint is being kept away from his family. He knows what he was risking, and he knew which side Tony was on, but it doesn't make the betrayal hurt any less that Tony would be going along with that treatment for the team.
George Oscar Bluth II
Banned
There's another 200 or so reviews to go before the average rating and percentage settles.
The Outsider
Member
94%!
illmatic22
Banned
Snyder's films have been divisive to say the least so yeah that's the wildcard here. But it would be dope if all the Superhero movies reviewed well.
Yeah...this is crazy!
Zeyphersan
Banned
The Outsider
Member
3 more.
Indeed but I doubt it will drop below 89%.
MiloHoffman
Member
EdReedFan20
Member
So far, Phase 3 is looking like the strongest of the Phases, with it being the first to have three 90 rated movies. Phase 1 had two (Iron Man, Avengers) and Phase 2 had one (GOTG). All four of them are "certified fresh" (75%+), which was not the case for Phase 1 or 2 (Phase 1 had The Incredible Hulk and Phase 2 had Thor: The Dark World). Sure, there's plenty of room in Phase 3 for some stinkers, but as for right now, Phase 3 is looking strong. Crazy that we still have Thor: Ragnarok left this year, with Black Panther, Avengers: Infinity War, and Ant-Man and the Wasp next year (the 10th year of the MCU!), and Captain Marvel, and Avengers 4 the year after before Phase 3 ends. The Spider-Man Homecoming sequel that same year begins Phase 4.